Federal District Court Rules That National Retailers Can Sell Liquor

[Mack Tripper 696]

Quote

Judge's ruling would let Texas consumers buy booze from Walmart and Costco

Unlike residents of more than 30 U.S. states and many foreign nations, Texans who want to buy a fifth of vodka or bourbon can't find their favorite spirit on the shelves of their local Walmart or Costco. A landmark ruling issued by a federal court in Austin could soon change that. 

A protectionist Texas law that has kept Walmart, Costco and other giant retailers from selling hard liquor was found unconstitutional by a federal judge this week, prompting cheers from free-market advocates — and vows of a quick appeal from one of the parties on the losing side.

The Texas law that was struck down — unique in the United States — forbids publicly traded businesses from owning liquor stores while allowing family-owned companies to grow into giant chains without fear of competition from large national or international corporations.  

...

The Texas Package Stores Association, which has fought to keep the law on the books and intervened as a defendant in the lawsuit, promised to appeal the ruling to the U.S. Court of Appeals in New Orleans. 

 

 

https://www.texastribune.org/2018/03/21/judges-ruling-would-let-consumers-buy-booze-walmart-and-costco/

 

 

[kevwun 15896]

Now about that noon on Sundays nonsense. 

[BottleRocket 647]

I don't get it.  I always thought that Walmart didn't sell liquor because they didn't want to sell liquor.  Costco already sells liquor. 

[Washpark 176]

Just now, BottleRocket said:

I don't get it.  I always thought that Walmart didn't sell liquor because they didn't want to sell liquor.  Costco already sells liquor. 

Nah. They have been lobbying to sell booze for a while. 

[DaysOff 7974]

Still love me some Spec's. And that Lisa Key. 

Edited March 27, 2018 by DaysOff

[BurntOrange&White 40008]

1 minute ago, kevwun said:

Now about that noon on Sundays nonsense. 

Let’s tackle the 9pm bullshit first.

[HenryJames 66171]

I can now buy all of my alcohol at Target.

[Dr Fear 1268]

So how does Costco do it? They are still a publicly traded corporation.

[Dr Fear 1268]

2 minutes ago, Dr Fear said:

So how does Costco do it? They are still a publicly traded corporation.

Granted, I have never been in one, just saw the sign.  Maybe they just sell wine.

[kevwun 15896]

Costco's way around it is that the liquor store has a separate entrance.  It's dumb since it's right next door and part of the same building, but it gets around the law.

Edited March 27, 2018 by kevwun

[TexasFootball18 48]

Just now, kevwun said:

Costco's way around is is that the liquor store has a separate entrance.

and this isn't just a Texas thing. It's like that in several states. Florida Winn Dixie has liquor stores right next to the main grocery store, but a 'different' store, costco exactly the same

 

[Dr Fear 1268]

3 minutes ago, kevwun said:

Costco's way around it is that the liquor store has a separate entrance.  It's dumb since it's right next door and part of the same building, but it gets around the law.

That still doesn't explain the publicly traded company prohibition.

[RPM 26354]

7 day sales 7a - 2a or just go 24/7.

[1978horn 896]

10 minutes ago, kevwun said:

Costco's way around it is that the liquor store has a separate entrance.  It's dumb since it's right next door and part of the same building, but it gets around the law.

You also don;t have to be a Costco member to buy it.  Anyone can walk in and buy.

[pops 7006]

6 minutes ago, Dr Fear said:

That still doesn't explain the publicly traded company prohibition.

Owned by a different entity that is not publicly traded I'll assume. 

[Mack Tripper 696]

6 minutes ago, Dr Fear said:

That still doesn't explain the publicly traded company prohibition.

Because it’s not Costco selling the liquor. It’s WB Liquor. 

[Neonmoon 38130]

I hope this kills those fucking worthless middlemen Glazier and Republic. 

They provide zero value. 

 

[BurntOrange&White 40008]

Costco sells this 

 

 

 

[Capt 235]

12 minutes ago, RPM said:

7 day sales 7a - 2a or just go 24/7.

My liver votes 7 days 7a-2a

 

[Jerry Callo 8727]

Twin Liquors is fucked.

[4th_and_18 687]

11 minutes ago, Jerry Callo said:

Twin Liquors is fucked.

and spec's

if the appeal fails as expected then there will need to be a special session

[kevwun 15896]

I think there will still be room for places like Spec's and Total Wine unless Walmart decides to sell stuff at cost until they go out of business.  I doubt they will offer a selection as good as the nice places do now.

Edited March 27, 2018 by kevwun

[4th_and_18 687]

someone correct me if the whiskey isn't in full effect yet:

twin and specs operate so many stores because they use the family ownership exception of the 5 permit limit

the judge ruled that family ownership exception is unconstitutional because of equal treatment, but did not rule that the 5 permit limit was unconstitutional

so how do specs and twin legally operate more than 5 stores? special session.

 

[G650 14277]

Virginia still has state owned ABC stores

[Rollo Tomassi 80]

this can be a game changer for sure.  

[Mack Tripper 696]

26 minutes ago, Jerry Callo said:

Twin Liquors is fucked.

More than 30 states already allow the Costcos and Walmarts of the world to sell liquor. They still have plenty of liquor stores. 

[Llano Estacado 1257]

43 minutes ago, Mack Tripper said:

Because it’s not Costco selling the liquor. It’s WB Liquor. 

Correct. You currently can't buy Kirkland branded products at the ones in Texas. As others have stated anyone can walk-in no Costco Membership needed.

[woohorn 1131]

45 minutes ago, Mack Tripper said:

Because it’s not Costco selling the liquor. It’s WB Liquor. 

Fact. The Texas stores next to Costco don't sell the good Kirkland's shit and they accept any form of payment. They are not Costco (yet).

Say what you will about Walmart, but they have been fighting the good fight on this issue for years and they appear to have won one for the good guys.

[Napoleon 8700]

23 minutes ago, kevwun said:

I think there will still be room for places like Spec's and Total Wine unless Walmart decides to sell stuff at cost until they go out of business.  I doubt they will offer a selection as good as the nice places do now.

This is the kicker.

I used to live in California and Trader Joe's had the best liquor prices (but an extremely limited variety and their own brands kept creeping in) & wine quality at low prices, but booze could still be found in every grocery store.

Total Wines & More had a much better selection and Walmart only offered swill.

Some will be run out of business by this, but there will still be plenty of room for companies that are not Walmart & Costco.

Edited March 27, 2018 by Napoleon

[Mack Tripper 696]

Hopefully, this is the first step towards getting rid of the Sunday prohibition.  The Texas Package Stores Association has always argued that even if stores could open on Sundays, they would prefer to stay closed because paying employees for an extra work day is more than what the sales would be.  Costco, Walmart, Target, etc. aren't going to be this lazy. 

Edited March 27, 2018 by Mack Tripper

[ToY 18]

16 minutes ago, 4th_and_18 said:

so how do specs and twin legally operate more than 5 stores? special session.

 

Because each family member can "own" 5 stores or something like that.  They're definitely exploiting a loophole so they have no room to complain at this.

[Smax 3800]

23 minutes ago, kevwun said:

I think there will still be room for places like Spec's and Total Wine unless Walmart decides to sell stuff at cost until they go out of business.  I doubt they will offer a selection as good as the nice places do now.

 

Agree, walmarts in other states sell mid and low priced booze. You need to go to better stores to buy what most here drink not to mention wine. Specs downtown has a damn good selection of wine from all over, wallyword and costco wont stock that inventory.

[Mack Tripper 696]

1 minute ago, ToY said:

Because each family member can "own" 5 stores or something like that.  They're definitely exploiting a loophole so they have no room to complain at this.

Yes, and family is broadly defined. So the cousins and in laws of the dancing monkey in the Spec's commercials all have 5 stores. 

[DaysOff 7974]

57 minutes ago, Neonmoon said:

I hope this kills those fucking worthless middlemen Glazier and Republic. 

They provide zero value. 

 

I guess grocery would learn quick, but it seems they rely on those two on what to sell and how to market it. I could be wrong though. 

[Anton Chigurh 3319]

25 minutes ago, G650 said:

Virginia still has state owned ABC stores

Can’t be worse than Utah. Even Colorado sucks with their beer laws (though they are in the process of fixing it). 

[Washpark 176]

Members mark vodka coming your way!

[ShaggyBevo RIP 3868]

1 hour ago, TexasFootball18 said:

and this isn't just a Texas thing. It's like that in several states. Florida Winn Dixie has liquor stores right next to the main grocery store, but a 'different' store, costco exactly the same

 

In Ohio they are within the grocery stores with their own registers but have walls(not all the way to the ceiling) and door.  The grocers do have to buyout someone's liquor license as they are X licenses per Y people.

Edited March 27, 2018 by ShaggyBevo RIP

[Brothahorn 10087]

1 hour ago, kevwun said:

Now about that noon on Sundays nonsense. 

 

1 hour ago, Bevo VIII said:

Let’s tackle the 9pm bullshit first.

Why not both? Go big or go home.

[BurntOrange&White 40008]

1 minute ago, Brothahorn said:

 

Why not both? Go big or go home.

The church crowd in Texas would never go for the Sunday part though, realistically.

[rage-a-holic 4470]

Kirkland liquor in Texas. Praise Jebus.

 

[APMP 688]

Judge Pittman is good people

[swraith 347]

Is the perception that Spec, Total Wine, and other’s have significant gross margins such that big box stores will drive prices even lower?  I got the sense that Spec’s prices were already competitive. So is this just a convenience thing to buy your booze while grocery shopping?  Or people really crave Kirkland brand booze?

 

i would rather get rid of the 9pm cutoff and the Sunday noon prohibition. Those are far more inconvenient. 

Edited March 28, 2018 by swraith

[Paco 1934]

Anything that can chip away at the cocksucking Texas liquor lobby is good with me.

[Mac8111 2116]

Not going to quote all the different post, but here are my comments to those things mentioned above:

 

Sunday selling - Most liquor stores do not want to open on Sunday because it is not worth the overhead.  Its not like people are going to starting drinking a bunch more liquor because they can buy it on Sunday.  You have already been trained to stock up.  The only incremental sales would be half pints being sold to the bums.  (No offense to some of you)

Texas will remain a three tier system, so Glazers and Republic will still have their level of involvement.  There are no warehouse options for chains like there is in FL or CA. 

 

As already stated, the Costco liquor stores in Texas are not owned by Costco.  

 

The little neighborhood liquor stores would be devastated.  It would be very interesting to see what HEB does with all those shopping centers with Twin Liquors sitting in them.  I know for a fact that HEB isn't pushing for the law to change, but they also know they can't afford to be the last major retailer to make the move if the law does change. 

 

 

 

[Mack Tripper 696]

1 hour ago, Mac8111 said:

Sunday selling - Most liquor stores do not want to open on Sunday because it is not worth the overhead.  Its not like people are going to starting drinking a bunch more liquor because they can buy it on Sunday.  You have already been trained to stock up.  The only incremental sales would be half pints being sold to the bums.  (No offense to some of you)

Sorry but I don’t believe this. And even assuming for the sake of argument it is true, those stores are free to stay closed on Sundays to their hearts’ content, while other stores are open for business.  But to have a statewide law prohibiting all stores from selling alcohol on Sundays, whether they want to or not, is just silly and archaic and anticompetitive and discriminatory in the sense that most other states do not have such arbitrary restrictions. Why shouldn’t someone in a supposedly free market be able to sell their goods when they want to? 

[Mack Tripper 696]

On a related note, with the traffic they get on Sundays, Costco would be making well above incremental sales. I imagine the same would hold true for the others like Target, Sam’s, and Walmat. And liquor is heavily taxed with that additional revenue going to the state. There’s no legitimate reason for prohibiting stores from selling liquor on Sundays. If they want to stay closed, so be it. 

[Brothahorn 10087]

14 hours ago, Bevo VIII said:

The church crowd in Texas would never go for the Sunday part though, realistically.

Probably right. Even though those fuckers would be the first to take advantage if it was legal.

[thunderlounge 7935]

15 hours ago, kevwun said:

I think there will still be room for places like Spec's and Total Wine unless Walmart decides to sell stuff at cost until they go out of business.  I doubt they will offer a selection as good as the nice places do now.

 

Nah. Wally, sams, and even the gas stations sell liquor here. We still have individual liquor stores as well. 

[HouTex 1894]

The main problem in Texas is the three tier system itself.  Take wine, for example. People in many other states and DC can get high end wine for about 10-20% less than the price at Specs.  And Specs usually has the lowest price in the state.  We should rewrite all of our liquor laws to make the market more competitive.

[solamente73 1132]

Re: cut-off times, prohibitions, etc., I'm not going to quote them all from above.....

Besides not being able to buy liquor at the local grocery store, the whole not being able to buy liquor at all on Sundays really sucks.  At least we can buy beer/wine on Sundays, though more than once I've been grocery shopping on Sunday morning, roll up to the check-out with beer and/or wine in the cart with my groceries, and been told I can't buy it yet.  D'oh!

As far as when to stop selling liquor/beer/wine on a given day, I probably shouldn't be in public (read: driving) after 9PM when alcohol is involved, so I'm more or less ambivalent there. (Unless I can Uber over Beer/Wine/Liquor after 9PM in case of emergency.  That would be cool.)

So, how would local laws impact the decision in the OP?  For example, would dry/damp cities in the Metroplex have to allow Costco and Walmart to sell liquor inside their city limits?