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Donald Trump 2019

Francisco 2.0

By Francisco 2.0
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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 89810

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Enfield said:

Dan Rather takes total made up bullshit documents and legitimizes them to the entire country about a candidates military record. He has an absolute agenda in publishing it. He gets no jail time, no congressional inquiry, nothing. 

Dan Rather didn’t do his homework, and his distinguished career was basically ended in nation-wide embarrassment, and whatever legacy he wanted was destroyed.  

Donald Trump on the other hand, spews shit he knows is a lie, and he is using his office to funnel a shit-ton of taxpayer money into his personal businesses.  

But yeah, same thing, amirite?

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GHOSTUSER
GHOSTUSER

I fucking love this President. My 2 faves during my lifetime are Trump and Nixon. They share a lot of similarities and were besieged by the same groups of assholes. No I’m not trolling. Y’all, the lef

Francisco 2.0
Francisco 2.0
Brisketexan
Brisketexan

This.....is magnificent. The "younger generation" is going to have to work double-time to fund YOUR Social Security, which YOUR generation of elected officials raided the fuck out of.  And which,

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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 89810

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Nivek said:


Vietnam didn’t attack us and our allies nor were they threatening world domination.

Vietnam is so much more than that, some of which we didn’t realize at the time, or at least it didn’t seem to match what the politicians were saying.  If Vietnam falls to the communists, the rest of SE Asia falls, and from there, who knows.    It would most likely be a lot more than 50,000 dead American troops, because we would have gotten involved at some point in that process.

Plus, if we don’t fight the Soviets by proxy there, we fight them somewhere else - we had quite a bit of pressure building up.  What happens if we and the Soviets pour those same resources into the Arab-Israeli conflicts?  What if the Cuba stuff gets hot?

anyways, enough of this.  Trump would have found a way out of any draft, no matter how necessary or just  it was or wasn’t, that much is clear.  

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wildcat09

wildcat09 29410

Posted
Posted
Just now, atomheartbevo said:

Vietnam is so much more than that, some of which we didn’t realize at the time, or at least it didn’t seem to match what the politicians were saying.  If Vietnam falls to the communists, the rest of SE Asia falls, and from there, who knows.    It would most likely be a lot more than 50,000 dead American troops, because we would have gotten involved at some point in that process.

Plus, if we don’t fight the Soviets by proxy there, we fight them somewhere else - we had quite a bit of pressure building up.  What happens if we and the Soviets pour those same resources into the Arab-Israeli conflicts?  What if the Cuba stuff gets hot?

anyways, enough of this.  Trump would have found a way out of any draft, no matter how necessary or just  it was or wasn’t, that much is clear.  

...isn't basically everything in your post exactly what they used to justify Vietnam at the time?

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105383

Posted
Posted
18 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Vietnam is so much more than that, some of which we didn’t realize at the time, or at least it didn’t seem to match what the politicians were saying.  If Vietnam falls to the communists, the rest of SE Asia falls, and from there, who knows.    It would most likely be a lot more than 50,000 dead American troops, because we would have gotten involved at some point in that process.

Plus, if we don’t fight the Soviets by proxy there, we fight them somewhere else - we had quite a bit of pressure building up.  What happens if we and the Soviets pour those same resources into the Arab-Israeli conflicts?  What if the Cuba stuff gets hot?

anyways, enough of this.  Trump would have found a way out of any draft, no matter how necessary or just  it was or wasn’t, that much is clear.  

 

17 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

...isn't basically everything in your post exactly what they used to justify Vietnam at the time?

Met my wife when we both took a class on the Vietnam War.  I argued what Atomheart was arguing -- "AT THE TIME, it was a rational and justifiable decision.  Once you understand what our predicate beliefs were, then from there, it was the right decision."  She argued "but our predicate beliefs were WRONG."  Kind of an interesting pair of perspectives, both of which are significantly correct.  Of course, I got an A in the class, she got a B+, but it would be a real dick move of me to bring that up every time the class comes up, which I do, because I'm a dick.

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Loco

Loco 3754

Posted
Posted (edited)
27 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Vietnam is so much more than that, some of which we didn’t realize at the time, or at least it didn’t seem to match what the politicians were saying.  If Vietnam falls to the communists, the rest of SE Asia falls, and from there, who knows.    It would most likely be a lot more than 50,000 dead American troops, because we would have gotten involved at some point in that process.

Plus, if we don’t fight the Soviets by proxy there, we fight them somewhere else - we had quite a bit of pressure building up.  What happens if we and the Soviets pour those same resources into the Arab-Israeli conflicts?  What if the Cuba stuff gets hot?

anyways, enough of this.  Trump would have found a way out of any draft, no matter how necessary or just  it was or wasn’t, that much is clear.  

Watch the Ken Burns series on Vietnam...   prepare to be pissed off.    tl/dr  the French fucked us because they wanted to keep their colony

 

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Chad Fuck

Chad Fuck 17791

Posted
Posted
Just now, Loco said:

Watch the Ken Burns series on Vietnam...   prepare to be pissed off.    tl/dr  the French fucked us because they wanted to keep their colony

That didn't stop us from marching in there with a complete lack of understanding of the locals and their perspective.  The more things change...

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RomaVicta

RomaVicta 30027

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

 

Met my wife when we both took a class on the Vietnam War.  I argued what Atomheart was arguing -- "AT THE TIME, it was a rational and justifiable decision.  Once you understand what our predicate beliefs were, then from there, it was the right decision."  She argued "but our predicate beliefs were WRONG."  Kind of an interesting pair of perspectives, both of which are significantly correct.  Of course, I got an A in the class, she got a B+, but it would be a real dick move of me to bring that up every time the class comes up, which I do, because I'm a dick.

Any president or politician who looked weak on communism was doomed. LBJ is on tape saying that more commitment to Viet Nam is a mistake, but that the voter won't see it that way. He proceeded to take the wrong course hoping some kind of victory might be won.

LBJ's position is difficult. If you do the right thing, you'll be replaced with someone who will do the wrong thing. Do the wrong thing, and maybe you can do other things better.

Viet Nam was the continuation of the narrative that "our boys" are welcome liberators wherever they go. That was largely unique to WWII. People don't like armies bumbling around their countries killing their friends and family.

We never learn this. We're always the good guys and they're always the bad guys. The world permanently viewed from the eye of a child as far as the populace goes. There are more cynical forces at work actually making decisions.

 

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Chooky

Chooky 13319

Posted
Posted
21 minutes ago, Loco said:

Watch the Ken Burns series on Vietnam...   prepare to be pissed off.    tl/dr  the French fucked us because they wanted to keep their colony

 

It's a great piece, but you're right. It's infuriating. Multitudes of politicians who deserved to be sodomized with farm implements but instead lived normal lives. 

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henrygandorf

henrygandorf 29195

Posted
Posted
19 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

Any president or politician who looked weak on communism was doomed. LBJ is on tape saying that more commitment to Viet Nam is a mistake, but that the voter won't see it that way. He proceeded to take the wrong course hoping some kind of victory might be won.

LBJ's position is difficult. If you do the right thing, you'll be replaced with someone who will do the wrong thing. Do the wrong thing, and maybe you can do other things better.

Viet Nam was the continuation of the narrative that "our boys" are welcome liberators wherever they go. That was largely unique to WWII. People don't like armies bumbling around their countries killing their friends and family.

We never learn this. We're always the good guys and they're always the bad guys. The world permanently viewed from the eye of a child as far as the populace goes. There are more cynical forces at work actually making decisions.

 

this is due to us basing every current war on shit we learned from the previous war.  hasn't shown to be a great idea.

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105383

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, henrygandorf said:

this is due to us basing every current war on shit we learned from the previous war.  hasn't shown to be a great idea.

Oh, there's about 20 layers of bad thinking that 1) got us there then, and 2) we're still holding onto, because maybe THIS time, that sort of thinking will be right.

Step one should be "stop viewing the USA as we view ourselves, and start viewing it as objective third parties see us"....and honestly, once you do that, then the rest of it pretty much falls into place.  Our repeated self-congratulatory excuse of "but we're bringing them FREEDOM!" is doing nobody any favors.  And, you know, the fact that it's rarely true is a nice little side problem.

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MaybeACoordinator

MaybeACoordinator 8349

Posted
Posted
23 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

Any president or politician who looked weak on communism was doomed. LBJ is on tape saying that more commitment to Viet Nam is a mistake, but that the voter won't see it that way. He proceeded to take the wrong course hoping some kind of victory might be won.

LBJ's position is difficult. If you do the right thing, you'll be replaced with someone who will do the wrong thing. Do the wrong thing, and maybe you can do other things better.

Viet Nam was the continuation of the narrative that "our boys" are welcome liberators wherever they go. That was largely unique to WWII. People don't like armies bumbling around their countries killing their friends and family.

We never learn this. We're always the good guys and they're always the bad guys. The world permanently viewed from the eye of a child as far as the populace goes. There are more cynical forces at work actually making decisions.

 

I was just listening to Reagan giving a speech about Vietnam the other day -- it was early in the publicity offensive in the 1980s to get us over losing that war, and he was going on and on about how "our boys" gave toys to burned children (who we'd probably napalmed), took care of orphans (whose parents we probably killed), and delivered babies in villages where there were no doctors (because they were either killed by us or fighting the war either with us or against us). I don't doubt that our soldiers enjoyed doing that humanitarian stuff, but the fact is, we did wayyyyyy more harm than good in that country. 

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suddenly shaggy

suddenly shaggy 929

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, Enfield said:

The FBI did two things with it. Deemed it unverified and also used it to obtain FISA warrants to surveil a campaign.

Do suggest Trump should do the same against his opponents during this election cycle?

They didn't deem it "unverified" and y'all look especially stupid in your misunderstanding of this. It's raw intel, of course it's not yet verified.  

Guess what? Almost all of the leads and intel used to get any warrant are "unverified". They form probable cause to investigate and verify. That's the entire point of the warrant. 

 

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Lagunamadre

Lagunamadre 1975

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, suddenly shaggy said:

They didn't deem it "unverified" and y'all look especially stupid in your misunderstanding of this. It's raw intel, of course it's not yet verified.  

Guess what? Almost all of the leads and intel used to get any warrant are "unverified". They form probable cause to investigate and verify. That's the entire point of the warrant. 

 

Exactly. If it was verified, then they wouldn't be asking for a warrant they would be typing up an indictment. Also, Page was being watched long before the Steele dossier ever surfaced.  

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Lagunamadre

Lagunamadre 1975

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, lemonlime said:

Is there any reason anyone should believe Pompeo on this?  

Zero reasons. Iran does not want war. Gulf States desperately want us to go to war with Iran. This is what they call a false flag. 

I'll at least enjoy a bump in WTI if the warmongers get their way. 

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SuingToGetAMessageBoard?

SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861

Posted
Posted

Re: Vietnam.  I had a professor that called 1939-1989 the Long War or some such.  It only 'felt' like the war ended in 1945 because that is when it stopped looking like every previous war.  But the reality was that the fighting continued, just under the rules of nuclear states.  Fascism v.  Communism v. Democracy v. National Socialism.  I think that helps put in to perspective why Nam was what it was to us at that time.

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FondrenRoad

FondrenRoad 4378

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

Re: Vietnam.  I had a professor that called 1939-1989 the Long War or some such.  It only 'felt' like the war ended in 1945 because that is when it stopped looking like every previous war.  But the reality was that the fighting continued, just under the rules of nuclear states.  Fascism v.  Communism v. Democracy v. National Socialism.  I think that helps put in to perspective why Nam was what it was to us at that time.

It didn't end in 1989 either. It's still going on. The Soviets just changed their name.  Their strongest blow yet in the war came in 2016. 

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David Dennison

David Dennison 18948

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, ChickenSandwich said:

Pelosi: Democrats will take up measure to ban foreign opposition research

 

LMAO. Now Trump needs to oppose term limits and encourage a raise for congress. 

Let’s get those passed too Nancy!  Defy Trump!! you glorious moron. 

So he'll support this bill?

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

Posted
Posted
20 minutes ago, ChickenSandwich said:

Pelosi: Democrats will take up measure to ban foreign opposition research

 

LMAO. Now Trump needs to oppose term limits and encourage a raise for congress. 

Let’s get those passed too Nancy!  Defy Trump!! you glorious moron. 

Says the moron

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

Posted
Posted
22 minutes ago, ChickenSandwich said:

Pelosi: Democrats will take up measure to ban foreign opposition research

 

LMAO. Now Trump needs to oppose term limits and encourage a raise for congress. 

Let’s get those passed too Nancy!  Defy Trump!! you glorious moron. 

Can you at least try to address the subject at hand without but Obama type deflection?

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

Posted
Posted
44 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:


There’s a cause of action called “quantum meruit.” They should use it.

Stiffing hardworking people is just part of the trump playbook. This should come as a surprise to nobody and in fact, if you ever do work for trump without getting paid up front you are a damn moron on the level of chicken sandwich. 

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

Posted
Posted
Just now, HenryJames said:

 

Good for them. It obviously needed to be said because the president is a traitor, a criminal, and a moron who would and almost assuredly has willfullly broken this law to serve his own personal self interest at the expense of the interest of the entire country. And that includes the interests of complete morons like chicken sandwich, johnny sack, chrispy, enfield and the rest of the surly troll army.

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105383

Posted
Posted
40 minutes ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

“The amount earned?” My Latin is rusty. Explain.

Quote

Quantum meruit is an equitable theory of recovery based on an implied agreement to pay for benefits received and knowingly accepted. 

A party can recover in quantum meruit when non-payment for the services rendered would result in an unjust enrichment to the party benefited by the work. To recover in quantum meruit, the plaintiff must establish that: (1) valuable services and/or materials were furnished, (2) to the party sought to be charged, (3) which were accepted by the party sought to be charged, and (4) under such circumstances as reasonably notified the recipient that the plaintiff, in performing, expected to be paid by the recipient.

I copied from a Texas case, deleted all the citation junk.  Bottom line, if I provided you something of value, you accepted them, and you know I expected to be paid, then you gotta pay me.

It's a good claim against the Trump campaign (and ANY campaign that doesn't pay, by the way -- for example, Beto staged a rally in El Paso that incurred such expenses. Of course, he paid his bill.  Trump hasn't).  They should pursue it.

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Upgrayedd

Upgrayedd 5821

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

I copied from a Texas case, deleted all the citation junk.  Bottom line, if I provided you something of value, you accepted them, and you know I expected to be paid, then you gotta pay me.

Probably a construction case

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23367

Posted
Posted (edited)

The irony of Trump and the Republicans accusing the Democrats of foreign opposition research is the Russians stole the democrats opposition research on Trump and it was among the first things they leaked along with the democrats strategy during the Republican primaries. 

Edited by Hugo Stiglitz
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Blotto

Blotto 23580

Posted
Posted
54 minutes ago, HenryJames said:

 

It's easy to become numb to all the inane bullshit that leaks out of Trump's orange blowhole (yes I know Trump counts on this), but the fact that this had to be stated by the person who stated it, in direct response to the president of the US.......damn. That's where we are as a country. 

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Blotto said:

It's easy to become numb to all the inane bullshit that leaks out of Trump's orange blowhole (yes I know Trump counts on this), but the fact that this had to be stated by the person who stated it, in direct response to the president of the US.......damn. That's where we are as a country. 

Welp. When you elect (or at least come close enough to electing) a narcissist mentally ill douchebag to be the leader of your country sometimes these things tend to happen. 

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