The Italy Thread

[52-80 19213]

Staking my opinion that food in Italy, as a whole, is less good than everyone gives it credit for.

But Rome being below "average for any major city", is one of the more inane statements thrown around in this thread.

[G650 14273]

2 hours ago, 52-80 said:

Staking my opinion that food in Italy, as a whole, is less good than everyone gives it credit for.

 

I would eat Italian food every day of my life if my wife allowed me to.

[52-80 19213]

45 minutes ago, G650 said:

 

 

I would eat Italian food every day of my life if my wife allowed me to.

Shouldve just gotten an italian wife

[AustinMT 952]

3 hours ago, 52-80 said:

Staking my opinion that food in Italy, as a whole, is less good than everyone gives it credit for.

But Rome being below "average for any major city", is one of the more inane statements thrown around in this thread.

Biggest thing I learned from eating Italian food in Italy is how much we over-sauce Italian food in the states

[52-80 19213]

1 minute ago, AustinMT said:

Biggest thing I learned from eating Italian food in Italy is how much we over-sauce Italian food in the states

and probably overcomplicated too

[Gil Bang 25985]

The best thing about Italy is the fact that they treat meals as a relaxing thing and you never feel like you’re being rushed out of the restaurant

[Biff Tannen 45697]

42 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

Shouldve just gotten an italian wife

Yep.  It's awesome.

[G650 14273]

58 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

and probably overcomplicated too

No probably about it.

[Loco 3753]

14 hours ago, AustinMT said:

Biggest thing I learned from eating Italian food in Italy is how much we over-sauce Italian food in the states

Italian-Americans have fooled you into thinking they know how to cook Italian food.   Garlic goes in everything!!!!11!!  They don't. It's a kin to saying Panda Express is chinese food or Taco Bell is Mexican.   Their grandparents came over like a 100 years ago and the recipes have been lost or morphed to fit local ingredients.

Just try and find guanciale to make an honest Carbonara.  Turns out you can't. (Amazon has it but it seems like it might be hit or miss)   Nobody carries it and it might not even be legal to import.  

Watch some Italian chefs lose their shit watching Gringos   Turn on CC

 

[52-80 19213]

31 minutes ago, Loco said:

Italian-Americans have fooled you into thinking they know how to cook Italian food.   Garlic goes in everything!!!!11!!  They don't. It's a kin to saying Panda Express is chinese food or Taco Bell is Mexican.   Their grandparents came over like a 100 years ago and the recipes have been lost or morphed to fit local ingredients.

Just try and find guanciale to make an honest Carbonara.  Turns out you can't. (Amazon has it but it seems like it might be hit or miss)   Nobody carries it and it might not even be legal to import.  

Watch some Italian chefs lose their shit watching Gringos   Turn on CC

 

I agree with the Spirit of your post but

 

(1) garlic does go in everything

(2) guanciale was easy to find in cm/wf even a decade ago when I lived in houston

[Loco 3753]

https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2013/05/16/184553890/no-more-smuggling-many-cured-italian-meats-coming-to-america

Legalized in 2013...  you really have to stop shopping at those black-market meat shops or you'll end up with the Peroni Virus

 

[52-80 19213]

Even those snobby californians got guanciale in at their whole foods in 2009

 

https://www.chowhound.com/post/la-quercia-guanciale-hillcrest-foods-san-diego-670633

 

 

Edited January 27, 2020 by 52-80

[Loco 3753]

Well, we ain't got shit in the quiet backwater of S Florida.  There are few stores here run by honest to god, from Italy, Italians.   They make their own cheeses etc...  I went in and asked them.  They gave me the name of a few smaller specialty markets...  went to those and got shutdown.  Was told just to just use Panchetta or order off Amazon.

[52-80 19213]

1 hour ago, Loco said:

Well, we ain't got shit in the quiet backwater of S Florida.  There are few stores here run by honest to god, from Italy, Italians.   They make their own cheeses etc...  I went in and asked them.  They gave me the name of a few smaller specialty markets...  went to those and got shutdown.  Was told just to just use Panchetta or order off Amazon.

Yeah usually I just drop to pancetta, and failing that, cubed bacon.

Apparently there's an American company making guanc (it may very well be what i bought), and they distribute across FL particularly whole foods

http://laquercia.us/find_stores

 

 

[Loco 3753]

6 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

Yeah usually I just drop to pancetta, and failing that, cubed bacon.

Apparently there's an American company making guanc (it may very well be what i bought), and they distribute across FL particularly whole foods

http://laquercia.us/find_stores

 

 

I checked TJ's, Lucky's, Whole Foods, Fresh Market, Publix, Winn Dixie, Doris' Italian Market, Il Paesano ...etc

Was highly motivated this was going to be a Valentine's Day Dinner and pussy was on the line.

[52-80 19213]

9 minutes ago, Loco said:

Was highly motivated this was going to be a Valentine's Day Dinner and pussy was on the line.

Isn't the surefire recipe for that just Olive Garden + Bottomless Pasta?

[Loco 3753]

19 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

Isn't the surefire recipe for that just Olive Garden + Bottomless Pasta?

Sounds like something Tiger Woods would say.

[Saint Austin 745]

This thread has me psyched. The wife and I are heading to a friend's wedding this summer in Tuscany. In all, we'll have three days in Rome, two days in Florence, and two in rural Tuscany with exact locations TBD. Aside from places already mentioned, where are the best places to eat in Rome and Florence, and where else in Tuscany should we visit/stay? Siena is an early contender, but I'm interested to hear what y'all think.

[Biff Tannen 45697]

36 minutes ago, Saint Austin said:

This thread has me psyched. The wife and I are heading to a friend's wedding this summer in Tuscany. In all, we'll have three days in Rome, two days in Florence, and two in rural Tuscany with exact locations TBD. Aside from places already mentioned, where are the best places to eat in Rome and Florence, and where else in Tuscany should we visit/stay? Siena is an early contender, but I'm interested to hear what y'all think.

Quattro Leoni in Florence is fucking great.  Specifically the Fiochetti with pears.  Damn.

[Loco 3753]

18 minutes ago, Saint Austin said:

This thread has me psyched. The wife and I are heading to a friend's wedding this summer in Tuscany. In all, we'll have three days in Rome, two days in Florence, and two in rural Tuscany with exact locations TBD. Aside from places already mentioned, where are the best places to eat in Rome and Florence, and where else in Tuscany should we visit/stay? Siena is an early contender, but I'm interested to hear what y'all think.

You'll have a great time.

My recommendations:  Take them for what they are worth, others on this thread have a lot more experience than I do...

Rome: 

• Go get some Supli in Trastevere
• Get a walking food tour on the 1st night  help you get your bearings and try some stuff you'd probably never find.  Then you can re-visit later
• Wanted to do this Villa D'Este in Trivoli  *there are NO water pumps*   
• Save this for the plane... The more you know .gif

 

 

Tuscany:

• Loved Pienza, but it's tiny.
• Siena One of the best meals I've had in Italy.  ... Osteria Da Divo
• Quiet afternoon outdoors...  Really enjoyed just relaxing    bring bathing suit   Bagni San Flippo
• I liked visiting Siena, but I would want to stay in a smaller town or in a villa in the countryside.  You'll need a car in Tuscany anyways.  Avoid ZTLs

Florence:

• EABOD  don't speed, better yet don't drive in or near Florence
• Wasn't my cup of tea, when I was there it seemed more crowded and Disney-like

[G650 14273]

6 hours ago, Loco said:

Just try and find guanciale to make an honest Carbonara.  

This is the bane of my existence. But done with pancetta is totally acceptable. The part most people, as in like 99.9% of people, fuck up is using the pasta heat properly to get the eggs silky enough. If you are good at that then even bacon works pretty well.

[texasdago 7576]

Roman food is excellent... Roman food in the touristy places is decidedly meh.  Dishes like Cacio e Pepe, Carbonara, Amatriciana, Abbacchio a Scottadito are exceptional when made properly.  Suppli' are so simple and so divine.  And the cuisine changes from town to town, valley to valley.  Yes, the food in Northern Italy is great but what does that mean?  My hometown of Bologna has drastically different food that Torino or Bolzano.  The lardo you get in Valle d'Aosta is completely different than how they serve it in Modena.  And the south?  Siciliy has completely different food than what you get in Puglia.  The food in Puglia is amazing, fresh, usually healthy and cheap.

 

 

 

Or passatelli in Le Marche or Romagna... something you will never find in the US but is so good.  (Basically pasta made out of bread crumbs, cheese and eggs and pushed through a strainer to make the shapes)

Edited January 27, 2020 by texasdago

[McCroskey 1505]

Do y'all mind if I dust this thread off?

Taking the family on a COVID tested flight in July for 14-15 nights.  Have pretty much carte blanche as an itinerary so planning to show the kids Rome for a few days (have a killer AirBNB lined up) and then explore the rest of the country in the rest of the allotted time.  Trying to finalize everything in the next week or two so I can stop worrying about it.

I don't think I've ever been more excited to GTFO of the states for a vacation, though part of me really wonders what we're walking into.

[VABuckeye 2472]

Pick a region. Italy is far too big and diverse to explore the rest of the country in two weeks. 

[Mo Horn 8853]

Looking forward to hearing how things are. We are scheduled for two weeks in September. Doing Rome, Cinque Terre, and Tuscany.

[Biff Tannen 45697]

10 hours ago, VABuckeye said:

Pick a region. Italy is far too big and diverse to explore the rest of the country in two weeks. 

This.  I did parts of Tuscany, Cinque Terre, Florence, Como, and the Dolomites in 17 days and we were going full bore the whole time.  It was great, but no way could we have done Rome and southern Italy also.

Edited June 2, 2021 by Biff Tannen

[South Austin 52535]

10 hours ago, VABuckeye said:

Pick a region. Italy is far too big and diverse to explore the rest of the country in two weeks. 

Agree with this and with Biff.

In 2014 we did Milan, Barolo, Cinque Terre, Verona, and Venice over about 14 days.  It was fun, but exhausting. 

[Wiler77 1567]

10 hours ago, VABuckeye said:

Pick a region. Italy is far too big and diverse to explore the rest of the country in two weeks. 

Good advice.  First trip to Italy we did Rome and Florence for a week, and there were still things we missed out on.

2nd trip we did Amalfi Coast for 5 days, and could have spent more time.

I want to spend 2 weeks just in Tuscany.

[Hate 20130]

Third or fourth picking a couple of places for 2 weeks. At most, I would do 3 cities given your time line.

Our second trip we did Rome, Siena, Pisa, Bologna, Venice and Florence. It’s doable as the train rides between the cities aren’t more than 3 hours or so, but in hindsight it was a little too much.

Don’t go to Pisa unless you just really want to see the Leaning Tower. There isn’t a whole lot to do there other than the Tower.

[BHMCruiser 1814]

On 5/7/2019 at 7:32 AM, South Austin said:

 

Try driving into Cinque Terre.  My wife drove us on narrow roads along a 200-foot sheer drop, and I must have lost two pounds of water weight sweating the whole way. 

And that was stressful? Huh that's weird

Edited June 2, 2021 by BHMCruiser

[South Austin 52535]

Turns out she was a better driver than a wife.

[gmr548 16590]

Pick a region. Italy is far too big and diverse to explore the rest of the country in two weeks. 

Dilly dilly. Our first trip we were in Rome for about a week with a day trip to Florence. The whole-nation highlight reel is always a mistake in Europe.

[gmr548 16590]

part of me really wonders what we're walking into.

I’m not really sure what you mean by this, but given the literal answer is two weeks in Italy in the summer with a huge chunk of the typical summer crowd gone, get excited.

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19139]

I am planning on a week in Venice next year, I think.  

[VABuckeye 2472]

I love Venice but I really want to rent an apartment in Montalcino or Montepulciano or Greve right on the piazza for a while and just live like a local.  The food, the wine, the views.  Amazing.

[McCroskey 1505]

17 hours ago, VABuckeye said:

Pick a region. Italy is far too big and diverse to explore the rest of the country in two weeks. 

Agree and that was my bad in fucking up what I said...I didn't mean to suggest we'd see the entire country in two weeks but we do have flexibility to really go anywhere outside of Rome and I figured a couple of stays would be very enjoyable.  Venice is high on my list since I've never been although my wife has and she thinks 2-3 nights will be plenty there, which leaves roughly a week for somewhere else.

Thanks for all the feedback...when y'all are hitting some of these regions like Tuscany...is a car rental an absolute must or can you get around moderately well enough between trains and cabs?    When I looked at a car rental outside of Florence the rates were just absurd.

[VABuckeye 2472]

I love driving around Italy when I get to a place that I'll spend a little time in.  Be careful of the signs and speed limits.  They love to send tickets to foreigners.

Trains between metro areas like Florence and Rome and drive in the countryside.  Just know that a LOT of Italians are bicyclists so watch those blind curves in the hills.

ETA: There is no way I'd drive in Rome or Naples.  It's insanity. 

Edited June 2, 2021 by VABuckeye

[conVINCEd 21469]

5 minutes ago, McCroskey said:

Agree and that was my bad in fucking up what I said...I didn't mean to suggest we'd see the entire country in two weeks but we do have flexibility to really go anywhere outside of Rome and I figured a couple of stays would be very enjoyable.  Venice is high on my list since I've never been although my wife has and she thinks 2-3 nights will be plenty there, which leaves roughly a week for somewhere else.

Thanks for all the feedback...when y'all are hitting some of these regions like Tuscany...is a car rental an absolute must or can you get around moderately well enough between trains and cabs?    When I looked at a car rental outside of Florence the rates were just absurd.

Rental car rates are insane everywhere right now.

[Biff Tannen 45697]

30 minutes ago, VABuckeye said:

I love driving around Italy when I get to a place that I'll spend a little time in.  Be careful of the signs and speed limits.  They love to send tickets to foreigners.

Trains between metro areas like Florence and Rome and drive in the countryside.  Just know that a LOT of Italians are bicyclists so watch those blind curves in the hills.

ETA: There is no way I'd drive in Rome or Naples.  It's insanity. 

I rented a convertible BMW and drove all over the country.  It was phenomenal.  Tuscany especially.  Driving in the big cities, especially Florence, not so much.  You're just asking to end up with a ticket for being in a restricted area and it's basically impossible anyway, but you can park outside and walk in.  Same with Siena.  

[Grimas 670]

I haven't seen this mentioned but do a search for agriturismo's in the Tuscany region if you are looking for cool places to stay (agriturismo.it) - we did it a few years ago when we lived in Europe and had a blast.  They are basically family farms/vinyards where they have converted part of it to apartments and you usually get meals with the family and other guests if you want... Near Rome, we stayed at a ranch that was inside the caldera of a volcano and had a huge apartment 93 rooms and a kitchen and living room) 20 minutes  south of Florence that was something like $150/night for 4 of us...

[Biff Tannen 45697]

Just now, Grimas said:

I haven't seen this mentioned but do a search for agriturismo's in the Tuscany region if you are looking for cool places to stay (agriturismo.it) - we did it a few years ago when we lived in Europe and had a blast.  They are basically family farms/vinyards where they have converted part of it to apartments and you usually get meals with the family and other guests if you want... Near Rome, we stayed at a ranch that was inside the caldera of a volcano and had a huge apartment 93 rooms and a kitchen and living room) 20 minutes  south of Florence that was something like $150/night for 4 of us...

Yes. This man is wise. 

[Hate 20130]

5 hours ago, VABuckeye said:

I love Venice but I really want to rent an apartment in Montalcino or Montepulciano or Greve right on the piazza for a while and just live like a local.  The food, the wine, the views.  Amazing.

I love Montalcino.  The fort at the top of the hill is awesome, even if it is a little worrisome climbing up those stairs.

[Biff Tannen 45697]

1 minute ago, Hate said:

I love Montalcino.  The fort at the top of the hill is awesome, even if it is a little worrisome climbing up those stairs.

I have three bottles of Brunello aging from there right now. 

[Grimas 670]

13 minutes ago, Grimas said:

I haven't seen this mentioned but do a search for agriturismo's in the Tuscany region if you are looking for cool places to stay (agriturismo.it) - we did it a few years ago when we lived in Europe and had a blast.  They are basically family farms/vinyards where they have converted part of it to apartments and you usually get meals with the family and other guests if you want... Near Rome, we stayed at a ranch that was inside the caldera of a volcano and had a huge apartment 93 rooms and a kitchen and living room) 20 minutes  south of Florence that was something like $150/night for 4 of us...

Dug through my emails after I posted and it was closer to $250 a night but here's the place we went to south of Florence:  https://www.letorri.com/ It's been a few years but the site above gives you lots of options...

Details:

I confirm you with this e-mail, availability for 4 nights from 13th of December to 17th , in a three-room 4 people, at the total price of Euro 252,00.

Apartment without extra charge, included final cleaning, taxes, weekly linen (not towels for pool), gas, electricity and heating in the price.

  

DESCRIPTION THREE-ROOM 4 PEOPLE.

In the three  room-apartments there is a living room-kitchen, a master bedroom with double bed and bathroom, and another bedroom with two single beds, and a bathroom, for a total 80mt2.

  

IN THE HEART OF TUSCANY.

Le Torri Villa is about 20 km. from Florence,  30 Km from San Gimignano,  50 km from Siena,  60 km. from Pisa and 230 km from Rome.  The kilometers are more or less equal to the time you'll take to reach each city. Bus service connection with Florence City. At your arrival full information and details maps

 

Oh, typo - not 93 rooms but 3...

Edited June 3, 2021 by Grimas

[Grimas 670]

Wow - Just checked the prices and it's closer to 120 Euro/night in June... Damn Covid...

[Hate 20130]

1 hour ago, Biff Tannen said:

I have three bottles of Brunello aging from there right now. 

The wineries we visited along the way were Abbadia Ardenga and Il Paradiso Di Frassina.  That was now 14 years ago so who knows if they are even still around.  Abbadia Ardenga has the original well that travelers (from the north) would have made their last stop for water before completing the trip to Rome.  Il Paradiso Di Frassina was owned by a lawyer who had moved from Milan.  He loved classical music and would run large speakers into the vineyard so he could listen to the classics while tending to the grapes. He discovered that the fields with the speakers blasting the classical music tended to grow larger grapes.  They attributed it the sound waves in the soil scared off intruders.  They entered into a study with the U of Florence, but I never saw any conclusions they reached.

[Grimas 670]

7 hours ago, McCroskey said:

Agree and that was my bad in fucking up what I said...I didn't mean to suggest we'd see the entire country in two weeks but we do have flexibility to really go anywhere outside of Rome and I figured a couple of stays would be very enjoyable.  Venice is high on my list since I've never been although my wife has and she thinks 2-3 nights will be plenty there, which leaves roughly a week for somewhere else.

Thanks for all the feedback...when y'all are hitting some of these regions like Tuscany...is a car rental an absolute must or can you get around moderately well enough between trains and cabs?    When I looked at a car rental outside of Florence the rates were just absurd.

I'd say one to 2 days max in Venice... Ride a gondola, walk over the bridge and eat some black squid-in pasta and hope it doesn't flood.... We flew in there several times as you could get something like $30/person for flights the airport from where we lived. On the second visit there, we skipped Venice all together and drove up and over the Adriatic and went to Croatia instead...  3rd trip there, we hopped on the train and headed east to Turin with stops in Verona and Milan (with a detour north to stay on Lake Como), 

Florence to Pisa to Lucca is a nice day trip...

That being said, unless it's a beach resort in SE Asia, I'm more like Chevy Chase in Vacation at the Grand Canyon - yea it's nice... Another damn church... Next stop!

[VABuckeye 2472]

8 hours ago, Hate said:

I love Montalcino.  The fort at the top of the hill is awesome, even if it is a little worrisome climbing up those stairs.

La Fortezza in the castle alongside with the enoteca in Greve are the two best wine rooms I've ever tasted in.  About 10% of my wine that is aging is Brunello that came from La Fortezza.

[conVINCEd 21469]

On 6/1/2021 at 10:17 PM, VABuckeye said:

Pick a region. Italy is far too big and diverse to explore the rest of the country in two weeks. 

Starting to plan a trip.  We were planning on going last summer.  Is 4 days in Rome, 3 in Cinque Terre, and a week in Florence/Tuscany too much?

[Mo Horn 8853]

Just now, conVINCEd said:

Starting to plan a trip.  We were planning on going last summer.  Is 4 days in Rome, 3 in Cinque Terre, and a week in Florence/Tuscany too much?

That's almost exactly what we have booked. We arrive in Rome on Sunday morning, head to the Cinque Terre on Wednesday, leave for Tuscany on Saturday, head back toward Rome airport the next Friday and fly out Saturday. It's our first time, but everything we read in planning seemed to agree with what we booked.