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So...about Charlie Strong at USF...

horn_of_the_morning

By horn_of_the_morning
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Thatguy

Thatguy 8299

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4 hours ago, SydneyCarton said:

Snacks you full of shit motherfucker. Quentin Flowers was the 2016 AAC player of the year, an 11 game winner, and returned for charlie’s first year in 2017 and promptly got worse. His ypc dropped 2.2 yards and he dipped by 7 less rushing TDs. His completion percentage dropped from 62.5 to 53.1.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quinton_Flowers

He had nfl athleticism, as evidened by the fact hes still cashing an nfl check after being an undrafted free agent. This was a guy who was mentioned for heisman candidacy going into the 2017 season. Charlie had a QB, he just didnt know wtf to do with one that couldnt coach himself, much less a guy who fit a scheme he couldnt understand. Charlie Strong had an experienced, senior qb in 2017 and he and the team promptly performed poorer than they did in the preceding season, getting worse as the season wore on. 

Or do duel threat qbs not count as “real” qbs?

  Let's not get too cute with the stats. He had a crazy good 7.7 per carry that dropped to in the 5's, which was more to his average coming into the breakout year. Colt McCoy dropped back a little bit from 08 to 09, losing 6% completion percentage, 11 touchdowns total, -1.4 ypc, and -300yrds passing.

   They went 11-2 the year before Charlie and 10-2 Charlie's first.

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TreatyOak
TreatyOak

That's gonna look great one day in the USF locker room.  

SwanderedTalent
SwanderedTalent

Charlie's ban was on guns. He didn't have a problem with knives, as evidenced by all the times he brought one to a gunfight and we lost by 40 points

closetojumping
closetojumping

There are a lot of easy reasons to despise Chuckles. He shit all over the program. Like, he was terrifuckingbad. It’s a program we follow almost as a religion. That was bad enough. He also plead with

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SydneyCarton

SydneyCarton 47808

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15 minutes ago, Thatguy said:

  Let's not get too cute with the stats. He had a crazy good 7.7 per carry that dropped to in the 5's, which was more to his average coming into the breakout year. Colt McCoy dropped back a little bit from 08 to 09, losing 6% completion percentage, 11 touchdowns total, -1.4 ypc, and -300yrds passing.

   They went 11-2 the year before Charlie and 10-2 Charlie's first.

1) worse is worse. Thats a fact. 

2) you’re using words like “breakout” and comparing this guy to colt McCoy? Sounds to me like Charlie Strong had an excellent fucking QB on his hands. I appreciate you proving my point. 

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Thatguy

Thatguy 8299

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1 minute ago, SydneyCarton said:

1) worse is worse. Thats a fact. 

2) you’re using words like “breakout” and comparing this guy to colt McCoy? Sounds to me like Charlie Strong had an excellent fucking QB on his hands. I appreciate you proving my point. 

    They went 10 and 2 vs 11 and 2. That just means they played 13 games vs 12. My point with using Colt was to show a statistical slide is more about the opposition's adjustments YOY than coaching changes. Flowers is playing running back in the NFL not quarterback. So it seems that Strong had an excellent athlete on his hands and not a QB. Look, we can all agree that Strong isn't among the elite of the elite of head coaches. However, the guy isn't a flaming pile of dogshit either.

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SydneyCarton

SydneyCarton 47808

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33 minutes ago, Thatguy said:

    They went 10 and 2 vs 11 and 2. That just means they played 13 games vs 12. My point with using Colt was to show a statistical slide is more about the opposition's adjustments YOY than coaching changes. Flowers is playing running back in the NFL not quarterback. So it seems that Strong had an excellent athlete on his hands and not a QB. Look, we can all agree that Strong isn't among the elite of the elite of head coaches. However, the guy isn't a flaming pile of dogshit either.

1) The man’s original point was strong hasnt had a qb since bridgewater. I call absolute bullshit on that. Flowers was mentioned as a heisman candidate and was first team all aac after his junior year. That is a qb, unless youre telling me you dont think running qbs count as qbs? Ill be sure to relay that to eric crouch and antwon rande-el, among others. 

2) i said nfl athleticism, as an indicator of his natural abilities. Im aware hes a rb in the nfl. See my last sentence in the post above. 

3) I dont think charlie is a pos human being. Bur hes statisticaly the worst coach in UTs history, and I watched that 2017 usf team about 8 times. They got progressively worse as the season went on, and their margin of victory got smaller and smaller versus the “meat” of their schedule, culminating in a last second hail mary by their Not A QB versus tech to win.

You see a pattern of non development and regression at USF so bad that their school’s fans are penning missives to fire him after 2 years. At texas he was the worst statistical coach in our history. With Louisville, he had a great record. So far, the trendline is looking more like USF is the norm, and Louisville is the fluke. 

And no qb wouldnt even explain the  dozens of head scratching, stupid decisions he made as a coach, coin toss, penalties declined and accepted, etc. Who gets the blame for that if we cant blame his players? Personally, considering the flaiming trash heap herman stepped into that charlie left, while claiming the cake was baked, indicates the guy had either no fucking clue just how bad of a program and roster he had on his hands, or he might actually be a POS. But everyone else gets to pick what they think there. 

 

Edited by SydneyCarton
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Doc Reeves

Doc Reeves 6434

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It seems like it’s becoming a characteristic of this country to be dishonest with ourselves when it comes to things we care deeply about.

Charlie was a horrible coach. In literally every way. He was obviously out of his league and chosen simply because he was not Saban.

It was a simple mistake because of ego, desperation and hubris. Let’s accept it and move on.

He’s South Florida’s problem now.

 

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Johnny Sack

Johnny Sack 8397

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Charlie’s main problem is his sub 80 IQ.  He’s a fucking retard.  And the worst coach in our long history by far.  

I have no idea if he’s a nice guy.  He seems to take no responsibility for the dumpster fire teams he fields and instead throws the assistants he hires under the bus while also blaming the players.  

Also he appeared to be cheating on his wife with some rich boosters wife at Louisville 

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Johnny Sack

Johnny Sack 8397

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12 hours ago, Snacks said:

How many years does it normally take to recruit a really good QB?

1st season strong had had zero recruits, right? But he had Ash, Swoopes, Heard (HSFR) ... Ash played half a game. Swoopes finished the season...

2nd season, he had Swoopes, Heard and recruited Buechele.

3rd season, Buechele started as a true fr. Strong was fired.

When was he supposed to get this all world QB to play behind that terrible OL?

Anybody walking into that job was done from day one. Anybody.

This is the reason people are pissed at Mack... We are still recovering...really.


And I admit that strong wasn't the right guy. I wanted him to be, but I'm not sure Nick Saban would be any further along than where we are right now. It was going to take anybody 5 years to get to 10 wins.

There’s this thing called recruiting.  And also transfers. 

Is first Texas team had 5 players drafted.  And an undrafted free agent who is still on a 53 man roster. 

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Doc Reeves

Doc Reeves 6434

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1 minute ago, Johnny Sack said:

Charlie’s main problem is his sub 80 IQ.  He’s a fucking retard.  And the worst coach in our long history by far.  

I have no idea if he’s a nice guy.  He seems to take no responsibility for the dumpster fire teams he fields and instead throws the assistants he hires under the bus while also blaming the players.  

Also he appeared to be cheating on his wife with some rich boosters wife at Louisville 

Let’s not forget his dubious relationships with dirty coaches.  

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Johnny Sack

Johnny Sack 8397

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Just now, USMCHorn said:

The personal attacks on here about Charlie are starting to sound a bit aggy. Yes, he sucked as a head coach and we fired him for it. Outside of that what is there really to bitch about?

I guess we should all include the “he’s a great nice guy” white surly dudes criticizing a black coach disclaimer even though there isn’t much evidence for that.  

People here talk far more viciously about Mack Brown.  For some weird reason.  

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USMCHorn

USMCHorn 1369

Posted
Posted
Just now, Johnny Sack said:

I guess we should all include the “he’s a great nice guy” white surly dudes criticizing a black coach disclaimer even though there isn’t much evidence for that.  

People here talk far more viciously about Mack Brown.  For some weird reason.  

Who gives a fuck? He sucked, we fired him. That’s it. Move the fuck on.

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Barry_McCokiner

Barry_McCokiner 160

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7 hours ago, Longboard Horn said:

That's when I knew we were in trouble with him at the controls.

We were running hurry up with four minutes left and the lead as well

8 hours ago, Tired Horn said:

Lots of positions looked confused under Charlie.

Charlie looked confused

1 hour ago, Thatguy said:

    They went 10 and 2 vs 11 and 2. That just means they played 13 games vs 12. My point with using Colt was to show a statistical slide is more about the opposition's adjustments YOY than coaching changes. Flowers is playing running back in the NFL not quarterback. So it seems that Strong had an excellent athlete on his hands and not a QB. Look, we can all agree that Strong isn't among the elite of the elite of head coaches. However, the guy isn't a flaming pile of dogshit either.

He’s a flaming pile of dogshit.  USF is already trending down but I’m sure he’ll say the kids are trying too hard or that his replacement should win ten games because he baked the cake. 

 

He also has  a penchant of firing coaches mid year to save his own ass

21 minutes ago, USMCHorn said:

Who gives a fuck? He sucked, we fired him. That’s it. Move the fuck on.

You’re on a thread about Charlie. 

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CBHorn

CBHorn 414

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Charlie was a complete and utter failure.  His record at Texas was the worst for any head coach in Texas history.  He wasn't a good recruiter. All of his recruiting classes were ranked below our historical average. His offenses were dog crap, even when blessed with a 2000 yard rusher.  His defenses were so bad, just thinking about them makes me want to vomit.  His special teams was probably the worst I've ever seen in longhorn history.  He did nothing well.

Blaming Mack is a cop out.  Mack certainly didn't leave him a great team, but Charlie's teams got worse the longer he was here.  His only bowl game was his first year.  Mack's last three years were all better than any of Charlie's.

Herman's 2017 team lost 6 games.  Ironically, during those losses, they looked a lot like Charlies teams.

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Deej

Deej 76355

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Argue all you want that Charlie wasn't left any talent by Mack, didn't have a qb, etc., but what talent we had was so ill-prepared by Charlie come game time, that it was criminal. Any halfway decent coach could have squeezed 7 wins a season from his teams here.

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HornsOverIthaca

HornsOverIthaca 2333

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16 hours ago, Randolph Duke said:

In the 2014 UCLA game at Jerryworld, late in the game, on 4th down, with the game on the line and an inexperienced Swoopes as QB, with the play clock running down, instead of calling his last time out and getting things under control, Charlie decided to run a play even though multiple players were out of alignment and confused as to what was going on. Of course, the play went nowhere, UCLA took over on downs, and Charlie Strong went into the post-game press conference with a time out left to burn. That was my first Charlie Strong “wtf” moment. 

For me it was when they managed to screw up the coin toss.

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Bill Lumbergh

Bill Lumbergh 7168

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14 hours ago, Snacks said:

How many years does it normally take to recruit a really good QB?

Snacks, you usually seem to be an objective poster, but you have a blind spot with Charlie. 

Herman has two recruiting classes under his belt and has secured enough qb talent that some of his own recruits are transferring out bc the room is too crowded (yes, I know he didn't bring in Sam or Shane, but Rising, Thompson, and Johnson are a hell of a haul in two classes).

One huge difference in Charlie's tenure and Herman's so far is that Herman has been much more proactive filling the dangerous holes in our roster.  Calvin Anderson, Gary Johnson, and Tre Watson were not just obvious Texas guys who fell in our lap.  They were prioritized as positions of need and helped us get a 10 win season. 

Under Charlie, much like qb, I have no faith those positions would have been filled, and Charlie's apologists would be on here shrugging and saying "what's he supposed to do, he doesn't have the talent he needs to win."

It's his job to get the talent, and if he doesn't, he's failing. 

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Rimbo

Rimbo 25555

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3 hours ago, Johnny Sack said:

I guess we should all include the “he’s a great nice guy” white surly dudes criticizing a black coach disclaimer even though there isn’t much evidence for that.  

People here talk far more viciously about Mack Brown.  For some weird reason.  

The "nice guy" narrative has more to do with those of us who remember McWilliams.

And the reasons we talk viciously about Mack Brown should be well known by now.

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Rhinotx

Rhinotx 499

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1 hour ago, Bill Lumbergh said:

Snacks, you usually seem to be an objective poster, but you have a blind spot with Charlie. 

Herman has two recruiting classes under his belt and has secured enough qb talent that some of his own recruits are transferring out bc the room is too crowded (yes, I know he didn't bring in Sam or Shane, but Rising, Thompson, and Johnson are a hell of a haul in two classes).

One huge difference in Charlie's tenure and Herman's so far is that Herman has been much more proactive filling the dangerous holes in our roster.  Calvin Anderson, Gary Johnson, and Tre Watson were not just obvious Texas guys who fell in our lap.  They were prioritized as positions of need and helped us get a 10 win season. 

Under Charlie, much like qb, I have no faith those positions would have been filled, and Charlie's apologists would be on here shrugging and saying "what's he supposed to do, he doesn't have the talent he needs to win."

It's his job to get the talent, and if he doesn't, he's failing. 

Yep, Charlie seemed to coast in a lot of areas. We still have holes and lack depth in areas but at least you see progress and being proactive in hitting the GT market. I would also say Herman has less recruits that are grade or personality risks. 

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927 E. 41st

927 E. 41st 1124

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I will go on the "I think he was a nice guy " list. It's a quality missing in a number of people and coaches. I wanted him to succeed, just as I wanted Akers, McWilliams, and Mackovic to succeed. I wanted the rules of conduct to succeed.

Of all of our head coaches, current and ex, I would have a coffee or sit down to dinner with any of them except Mackovic. Just because I don't want to have a conversation with a self-important jackass. 

Now, if I may vent. To say Charlie is an awful head coach is an understatement of historic proportion. I think he would have done better without Patterson as AD (who wouldn't), but STILL would have FAILED MISERABLY! UCLA game left me with an awful feeling of foreboding. I turned out to be even worse than that. So while I would have a coffee with him, there are phrases  he could say that would make me leap across the table and go after him... "we just have to play better!",  ANYTHING containing "It's ALL about... (line work, turnovers, running the ball, stopping them on 3rd down, takeaways, ball control, keeping them off balance, fill in the blank). ", or ANY mention of having baked a cake.

I give ZERO credence to the whole "previous coach left him with nothing" argument, that's someone being an apologist for a bad coach. Good coaches take what they are given and show improvement game over game and season over season. Yes, other factors come into play, but we got worse, a LOT worse as we went along. USF is now experiencing the same thing, the explanation is so obvious it's painful.

Thank you for putting up with my venting, I feel better now.

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USMCHorn

USMCHorn 1369

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Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, Dr. Beeper said:

Whether or not he was a nice guy is wholly irrelevant.

Being a good person is absolutely a part of being the head coach at Texas. Wtf are you talking about? Charlie’s couldn’t win games to save his life, and was rightfully fired for it. That said dude generally recruited well and kept us out of scandals during a time when Baylor allowed rape and aggy had a drunk at the helm. Nobody here believed the cheating allegations when Charlie was our coach, the same way we ignored the allegations against Herman. Are you going to switch up if Herman starts to suck?

 

My point is this, Charlie failed to perform and was let go because of it. If we want to bag on his coaching skills, cool, but to attack him as a person is grade school bullshit and below us. If this makes me a “Charlie apologist” what does hating on the man who no longer works here make you?

Edited by USMCHorn
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Nivek

Nivek 16739

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Posted
There’s this thing called recruiting.  And also transfers. 
Is first Texas team had 5 players drafted.  And an undrafted free agent who is still on a 53 man roster. 

Situations matter. The injuries and situation he inherited was difficult to overcome. I think he should have hit the juco route harder.
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Doc Reeves

Doc Reeves 6434

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, USMCHorn said:

Nobody here believed the cheating allegations when Charlie was our coach, the same way we ignored the allegations against Herman.

Oh, I whole heartily believed and still believe it, I just didn’t care. Same with Herman. 

 

The thing with Charlie is I believed he was an actual fraud and I haven’t seen anything to prove otherwise.

Edited by Doc Reeves
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Barry_McCokiner

Barry_McCokiner 160

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, USMCHorn said:

Being a good person is absolutely a part of being the head coach at Texas. Wtf are you talking about? Charlie’s couldn’t win games to save his life, and was rightfully fired for it. That said dude generally recruited well and kept us out of scandals during a time when Baylor allowed rape and aggy had a drunk at the helm. Nobody here believed the cheating allegations when Charlie was our coach, the same way we ignored the allegations against Herman. Are you going to switch up if Herman starts to suck?

 

My point is this, Charlie failed to perform and was let go because of it. If we want to bag on his coaching skills, cool, but to attack him as a person is grade school bullshit and below us. If this makes me a “Charlie apologist” what does hating on the man who no longer works here make you?

There’s a 20 page fire herman thread.  Many turned on him well before charlie

 

 

good for Charlie for not allowing rape

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Vito Andolini

Vito Andolini 9067

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Posted
On 1/15/2019 at 10:07 AM, SwanderedTalent said:

fuck, just watch the first 30 seconds of this

 

Just checking this thread for the first time in a while, and I can always remember the name of this bowl where we shit shat the bed so bad. If you’ll recall, this was the first ever Freedom Bowl, so some called it “the new Freedom Bowl.”

New Freedom is (or was) a brand of feminine hygiene products. So, whenever I recall our team looking like they were in need of a tampon against Iowa and Chuck Long, I just remember the new Feeedom Bowl. I know, CSB.

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Johnny Sack

Johnny Sack 8397

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49 minutes ago, Bobby_Batronic said:

Herman has always had a fairly coherent offensive vision and system running Urban Meyer’s power spread attack. 

Charlie had Shawn Watson. 

Too bad Red McCombs and the evil boosters who wanted Strong to fail made him hire Watson. And didn’t allow him to recruit high school or transfer QBs 

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Walden Ponderer

Walden Ponderer 12638

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Posted

Charlie seemed/still publicly seems like a nice guy. Race has nothing to do with such a statement, as there are plenty of black assholes, just like their white counterparts.

That having been said, the record doesn't lie: Texas has never had a worse head coach than Charlie Strong. The only question left is why we have to keep dissecting that reality.

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sushihorn

sushihorn 3233

Posted
Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, Walden Ponderer said:

Charlie seemed/still publicly seems like a nice guy. Race has nothing to do with such a statement, as there are plenty of black assholes, just like their white counterparts.

That having been said, the record doesn't lie: Texas has never had a worse head coach than Charlie Strong. The only question left is why we have to keep dissecting that reality.

Institutional scab picking is a way of life for big time CFB fans.  It lessens over time but never completely goes away.  Some people still talk about McWilliams and his Shock the Nation Tour.

Edited by sushihorn
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Magus Ossis

Magus Ossis 2751

Posted
Posted (edited)
50 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

How long are we going to continue to talk about Charlie Strong?

A while.

1. He is the immediate predecessor of our current HC

2. We are still a bit PTSD from back-to-back-to-back losing seasons

3. It is the offseason

4. We haven’t argued it into a consensus (yeah, like that would happen on the internet)

5. Surly gon’ Surl

Edited by Magus Ossis
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BrazilHorn

BrazilHorn 6575

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Posted

I went to that UCLA game and watched a ninth string QB beat Texas after a fumble-fucked coin toss and piss poor clock mgmt

i went to the Texas bowl and watched Texas get face raped by piggies and heard Reliant rock with the chants of inbred toothless dick weasels 

I went to South Bend and saw Texas get plowed by the Irish in a stadium & facilities that make the Cotton Bowl look like a beacon of football modernity. 

CS May be a nice guy but he can get fucked. Flat out robbed UT. 

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totallynotabuttpirate

totallynotabuttpirate 5329

Posted
Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, BrazilHorn said:

I went to that UCLA game and watched a ninth string QB beat Texas after a fumble-fucked coin toss and piss poor clock mgmt

i went to the Texas bowl and watched Texas get face raped by piggies and heard Reliant rock with the chants of inbred toothless dick weasels 

I went to South Bend and saw Texas get plowed by the Irish in a stadium & facilities that make the Cotton Bowl look like a beacon of football modernity. 

 CS May be a nice guy but he can get fucked. Flat out robbed UT. 

I was there at ND for that gangbang. My family had to witness it as well. #NeverForget

Edited by totallynotabuttpirate
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