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2023 Republican Government Shutdown: Same Shit, Same Story

horn4life

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atomheartbevo

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40 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

I think Trump will try to shutdown the government again. I don’t know if he will or can due to pressure from Senate Republicans.  However, he’s gonna want another loyalty test. 

He needs to constantly gauge the Senate Republicans allegiances.  

They are loyal to their corporate paymasters first and foremost, and Trump discovered that.  Trump does not want to be humiliated with a veto override.  

As I said, if they override Trump there is a possibility his base will go after them in 2020.   However, he and his base will have far bigger distractions between now and then.  

But if they fuck over their donors and allow a shutdown, here is a certainty that those donors will give their money to somebody else. 

And that’s not getting into delayed tax returns, etc. that will piss off s lot of his voters.  

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Pancho
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He's 3/5ths correct  

SmokeyTheBear
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Can any GOP supporters really outline their platform at this point? Cause all I can see as their platform being is: move money from middle-class and poor up to the top percentages, limit civil liberti

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Hugo Stiglitz

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24 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

They are loyal to their corporate paymasters first and foremost, and Trump discovered that.  Trump does not want to be humiliated with a veto override.  

As I said, if they override Trump there is a possibility his base will go after them in 2020.   However, he and his base will have far bigger distractions between now and then.  

But if they fuck over their donors and allow a shutdown, here is a certainty that those donors will give their money to somebody else. 

And that’s not getting into delayed tax returns, etc. that will piss off s lot of his voters.  

Why don’t the corporate pay masters lobby GOP Senators to remove Trump?   

Wouldn’t that be in their best interest? Removing the threat to their bottom line? 

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GopherRock

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On 1/26/2019 at 8:31 AM, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Out of curiosity, has the govt ever seized land under the guise of a national emergency?  I just wonder if a national emergency can allow them to bypass the normal eminent domain processes. 

 

Wasn't the Steel Seizure Case about something similar?

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atomheartbevo

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3 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Why don’t the corporate pay masters lobby GOP Senators to remove Trump?   

Wouldn’t that be in their best interest? Removing the threat to their bottom line? 

Because they aren’t there yet.  

They were getting close to the event horizon though if Turtle was getting chewed out by other R Senators - that means those Senators were getting chewed out by BMDs.  

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FondrenRoad

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Posted
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On 1/26/2019 at 10:55 AM, Aqua Buddha said:

I'm not a lawyer nor do I play one on TV but Truman tried seizing control of the steel industry and the courts shot him down.  Don't know the legal background but it's very similar.

In actual emergencies, courts don't even come into play. You move your troops and they do what they need to do. German and American soldiers weren't filing paperwork in Belgian courts in WW2.  Lincoln and Grant weren't bothering with eminent domain law in the Civil War either. 

Its hard to justify any permanent taking as an "emergency."  Emergencies are usually temporary takings.

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Rockymtns

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On 1/26/2019 at 10:13 AM, SquishMitten said:

If it ever gets to this point, which I don’t think it will, the determination of “just compensation” is going to be massive. It’s not the land value that’s going to be the issue, it’s going to be access to the Rio Grande. Without it, all those ranches along the Texas border will be unsustainable.

Concrete canals are used extensively all over the desert out west to move water for ranches/ people...Arizona and California use them extensively to get water from the Colorado River to cities and farm land.  Their is no way they are ceding the Rio Grande to Mexico......And, their is probably vast stretches of it where a wall or barrier is not needed.  

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RPM

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Posted
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12 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

I think Trump will try to shutdown the government again. I don’t know if he will or can due to pressure from Senate Republicans.  However, he’s gonna want another loyalty test. 

He needs to constantly gauge the Senate Republicans allegiances.  

I wonder what a veto override will tell him?

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Atx71

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3 hours ago, Rockymtns said:

Concrete canals are used extensively all over the desert out west to move water for ranches/ people...Arizona and California use them extensively to get water from the Colorado River to cities and farm land.  Their is no way they are ceding the Rio Grande to Mexico......And, their is probably vast stretches of it where a wall or barrier is not needed.  

A Wall and now canals??? Awesome. Do the Russians supply the concrete AND steel? 

 

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Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand

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On 1/26/2019 at 11:45 PM, Francisco 2.0 said:

Ya gotta admit; Rick Perry may be the most politically astute cabinet member.  Name a gaffe by him since he took over. Admittedly, that's a pretty low bar given his cohorts.

He knows this is a shitshow, and he keeps himself at arms length.  I'm not saying he's competent, but to this point, he's kept his nose clean.

Perry could accidentally set himself on fire and still be the wall flower of this administration.

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Bookman

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On 1/26/2019 at 8:17 AM, Dahobbs said:

Eminent domain cases do not get resolved in less than 2 years. It doesn't happen. You are conflating several different questions: (1) whether the president has authority to issue an emergency declaration under these circumstances, (2) whether the border can seize the lands under eminent domain, and (3) if 2 is yes, how much the government must pay the landowners. All three of those questions have distinctive legal and factual inquiries. And all three would ultimately require at least two, and probably 3 levels of review (district court, appellate court, supreme court). Even under a very aggressive schedule, that isn't likely to conclude in less than two years.

And, I think the most optimistic situation for the government would be one year to resolve the legal challenges. That leaves very little time for any actual construction of anything. Point being, a wall is 100% not being built within two years. Even if everything goes to perfectly for Trump, you'll have just the bare groundwork prior to the next President coming in. Oh, and since the available money is well short of what would actually be needed to acquire the property and construct a wall, you wont even have that.

Several years ago the federal government was condemning land in Eagle Pass for fencing. My client, a bank, had a purchase money lien on the property but wasn't added to the eminent domain proceeding. Gov't paid the landowner, who took off with the money and stopped paying the bank so I foreclosed.

The Asst. U.S. Attorney started crying when I told them that we had an assignment of those condemnation proceeds and they just lost their land.

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Goredho

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2 hours ago, Atx71 said:

A Wall and now canals??? Awesome. Do the Russians supply the concrete AND steel? 

 

FOR GOD’S SAKE, MAN!!  YES!!! Look at this footage from here in Laredo.   WE ARE BEING OVERRUN AND CAN’T..   ARGGGHHHHHH!!!”

*the television feed suddenly cuts to white noise*

OcZt.gif

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NameAlreadyInUse

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3 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Oh You!

So he's taken money he knows is dirty, and someone has shown him they have the proof of it.  Or else someone has shown him they have the documentation to move the rumors about him being gay into actual fact.  There's really no other explanation for why he's done such a turnaround in the last year and a half.  It's pretty disgusting to watch.

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SmokeyTheBear

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, relapse98 said:

fiscal conservatism folks.

Can any GOP supporters really outline their platform at this point? Cause all I can see as their platform being is: move money from middle-class and poor up to the top percentages, limit civil liberties, limit voting population, choke all public services (education, utilities, infrastructure, etc) to allow for private enterprises to fill the void, get far-right judges into key positions to ensure this cycle continues for years. 

And if you agree with this strategy, how do you think this will benefit the country long-term? 

Edited by SmokeyTheBear
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Nivek

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Can any GOP supporters really outline their platform at this point? Cause all I can see as their platform being is: move money from middle-class and poor up to the top percentages, limit civil liberties, limit voting population, choke all public services (education, utilities, infrastructure, etc) to allow for private enterprises to fill the void, get far-right judges into key positions to ensure this cycle continues for years. 
And if you agree with this strategy, how do you think this will benefit the country long-term? 

Oh now you did it.
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Homercles

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Posted
Posted
Can any GOP supporters really outline their platform at this point? Cause all I can see as their platform being is: move money from middle-class and poor up to the top percentages, limit civil liberties, limit voting population, choke all public services (education, utilities, infrastructure, etc) to allow for private enterprises to fill the void, get far-right judges into key positions to ensure this cycle continues for years. 
And if you agree with this strategy, how do you think this will benefit the country long-term? 


It’s ok because guns and abortion
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atomheartbevo

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1 hour ago, Homercles said:

 


It’s ok because guns and abortion

 

And the queers,  Lurelle in Bumfuck, Kansas (population: 1;763) is worried that queer transgender Mexican drug runners from Honduras voted illegally for Hillary and are giving out BJs in the bathroom at the local truck stop that her brother works at.  Little does she know that it’s her brother giving out the BJs, and his customers are the ones who voted for Hillary. 

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gmr548

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Posted
Posted (edited)
On 1/29/2019 at 9:44 AM, SmokeyTheBear said:

Can any GOP supporters really outline their platform at this point? Cause all I can see as their platform being is: move money from middle-class and poor up to the top percentages, limit civil liberties, limit voting population, choke all public services (education, utilities, infrastructure, etc) to allow for private enterprises to fill the void, get far-right judges into key positions to ensure this cycle continues for years. 

And if you agree with this strategy, how do you think this will benefit the country long-term? 

The funny/sad thing is that the platform of GOP supporters does not line up with GOP policy goals. The actual GOP doesn't believe a fucking word of what they're saying about trickle down, privatization, etc. being good for the country as a whole. They know it isn't. And they could give a fuck about abortion or guns at the end of the day, those are just good wedges. Their goal is to create a feudal system with corporations and their investors replacing houses of nobility, rolling back most economic and social progress made over the past 150 years. The rubes keep drinking the fucking kool aid though. Cause things were better when the coloreds and women knew their place, and Omaba might still be out there to take our guns. 

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kevwun

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36 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

He’s all over the place on his shitter twitter storm this morning, but he just the Rs an out on moving forward without the $5.7 billion. 

 

So shocking that he would come up with a fake victory in order to avoid getting his ass handed to him again by Pelosi.

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atomheartbevo

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26 minutes ago, bolverk said:

Yup.

Gave is kind of an important word that I left out, but while he’s not going to give up the idea of WALL, that little tweet made it clear that  somebody or something has gotten through to him   Don’t see him shutting it down again.  

Chris Christie was on Colbert last night, and he was with Trump right before the shutdown, and he said that he told Trump it was a mistake, and that there was no exit strategy.   Interesting that he was still hanging with Christie (they talked in the private residence), and it makes me think Trump had a lot of people telling him it was a mistake.  

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SuingToGetAMessageBoard?

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36 minutes ago, bolverk said:

Yup.

That’s interesting.  He is acting like he’s okay with no money for WALL from the house, and also acting like no national emergency will be declared.  Sounds like he’s headed toward what we’ve been saying:  just claim WALL is already there.  There’s enough fencing to take pictures of that is good enough for your base. 

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2 minutes ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

That’s interesting.  He is acting like he’s okay with no money for WALL from the house, and also acting like no national emergency will be declared.  Sounds like he’s headed toward what we’ve been saying:  just claim WALL is already there.  There’s enough fencing to take pictures of that is good enough for your base. 

 It’s odd that he’s acting this way.  I don’t expect Mitch to have grown a backbone, so somebody told him Republican Senators may not support him next time. 

That could be a huge fear of his - another budget comes up with no WALL funding, and Rs in the Senate pass it, daring him to shut things down again.  

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Doc Sam Beckett

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17 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Gave is kind of an important word that I left out, but while he’s not going to give up the idea of WALL, that little tweet made it clear that  somebody or something has gotten through to him   Don’t see him shutting it down again.  

 

 

I think you all are giving him too much credit. I read that tweet as his usual verbal diarrhea trying to make himself look like the bestest prez eva, and he accidentally made it seem like he's not still going to fight for it.... 

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relapse98

relapse98 634

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Quote

He’s all over the place on his shitter twitter storm this morning, but he just the Rs an out on moving forward without the $5.7 billion.  

So - if he's already building it, then obviously he wouldn't need to declare a national emergency (since it's already being done) and he no longer needs the money so we don't need to worry about the government being shut down in 3 weeks, right?

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'stache

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9 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

I think Trump wants to shutdown the government again but he realized he can’t do it without a backlash from GOP senators.  

He’s decided to punt.

He's a god to the GOP voters. GOP senators would never cross him and sure as fuck would never veto any of his decisions. It would be against the word of god to do such a thing. They would lose their next primary.

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atomheartbevo

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7 minutes ago, relapse98 said:

Negative on that one. He's a fucking retard that can't ke.. SQUIRREL!

Even idiots respond to getting popped in the nose, and Pelosi exposed him for all the world to see. 

 I’m sure he would like to shut the government down again, just out of spite and to say “fuck you, I’m the President and can do this.”

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kevwun

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3 minutes ago, 'stache said:

He's a god to the GOP voters. GOP senators would never cross him and sure as fuck would never veto any of his decisions. It would be against the word of god to do such a thing. They would lose their next primary.

Nah, he would have never folded if he had the undying support of Republican Senators.  He finally got to the end of his leash with the shutdown.  Now he's walking back needing additional funding for the imaginary wall that is already being built because he has finally been made to understand that he can't beat Pelosi on this one.

Edited by kevwun
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atomheartbevo

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1 minute ago, 'stache said:

He's a god to the GOP voters. GOP senators would never cross him and sure as fuck would never veto any of his decisions. It would be against the word of god to do such a thing. They would lose their next primary.

The voters/base will be focused on something else between now and then (Mueller).  

This shutdown cost s lot of companies a lot of money.   Republican Senators weren’t yelling at McConnell because they were getting positive feedback from lobbyists and corporations.  

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Hugo Stiglitz

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Just now, 'stache said:

He's a god to the GOP voters. GOP senators would never cross him and sure as fuck would never veto any of his decisions. It would be against the word of god to do such a thing. They would lose their next primary.

Trump caved in the last shutdown because there was about to be a mutiny in the Senate.  The day before Trump’s capitulation, GOP Senators were intentionally leaking to the press they were about to throw McConnell under the bus if something wasn’t done to end the shutdown. 

McConnell couldn’t have that so he forced Trump’s hand because GOP loyalty in the Senate is the only thing keeping Trump in power.

The last shutdown was really a game of chicken between Trump and the Senate.  The Senate won. 

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