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2019 Tampa Bay Rays Thread

Fawesome

By Fawesome
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Goo Punch
Goo Punch

uh, i'm cool with 14 as well, but thus far our vetting process is...nonexistent. if we're going to add two more people let's make sure that they're down to manage their teams and stay involved for the

henrygandorf
henrygandorf

it's now a double secret protest. i already sent in paperwork to the commissioner, so you probably haven't seen it.

UTPhil2006
UTPhil2006

Here's mine.  

henrygandorf

henrygandorf 29201

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Fawesome said:

Draft order set. Draft date set. Draft pick trading turned on. 

 

See yall in 29 days, 8 hours, 9 minutes, 30 seconds, like anyone is even counting. 

ok, so this brings up an interesting question/debate: are trading draft picks allowed?

my opinion is that trading slots (picks for the entire draft) should be allowed.  but trading for individual picks should not be allowed.

i don't know if the system even supports that, but it's my opinion on the matter.

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Fawesome

Fawesome 111

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7 minutes ago, henrygandorf said:

ok, so this brings up an interesting question/debate: are trading draft picks allowed?

my opinion is that trading slots (picks for the entire draft) should be allowed.  but trading for individual picks should not be allowed.

i don't know if the system even supports that, but it's my opinion on the matter.

The system doesn't support one OR the other. Just all pick slots or none. 

I dont have a preference so lets discuss. Its been open every year but no one trades anything.

 

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Goo Punch

Goo Punch 4275

Posted
Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, BigOrange1 said:

i have no problem whatsoever with people trading individual picks.

same here. as an example, in this year's shaggy hoops league i got the #1 overall pick. I swapped places with the guy who had the 10th pick, and as compensation we also swapped fifth round picks, moving me up nine spots in one round of the draft in exchange for picking from the #1 overall spot. I thought it was a fair trade. i had no incentive to trade the #1 overall pick (was going to take Harden) without being able to trade an individual draft spot as well. 

in other words, if we're only allowed to trade entire draft places then there's only 3-4 teams in the whole league who even have incentive to trade, which to me is even more unfair than giving everyone in the league an equal opportunity to make a move to improve their position. I have the 5th pick. Nobody will trade spots with me without me giving them compensation. really only the first two and last two picks of each round have any incentive/leverage for trading if we can't trade individual picks. I'd love to trade out of this spot but I have no chance to do so if I can't offer someone a better pick somewhere in return. I could make some nice offers to the teams picking 1-3 or 10-12 if i could throw in individual picks. otherwise those picking 1-3 and 11-12 can trade with each other and that's about it. 

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henrygandorf

henrygandorf 29201

Posted
Posted
24 minutes ago, Goo Punch said:

in other words, if we're only allowed to trade entire draft places then there's only 3-4 teams in the whole league who even have incentive to trade, which to me is even more unfair than giving everyone in the league an equal opportunity to make a move to improve their position. I have the 5th pick. Nobody will trade spots with me without me giving them compensation. really only the first two and last two picks of each round have any incentive/leverage for trading if we can't trade individual picks. I'd love to trade out of this spot but I have no chance to do so if I can't offer someone a better pick somewhere in return. I could make some nice offers to the teams picking 1-3 or 10-12 if i could throw in individual picks. otherwise those picking 1-3 and 11-12 can trade with each other and that's about it. 

what you're assuming as fact in your argument is that certain picks (or draft positions) are more valuable than others.  i would disagree.  i don't have the research, but i would imagine fantasy baseball more than other sports can be won (or playoffs made) from any draft position on the board in any given year.  football and basketball have had players that are so fucking valuable that it almost assures the postseason - at least in football, it's just the nature of the scoring system.

i have the 10th pick and you have the 5th pick.  let's include the 2nd round and use espn rankings.  they say after two rounds you would have arenado and goldschmidt.  i would have lindor and stanton.  are you going to tell me definitively that my guys are better?  if the rankings hold, i would have the 2nd/3rd best out of the foursome, and it would look the way an "even" trade during the regular season would look.

it's a snake draft, not an mlb draft.  every spot should be equal, therefore an entire draft pick should have to be traded, not just certain rounds.

what if i started trying to acquire first round picks, and convinced 3-4 of you to give me your 1st rounders for 3-4 picks in the 2nd-20th rounds?  what if i ended the draft with 5 superstars and just used the waiver wire to fill out my roster?  are any of you interested in playing against me (or anyone) who can pull that off?

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Goo Punch

Goo Punch 4275

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, henrygandorf said:

what you're assuming as fact in your argument is that certain picks (or draft positions) are more valuable than others.  i would disagree.  i don't have the research, but i would imagine fantasy baseball more than other sports can be won (or playoffs made) from any draft position on the board in any given year.  football and basketball have had players that are so fucking valuable that it almost assures the postseason - at least in football, it's just the nature of the scoring system.

i have the 10th pick and you have the 5th pick.  let's include the 2nd round and use espn rankings.  they say after two rounds you would have arenado and goldschmidt.  i would have lindor and stanton.  are you going to tell me definitively that my guys are better?  if the rankings hold, i would have the 2nd/3rd best out of the foursome, and it would look the way an "even" trade during the regular season would look.

it's a snake draft, not an mlb draft.  every spot should be equal, therefore an entire draft pick should have to be traded, not just certain rounds.

what if i started trying to acquire first round picks, and convinced 3-4 of you to give me your 1st rounders for 3-4 picks in the 2nd-20th rounds?  what if i ended the draft with 5 superstars and just used the waiver wire to fill out my roster?  are any of you interested in playing against me (or anyone) who can pull that off?

i mean i generally agree with you in principle, but allow me to explain my POV: to me (and i know you as well) the top 3 picks in this draft are in a class by themselves in terms of those guaranteed stars you talked about from other sports who can carry a team by themselves. And, imo, spots near the front and back of the first round are more valuable than picks in the middle of the round because you get those back to back picks (or something close to it) for 90% of the draft. So from my perspective the #5 pick is almost impossible to trade, even if I generally agree with you. Because at the end of the day I personally value the wheel picks (or close to it) more than I do middle round slots. I feel that the wheel picks minimize risk and , if you choose, also allow you to take more risks, which is my whole MO. Maybe others disagree, but in case they don't I'd like a chance at getting closer to those wheel picks that I value which i can't do imo if i can't trade even a single individual pick. 

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Fawesome

Fawesome 111

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what else would we be discussing in regards to trading picks?

Well yeah that’s what I was trying to get at. You trying to acquire 4 first round picks is no different than you trying to acquire 4 superstars post-draft. Sounds like you don’t trust perceived slot value vs actual drafter player in that slot.


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henrygandorf

henrygandorf 29201

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Posted
16 minutes ago, Goo Punch said:

i mean i generally agree with you in principle, but allow me to explain my POV: to me (and i know you as well) the top 3 picks in this draft are in a class by themselves in terms of those guaranteed stars you talked about from other sports who can carry a team by themselves. And, imo, spots near the front and back of the first round are more valuable than picks in the middle of the round because you get those back to back picks (or something close to it) for 90% of the draft. So from my perspective the #5 pick is almost impossible to trade, even if I generally agree with you. Because at the end of the day I personally value the wheel picks (or close to it) more than I do middle round slots. I feel that the wheel picks minimize risk and , if you choose, also allow you to take more risks, which is my whole MO. Maybe others disagree, but in case they don't I'd like a chance at getting closer to those wheel picks that I value which i can't do imo if i can't trade even a single individual pick. 

you mention those 3 stars.  trout, mookie, and jose r?  i drafted mookie 10th last year.  ramirez went 20th.  trout has been hurt off and on the last few years, but i guess he's a "sure thing", although whomever drafted him didn't finish top 3 (not looking at full standings).

altuve (top 3 last year) might slide to me at 10th this year.  kershaw went 3rd last year.  the point is - nobody knows what's gonna happen, and to me, it's much harder to predict than fantasy football (i don't play baskets).

look, if you want to draft near the turn, i get it.  but that doesn't mean everyone thinks that way.  i bet if you offer 5 to 1-3 and 10-12 you'll get some interest.

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BigOrange1

BigOrange1 6566

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Fawesome said:


Well yeah that’s what I was trying to get at. You trying to acquire 4 first round picks is no different than you trying to acquire 4 superstars post-draft. Sounds like you don’t trust perceived slot value vs actual drafter player in that slot.


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agreed.

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henrygandorf

henrygandorf 29201

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, BigOrange1 said:

also, in order to get anyone to give up a 1st round pick you'd probably have to give them your 2nd and 3rd at least.  after that, no one is trading a 1st round pick for a bunch of 4th+ rounders so your premise is flawed.

the point is that you don't know what some of these goofballs will do.  neither do i, and i don't trust them.

that's the point.

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henrygandorf

henrygandorf 29201

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, BigOrange1 said:

also, in order to get anyone to give up a 1st round pick you'd probably have to give them your 2nd and 3rd at least.  after that, no one is trading a 1st round pick for a bunch of 4th+ rounders so your premise is flawed.

i'll give you my 1st round pick for your 2nd and 3rd right now and i don't even know what pick you have.

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henrygandorf

henrygandorf 29201

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Posted
1 hour ago, BigOrange1 said:

pretty sure you have to trade the same number of picks in any trade.  another reason trading picks isn't going to result in some massive haul for one team.

we've never had pick trading on the table to my knowledge so i don't know the parameters.  during the season you can trade odd numbers of players.

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NorthLoop

NorthLoop 14305

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, henrygandorf said:

so it looks like i'm out of commission on wed night, so i'm gonna have a proxy in place (for the 2nd time in 3 years).  i just told him to draft all astros.

My yearly annoying reminder that the one time I forgot and had a completely autodrafted team I finished 2nd. I should probably just do that every year. 

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