CoTA sounds like it sucks

[utee94 15805]

[Updawg 2266]

Ouch

[wood 11225]

41 minutes ago, Updawg said:

Ouch

Yeah 2, 4, and 6 aren't selling great, but that $79 is for Friday iirc. IIRC Sunday is around $300.

[wood 11225]

53 minutes ago, Updawg said:

Ouch

Nope. I was wrong. I guess I was thinking of the GovX tickets I had seen. Just checked and it looks like the cheapest Sunday-only GS tickets are around $600.

[elfenix 34223]

friday GS tickets are cheap.  film at 11.

[utee94 15805]

26 minutes ago, elfenix said:

friday GS tickets are cheap.  film at 11.

That's not the point.  But this event was sold out months ago, and yet...

[elfenix 34223]

i feel like they do this every year.  sold out and then several months later more go on sale. 

[wood 11225]

2 hours ago, utee94 said:

That's not the point.  But this event was sold out months ago, and yet...

Ah, yeah. Good point. It's become so routine that I didn't catch on.

2 hours ago, elfenix said:

i feel like they do this every year.  sold out and then several months later more go on sale. 

They never stopped selling them. They've been for sale on their website/ticketmaster/costco the entire time. Same shit every year. "Sold out for months", but they'll be selling tickets right up until the race starts.

[wood 11225]

BTW they'll be way cheaper on Stubhub & Tickpick. $600 for the cheapest Sunday-only GS seats is insane. You can get a 3-day in T4 right now for about $400 on Stubhub.

[Guest]

8 hours ago, wood said:

BTW they'll be way cheaper on Stubhub & Tickpick. $600 for the cheapest Sunday-only GS seats is insane. You can get a 3-day in T4 right now for about $400 on Stubhub.

Just came to remind people of this. Friday sessions will be less than the $79 price COTA is advertising for a seat in the main grandstand. 

[utee94 15805]

10 minutes ago, FirstTimeCaller said:

Just came to remind people of this. Friday sessions will be less than the $79 price COTA is advertising for a seat in the main grandstand. 

If you have friends who are regulars, there's a decent chance you can find one or more of them offering up Friday tix for free.  I always take a long weekend off from work but some folks who are not super-fans like I am, actually feel like they should go to work on that day, and so offer up their tickets to friends.

[wood 11225]

2 hours ago, utee94 said:

If you have friends who are regulars, there's a decent chance you can find one or more of them offering up Friday tix for free.  I always take a long weekend off from work but some folks who are not super-fans like I am, actually feel like they should go to work on that day, and so offer up their tickets to friends.

What is this "work" you speak of? 

[utee94 15805]

2 hours ago, wood said:

What is this "work" you speak of? 

Ha!  I wish I didn't know.

At this point, I'm taking 3 full days off (Thus, Fri, Mon) and sometimes a half day on the Wednesday before.  It's basically a 5-day tailgate party for us, out in the RV lot.

 

[wood 11225]

18 minutes ago, utee94 said:

Ha!  I wish I didn't know.

At this point, I'm taking 3 full days off (Thus, Fri, Mon) and sometimes a half day on the Wednesday before.  It's basically a 5-day tailgate party for us, out in the RV lot.

Yeah, sorry. Just a dumb retirement joke. You'll get there! Be careful though. I've always heard retired friends say that they'd been busier since they retired than they were before. That sure seems to be the case with me. 2+ years now and I feel like I haven't stopped in all that time. Another thing is that it takes away your best excuse to use to get outta shit you don't wanna do. Everyone knows you're retired ...     /csb

Edited September 27, 2023 by wood

[morehornsepower 887]

2 hours ago, utee94 said:

Ha!  I wish I didn't know.

At this point, I'm taking 3 full days off (Thus, Fri, Mon) and sometimes a half day on the Wednesday before.  It's basically a 5-day tailgate party for us, out in the RV lot.

 

Map to tailgate party not showing for some reason...

 

We haven't gone the last few years, as we got tired of the traffic and logistics bullshit (refer to thread topic)....but I think we may go this year.  I'll be looking for those stubhub options as it gets closer, likely...

[utee94 15805]

30 minutes ago, morehornsepower said:

Map to tailgate party not showing for some reason...

 

We haven't gone the last few years, as we got tired of the traffic and logistics bullshit (refer to thread topic)....but I think we may go this year.  I'll be looking for those stubhub options as it gets closer, likely...

Yeah I might consider not going, if we had to deal with all that stuff.  As it is, we've settled in on a solution that mitigates most of the problems and allows for us to have maximum fun.  

 

[utee94 15805]

Oh, and here's the map:

 

[wood 11225]

3 minutes ago, utee94 said:

Yeah I might consider not going, if we had to deal with all that stuff.  As it is, we've settled in on a solution that mitigates most of the problems and allows for us to have maximum fun.  

 

So when do the strippers arrive?

[wood 11225]

1 minute ago, utee94 said:

Oh, and here's the map:

 

You're one flag short ... 🤘

[utee94 15805]

3 minutes ago, wood said:

So when do the strippers arrive?

I bring mine with me. You're on your own for yours.

 

2 minutes ago, wood said:

You're one flag short ... 🤘

Not a great picture, but the Gonzales flag is tucked away to the right, not blowing as nicely as I'd like.

Here's another one, this was for NASCAR hence the Mustang flag, but of course even for NASCAR, the Ferrari flag must fly.

 

 

[Guest]

I'm going to be out of town for this, but there is an electric expo at COTA a few weeks after the USGP. You can evidently drive electrics on track, go through an electric bike course, drive electric go-karts for kids, etc. I'd be there in an instant if I was in town. Your electric bill has a code for 25% off admission.

https://www.electrifyexpo.com/austin

 

[elfenix 34223]

@wood to the white courtesy phone

 

Quote

“Actually, not bigger this time,” COTA chairman Bobby Epstein tells RACER. “This is better. Which in terms for us, putting on an event, since we have nothing to do with what goes on on the track; it’s how to get people in and out. How do you provide better food, better service, higher quality, more entertainment? and so that’s been our focus and continues to be.

 

https://racer.com/2023/10/17/why-cota-is-going-for-better-not-bigger/

[wood 11225]

47 minutes ago, elfenix said:

@wood to the white courtesy phone

https://racer.com/2023/10/17/why-cota-is-going-for-better-not-bigger/

LOL yeah I saw that earlier. It's full of good laughs, like the talk about having added capacity last year (they didn't add capacity, they just moved stands around), or reaching the unattainable 500k attendance mark, which Indy and Adelaide did decades ago, or when he covers slower ticket sales by saying he isn't trying to break a record this year, as if he's ever actually broken one in the past  ...

Same shit different year.

Now, if we're talking about making it better, let's talk about that racing surface ...

Look closely, and you can see several different ages and types of asphalt randomly strewn about the patchwork COTA circuit. Grip levels? Which one? They did just resurface T12 and 15, after the MotoGP announcers raked them mercilessly over the coals about it in April, so there's that.

 

Edited October 17, 2023 by wood

[YGIFS 19449]

But they make it an annual point to add fresh mulch to the concourses.  And that's what I appreciates about them.  

[Guest]

5 hours ago, wood said:

LOL yeah I saw that earlier. It's full of good laughs, like the talk about having added capacity last year (they didn't add capacity, they just moved stands around), or reaching the unattainable 500k attendance mark, which Indy and Adelaide did decades ago, or when he covers slower ticket sales by saying he isn't trying to break a record this year, as if he's ever actually broken one in the past  ...

Same shit different year.

Now, if we're talking about making it better, let's talk about that racing surface ...

Look closely, and you can see several different ages and types of asphalt randomly strewn about the patchwork COTA circuit. Grip levels? Which one? They did just resurface T12 and 15, after the MotoGP announcers raked them mercilessly over the coals about it in April, so there's that.

 

Why did you post a picture of the Red Bull Ring in Austria? Oh wait, that's the racetrack out by the airport. 

They look so similar.

[wood 11225]

24 minutes ago, FirstTimeCaller said:

Why did you post a picture of the Red Bull Ring in Austria? Oh wait, that's the racetrack out by the airport. 

They look so similar.

It's totally the same. We just disguise all of our green grass and beautiful trees as dirt, gravel, and concrete.

[wood 11225]

OBTW, just saw T4 GS for 3 days on Tickpick for $304, all-in. Prices falling like crazy.

[Guest]

On ticket pricing, StubHub has them for $261, but when you include their fees, it's $333.

$72 in fees is bullshit.

[ConferenceRoom 6141]

Ticketmaster hit me with $60 in fees for Tool tickets. Highway robbery. 

[wood 11225]

Yep. Said it before and will say it again ... the internet has enabled the scalpers to completely control the ticket market and completely fuck us.

[Guest]

$284 all in for 3-day GA on Stubhub. There were the $349 (before tax) tickets at Costco.

$33 for a grandstand on Friday all in. Tickets were advertised for $79 for Friday only.

 

[Goofyboy 3268]

Yep. Said it before and will say it again ... the internet has enabled the scalpers to completely control the ticket market and completely fuck us.

Scalpers don’t buy Paddock tickets.

[blacklab 11926]

I just had some 3 day tickets fall in my lap. 

Not sure which days/times I will be able to go, may have some extra.

PM me if interested.

[wood 11225]

2 hours ago, Goofyboy said:

Scalpers don’t buy Paddock tickets.

By 'scalpers' I was referring to the online 'ticket brokers' like TicketCity, etc, who are really just scalpers. They buy anything they can get their hands on. A Paddock Pass would be right up their alley given the exclusivity.

[wood 11225]

Some clown shows never end ...

Notice anything wrong here?

Drugovich, but no Stroll for Aston Martin

Edited October 19, 2023 by wood

[ConferenceRoom 6141]

I'll never forget how to spell it because I can hear Coulthard saying it: Ricky AR-do. 

[The Tres Leches 58]

COTA is still bumpy.

Quote

It’s worth noting that Circuit of The Americas is known as a fairly bumpy circuit — a topic of conversation that comes up not just in F1 but also in MotoGP. The top three finishers of the U.S. Grand Prix were asked about the track’s nature during the post-race press conference, and they all agreed that something needs to be done to fix the track.

Max Verstappen felt “it needs to be redone because at the moment, it feels like it’s better suited to a rally car.” He later added that he does “love” COTA; however, a new tarmac is needed. Lewis Hamilton agreed with the Dutchman but said, “I like some of the bumps because (it) adds character to a circuit, but there’s way too many.”

https://theathletic.com/4987669/2023/10/22/hamilton-leclerc-disqualified-united-states-grand-prix/

[blacklab 11926]

I wonder if they had built it the right way with piers going into the ground they would have spent less money doing that then all the repairs they made over the years.

I ended up missing my turn and went a long way around to get to the north side of the venue Sunday and was laughing to myself as we hit all the bumps in the road. In multiple places sections of the road were sliding off into the ditch. I can't imagine one person driving to the track site and seeing that and not thinking they need to make sure the track doesn't do that.

[wood 11225]

Bobby says he'll 'fix it', just like he's said before. Says part of the track is 12 years old. Yeah, no shit. But news flash, the problems are all the way around the track, even on a bit that y'all just resurfaced a couple of months ago (T12), and your bullshit low-bid patchwork 'fixes' don't 'fix' anything.

Fucking embarrassing.

51 minutes ago, blacklab said:

I wonder if they had built it the right way with piers going into the ground they would have spent less money doing that then all the repairs they made over the years.

I ended up missing my turn and went a long way around to get to the north side of the venue Sunday and was laughing to myself as we hit all the bumps in the road. In multiple places sections of the road were sliding off into the ditch. I can't imagine one person driving to the track site and seeing that and not thinking they need to make sure the track doesn't do that.

Piers into the ground and concrete slabs? They did put a couple hundred piers in the ground for the pit building and pits, but from everything I've been told by the guys who know a whole lot more than I do about this shit, that would have been prohibitively expensive. Even in the pits, the slabs are spreading despite being on piers.

Re: the roads around there, yeah, they're a mess. Every few of years the county comes through & smooths and resurfaces 'em, and then they just go to shit again very quickly. The only roads they give a damn about are the ones that actually serve COTA. Margaret Gomez is fucking her constituents out there every day she stays in office.

Re: the soil conditions prior to construction ... The engineers had done extensive soil core sampling and knew about the soil problems. They came up with a great plan and put an engineering solution in place to limit the issues. They dug down as much as 20 feet in places and laid an impermeable polymer barrier, then refilled it all with prescribed, imported road base aggregates, then paved on top of that in a very precie layering process with specialize paving equipment, supervised by an F1/MotoGP track paving specialist.

Obviously, the track is built along the side of a hill. A drainage solution was designed to divert rain runoff down the hill - around and under the track and under the water barrier. This way, the engineers sought to create an isolated 'tube' on which the track would rest and which would be made more stable than the surrounding soil by controlling the water content inside it .

They designed a robust drainage system which was a critical component of the system. That solution worked very well and kept the track very smooth until 2015, when poor/no maintenance led to failure of the drainage system that's a key component of the soil mitigation solution.

Early on, to save money, Bobby had canceled scheduled maintenance that the designing engineers had prescribed for the drainage system. Then when big rain events predictably occurred, the unmaintained drainage system was overwhelmed. Water is always going to find a way downhill, no matter what, so it ran across, under, and even through the now-damaged subsurface barrier ‘tube’.

The water moving inside the tube weakened the track base, eroding the substrate and causing subsidence. That created bumps and cracks in the surface. You can see evidence of this during and even days after any significant rain at COTA, as water weeps up from the track base (where it’s not even supposed to be) and out through cracks in the track surface).

Now the drainage system needs to be repaired to help stabilize the track's substrate, but in short that's not happening, so the cheaper, superficial fixes (patchwork grinding and lower-grade repaving only portions of the track) only last a few months rather than years.

Edited October 23, 2023 by wood

[blacklab 11926]

It was many beers ago that I read about the piers. Did not remember the exact context but I thought that was the way to prevent the track from moving around. I don't remember the details above, thanks for the information.

[wood 11225]

15 minutes ago, blacklab said:

It was many beers ago that I read about the piers. Did not remember the exact context but I thought that was the way to prevent the track from moving around. I don't remember the details above, thanks for the information.

Oh yeah I think it would probably work pretty well, but too much money. Bobby won't even pay for any decent resurfacing, even when doing only small portions of the track at a time. He ain't paying for that, but according to what I was told, that would be so expensive it would probably crash the business p,an completely.

[wood 11225]

*plan

[YGIFS 19449]

What exactly is the track surface made from?  Asking for a friend. 

[wood 11225]

4 hours ago, YGIFS said:

What exactly is the track surface made from?  Asking for a friend. 

Do you mean the actual aggregate? I know I  I've seen it in an article or two, but I can't remember. IIRC there were different mixes for different layers, too.

[G650 14229]

14 hours ago, wood said:

Even in the pits, the slabs are spreading despite being on piers.

 

How on earth is that possible. As a professional road builder this raises some really uncomfortable questions for me.

[wood 11225]

8 hours ago, G650 said:

 

How on earth is that possible. As a professional road builder this raises some really uncomfortable questions for me.

Yeah I have no idea. It's crazy. Here's a photo a local racing photog chick took on pit lane years ago. They were laready measuring the spread back then. No idea what it's like now.  (analisa photography or something like that on insta iirc)

So wait ... you're in road building? You should be telling us all what's up re: COTA!  : )

 

Edited October 24, 2023 by wood

[G650 14229]

33 minutes ago, wood said:

Yeah I have no idea. It's crazy. Here's a photo a local racing photog chick took on pit lane years ago. They were laready measuring the spread back then. No idea what it's like now.  (analisa photography or something like that on insta iirc)

So wait ... you're in road building? You should be telling us all what's up re: COTA!  : )

 

Yessir, that's my day job.

 

Honestly if this shit is on piles and is spreading like that, I don't know how that passed any sort of certification process.

[wood 11225]

33 minutes ago, G650 said:

Yessir, that's my day job.

 

Honestly if this shit is on piles and is spreading like that, I don't know how that passed any sort of certification process.

So, there's a thread about this in the Austin reddit, where COTA threads typically fizzle and die. This one is booming, and there's a guy in there who helped build that drainage system  and more. He just confirmed (again) what I've already been told by a few people - that the ACO drain maintenance was indeed cancelled by COTA (Bobby), against the advice of the engineers and even COTA employees at the time (one of whom I know personally), and that led to these problems. 

[YGIFS 19449]

JFC, I gotta spell it for you guys then get a "timeout" for going too political?  How the fuck you think the tax benefits keep flowing for Red/Rad/Bobby's pet project?  You think the contractors getting funding know what the fuck they're doing?  I gotta draw a fucking diagram?  You don't think those vendors/subs are brought on without knowing what exactly they're doing to keep money flowing in both directions?  Fucking-A, no CR on the F1 thread, I get it.  But come the fuck on people, you wanna speak like adults...fucking act like one.  After 7 drinks and speaking Spanish, all you gotta do is ask open-ended questions of Tavo or a dozen other folks that used to work for Red and Bobby and donate to the playmakers of Texas and you'll learn all you need to know about why that shitshow out there, outside of a few "cool curves and legacy turns" persists.  And why it's costing us way more than anybody ever imagined.  DOn't get me wrong, I love the sport.    Though it may be time for some butt-hurt "I don't know why the track/venue is so rough" fans to come back to reality.  The rest of the world is laughing at us because we can't figure out how fucked we are.  All that said, see you guys out there next year...girls want to go to their first race so we're leaving in the morning to get a parking spot.

Edited October 24, 2023 by YGIFS

[wood 11225]

26 minutes ago, YGIFS said:

JFC, I gotta spell it for you guys then get a "timeout" for going too political?  How the fuck you think the tax benefits keep flowing for Red/Rad/Bobby's pet project?  You think the contractors getting funding know what the fuck they're doing?  I gotta draw a fucking diagram?  You don't think those vendors/subs are brought on without knowing what exactly they're doing to keep money flowing in both directions?  Fucking-A, no CR on the F1 thread, I get it.  But come the fuck on people, you wanna speak like adults...fucking act like one.  After 7 drinks and speaking Spanish, all you gotta do is ask open-ended questions of Tavo or a dozen other folks that used to work for Red and Bobby and donate to the playmakers of Texas and you'll learn all you need to know about why that shitshow out there, outside of a few "cool curves and legacy turns" persists.  And why it's costing us way more than anybody ever imagined.  DOn't get me wrong, I love the sport.    Though it may be time for some butt-hurt "I don't know why the track/venue is so rough" fans to come back to reality.  The rest of the world is laughing at us because we can't figure out how fucked we are.  All that said, see you guys out there next year...girls want to go to their first race so we're leaving in the morning to get a parking spot.

I hear ya, and I don't even mind going CR (not red v blue CR) about it here in this thread (I might be the only one tho), because nobody in the CR is interested in the $350+ Million fraud that's been/being perpetrated on the taxpayers of the State of Texas. But I don't blame the contractors. The original contractors and engineers did an amazing job. I knew a lot of them at the team. Where it all turned south is when Bobby cancelled the drainage system maintenance. Then he hired local guys to resurace it for cheap, and they delivered what he paid for. Cheap resurfacing, without fixing the underlying problems. And yeah, of course there are people who are enabling it all from the highest level. Preach to the choir (me)!