Русский корабль - иди нахуй

[MillerEP 30,339]

 

[MillerEP 30,339]

Occupied Stakhanov (Kadiivka), Luhansk region Flew through the city. Something burns and detonates

[MillerEP 30,339]

 

[atomheartbevo 89,390]

 

[ShaggyBevo RIP 3,868]

Those are smaller craft, so most likely they will be trucked in whole, or broken down into sub-assemblies then reassembled in Odessa.

River boats are 40’. they can go on a truck.

[InkaUtexas 25,485]

 

[InkaUtexas 25,485]

5 minutes ago, ShaggyBevo RIP said:

River boats are 40’. they can go on a truck.

I figured this after looking them up. Thanks for clarifying. 

[atomheartbevo 89,390]

If you want to know how deep Russian propaganda can go, Dimitri Simes heads up the Center for the National Interest, a Washington D.C. public policy think tank, formerly known as the Nixon Center.  

Simes was an aid to President Nixon (after he left office) and has run the center for a few decades, but the Nixon family forced him change the name from the Nixon Center after Simes attack John McCain (who had been the GOP nominee) because McCain was criticizing Russia for attacking Georgia.  Simes thought Russia was justified   

He was born and raised in the Soviet Union and  traveled extensively through the USSR/Russia and has met Putin and had ties to a lot of shady Russians, including Maria Butina, and is rumored to be working for Russian security services.

Oh and he moderates a show on Russia Channel One.  Putin’s official station.  

So yeah, even though he runs a think tank in Washington D.C., he’s in the tank for the Russians.  

 

[atomheartbevo 89,390]

I’ve mentioned this guy months ago, he has a fantastic website and writes about a lot of cool topics.  Importance of Snake Island

 

 

[Brisketexan 104,532]

9 minutes ago, InkaUtexas said:

 

 

[atomheartbevo 89,390]

[atomheartbevo 89,390]

Also helps Moldova

AA or Harpoons on Snake Island with proper defenses would make it very hard for Russia to move on Moldova.

[Brisketexan 104,532]

8 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Also helps Moldova

AA or Harpoons on Snake Island with proper defenses would make it very hard for Russia to move on Moldova.

Counterpoint......Russia has long-range weapons, too.  Whatever Ukraine puts there, Russia can hit the same as Ukraine hit the Russians.  I think that in the current battlescape, it's just a limited asset that's too hard to hold.

[InkaUtexas 25,485]

psychological victory at a minimum. plant the flag and maintain the capacity to put gear there if need be. 

[atomheartbevo 89,390]

24 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Counterpoint......Russia has long-range weapons, too.  Whatever Ukraine puts there, Russia can hit the same as Ukraine hit the Russians.  I think that in the current battlescape, it's just a limited asset that's too hard to hold.

Russia would have to rely completely on their long-range missiles, and those ain’t that accurate as they burn through their limited newer stuff.  Still, Ukraine will probably raise the flag and leave it at that for now.  And would be good if Ukraine put decoys on the island and made Russia waste missiles for nothing.

[MillerEP 30,339]

They should pay some old-timer with a small engine craft to go out there, plant a flagpole, and putter over there every day to make sure the Ukrainian flag is still there, and then upload a picture to twitter everyday to rub it in.

Edited June 30, 2022 by MillerEP

[texastough 1,128]

Put some Harpoons and Exocets out there along with one of the fancy NATO air defense systems and voila

[Brisketexan 104,532]

7 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Russia would have to rely completely on their long-range missiles, and those ain’t that accurate as they burn through their limited newer stuff.  Still, Ukraine will probably raise the flag and leave it at that for now.  And would be good if Ukraine put decoys on the island and made Russia waste missiles for nothing.

Without a bunch of air defenses on the island -- and if I were UKR, I wouldn't waste them there -- they can hit it with strike aircraft.  The juice ain't worth the squeeze.  Denying the space to Russia and planting the UKR flag there is a big enough win.

I mean, if you could SNEAK some harpoons in there, hidden, so you could hit unsuspecting Russian vessels who got too close, that might be worthwhile.  But I doubt there's a place to hide them.

[InkaUtexas 25,485]

8 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Russia would have to rely completely on their long-range missiles, and those ain’t that accurate as they burn through their limited newer stuff.  Still, Ukraine will probably raise the flag and leave it at that for now.  And would be good if Ukraine put decoys on the island and made Russia waste missiles for nothing.

Turn it into the Ukrainian Alcatraz for POW's. 

[atomheartbevo 89,390]

https://www.bellingcat.com/news/2022/06/29/russias-kremenchuk-claims-versus-the-evidence/
 

[atomheartbevo 89,390]

23 minutes ago, InkaUtexas said:

Turn it into the Ukrainian Alcatraz for POW's. 

[Fico 1,743]

1 hour ago, atomheartbevo said:

I’ve mentioned this guy months ago, he has a fantastic website and writes about a lot of cool topics.  Importance of Snake Island

 

 

Im fairly certain he does all of his diagrams in MS Paint. We need to recruit him to surly for more dick drawing material.

 

[ABSR 5,289]

1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

Counterpoint......Russia has long-range weapons, too.  Whatever Ukraine puts there, Russia can hit the same as Ukraine hit the Russians.  I think that in the current battlescape, it's just a limited asset that's too hard to hold.

Not completely.  The island was located close enough to the Ukraine coast to be hit by long range artillery and MLRS systems.  It is NOT that close to Crimea or Russian controlled areas.  I am pretty confident that the improved artillery and MLRS systems were the key for Ukraine.  

[utee94 15,742]

53 minutes ago, InkaUtexas said:

Turn it into the Ukrainian Alcatraz for POW's. 

But do you really think this would deter Russia from blowing the place apart?  They don't give a shit about their soldiers.  They'd just claim Ukraine did it and call it a war crime.

Edited June 30, 2022 by utee94

[Fico 1,743]

4 minutes ago, utee94 said:

But do you really think this would deter Russia from blowing the place apart while trying to hit Odessa?  They don't give a shit about their soldiers.  They'd just claim Ukraine did it and call it a war crime.

FIFY

[texastough 1,128]

1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

Without a bunch of air defenses on the island -- and if I were UKR, I wouldn't waste them there -- they can hit it with strike aircraft.  The juice ain't worth the squeeze.  Denying the space to Russia and planting the UKR flag there is a big enough win.

I mean, if you could SNEAK some harpoons in there, hidden, so you could hit unsuspecting Russian vessels who got too close, that might be worthwhile.  But I doubt there's a place to hide them.

If putting missiles & air defense out there can open the shipping lanes it would totally be worth it

[Scheiss Meister 8,398]

1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

Counterpoint......Russia has long-range weapons, too.  Whatever Ukraine puts there, Russia can hit the same as Ukraine hit the Russians.  I think that in the current battlescape, it's just a limited asset that's too hard to hold.

This.  Snake Island is to this war as Harpers Ferry was to the Civil War.  You want it, but you can't hold it.

[TexasEd 8,064]

2 hours ago, atomheartbevo said:

If you want to know how deep Russian propaganda can go, Dimitri Simes heads up the Center for the National Interest, a Washington D.C. public policy think tank, formerly known as the Nixon Center.  

Simes was an aid to President Nixon (after he left office) and has run the center for a few decades, but the Nixon family forced him change the name from the Nixon Center after Simes attack John McCain (who had been the GOP nominee) because McCain was criticizing Russia for attacking Georgia.  Simes thought Russia was justified   

He was born and raised in the Soviet Union and  traveled extensively through the USSR/Russia and has met Putin and had ties to a lot of shady Russians, including Maria Butina, and is rumored to be working for Russian security services.

Oh and he moderates a show on Russia Channel One.  Putin’s official station.  

So yeah, even though he runs a think tank in Washington D.C., he’s in the tank for the Russians.  

 

Being right about the state of our news sources is the one truth he'll throw out to gain cred before he starts spreading the propaganda.

[Fico 1,743]

47 minutes ago, texastough said:

If putting missiles & air defense out there can open the shipping lanes it would totally be worth it

I would think Russia could still maintain the blockade with subs plus aviation and anti ship missiles out of Crimea.

[RDCanecutter 26,246]

The best way to destroy the Russian Navy is to force it to deploy constantly.

[ShaggyBevo RIP 3,868]

I would think Russia could still maintain the blockade with subs plus aviation and anti ship missiles out of Crimea.

Those subs are due to surface for resupply.

Harpoon time?

[Fico 1,743]

1 hour ago, ShaggyBevo RIP said:

Those subs are due to surface for resupply.

Harpoon time?

 

 

Resupplying in Sevastopol, it would be nice for something to hit it. What do the Ukrainians have (if anything) to strike Sevastopol currently?

OT: Soviets had an underground sub base near by in Balaklava. Link

[Bevo 13,516]

2 hours ago, RDCanecutter said:

The best way to destroy the Russian Navy is to force it to deploy constantly.

I thought the easiest way to sink the Russian Navy was to create waves in the tub?

[Scheiss Meister 8,398]

27 minutes ago, Fico said:

 

 

Resupplying in Sevastopol, it would be nice for something to hit it. What do the Ukrainians have (if anything) to strike Sevastopol currently?

OT: Soviets had an underground sub base near by in Balaklava. Link

Some quick Googling says that Sevastopol is 188 air miles from Odessa, which is right at the 190 mile range of the ATACMS that can be fired from the HIMARS launchers.  I'm not sure that is close enough for accurate targeting, but there should be closer launch sites.  Drop several ATACMS on the port facilities and see what you can wreck.  Same with Melitopol, Berdiansk, and Mariopol.  Jam up their nautical supply lines.

[DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt 12,301]

2 minutes ago, Scheiss Meister said:

Some quick Googling says that Sevastopol is 188 air miles from Odessa, which is right at the 190 mile range of the ATACMS that can be fired from the HIMARS launchers.  I'm not sure that is close enough for accurate targeting, but there should be closer launch sites.  Drop several ATACMS on the port facilities and see what you can wreck.  Same with Melitopol, Berdiansk, and Mariopol.  Jam up their nautical supply lines.

This is why I don't understand why we're helping them fight but putting kids gloves on them..."we'll give you these systems but only the rockets hat go this far"

Give them everything short of nukes and let them push Russia's shit in and end this war.

[texastough 1,128]

16 minutes ago, DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt said:

This is why I don't understand why we're helping them fight but putting kids gloves on them..."we'll give you these systems but only the rockets hat go this far"

Give them everything short of nukes and let them push Russia's shit in and end this war.

It seems thats where we're headed. The arms announced the last couple days have been massive.

[Fico 1,743]

51 minutes ago, Scheiss Meister said:

Some quick Googling says that Sevastopol is 188 air miles from Odessa, which is right at the 190 mile range of the ATACMS that can be fired from the HIMARS launchers.  I'm not sure that is close enough for accurate targeting, but there should be closer launch sites.  Drop several ATACMS on the port facilities and see what you can wreck.  Same with Melitopol, Berdiansk, and Mariopol.  Jam up their nautical supply lines.

Would be nice to hit a few of the air fields down there while you're at it.

[Scheiss Meister 8,398]

3 minutes ago, Fico said:

Would be nice to hit a few of the air fields down there while you're at it.

Air fields, train yards, rolling stock, oil pump stations, supply dumps, and equipment repair yards.  Cut that tail and starve the head.

[clapclapclap 9,000]

8 hours ago, AUS-97HORN said:

is there something wrong with Putin's right arm?.... it barely moves when he's walking, while the left is wildly swinging...

now he does move it to clasp his hands and he then raises and points with it... but thas a really odd walk for the guy

Putin now self-identifies as Dr. Strangelove.

[The Dog 43,784]

HIMARS doing work:

 

[atomheartbevo 89,390]

This guy is in southern Russia, not far from Ukrainian border, he’s lived in the US, lived in Ukraine and has a lot of friends in both. He does a podcast everyday and I occasionally listen to him - he makes sure and doesn’t cross the line into getting himself or his family in trouble (doesn’t call it a war, doesn’t criticize Putin, etc.).  Basically a small glimpse inside of Russia at the economy (he’ll go to malls, grocery stores, etc.), results of sanctions, etc. and just talks a lot about how things are, but ultimately he’s pretty careful about not having the FSB show up at his door.

A few days ago with the mall stuff, he definitely shifted his tone.  Today’s, he kind of did a summary of the war, and he unloaded quite a bit.  Didn’t call it a war, didn’t directly criticize Putin, but talked at length about how it’s given NATO a new purpose, revitalized NATO and the EU, it’s de-Russified Ukraine and now Ukrainians don’t speak Russian and changed street names, etc. and how Ukraine had a bright future because the world is ready to help it rebuild and reconnect, and caused Sweden and Finland to become hostile to Russia, etc.  kind of an interesting listen, but I’m wondering how much longer his podcasts will be around now..

 

[atomheartbevo 89,390]

They hit malls after lunch, and residential buildings at night, when they are full.

 

[Scheiss Meister 8,398]

Hell doesn't have tortures horrible enough for Putin and his war criminals.  I'd still like to send them there.

[956 Worldwide 34,393]

Greece will buy a squadron of F-35s and might outfit another.  And soon to be NATO member Finland has placed an order for 64.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/greece-submit-request-purchase-20-120120471.html

[DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt 12,301]

12 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Greece will buy a squadron of F-35s and might outfit another.  And soon to be NATO member Finland has placed an order for 64.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/greece-submit-request-purchase-20-120120471.html

64? That seems like a lot. Is that a lot?

[Gengs1 2,583]

12 minutes ago, DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt said:

64? That seems like a lot. Is that a lot?

Yup similar number of planes as in a it’s like a carrier strike group

[956 Worldwide 34,393]

Finland will be one of the largest operators. They are serious about air defense. It’s a crazy number for a country their size, and more evidence of why they are an awesome NATO add. 

[Brisketexan 104,532]

51 minutes ago, Gengs1 said:

Yup similar number of planes as in a it’s like a carrier strike group

 

14 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Finland will be one of the largest operators. They are serious about air defense. It’s a crazy number for a country their size, and more evidence of why they are an awesome NATO add. 

Yep.  NATO just added a permanent carrier strike group in the Baltic.  Strategically, what a horribad outcome for Putin.  Dumbass.

[Parliament 14,121]

It's impressive to see the Free World rally around an important cause.  You wish that cause was ending world poverty or something.  But making war against evil will hafta work.

ETA 

I presume these F35's are gonna be made in the US?  Seems we can still build an Arsenal of Democracy.

Edited July 1, 2022 by Parliament

[956 Worldwide 34,393]

2 minutes ago, Parliament said:

It's impressive to see the Free World rally around an important cause.  You wish that cause was ending world poverty or something.  But making war against evil will hafta work.

ETA 

I presume these F35's are gonna be made in the US?  Seems we can still build an Arsenal of Democracy.

Main assembly line is in Fort Worth.  Italy has a line up and running operated by Leonardo which is only producing for Italy. The capacity in Ft Worth is about 150/year when things are going well. So this is something that customers have to consider.

The Swedes have a good indigenous defense industry and their Gripen is a VERY good fighter. They may see some more orders now that they are fully NATO and not only NATO interoperable.