The Italy Thread

[Biff Tannen 45691]

1 hour ago, VABuckeye said:

Have you been to La Fortezza in Montalcino?  Along with the enoteca in Greve I've never seen better and if you love Brunello La Fortezza is a must.

Our last wine tasting at La Fortezza.

My bottles that I bought there in 2018 are going to be ready for drinking next year.  Very excited.

[Chopper 17236]

Re - Florence. In 1975 the Bargello Museums in Florence discovered the crypt where Michelangelo apparently hid from the Medicis for a couple months until he was forgiven. In the room they also discovered what are believed to be some of Michelangelo's drawings (unsigned) on the walls. The room's most recent use had been to store coal. The museum has restored a portion of the crypt (aka Secret Room/Stanza Segreta), protected it, and built an exit, and is preparing to allow the public to view it for the first time in very limited numbers. Availability for tickets first opens 11/15, will be extremely limited and will require online reservation. My wife is friendly with a woman who's a longtime curator at the Ufizzi who describes the space as absolutely amazing to see. Unfortunately they were still working on it in October so she couldn't get us a sneak preview.

https://news.artnet.com/art-world/michelangelo-secret-room-museum-of-medici-chapels-2387647

Quote

To protect the drawings, Ms. D’Agostino said, visits will be kept to groups of four and limited to 15 minutes, with 45 minute lights-out periods in between to protect the drawings. Tickets, each connected to a specific person whose I.D. will be checked to prevent tour operators from gobbling them up, will cost 32 euros (about $34), and include access to the Medici tombs. Depending on how things go, the museum could increase visitor numbers next year.

 

2 hours ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

For Tuscany, Cortona, Siena, etc.. are the areas I am honing in on.

Siena - La Taverna di San Giuseppe is excellent, not expensive despite having a bit of a pedigree, and serves both locals and tourists. You'll have to prepare yourself (i.e. don't expect warm service) for a bit of a factory-like production because they operate on strict seating times.

Lucca - Gigi Trattoria. Not many tourists find themselves here.

Cortona - Osteria del Teatro.

 

[VABuckeye 2472]

2 hours ago, Chopper said:

Lucca

A friend has a dog named Lucca.  Because that is where her family lives. 

[Mr. Drummond 2199]

Hello Italy experts.

So i am going for a couple of weeks in September of this year -(i'm sure i will ask quesitons about rome/positano/capri etc as we get closer).     At the end of the trip i was going to be in lake como area for 3 nights then flying out of Milan.    I have found that airfare flying out of Zurich one day later is about 800 dollars cheaper per person for biz class.    So now i have 4 nights.   

Should i do 2 nights in lake como and the two nights in old town zurich?   Never been to either.    Or stay with the 3 nights in lake como, take the train to zurich and just stay by airport?

Basically, is old town zurich worth taking away a night in como?   TIA.

[texasdago 7573]

I personally love Zurich and think it is a cool city and you would get a chance to see a different place with a different look/feel.  

[Lazarus Bocanegra 305]

we're booked for ten days in March.  Florence > Rome > Naples.  We've got friends living in Rome, so we structured the trip to spend a few days Florence, extended weekend in Rome, and a few days in Naples.  The vagaries of the calendar being what they are, we elected to head straight to Florence after landing in Rome so as not to burn an additional day travelling. 

Question for the initiated:  how long should I anticipate it will take to clear customs at Fiumicino?  

We booked one of the Florence in a day tours to bang out the big hits on day 1 so we can spend the other days getting lost and eating 

Coliseum Underground and Pristine Sistine booked as well so we can bang out this hits and spend the rest of the time getting lost and eating

Only thing we've booked in Napoli is a culinary backstreets tour the internet seems to think highly of.  National Museum, Herculaneum, Statue of the Veiled Christ on the agenda.  Probably won't have time to visit Secondigliano, much to my chagrine <sucks teeth>. rest of the time getting lost and eating

Open to recs, mofos 

'ta poste

Edited January 11 by Lazarus Bocanegra
are you not entertained

[texasdago 7573]

42 minutes ago, Lazarus Bocanegra said:

won't have time to visit Secondigliano, much to my chagrine

Just trying to process these words while not trying to think of Gomorrah.  

Why not take a boat over to Procida for a day if the weather is nice?  Not sure how much is open... ask your hotel.

[Lazarus Bocanegra 305]

4 hours ago, texasdago said:

Just trying to process these words while not trying to think of Gomorrah.  

Why not take a boat over to Procida for a day if the weather is nice?  Not sure how much is open... ask your hotel.

There's supposed to be a Scampia tour that postures itself as  "this is not Gomorrah" that is supposed to be cool but I prefer the grittier depiction where they murder women and children in cold blood

I'm thinking we'll leave one of later days open in the event the weather is nice to take a boat trip.  Procida looks interesting.  

[texasdago 7573]

Maybe if you're lucky Campi Flegrei will erupt 

[troph 24810]

Question - Amalfi Coast or Cinque Terre?

 

So we bid on and won a week in cortona - a bit long there - I’ve been 20 years ago - but we will make do and probably day trip around some. Anyway, we are going to stretch that 7 days to 15-16. We will land in Rome, spend the night then train or drive to cortona. Haven’t decided yet car would be great for wandering day trips. From there it’s either amalfi or cinque terra. Then finish with 2 nights in Rome and come home. 
 

so pros / cons - plusses / minuses to cinque terra and amalfi coast? 
 

in the meantime I’ll read the thread…

Edited January 30 by troph

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19103]

1 hour ago, troph said:

Question - Amalfi Coast or Cinque Terra?

 

So we bid on and won a week in cortona - a bit long there - I’ve been 20 years ago - but we will make do and probably day trip around some. Anyway, we are going to stretch that 7 days to 15-16. We will land in Rome, spend the night then train or drive to cortona. Haven’t decided yet car would be great for wandering day trips. From there it’s either amalfi or cinque terra. Then finish with 2 nights in Rome and come home. 
 

so pros / cons - plusses / minuses to cinque terra and amalfi coast? 
 

in the meantime I’ll read the thread…

What time of year?

[texasdago 7573]

1 hour ago, troph said:

Question - Amalfi Coast or Cinque Terra?

 

So we bid on and won a week in cortona - a bit long there - I’ve been 20 years ago - but we will make do and probably day trip around some. Anyway, we are going to stretch that 7 days to 15-16. We will land in Rome, spend the night then train or drive to cortona. Haven’t decided yet car would be great for wandering day trips. From there it’s either amalfi or cinque terra. Then finish with 2 nights in Rome and come home. 
 

so pros / cons - plusses / minuses to cinque terra and amalfi coast? 
 

in the meantime I’ll read the thread…

I wouldn't pick either but I am a contrarian when it comes to Italy.  Cinque Terre is closer so I would go with that and then find side trips along the way.  If you have a car, you can explore a lot more efficiently.  

[troph 24810]

56 minutes ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

What time of year?

end of september/early october.

41 minutes ago, texasdago said:

I wouldn't pick either but I am a contrarian when it comes to Italy.  Cinque Terre is closer so I would go with that and then find side trips along the way.  If you have a car, you can explore a lot more efficiently.  

we plan to have a car. I didn't want to derail the question (no pun intended) with a car vs. train. I strongly prefer a car, we drove from Venice to Florence and Tuscany countryside 20 years ago it was idyllic. I've already done most of Tuscany/Venice. I haven't done Rome but my wife has. So we are trying to get me some Rome time and her some Tuscany time, and then pick one spot we haven't been together.

btw I'm a sailor - cleared for up to 50 foot yachts / self-captain in the Caribbean and will hope to have my ICC at some point and we will do sicily, southern Italy, Sardina, etc. by sailboat, so I'm specifically saving that for later.

Edited January 30 by troph

[BHMCruiser 1814]

On 1/11/2024 at 8:30 AM, Lazarus Bocanegra said:

we're booked for ten days in March.  Florence > Rome > Naples.  We've got friends living in Rome, so we structured the trip to spend a few days Florence, extended weekend in Rome, and a few days in Naples.  The vagaries of the calendar being what they are, we elected to head straight to Florence after landing in Rome so as not to burn an additional day travelling. 

Question for the initiated:  how long should I anticipate it will take to clear customs at Fiumicino?  

We booked one of the Florence in a day tours to bang out the big hits on day 1 so we can spend the other days getting lost and eating 

Coliseum Underground and Pristine Sistine booked as well so we can bang out this hits and spend the rest of the time getting lost and eating

Only thing we've booked in Napoli is a culinary backstreets tour the internet seems to think highly of.  National Museum, Herculaneum, Statue of the Veiled Christ on the agenda.  Probably won't have time to visit Secondigliano, much to my chagrine <sucks teeth>. rest of the time getting lost and eating

Open to recs, mofos 

'ta poste

If you've never been and you're going to Herculaneum you should try for Pompeii as well. 

[Biff Tannen 45691]

2 hours ago, troph said:

end of september/early october.

we plan to have a car. I didn't want to derail the question (no pun intended) with a car vs. train. I strongly prefer a car, we drove from Venice to Florence and Tuscany countryside 20 years ago it was idyllic. I've already done most of Tuscany/Venice. I haven't done Rome but my wife has. So we are trying to get me some Rome time and her some Tuscany time, and then pick one spot we haven't been together.

btw I'm a sailor - cleared for up to 50 foot yachts / self-captain in the Caribbean and will hope to have my ICC at some point and we will do sicily, southern Italy, Sardina, etc. by sailboat, so I'm specifically saving that for later.

Get to Cinque Terre area via car, but then use the train or the ferry to actually visit the towns (I prefer ferry).  I stayed in Portovenere on the south side and it was so chill compared to the actual five towns.  You still get some of the cruise crowd, but in the evenings it was mostly just locals.  30 minutes or so for the ferry to get to the towns from there.  Super easy.

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19103]

3 hours ago, troph said:

end of september/early october.

we plan to have a car. I didn't want to derail the question (no pun intended) with a car vs. train. I strongly prefer a car, we drove from Venice to Florence and Tuscany countryside 20 years ago it was idyllic. I've already done most of Tuscany/Venice. I haven't done Rome but my wife has. So we are trying to get me some Rome time and her some Tuscany time, and then pick one spot we haven't been together.

btw I'm a sailor - cleared for up to 50 foot yachts / self-captain in the Caribbean and will hope to have my ICC at some point and we will do sicily, southern Italy, Sardina, etc. by sailboat, so I'm specifically saving that for later.

I am going to be in Tuscany about the same time.  You should check out other areas of Tuscany.  There is some really pretty coastline there as well.

[troph 24810]

3 minutes ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

I am going to be in Tuscany about the same time.  You should check out other areas of Tuscany.  There is some really pretty coastline there as well.

from cortona for a week we will. there's only so much you can do in one village for 7 days.

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19103]

4 minutes ago, troph said:

from cortona for a week we will. there's only so much you can do in one village for 7 days.

Lucca, Pisa, Siena, and of course Florence are all right there.  I am going to spend a week in Florence then a week somewhere in Tuscany (was going to do Lucca, but not sure now).  I doubt it will, be enough time.

[Mo Horn 8848]

I have not been to Amalfi so I can't give a fair comparison. We did spend several days in the Cinque Terre in late September and loved it. We had no car and just used the train to get there and get around. We hiked the trails during the day when the towns were busy, and then wandered at night when it was quieter. One of my favorite places I've ever visited, and had the best plate of pasta I've ever had in my life. 

[troph 24810]

1 minute ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

Lucca, Pisa, Siena, and of course Florence are all right there.  I am going to spend a week in Florence then a week somewhere in Tuscany (was going to do Lucca, but not sure now).  I doubt it will, be enough time.

we've both spent considerable time in Tuscany years ago and we will be there for a week (well on the edge of Tuscany and Umbria) so we have that covered. 

The question is where next, we are considering Cinque Terra vs. Amalfi Coast and looking for input there.

 

 

[texasdago 7573]

By the way, September is an ideal time.  

You could always drive over to Piombino, take the ferry over to Elba and just chill out there for a few days.  Water should be warm enough to swim.

https://www.visitelba.com/discover-elba/the-beaches-of-elba/

 

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19103]

I have been to Amalfi.  It is a lot less crowded in September.  The weather is great at that time.  I was in Capri in September, and it was great.  

[Gil Bang 25961]

don't go to amalfi if either of you has bad knees, because you'll be climbing about 10,000 stairsteps per day. 

[MAUFRAIS 6629]

Tough life selling gym memberships in Positano.

[VABuckeye 2472]

6 hours ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

I am going to be in Tuscany about the same time.  You should check out other areas of Tuscany.  There is some really pretty coastline there as well.

And if you like Super Tuscans that’s where the great ones are from.  Sassicaia. Ornellaia. Delicious. 

[Upgrayedd 5813]

I have nothing to add except every time I scroll past this thread I hear Sgt Hulka voice pronounce Italy 

[texasdago 7573]

13 hours ago, VABuckeye said:

And if you like Super Tuscans that’s where the great ones are from.  Sassicaia. Ornellaia. Delicious. 

A drive down to Maremma is worthwhile... lots of great wineries and much much less crowded.  You can go hang out with the jet set in Porto Ercole or "slum it" in Porto Santo Stefano

[Biff Tannen 45691]

4 minutes ago, texasdago said:

A drive down to Maremma is worthwhile... lots of great wineries and much much less crowded.  You can go hang out with the jet set in Porto Ercole or "slum it" in Porto Santo Stefano

My wife and I were supposed to go here, but only booked one night in San Bonifacio, so didn’t have time. Definitely on the list for later. 

[texasdago 7573]

2 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

My wife and I were supposed to go here, but only booked one night in San Bonifacio, so didn’t have time. Definitely on the list for later. 

The list can get impossibly long... 

[Biff Tannen 45691]

1 hour ago, texasdago said:

The list can get impossibly long... 

you say that like it’s a bad thing 

[texasdago 7573]

1 minute ago, Biff Tannen said:

you say that like it’s a bad thing 

Ask my wife... 

[wild_turkey 3159]

I have not been to Amalfi so I can't give a fair comparison. We did spend several days in the Cinque Terre in late September and loved it. We had no car and just used the train to get there and get around. We hiked the trails during the day when the towns were busy, and then wandered at night when it was quieter. One of my favorite places I've ever visited, and had the best plate of pasta I've ever had in my life. 

I’ll echo this. I have not been to Amalfi either but it’s on my list for my next mainland Italy trip. I caught a Sardinia bug so that may be a bit, but I’ll get there.

I have been to Cinque Terre twice, both times in high season, and I really enjoyed it and would happily go again. It’s just a nice peaceful place to exist for a few days.

It gets crowded in the day but the crowds don’t bother me in a place like that nearly as much as they do in a congested city. If you stay in Cinque Terre, the crowds die off significantly by evening and the evenings/nights are splendid. I know Biff recommended staying outside Cinque Terre, but IMO that would be a mistake because then you are only experiencing it as one of the many day trippers, and you miss perhaps the best times.

[Mo Horn 8848]

33 minutes ago, wild_turkey said:

I’ll echo this. I have not been to Amalfi either but it’s on my list for my next mainland Italy trip. I caught a Sardinia bug so that may be a bit, but I’ll get there.

I have been to Cinque Terre twice, both times in high season, and I really enjoyed it and would happily go again. It’s just a nice peaceful place to exist for a few days.

It gets crowded in the day but the crowds don’t bother me in a place like that nearly as much as they do in a congested city. If you stay in Cinque Terre, the crowds die off significantly by evening and the evenings/nights are splendid. I know Biff recommended staying outside Cinque Terre, but IMO that would be a mistake because then you are only experiencing it as one of the many day trippers, and you miss perhaps the best times.

100% We stayed in Vernazza, and loved it. 

[mchookem 16336]

oh yeah? well i am also going to Italy, in late May. and it's totally impromptu...family trip,  Germany first. my dad lived in Kitzigen and i was born there. we're doing some WWII sites, renting a car and heading to Normandy. my French exchange student lives in Brest, she's going to meet us somewhere, i think we're just going to tour some of the countryside around there, i still need to do research on what to see (other than WWII sites which my dad is planning). at least 2 days in Paris (we actually love cities)... then we were going to just drive back to Frankfurt and fly home... but then my mate said something about 'too bad we're not going to visit Italy' and I was like...pause... actually, we can do whatever we want to do lol.

so now dad and sis will take car and head back to Germany/home and we're gonna add another 4-5 days and probably fly home from Rome. i'm already on top of booking the train Paris>Rome.

i have no idea what i'm doing, never visited anywhere overseas 😜... but i figure we will likely never be back there again so there are some musts in Paris and Rome. 

anyways...we've been talking about this trip for a few years, but not actually doing anything for it. then my dad had shoulder surgery, then fell and broke his leg last summer or we might have done it in the fall. bottom line... i purchased one-way tickets Denver>Frankfurt last weekend, so this is happening one way or another 😆😮 

 

[texasdago 7573]

9 hours ago, mchookem said:

this is happening one way or another

This is the way

[Sensitive Ponytail Man 9]

Lake Como is the most beautiful place I have ever seen.   Padua was also lovely.   But that was 30 years ago.  In Rome I got a slice of pizza from a street vendor and could not believe how good it was.   Driving around Tuscany seemed like heaven.   Enjoy.

[Lazarus Bocanegra 305]

We have just returned from our trip. I am going to need a few days to collect my thoughts, but suffice it to say we had a wonderful time. 2 full days in Florence, long weekend in Rome (with palm sunday at Ninfa Gardens/Sicily-Rome American Cemetery/Anzio), and 4.5 days in Napoli.

More to come as I curate the 1600 photos. Napoli was as incredible as I’d hoped. If you are only stopping through en route to Amalfi/Capri etc/points furthet south, you are missing out. We booked a food tour through Culinary Backstreets that I can’t speak highly enough about. I will gladly seek out their offerings in other cities, and wouldn’t balk at doing the tour in Napoli again.

Pos rep to PW for some solid recs. The margherita at 50 Kalo on our pilgrim route to Virgil’s Tomb was a masterpiece of simplicity that will live in my dreams until I die. Butter chicken at Sostanza in Florence will be something I feebly attempt to recreate for the rest of my days. Lmk if any of you assholes has an olive grove

I could use a steaming hot cup of octopus broth right about now.

[VABuckeye 2472]

Butter chicken at Trattoria Sostanza is my favorite chicken dish in the world.  I've recreated it stopetop with some success but there's something about cooking it over wood the way they do.

[texasdago 7573]

If you are lucky enough to be in Italy at just the right time, you can catch one of three legs of the Tour de France

https://www.letour.fr/en/the-race/grands-departs/grand-depart-2024

[Lazarus Bocanegra 305]

we saw them doing some sort of kick off event in one of the Piazzas in Florence and I was utterly perplexed.  This explains 

[texasdago 7573]

47 minutes ago, Lazarus Bocanegra said:

we saw them doing some sort of kick off event in one of the Piazzas in Florence and I was utterly perplexed.  This explains 

Will be very cool, for sure

[Napoleon 8682]

Tips for endearing yourself to the locals.

 

[texasdago 7573]

Some of that is so staged... but I will definitely confirm that if you do the wrong thing in a restaurant, you risk drawing the ire of the owner or waitstaff.  My wife learned the hard way in the late 90s to not order a cappuccino in the evening.  At a minimum, you're getting a very dirty look.

For those wanting to complain about this, please ask for a bottle of ketchup for your bowl of chili at the Texas Chili Parlor and make sure they see you put it on the chili.

 

Edited April 30 by texasdago

[MAUFRAIS 6629]

Probably more effective to order a virgin drew drink which I believe is a cup of ice.

[locodos 5387]

1 hour ago, texasdago said:

 My wife learned the hard way in the late 90s to not order a cappuccino in the evening.  At a minimum, you're getting a very dirty look.

Tried to order filter coffee at 8am, which was on the menu at the Autogrill.  The machine was sitting there unused behind the counter.  They just looked so sad and disappointed, then mentioned it was a pain to clean.  Then asked me if I wanted anything else because they weren't going to make the coffee.  /csb

Edited April 30 by locodos

[texasdago 7573]

48 minutes ago, locodos said:

Tried to order filter coffee at 8am, which was on the menu at the Autogrill.  The machine was sitting there unused behind the counter.  They just looked so sad and disappointed, then mentioned it was a pain to clean.  Then asked me if I wanted anything else because they weren't going to make the coffee.  /csb

Filter coffee like traditional drip coffee that Americans drink?  Yeah... I'm sure.   They talked about you after you left.  LOL.  Your best bet is an Americano which is them making an espresso and then watering it down with hot water.   

[Firemans4Horn 18080]

I’m going to Palermo and Catania the last week of May. Any restaurant and excursion recommendations  are appreciated. 

[texasdago 7573]

4 minutes ago, Firemans4Horn said:

I’m going to Palermo and Catania the last week of May. Any restaurant and excursion recommendations  are appreciated. 

From Palermo, assuming you will have access to a car

Riserva dello Zingaro

Erice (and Trapani)

If you have more time, Favignana

San Vito Lo Capo (A beach town but should be quite open by then)

Poke around on Google Maps and look at the coastline - lots of amazing beaches/coves.

[texasdago 7573]

17 minutes ago, texasdago said:

From Palermo, assuming you will have access to a car

Riserva dello Zingaro

Erice (and Trapani)

If you have more time, Favignana

San Vito Lo Capo (A beach town but should be quite open by then)

Poke around on Google Maps and look at the coastline - lots of amazing beaches/coves.

FYI...

Erice:

Inside Riserva dello Zingaro

San Vito Lo Capo

Why you should go swimming there...

Random seafood picture.  We were there two weeks... I had so much fresh seafood...

This is from one restaurant... before and after...

[locodos 5387]

2 minutes ago, texasdago said:

Filter coffee like traditional drip coffee that Americans drink?  Yeah... I'm sure.   They talked about you after you left.  LOL.  Your best bet is an Americano which is them making an espresso and then watering it down with hot water.   

Yup drip coffee.  It was on the menu and they had the machine.  However, they had no intention of ever using it.   Oh, I'm sure they talked shit about me, and that's ok.