The Italy Thread

[Ted Lange 16084]

Same, I was in Naples 2 years ago and thought it was awesome.  

[BHMCruiser 1813]

Then I am duly chastised and will cease dumping on it

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19100]

22 hours ago, BHMCruiser said:

Then I am duly chastised and will cease dumping on it

Yeah, we had this argument back in 2021 when I was headed to Naples, having previously been in 2018.  I told you then you were way off.  

I mean, sorry but the food is awesome, the city is steeped in history, and some of the views are absolutely amazing.  

[Ted Lange 16084]

The views from Castel Sant’Elmo are awesome.   Food is fantastic.   Easy day trips to all sorts of great spots too.  

Edited July 30, 2023 by Ted Lange

[Ted Lange 16084]

We are going back in a month, but decided to vacation/relax in Ischia for the first portion of the trip. 

[BHMCruiser 1813]

On 7/29/2023 at 12:14 PM, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

Yeah, we had this argument back in 2021 when I was headed to Naples, having previously been in 2018.  I told you then you were way off.  

I mean, sorry but the food is awesome, the city is steeped in history, and some of the views are absolutely amazing.  

I have memory issues and I forgot you were on retainer for the Naples Tourism Board. 

and I do want to back to the museo nazionale

[wild_turkey 3159]

On 7/5/2023 at 5:39 PM, South Austin said:

Even a smaller place like Cinque Terre that used to be quieter before guys like Rick Steves started telling everyone how great it was are now so crowded that they're much less enjoyable. 

I've been to Cinque Terre twice, in June 2011 and July 2017, and really enjoyed it both times. It was peak summer on both occasions and there were definitely crowds during the day, but it was still nothing compared to crowds encountered in European cities. I can tolerate crowds much easier in a small coastal town when my day is spent on the beach or hiking. 

I also stayed multiple nights on both occasions, and found that the crowds thinned out significantly in the late afternoon when a lot of the day trippers returned to wherever they came from. If you only visit for a day, you're kind of depriving yourself of the better side of it.

[Ted Lange 16084]

Anyone have a Sorrento recommendations?  Think we are gonna train over from Naples for an afternoon & evening. 

[TheAuditor 1035]

19 hours ago, wild_turkey said:

I've been to Cinque Terre twice, in June 2011 and July 2017, and really enjoyed it both times. It was peak summer on both occasions and there were definitely crowds during the day, but it was still nothing compared to crowds encountered in European cities. I can tolerate crowds much easier in a small coastal town when my day is spent on the beach or hiking. 

I also stayed multiple nights on both occasions, and found that the crowds thinned out significantly in the late afternoon when a lot of the day trippers returned to wherever they came from. If you only visit for a day, you're kind of depriving yourself of the better side of it.

Just back from Cinque Terre area - stayed south at Porto Venere cause they've got a pretty good hotel and a good marina for getting in and out on -  and took boat around to the cities.  Very crowded during the day,  but thinned out at night as described.  First time there,  enjoyed it,  but it's pretty crowded at the moment.   Also headed up to Bolzano which was great especially above it, up in the Mtns - great hikes, cool tiny little towns.  

[Mo Horn 8826]

We did the CT in September a couple of years ago. Not nearly as crowded during the shoulder season during the day. Evenings were even better. Maybe my favorite place in Italy. 

[South Austin 52448]

One outstanding thing I remember about Cinque Terra were the sardines, so fresh and delicious. I ordered some as an appetizer whenever I could.

[Mo Horn 8826]

1 minute ago, South Austin said:

One outstanding thing I remember about Cinque Terra were the sardines, so fresh and delicious. I ordered some as an appetizer whenever I could.

Absolutely the best. The cuttlefish ink seafood pasta we had at Trattoria Billy is the best plate of pasta I've ever had. 

[South Austin 52448]

Just now, Mo Horn said:

Absolutely the best. The cuttlefish ink seafood pasta we had at Trattoria Billy is the best plate of pasta I've ever had. 

Trattoria Billy! You just sent me down a time warp!

[Biff Tannen 45665]

2 hours ago, TheAuditor said:

Just back from Cinque Terre area - stayed south at Porto Venere cause they've got a pretty good hotel and a good marina for getting in and out on -  and took boat around to the cities.  Very crowded during the day,  but thinned out at night as described.  First time there,  enjoyed it,  but it's pretty crowded at the moment.   Also headed up to Bolzano which was great especially above it, up in the Mtns - great hikes, cool tiny little towns.  

This is exactly what I did in 2018.  It was great.  

[TexMex Horn 68]

On 8/5/2023 at 2:40 PM, Ted Lange said:

Anyone have a Sorrento recommendations?  Think we are gonna train over from Naples for an afternoon & evening. 

Met a tour guide at a local coffee shop that took us all over the area. Still communicate with him via WhatsApp. Here's his instagram;  https://www.instagram.com/luigidaytour/ He'll take you wherever you want to go, or recommend areas. We hired him for 2 full days. WhatsApp # 39 333 221 8812 - Luigi Martino. 

 

[texasdago 7567]

Well, this was the summer of our discontent.  With the miserable heat bearing down on us, not having gone to the beach in Italy pretty much pissed everyone off.  My son even sent me an aerial view of our usual beach saying, "we need to go here next summer".  Yes, Oregon was amazing... loved it... but there's something about sitting on the beach and getting into a summer rhythm.

So... three week trip booked for next summer.  Plan is to hit up Rimini half of the time since that's "our" beach town.  We always rent the same apartment... we know the neighborhood, the local restaurants, the shops, the people who operate the lido near us.  Its comfortable and its fun. 

The rest of the time we will either:

1) spend a week in Riva del Garda - I kind of like this idea but my wife doesn't. We did it another time and I really enjoyed it and you can't beat being in the mountains but I'm 50/50 on it.  If not Riva del Garda, then slightly south of Malcesine.

2) spend a week in Puglia in Mattinata.  Been before.  Cheap, great food, chill vibe... but about 6 hours from the Bologna airport.  

3) spend a week in Numana or Sirolo.  Spent a day there last summer on a little boat trip and I loved it.  It would be cool to check it out for a week.  Gorgeous scenery, great food and wine, water is really really nice

4) spend a week in Sperlonga. I love the town for nostalgic reasons and its a great area... but its not logical.  I'd love to go back for the first time in 20 years but I'm thinking it would be a PITA

We drive everywhere so I have to use that lens.  Right now leaning towards option 3, 2, 1 or 4 in that order unless I think of another beach/lake town.  Also will most likely mix in a couple of nights somewhere even while we have a base in Rimini.  Last summer we stayed here for two nights... https://relaismevigo.it/en/

[Biff Tannen 45665]

1 hour ago, texasdago said:

Well, this was the summer of our discontent.  With the miserable heat bearing down on us, not having gone to the beach in Italy pretty much pissed everyone off.  My son even sent me an aerial view of our usual beach saying, "we need to go here next summer".  Yes, Oregon was amazing... loved it... but there's something about sitting on the beach and getting into a summer rhythm.

So... three week trip booked for next summer.  Plan is to hit up Rimini half of the time since that's "our" beach town.  We always rent the same apartment... we know the neighborhood, the local restaurants, the shops, the people who operate the lido near us.  Its comfortable and its fun. 

The rest of the time we will either:

1) spend a week in Riva del Garda - I kind of like this idea but my wife doesn't. We did it another time and I really enjoyed it and you can't beat being in the mountains but I'm 50/50 on it.  If not Riva del Garda, then slightly south of Malcesine.

2) spend a week in Puglia in Mattinata.  Been before.  Cheap, great food, chill vibe... but about 6 hours from the Bologna airport.  

3) spend a week in Numana or Sirolo.  Spent a day there last summer on a little boat trip and I loved it.  It would be cool to check it out for a week.  Gorgeous scenery, great food and wine, water is really really nice

4) spend a week in Sperlonga. I love the town for nostalgic reasons and its a great area... but its not logical.  I'd love to go back for the first time in 20 years but I'm thinking it would be a PITA

We drive everywhere so I have to use that lens.  Right now leaning towards option 3, 2, 1 or 4 in that order unless I think of another beach/lake town.  Also will most likely mix in a couple of nights somewhere even while we have a base in Rimini.  Last summer we stayed here for two nights... https://relaismevigo.it/en/

So sounds like you're mainly looking at beaches, but for me, my second spot would be somewhere up north of Garda in the Dolomites.  I've been to Ortisei twice and love it.  Obviously you know far more about it than me.

Edited August 21, 2023 by Biff Tannen

[texasdago 7567]

1 minute ago, Biff Tannen said:

So sounds like you're mainly looking at beaches, but for me, my second spot would be somewhere up north of Garda in the Dolomites.  I've been to Ortisei twice and love it.  Obviously you know far more about it than me.

We last went to Ortisei (based in Selva) in 2014.  Its so beautiful there.  The two cable car ride up to Seceda is one of my favorite views in the Dolomiti.  Hmmm... I would be willing to do that.  Would need a place with a pool and a spa to be able to sell that idea to my wife.

Looking down towards Ortisei.

[Biff Tannen 45665]

1 hour ago, texasdago said:

Would need a place with a pool and a spa to be able to sell that idea to my wife.

Boom

https://www.gardena.it/en/

[texasdago 7567]

Got anything with fewer $tars ?

That does look badass but I am a tightwad.  

Edited August 21, 2023 by texasdago

[bonnieblue 542]

Go kitesurfing in Riva

[texasdago 7567]

14 hours ago, bonnieblue said:

Go kitesurfing in Riva

Last time we were there that wind was something else.  There is a hike that starts in Riva del Garda and goes up through an old tunnel/road system and from up above you can see the races that take place on the regular... sailboats, windsurfing, etc.  Wind can really get going.

Right now the leading alternative destination looks like this... too early to book

Incidentally, here is a good list of typical foods from the area - https://agenziahumana.com/en/food-and-wine/ - this does a great job of illustrating that the "Italian food" we are exposed to here is a miniscule fraction of what Italy has to offer.  Consider these are typical foods from this little corner of Le Marche.  Another list... https://www.rivieradelconero.info/en/made-in-conero/typical-dishes/

Geographic perspective...

 

 

Edited August 23, 2023 by texasdago

[Biff Tannen 45665]

1 hour ago, texasdago said:

Last time we were there that wind was something else.  There is a hike that starts in Riva del Garda and goes up through an old tunnel/road system and from up above you can see the races that take place on the regular... sailboats, windsurfing, etc.  Wind can really get going.

Yep. Here’s some pics from the west side of Lake Garda. 
 

 

[texasdago 7567]

Yup... pretty amazing views from that side.

[MAUFRAIS 6618]

Did somebody on here know a boat captain in positano?

[texasdago 7567]

Looks like car rental rates are starting to settle down a bit.  Found a rate with Hertz flying in/out of Bologna for about 270 Euro base rate for a week... that's for a five passenger/five bag mid-size SUV.  Three weeks plus all the absurd fees (facility charge, taxes, etc) came out to 1300ish Euro which is what you might have paid for a week back when the rates were ridiculous.  

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19100]

On 8/24/2023 at 7:34 PM, MAUFRAIS said:

Did somebody on here know a boat captain in positano?

I know one in Amalfi.

[MAUFRAIS 6618]

All good. Found one. Went up and down. Great time. Grotzy.

[Chopper 17230]

2023 overtourism report: October is typically a low month for tourism in Florence but it's massively crowded this year. At the same time, Sienna and Lucca were not crowded. Perugia and the rest of Umbria were remarkably tourist-free.

[Biff Tannen 45665]

54 minutes ago, Chopper said:

October is typically a low month for tourism in Florence but it's massively crowded this year

I feel like this is just the new normal for Florence.

[Chopper 17230]

2 hours ago, Biff Tannen said:

I feel like this is just the new normal for Florence.

That would be a shame but we'll avoid Octobers in Florence until we hear otherwise because it was far too many people. October 2023 had ~twice the crowds of October 2022 per my better half. I was thinking it was pent-up demand following the pandemic but maybe it's also a combo of that and all the new remote workers taking advantage of what has been known as low season but still a great time to visit.

Also fwiw 2023 was a crappy year for most Italian olive regions - very low quantity. However it was a good year for grapes. October is harvest time for olives in Tuscany. Unfortunately unadulterated Italian olive oil is going to be difficult to find next year.

[VABuckeye 2472]

Spanish olive oil is better anyway and I’m a fan of real Italian olive oil. 

[texasdago 7567]

On 10/24/2023 at 6:03 PM, Chopper said:

That would be a shame but we'll avoid Octobers in Florence until we hear otherwise because it was far too many people. October 2023 had ~twice the crowds of October 2022 per my better half. I was thinking it was pent-up demand following the pandemic but maybe it's also a combo of that and all the new remote workers taking advantage of what has been known as low season but still a great time to visit.

Also fwiw 2023 was a crappy year for most Italian olive regions - very low quantity. However it was a good year for grapes. October is harvest time for olives in Tuscany. Unfortunately unadulterated Italian olive oil is going to be difficult to find next year.

Can confirm from first-hand reports of a friend of mine that went to visit family.  Said it was really crowded.  I think Rome is stuck in that mode now, as well.  Used to be you could go in the spring or winter months and it was "relatively" chill.  Sorry for my family in Rome but we just don't go back there.  They may be celebrating that, though.

[BHMCruiser 1813]

3 hours ago, texasdago said:

Can confirm from first-hand reports of a friend of mine that went to visit family.  Said it was really crowded.  I think Rome is stuck in that mode now, as well.  Used to be you could go in the spring or winter months and it was "relatively" chill.  Sorry for my family in Rome but we just don't go back there.  They may be celebrating that, though.

A friend of mine was visiting Rome with his family over the summer and said it was just a total crush. It was kind of driving his wife batty so he asked me what he should do and I told him to stop trying to visit every museum and tourist attraction and just try to hit some local neighborhood spots like Romans do and sent him to spend a day wandering around Trastevere. It really improved his experience. 

[Biff Tannen 45665]

4 hours ago, BHMCruiser said:

A friend of mine was visiting Rome with his family over the summer and said it was just a total crush. It was kind of driving his wife batty so he asked me what he should do and I told him to stop trying to visit every museum and tourist attraction and just try to hit some local neighborhood spots like Romans do and sent him to spend a day wandering around Trastevere. It really improved his experience. 

Those are always the best experiences.  I love small towns in Italy so much more.  It blows my mind how they always have the best people and hospitality and generally feel like the rest of the country, just smaller.  Contrast that with the small towns in the US...

[VABuckeye 2472]

Same here.  The best meals we've had in Italy were in small towns with one restaurant.  Shit better be good or the locals aren't coming.

[BHMCruiser 1813]

Well the thing about Rome is that it's a huge tourist destination surrounded by one of the world's great cities. It is far more enjoyable to experience as a city than as a big museum. 

[texasdago 7567]

37 minutes ago, BHMCruiser said:

Well the thing about Rome is that it's a huge tourist destination surrounded by one of the world's great cities. It is far more enjoyable to experience as a city than as a big museum. 

Correct and the city is full of amazing sites and gems that are completely ignored by the masses... and that's where we spend our time.  As someone who has been to Rome over a dozen times to visit family, etc., I still haven't been to the Vatican Museums.  I'll live.  I still haven't been to Franklin, either.  

[BHMCruiser 1813]

20 minutes ago, texasdago said:

Correct and the city is full of amazing sites and gems that are completely ignored by the masses... and that's where we spend our time.  As someone who has been to Rome over a dozen times to visit family, etc., I still haven't been to the Vatican Museums.  I'll live.  I still haven't been to Franklin, either.  

Dude the Vatican museums are worth the hassle. Especially if you do a scavi tour and have a guide for the museum but otherwise I agree there's more to Rome than the usual stuff. 

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

I found the capuchin chapel more interesting than the Vatican. But I am a morbid heathen. I did sneak photos of both the Sistine chapel ceiling and the capuchin ossuary.

[texasdago 7567]

2 minutes ago, BHMCruiser said:

Dude the Vatican museums are worth the hassle. Especially if you do a scavi tour and have a guide for the museum but otherwise I agree there's more to Rome than the usual stuff. 

I know... one of these days... I've been to the museums in the Campidoglio and various other museums and galleries around town. Some of them are usually barren and filled with amazing works.  Also haven't done the Scavi tour but have been to the catacombs off of the Appian Way which used to be very quiet and they are quite extensive.  

2 minutes ago, Patricio Swayze said:

I found the capuchin chapel more interesting than the Vatican. But I am a morbid heathen. I did sneak photos of both the Sistine chapel ceiling and the capuchin ossuary.

Did you get shushed for talking in the capuchin chapel?

 

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

Did you get shushed for talking in the capuchin chapel?
 

No. I was by myself on the tour of the crypts/catacombs and the capuchin chapel.

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19100]

Thinking of doing a week in Tuscany and a week in Emilia Romagna next fall.  Not 100% sure.  Debating a lot of trips at the moment.  

[VABuckeye 2472]

Do it!

[texasdago 7567]

2 hours ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

Thinking of doing a week in Tuscany and a week in Emilia Romagna next fall.  Not 100% sure.  Debating a lot of trips at the moment.  

Totally do it... where in Emilia Romagna and will you have a car?  Emilia Romagna like Tuscany is big and varied.  We'll be back in Emilia Romagna for 2 weeks next summer but primarily in Romagna so we'll be more around the coast with jaunts into the interior and probably Le Marche which is also strongly recommended.  Mind you, if you want suggestions, expect zero high end dining suggestions from me as that's not typical Italy to me... more along the lines of typical restaurants where Italians eat.

Three places I can recommend from personal experience in Emilia (if you have a car) 

https://www.opera02.it/ (near Castelvetro di Modena)

http://www.cabiancadellabbadessa.it/index.php/en/ (belongs to a friend - great B&B outside of Bologna)

https://relaismevigo.it/ (in the middle of the countryside - great restaurant)

 

[Biff Tannen 45665]

I didn't realize the region was called Emelia Romagna, but we did a tour of a parmigiano reggiano factory, a parma ham factory, both near Parma, and also a balsamic vinegar operation in Modena (Medici's) and it was fucking incredible.  

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19100]

1 hour ago, texasdago said:

Totally do it... where in Emilia Romagna and will you have a car?  Emilia Romagna like Tuscany is big and varied.  We'll be back in Emilia Romagna for 2 weeks next summer but primarily in Romagna so we'll be more around the coast with jaunts into the interior and probably Le Marche which is also strongly recommended.  Mind you, if you want suggestions, expect zero high end dining suggestions from me as that's not typical Italy to me... more along the lines of typical restaurants where Italians eat.

Three places I can recommend from personal experience in Emilia (if you have a car) 

https://www.opera02.it/ (near Castelvetro di Modena)

http://www.cabiancadellabbadessa.it/index.php/en/ (belongs to a friend - great B&B outside of Bologna)

https://relaismevigo.it/ (in the middle of the countryside - great restaurant)

 

I love restaurants that are where regular Italians eat.  Was looking at the area surrounding Bolgna/Modena from a location there.

For Tuscany, Cortona, Siena, etc.. are the areas I am honing in on.  We would have a car the whole time.  I am trying to convince my parents to do this, and if so, my mom could be our DD (she isn't a wine drinker, so works for the rest of us).  

 

[VABuckeye 2472]

Have you been to La Fortezza in Montalcino?  Along with the enoteca in Greve I've never seen better and if you love Brunello La Fortezza is a must.

Our last wine tasting at La Fortezza.

Edited November 2, 2023 by VABuckeye

[texasdago 7567]

46 minutes ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

I love restaurants that are where regular Italians eat.  Was looking at the area surrounding Bolgna/Modena from a location there.

For Tuscany, Cortona, Siena, etc.. are the areas I am honing in on.  We would have a car the whole time.  I am trying to convince my parents to do this, and if so, my mom could be our DD (she isn't a wine drinker, so works for the rest of us).  

 

The great thing is Bologna and Modena are close to each other and you are in the middle of culinary heaven and you don't have to spend a mint to enjoy it.   Modena and Reggio Emilia are not far and Ferrara is also an easy drive.

To me places like the following are not only perfect but really take me back in time to when I was a little kid.  Simple, delicious, not expensive...

https://trattoriasantacroce.it/ 

https://en.aziendalacasetta.it/ 

Chiosco ai Pini

Trattoria Bolognina

https://www.croara.com/

https://osterialavetta.it/

Can recommend any of those but honestly, there's a million of those kinds of places in the countryside of Emilia.  

 

 

[texasdago 7567]

Mantova, not Modena