Donald Trump 2019

[Brisketexan 106874]

2 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

What would be negotiating in good faith?  Re-establishing DACA protections and then starting over?  I’m gonna go out on a limb and say Pelosi wouldn’t do anything then. It wouldn’t satisfy you either.  As you said, it’s about Trump and his tactics and personality. 

Giving something back that you took away isn't good faith negotiation.  Anyone older than 4 knows that.  That's it, full stop.

"Hey Brisket, I stole your truck.  But I'll give it back, IF you fund a monument of me.  After that, then we can start negotiating about the right way to deal with monuments and trucks?"

I negotiate for a living, dude.  The only answer to that would be "no."  I wouldn't even bother explaining myself.

[hobbes2702 13436]

3 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

What would be negotiating in good faith?  Re-establishing DACA protections and then starting over?  I’m gonna go out on a limb and say Pelosi wouldn’t do anything then. It wouldn’t satisfy you either.  As you said, it’s about Trump and his tactics and personality. 

That would be a start. You’re trying to argue things that haven’t happened. Maybe we could try re-establishment of DACA and go from there. Shit if anything that would make Trumps arguments stronger. But that’s not the point. The point is to create as much pain as possible until something cracks. 

Seriously do you have any clue as to how any of this works?

[GRHorn 105]

1 minute ago, Brisketexan said:

Giving something back that you took away isn't good faith negotiation.  Anyone older than 4 knows that.  That's it, full stop.

"Hey Brisket, I stole your truck.  But I'll give it back, IF you fund a monument of me.  After that, then we can start negotiating about the right way to deal with monuments and trucks?"

I negotiate for a living, dude.  The only answer to that would be "no."  I wouldn't even bother explaining myself.

Ok, dude. I asked what would be considered good faith? 

[ChiTownDoc 21345]

6 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

No, I meant Gekko is actually influenced as a character by Icahn and Boesky per Oliver Stone.

 

Got it.  Huge pet peeve is the hippy protesters lumping Trump in with people with actual brains, and at least some conscience, on Wall Street.  

[hobbes2702 13436]

1 minute ago, GRHorn said:

Ok, dude. I asked what would be considered good faith? 

Opening the fucking government. This isn’t hard

[SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3871]

6 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

What would be negotiating in good faith?  Re-establishing DACA protections and then starting over?  I’m gonna go out on a limb and say Pelosi wouldn’t do anything then. It wouldn’t satisfy you either.  As you said, it’s about Trump and his tactics and personality. 

Yes, taking away popular things and advocating unpopular ones is hard.  Negotiating in good faith would be to get American support behind your plan and then push it.  His basic failure to understand how politics works puts him in a position without leverage. 

We all saw his incompetence about the job he was taking on coming.  I'm sorry his supporters have to deal with it.  

[4th&Five 41985]

 

[Brisketexan 106874]

1 minute ago, GRHorn said:

Ok, dude. I asked what would be considered good faith? 

In my analogy, give up the hostages.  That's it.  He took DACA recipients hostage, and now he's taken the American people and all of those who work for the government hostage.  Hell, if he just gave back the SECOND set of hostages, then we could have meaningful negotiations about the first.  He won't even do that.

Never negotiate with terrorist, you only encourage identical tactics in the future.  Seriously, this shit is game theory 101.

If Trump agreed to sign a short-term CR, so that the parties could negotiate WITHOUT hostages, and if he could sell a coherent border security/immigation strategy that was supported by more than 30% of the people, then I'd be all for agreeing to it in such negotiations. 

He won't do any of that.  Because he's not capable of thinking that way.  Just like a three year old.

[Js1 87174]

2 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

If Trump agreed to sign a short-term CR, so that the parties could negotiate WITHOUT hostages, and if he could sell a coherent border security/immigation strategy that was supported by more than 30% of the people, then I'd be all for agreeing to it in such negotiations. 

This is Trump Infrastructure all over again.

2 opportunities to address real issues, with bipartisan support, and he fucked them over both time.

[WhatTheBuck 28928]

19 minutes ago, retread said:

Preach. Why not look at immigrants from Central America as assets? Look at it as a problem with a solution as opposed to a concocted bogeyman that's gonna rape errbody up in here.

It's no more intractable than healthcare, but we've lost the ability to legislate and to govern ourselves equitably.

The thing is, those people are brown. They might eventually become U.S. Citizens. If they have children here, their children will be U.S. citizens...brown U.S. citizens. That is what Trump is trying to guard against, the loss of the white majority population in the U.S. He says "Make America great again." What he means is "Make America white again." It's why he's so popular with the KKK. 

[Underdog 29162]

44 minutes ago, SimonBolivar said:

I loved a cold can of spaghetti-o's with meatballs as a kid. I thought it lost some flavor when heated up.

Never did spaghetti-O’s but ravioli several times. 

[Underdog 29162]

54 minutes ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

I travel with cans of Tuna and Sardines packed in Olive Oil, because it’s a delicious snack and keeps me out of tedious conversations on the road.
Don’t understand soup, but you do you brother.

It Damn well better have been Schooner Tuna, the tuna with a heart or you’re a heartless commie. 

[Planet Houston 4950]

3 hours ago, Bojack said:

Has anyone ever gotten Trump to answer whether Wall will be built across Big Bend?  I think that's one of the easiest ways to show the absurdity of this bullshit. 

Trump:  Why would I build a wall across that big clock in France?  

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

Can we have an honest discussion about my bigger river idea yet? 

[Red Five 41703]

Golly, it’s almost like the “president” shut down the government immediately after his party lost control of the House. And it’s almost like this super duper wall emergency wasn’t that big of an emergency his first two years in office. I don’t know, maybe it’s just me.

[Post Oak 20555]

 

 

[Doc Sam Beckett 5901]

8 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Can we have an honest discussion about my bigger river idea yet? 

I like rivers. Very cool! 

[retread 2951]

When DOTUS can dog whistle 40% of the country and hold >1 million federal employees hostage, we're pretty much screwed.

[jimmyjazz 47127]

1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

If you never got back to your room in college at 3:00 am, drunk as hell and broke as fuck, and popped open a can of Campbell's Sirloin Burger Chunky Soup and ate that shit cold and straight outta the can, I don't want to know you.  You are dead to me.

It's less of a safety hazard, too.  At one point in my youth I bought one of those Fry Daddy fryers.  They had a tupperware lid to cover the oil when not in use.  (I imagine you can see where this is going.)

Went out drinking with friends, came home hungering for fried something, turned on the Fry Daddy but forgot to remove the lid, sat down on the couch and promptly passed out.  Woke up hours later to an apartment filled with horrible acrid smoke from the tupperware lid that had melted into the hot oil.  I have no idea why the place didn't burn down with me in it.

[conVINCEd 21477]

Just now, jimmyjazz said:

It's less of a safety hazard, too.  At one point in my youth I bought one of those Fry Daddy fryers.  They had a tupperware lid to cover the oil when not in use.  (I imagine you can see where this is going.)

Went out drinking with friends, came home hungering for fried something, turned on the Fry Daddy but forgot to remove the lid, sat down on the couch and promptly passed out.  Woke up hours later to an apartment filled with horrible acrid smoke from the tupperware lid that had melted into the hot oil.  I have no idea why the place didn't burn down with me in it.

I too once melted a Fry Daddy lid.  Very poor design.

[Chooky 13340]

And that lady over there is named Karen, but I call her Karen.  Her sister is Katherine.  Many people like to call Karen's sister, Katherine, by her name, which is Katherine.  I also call her Katherine.  Debbie is a bitch, though.  She wants to be called Deborah.  Well, too bad, Debbie.

[Loco 3754]

On the soup front....   I would take a can of "chowda" out on fishing trips...   vent the can, set it on the engine manifold for 5-10 mins...  I'm eating steaming hot clam chowder with some oyster crackers on a cold wet morning and other guys are looking at a shitty cold 7-11 sandwich...  Checkmate mofos

as for late night...  that's the mysterious realm of cheap deliver pizza...  Gumby's and Pirate Pete's...   your burnt roof of the mouth will not thank you though

[wildcat09 29577]

49 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

Ok, dude. I asked what would be considered good faith? 

It's really sad that you have to ask because you can't grasp the concept.

[SubliminalHorn 7008]

18 minutes ago, Doc Sam Beckett said:

I like rivers. Very cool! 

And very legal!

[Chooky 13340]

Mike Pence read this article and didn't understand why gravity made him feel so heavy when in his head he felt like he was floating out of his loafers.

[GRHorn 105]

16 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

It's really sad that you have to ask because you can't grasp the concept.

I ask because I’d like to know where people on the Left see as actual starting point.

[wildcat09 29577]

"Look, look, ok, I know I started a fire that's burning all ten stories of this building and have a gun to this child's head. What if I put out the fire on six floors? What will you give me to put the rest of the fire out and remove the gun from this child's head? Nothing!? That's completely unreasonable! C'mon, I'm making a huge concession here, what the hell else could you people possibly want!?"

[Biff Tannen 46151]

12 minutes ago, Chooky said:

Mike Pence read this article and didn't understand why gravity made him feel so heavy when in his head he felt like he was floating out of his loafers.

[elguapo 4620]

1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

In my analogy, give up the hostages.  That's it.  He took DACA recipients hostage, and now he's taken the American people and all of those who work for the government hostage.  Hell, if he just gave back the SECOND set of hostages, then we could have meaningful negotiations about the first.  He won't even do that.

Never negotiate with terrorist, you only encourage identical tactics in the future.  Seriously, this shit is game theory 101.

If Trump agreed to sign a short-term CR, so that the parties could negotiate WITHOUT hostages, and if he could sell a coherent border security/immigation strategy that was supported by more than 30% of the people, then I'd be all for agreeing to it in such negotiations. 

He won't do any of that.  Because he's not capable of thinking that way.  Just like a three year old.

Lucky for us Pelosi has raised 5 kids, manipulating Dotard will be cake for her.

[hobbes2702 13436]

7 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

I ask because I’d like to know where people on the Left see as actual starting point.

Wait for it... open the government. Seems like a logical starting point.

[Js1 87174]

35 minutes ago, conVINCEd said:

I too once melted a Fry Daddy lid.  Very poor design.

Me too!

[G650 14437]

1 hour ago, GRHorn said:

 I wouldn’t even think about it if the news wasn’t going on and on about it. 

Yeah, that's kind of your problem.

[Fudge Nuggets 19453]

4 hours ago, Bojack said:

Has anyone ever gotten Trump to answer whether Wall will be built across Big Bend?  I think that's one of the easiest ways to show the absurdity of this bullshit.  

 

Are there any supporters of Wall here who'd like to answer that?

Let me clue you in on something.  Most people outside ofTexas don’t give a shit about Big Bend and there are enough dumbasses in the state that will still vote R no matter what that it doesn’t matter.  Get ready for a big beautiful 50 ft wall right through that fucker.

[Jiggy-Z 3509]

38 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

It's less of a safety hazard, too.  At one point in my youth I bought one of those Fry Daddy fryers.  They had a tupperware lid to cover the oil when not in use.  (I imagine you can see where this is going.)

Went out drinking with friends, came home hungering for fried something, turned on the Fry Daddy but forgot to remove the lid, sat down on the couch and promptly passed out.  Woke up hours later to an apartment filled with horrible acrid smoke from the tupperware lid that had melted into the hot oil.  I have no idea why the place didn't burn down with me in it.

Saw this on an American Experience or something:  Lee Atwater lost his infant brother when his mom left one of those on and he tipped it over on himself.  It apparently really shaped young Lee .  that is all. 

[G650 14437]

33 minutes ago, Loco said:

On the soup front....   I would take a can of "chowda" out on fishing trips...   vent the can, set it on the engine manifold for 5-10 mins...  I'm eating steaming hot clam chowder with some oyster crackers on a cold wet morning and other guys are looking at a shitty cold 7-11 sandwich...  Checkmate mofos

as for late night...  that's the mysterious realm of cheap deliver pizza...  Gumby's and Pirate Pete's...   your burnt roof of the mouth will not thank you though

I had a similar strategy back when I was a excavator operator. In the winter would bring a leftover pork chop or steak wrapped in foil and toss it on the engine an hour or so before lunch. Shit was toasty by eatin time.

I have seen some guys not vent cans though. Quite messy.

[shnsajax 3607]

43 minutes ago, Chooky said:

And that lady over there is named Karen, but I call her Karen.  Her sister is Katherine.  Many people like to call Karen's sister, Katherine, by her name, which is Katherine.  I also call her Katherine.  Debbie is a bitch, though.  She wants to be called Deborah.  Well, too bad, Debbie.

This is fake news, Trump loves Debbie.

Little Debbie that is. 

[Js1 87174]

1 minute ago, shnsajax said:

This is fake news, Trump loves Debbie.

Little Debbie that is. 

Debbie does Donald.

[jdhorn92 1594]

2 minutes ago, Js1 said:

Debbie does Donald.

Donald is Debbie downer.

[Asithappens 978]

1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

Never negotiate with terrorist, you only encourage identical tactics in the future.  Seriously, this shit is game theory 101.If Trump agreed to sign a short-term CR, so that the parties

I understand your point, or at least I think I do, and not to be "that guy", but I gotta call bullshit on "never" negotiating with terrorists.

Of course one negotiates with terrorists. Negotiation may be done in a way that reduces or even eliminates the encouragement of tactics (identical or just similar) in the future. Imo, the phrase "never negotiate with terrorists" is mostly political pablum that is designed to make the populace feel they have a strong, stalwart, unwavering leader. That is, it's just bullshit. 

Chris Voss has a book or two on the topic, and has been on some podcasts talking about his method/theory of negotiation. 

Now, negotiating doesn't mean giving in to the terrorists (which is what I think is really meant by that way overly broad statement). 

But of course you negotiate with them.

[Brisketexan 106874]

6 minutes ago, Asithappens said:

I understand your point, or at least I think I do, and not to be "that guy", but I gotta call bullshit on "never" negotiating with terrorists.

Of course one negotiates with terrorists. Negotiation may be done in a way that reduces or even eliminates the encouragement of tactics (identical or just similar) in the future. Imo, the phrase "never negotiate with terrorists" is mostly political pablum that is designed to make the populace feel they have a strong, stalwart, unwavering leader. That is, it's just bullshit. 

Chris Voss has a book or two on the topic, and has been on some podcasts talking about his method/theory of negotiation. 

Now, negotiating doesn't mean giving in to the terrorists (which is what I think is really meant by that way overly broad statement). 

But of course you negotiate with them.

Correct -- I am using the shorthand.  You don't reward their tactics by giving in to their demands.  That's a recipe for hostage situation #2, etc ad infinitum.

[Hank Kingsley 21750]

GRHorn not understanding what actually constitutes good faith is just so fucking modern day Republican.

[retread 2951]

Pence, McC, and Kush negotiated a compromise. Why won't the extremist Ds get on board?

[Asithappens 978]

1 minute ago, Hank Kingsley said:

GRHorn not understanding what actually constitutes good faith is just so fucking modern day Republican.

Modern day evangelitard Republicans seem to have lots of problems with the word "faith".

And I'm NOT saying GRHorn is that. 

Just wanted to get a dig in at the evangelitard Republicans. It's my weak spot.

[Asithappens 978]

Just now, retread said:

Pence, McC, and Kush negotiated a compromise. Why won't the extremist Ds get on board?

I'm surprised Pence has the time to do this.

Doesn't he have a date later with some dude who used to run a gay conversion therapy program?

[High Plains Drifter 11186]

I have a friend, great guy, smart. I will not go to a restaurant with his family because his kids act like little fucking shitheads. My kids stay in their seat, do not whine about not getting to drink Coke, do not trash the place.

Why? Because years ago, one of them pulled some shit, wouldn't stop whining about not getting to drink coke instead of milk and then turning up the whining to screaming when I said no, I made us all get up and leave, left the barely eaten food on the table. They have never acted out in a restaurant again. If I had given them the coke just to shut them up so I could enjoy the meal in peace, they would be drinking coke every time we go to a restaurant.

You do not negotiate with terrorists, or misbehaving children. You do not meet them halfway. You do not make a deal. You do not make a counter offer. You do not give them the coke, or 5.7 billion for a stupid fucking wall that should have been laughed out of court the first time it was mentioned, just because its easier.

[Aqua Buddha 14803]

3 minutes ago, High Plains Drifter said:

I have a friend, great guy, smart. I will not go to a restaurant with his family because his kids act like little fucking shitheads. My kids stay in their seat, do not whine about not getting to drink Coke, do not trash the place.

Why? Because years ago, one of them pulled some shit, wouldn't stop whining about not getting to drink coke instead of milk and then turning up the whining to screaming when I said no, I made us all get up and leave, left the barely eaten food on the table. They have never acted out in a restaurant again. If I had given them the coke just to shut them up so I could enjoy the meal in peace, they would be drinking coke every time we go to a restaurant.

You do not negotiate with terrorists, or misbehaving children. You do not meet them halfway. You do not make a deal. You do not make a counter offer. You do not give them the coke, or 5.7 billion for a stupid fucking wall that should have been laughed out of court the first time it was mentioned, just because its easier.

Exactly this.  We all know people with kids like this.

The power of "no" is underrated.  If you compromise with someone or something that's unreasonable, then you're halfway unreasonable.

[Bojack 2090]

1 hour ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Can we have an honest discussion about my bigger river idea yet? 

An interbasin transfer of water from the Columbia below Grand Coulee to the headwaters of the Rio Grande would likely be more feasible than 2000 miles of border wall.  Both would have an awful environmental impact.  Neither, by themselves, would have much effect on illegal immigration.  Your bigger river would only cover Texas and would result in more flooding but would allow for increased irrigation in the Rio Grande Valley.  It would further diminish the Columbia salmon run.  It really is no worse an idea than the wall. We might also divert water from the Colorado after Hoover dam because fuck California.  I think if your plan was pitched just right to Trump, it might provide more distraction from the terrible things he'll do otherwise.   

[Chooky 13340]

 

[Born to Run 6601]

An interbasin transfer of water from the Columbia below Grand Coulee to the headwaters of the Rio Grande would likely be more feasible than 2000 miles of border wall.  Both would have an awful environmental impact.  Neither, by themselves, would have much effect on illegal immigration.  Your bigger river would only cover Texas and would result in more flooding but would allow for increased irrigation in the Rio Grande Valley.  It would further diminish the Columbia salmon run.  It really is no worse an idea than the wall. We might also divert water from the Colorado after Hoover dam because fuck California.  I think if your plan was pitched just right to Trump, it might provide more distraction from the terrible things he'll do otherwise.   

Make Santa Elena class V rapids again!!!

[Pancho 46269]

14 minutes ago, longhornmatt said:

That’s what you think.  Your kids are actually buying coke and ice cream from illegal immigrants behind your back because we don’t have WALL.

y