Fyre Fraud

mulletpelini · January 23, 2019

11 hours ago, Parliament said:

I always assumed those "social media personality" chicks with fake boobs were sugar babies and outright prostitutes.

yes

Neonmoon · January 23, 2019

7 hours ago, wild_turkey said:

Honest question, what made that a scam? People pay money to be members of exclusive clubs all the time and it sounds like that’s what Magnises was, basically a social club for NYC millennials. I don’t see a big problem with that, but admittedly I don’t know any details about it.

From what I read, Magnises was doing fine and then it failed when Billy went down after the Fyre Festival. I could be wrong but it sounds like it was somewhat sustainable as a business otherwise.

I think there was some advertising suggesting it might be a credit card. Either way, the promoted discounted concert tickets were a lie. People would buy these discounted concert tickets only to have them cancelled at the last minute.

NotActuallyALonghorn · January 23, 2019

The other thing with the card was they were supposed to have exclusive deals on tickets for stuff like concerts. Except they would cancel said deals at the last minute so people never got to use them.

Llano Estacado · January 23, 2019

When you accept a job, you should have vetted your employer. When you take a job at a start up, you are accepting a large amount of risk for the potential of a giant payoff. Just like the investors. This does not make the crazy CEO right, but start-up life is start-up life. If you don't want this risk, you need to get a job at Google or some other established company.

Agreed. Some of that risk is on them.

I just can’t help feel a little sorry for the app team in NYC. They accepted the risk, but got screwed in the vetting. Sounds like they were totally blind to the cluster-fuckery of the festival.

Their vetting process was clouded by straight up lies about burn rate, revenue, VOWD, completely fraudulent investment terms, etc. Hopefully they could get some sense of him as a charlatan from internal meetings and the CC deal.

“Hey our CEO is launching a festival with Ja Rule, marketing is kicking ass, and even if they fail to produce a Coachella on a tiny Cay we have 90mil on paper!” 60k, 90mil what’s the difference?

They didn’t get Richard Hendrick’s honesty or Erlich “fucking” Bachman as their primary investor.

Gene Parmesan · January 23, 2019

I watched this morning. I never realized there was a legitimate effort to put on a music festival. The only people I feel sorry for are the locals that got screwed. The rest hardly come off as sympathetic and I really don't see how they aren't more culpable. Especially the people that were on site. The ticket buyers got screwed, but they got their epic story and are a part of history which is likely worth more to them than had the festival had been as advertised.

Not a cat · January 23, 2019

I'm a gen Xer and am sometimes astounded when i look back at what a soft, entitled, selfish prick I was in my late teens and early 20s. And then I watch something like this and feel like I was part of the generation that survived the Great Depression and stormed the beaches of Normandy.

I will now go back to yelling at clouds and tying onions around my belt.

henrygandorf · January 23, 2019

1 hour ago, Gene Parmesan said:

I watched this morning. I never realized there was a legitimate effort to put on a music festival.

i may be remembering this wrong (from the hulu doc), but wasn't there a scene where (after the initial video went up) they were sitting around with a "holy shit, people are paying, i guess we have to actually put on this concert now"? i mean, that sounds dishonest and misleading (and is) but isn't that different from what kickstarter does. if they don't get enough donations, they don't do whatever the end goal is, and people get their money back.

even if this was their plan, they never had any type of "ok, if we raise x-million, then this is how we put on this event" plan in place. the way they scrambled around and pissed themselves makes it look like it was a planned fraud all along, even if it wasn't.

Patrick Bateman · January 23, 2019

14 hours ago, wild_turkey said:

Honest question, what made that a scam? People pay money to be members of exclusive clubs all the time and it sounds like that’s what Magnises was, basically a social club for NYC millennials. I don’t see a big problem with that, but admittedly I don’t know any details about it.

From what I read, Magnises was doing fine and then it failed when Billy went down after the Fyre Festival. I could be wrong but it sounds like it was somewhat sustainable as a business otherwise.

It's a scam because it didn't deliver on the idea it marketed to. That doesn't make it illegal but it's certainly a POS product and it's very easy to see how a person who engages in this type of rip-off could and would take the next step into engaging in illegal practices. These are just some of the complaints. When the Magnises brand stayed in it's wheelhouse of offering small get together or marginal discounts at POS, it was delivering it's services. The issue? It wasn't selling enough cards or premiums to be profitable so they had to up their game and this is when it started to fail.... It was already in financial trouble when the whole Fyre fiasco happened and basically swept the leg.

https://www.businessinsider.com/magnises-complaints-from-members-2017-1

https://www.bbb.org/us/ny/new-york/profile/concierge-service/magnises-0121-165229

Gene Parmesan · January 23, 2019

4 minutes ago, henrygandorf said:

i may be remembering this wrong (from the hulu doc), but wasn't there a scene where (after the initial video went up) they were sitting around with a "holy shit, people are paying, i guess we have to actually put on this concert now"? i mean, that sounds dishonest and misleading (and is) but isn't that different from what kickstarter does. if they don't get enough donations, they don't do whatever the end goal is, and people get their money back.

even if this was their plan, they never had any type of "ok, if we raise x-million, then this is how we put on this event" plan in place. the way they scrambled around and pissed themselves makes it look like it was a planned fraud all along, even if it wasn't.

I watched the Netflix version, so I am not sure. I just assumed that some guy just duped a bunch of millennials and stole their money. Basically that's what happened in the end, but there was a legitimate effort to accomplish something it just got way out of hand way too fast. At some point they were all implicit in the fraud as they knew they had no way to deliver what they sold.

Deej · January 23, 2019

8 minutes ago, Gene Parmesan said:

At some point they were all implicit in the fraud as they knew they had no way to deliver what they sold.

"That's not fraud. That is, uh... I would call that... false advertising."

texashorne · January 23, 2019

On 1/15/2019 at 12:22 PM, Bama Chick said:

Yeah the Instagram Influencer culture is nuts.

Fucking Kendall Jenner gets $250,000 for ONE Instagram post.

ONE

And one of the marketing people in the documentary said that was a bargain compared to traditional media. That her followers are are such a large specific audience and that a traditional commercial would cost way more and never achieve the kind of precise audience targeting they get with one of her posts.

The JennerDashians are everything wrong with America but those bitches are some marketing and PR geniuses.

The most intelligent thing they do is listen to whomever manges their enterprise. While I do respect them for doing this, there is a management team telling everyone of them exactly what to do.. They are far from geniuses.

Gene Parmesan · January 23, 2019

1 hour ago, Deej said:

"That's not fraud. That is, uh... I would call that... false advertising."

Whatever you want to call it. If it landed him in prison, I am surprised it didn't reach further since the other employees seemed to be on the exact same page as him.

Bartles · January 23, 2019

I can't grasp how this didn't get shut down in advance on the music side. Blink 182's generic bailout couldn't have been the only warning sign, right? The talent booker admitted he was 21-22 and had no idea what he was doing. I would think most of the major bands would have forced the issue based on some combination of not getting paid upfront, not having verified flight/lodging information, not having equipment logistics confirmed, sound specs, etc.

Just to name one, Major Lazer has 3.6 million Insta followers today - surely there was some back-and-forth with fans in the days before Fyre?

XYZ · January 23, 2019

Instagram is like that guy in the original Total Recall movie with another small guy growing out of his belly.

Deej · January 23, 2019

1 hour ago, Gene Parmesan said:

Whatever you want to call it. If it landed him in prison, I am surprised it didn't reach further since the other employees seemed to be on the exact same page as him.

That's a direct quote from Ja Rule, one of the organizers. Sorry you didn't get that.

Edited January 23, 2019 by Deej

henrygandorf · January 24, 2019

3 hours ago, Bartles said:

I can't grasp how this didn't get shut down in advance on the music side. Blink 182's generic bailout couldn't have been the only warning sign, right? The talent booker admitted he was 21-22 and had no idea what he was doing. I would think most of the major bands would have forced the issue based on some combination of not getting paid upfront, not having verified flight/lodging information, not having equipment logistics confirmed, sound specs, etc.

Just to name one, Major Lazer has 3.6 million Insta followers today - surely there was some back-and-forth with fans in the days before Fyre?

i think there's a pretty good chance (likely in order of size/rep of the band) that once payment deadlines had passed and calls/emails were ignored, that the bands were out, and likely notified...whomever was reading emails on the fyre side. not surprising they wouldn't want to broadcast it on the fyre side, and there's no real reason to talk shit on the performer side, on the off chance a last second wire comes through and you end up playing.

i believe they said blink 182 cancelled only a few days before, but i bet they knew way before that they would not be involved.

mulletpelini · January 24, 2019

I just find it kind of funny that a lazy POS millennial duped thousands of other millennials into thinking that he was actually going to work hard enough to get something accomplished.

and by POS I meant point of sale.

futureman · January 25, 2019

On 1/23/2019 at 4:56 PM, Deej said:

That's a direct quote from Ja Rule, one of the organizers. Sorry you didn't get that.

you’re not sorry.

On 1/21/2019 at 10:41 PM, Art Vandelay said:

I watched the Netflix doc first then the Hulu doc. Both were good but I thought Netflix was better overall and went into more detail on how it all unfolded. Hulu went more in-depth on millennials and social media culture, influencers, etc. If you're only going to watch one, I recommend the Netflix doc.

is this the consensus? netflix > hulu? I’m a very important person with a very busy schedule and I only have time for one.

Deej · January 25, 2019

1 minute ago, futureman said:

you’re not sorry.

is this the consensus? netflix > hulu? I’m a very important person with a very busy schedule and I only have time for one.

Yeah, I'm not.

I thought the Hulu version was better. It wasn't made by people who were complicit in the fraud.

Knoxtnhorn · January 25, 2019

1 hour ago, Deej said:

Yeah, I'm not.

I thought the Hulu version was better. It wasn't made by people who were complicit in the fraud.

I liked the Hulu one better as well.

I'm curious as to why there was virtually no coverage as to what happened between the first plane leaving and what happened with the rest of the people. IIRC, some of those stuck on the island were strong-armed by the local security and things got pretty shady.

happyfunball · January 25, 2019

I don’t blame the influencers at all especially now that they have to disclose if it is a paid post.

I don’t understand the influencer hate. Just another medium for marketing. I don’t think Brett farve actually like Levi jeans so why is this different

Neonmoon · January 25, 2019

4 minutes ago, happyfunball said:

I don’t blame the influencers at all especially now that they have to disclose if it is a paid post.

I don’t understand the influencer hate. Just another medium for marketing. I don’t think Brett farve actually like Levi jeans so why is this different

I believe the hate revolves around the fact that Brett Favre had to play football for 20 years before anyone would listen to his jeans advertisement, and random influencer had to tweet a bunch to get famous. They’re basically “famous” for trying to be famous, which makes them easy to hate.

satyanash · January 25, 2019

1 hour ago, futureman said:

is this the consensus? netflix > hulu? I’m a very important person with a very busy schedule and I only have time for one.

Watched the Hulu doc earlier in the week, just finished the Netflix one. Netflix was better IMO, partially because they didn't directly pay McFarland thousands of dollars to get his biased sympathetic take on what happened like Hulu did. Also Netflix had a ton of really interesting behind-the-scenes footage of the key players' discussions as things went down.

satyanash · January 25, 2019

Really felt like a case study in just how much damage a pathological liar with a lot of money can do. Watching the documentaries, it's honestly a minor miracle no one died.

Seasick Sailor · January 25, 2019

Which one has more Ratajkowski?

futureman · January 25, 2019

30 minutes ago, satyanash said:

Watched the Hulu doc earlier in the week, just finished the Netflix one. Netflix was better IMO, partially because they didn't directly pay McFarland thousands of dollars to get his biased sympathetic take on what happened like Hulu did. Also Netflix had a ton of really interesting behind-the-scenes footage of the key players' discussions as things went down.

I’m in the middle of the hulu one now. even though they paid him for his story it doesn’t seem all that sympathetic toward him.

satyanash · January 25, 2019

2 minutes ago, Seasick Sailor said:

Which one has more Ratajkowski?

The Hulu doc goes into more detail surrounding the actual fraud aspect. The Netflix one goes into more detail surrounding the disastrous event itself and what actually went down on the day of.

Both supplement each other quite well.

satyanash · January 25, 2019

Just now, futureman said:

I’m in the middle of the hulu one now. even though they paid him for his story it doesn’t seem all that sympathetic toward him.

The Netflix one straight-up unloads on Billy, very few punches pulled. The Hulu one takes pains to shift a significant portion of the blame onto other parties, like the financiers and marketing companies.

Nivek · January 25, 2019

. I don’t think Brett farve actually like Levi jeans so why is this different

Especially since it was wrangler paying him!

futureman · January 25, 2019

Just now, satyanash said:

The Netflix one straight-up unloads on Billy, very few punches pulled. The Hulu one takes pains to shift a significant portion of the blame onto other parties, like the financiers and marketing companies.

which one is more truthful though? should the financiers and marketing companies carry some of the blame?

Patrick Bateman · January 25, 2019

53 minutes ago, satyanash said:

Watched the Hulu doc earlier in the week, just finished the Netflix one. Netflix was better IMO, partially because they didn't directly pay McFarland thousands of dollars to get his biased sympathetic take on what happened like Hulu did. Also Netflix had a ton of really interesting behind-the-scenes footage of the key players' discussions as things went down.

In fairness, the Netflix one was produced in part by FuckJerry (Jerry Media) who are nowhere near subjective and part of the overall problem. Their involvement had the benefit of capturing some of the behind the scenes footage and access to some of the major players which Fyre Fraud didn't have, but it's certainly skips over their accountability in the debacle so you have to understand that they're frauds as well.... just like McFarland, who gets to shape some of the narrative of the Fyre Fraud doc...

Edited January 25, 2019 by Patrick Bateman

satyanash · January 25, 2019

23 minutes ago, futureman said:

which one is more truthful though? should the financiers and marketing companies carry some of the blame?

There are definitely lies in both. In the Netflix doc Jerry Media claims they were in the dark as to what was really going on until the day before, which is very suspect. The Hulu doc claims that they knew beforehand, one of the interviewees is an ex-employee.

In the Hulu doc though, Billy's behavior is excused a lot. For example, the claim that they actually did have all the houses rented and ready for the incoming guests, only to "forget the keys". The Hulu doc also kind of revels in what happened, to a degree that's a bit inappropriate. The Netflix doc takes pains to focus on all of the people who were affected, from the impoverished Bahamian workers who were left starving and never received $$$ for their work to the investors and production companies who lost millions to the scheme, while the Hulu doc does a lot of simplistic millennial bashing and "oh those rich kids got what was coming to them" without looking at the broader picture.

Edited January 25, 2019 by satyanash

HornsOverIthaca · January 25, 2019

Internet Historian did a good one awhile back.

Hugh G. Rection · January 25, 2019

12 hours ago, Nivek said:

Especially since it was wrangler paying him!

I know for a FACT that he and Jerry Rice use the copper fit sleeves when they're playing back yard tackle football.

Gene Parmesan · January 25, 2019

This whole thread is just a giant humble brag of people having access to both Hulu and Netflix. Well la de freaking da from those who had to just pick one or the other.

Deej · January 25, 2019

1 minute ago, Gene Parmesan said:

This whole thread is just a giant humble brag of people having access to both Hulu and Netflix. Well la de freaking da from those who had to just pick one or the other.

Hulu just dropped their monthly price to $5.99. Does that help you?

MNLonghornFUKM · January 25, 2019

This whole thread is just a giant humble brag of people having access to both Hulu and Netflix. Well la de freaking da from those who had to just pick one or the other.

I use hulu tv for my cable/local channels...and adding hulu original content was like 4 bucks/mo with my cable.

Everyone on earth has Netflix by default.

RPM · January 25, 2019

2 hours ago, Deej said:

Hulu just dropped their monthly price to $5.99. Does that help you?

2 hours ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

I use hulu tv for my cable/local channels...and adding hulu original content was like 4 bucks/mo with my cable.

Everyone on earth has Netflix by default.

Which is why Netflix just jacked up their price.

Dewey · January 25, 2019

I switched to Hulu, I feel like 90% Netflix content is murder and murderers. I liked some of the shows, but fuck sake. What should I watch now? Mind of a murderer? Bundy Tapes? Making of a murderer? Murders and Cartels? El Chopo? Murder Mountain?

futureman · January 25, 2019

3 hours ago, Dewey said:

I switched to Hulu, I feel like 90% Netflix content is murder and murderers. I liked some of the shows, but fuck sake. What should I watch now? Mind of a murderer? Bundy Tapes? Making of a murderer? Murders and Cartels? El Chopo? Murder Mountain?

oooh murder mountain sounds good, I’m gonna check that out.

Newdoc · January 25, 2019

Fool and his money... yada yada yada. But is does make me worried that we are building an economy based on inflated value of nothingness. I can't wrap my head around the lunacy of the whole thing and that 50+ year old ready to "take one for the team" was the biggest imp of them all.

woohorn · January 26, 2019

This whole thread is just a giant humble brag of people having access to both Hulu and Netflix. Well la de freaking da from those who had to just pick one or the other.

Funny. I'm not sayin' I don't, but I understand that a large number of users clearly don't pay.

Probably more of a humblebrag that they are pirates who have family or friends.

woohorn · January 26, 2019

Any comparisons to Woodstock? I know it had a serious line-up, but wasn't it a clusterfuck?

henrygandorf · January 26, 2019

14 minutes ago, woohorn said:

Any comparisons to Woodstock? I know it had a serious line-up, but wasn't it a clusterfuck?

when we were watching the hulu doc, i mentioned that if the festival turned out to be a crazy success, it would have a "woodstock" effect, in that years later, you would have 50,000+ people claiming they were there, when only 2-3k actually made it. i feel like that was one of those things in movies and tv shows, where people of a certain age all said "i was at woodstock" but clearly there weren't 20mm+ people there.

and yes, most of the big music festivals (in their early years) were total nightmares on the ramp up, as were a lot of the bigger, more famous movie shoots. it's always better in the retelling.

utxmike05 · January 26, 2019

On 1/23/2019 at 11:28 AM, Gene Parmesan said:

I watched this morning. I never realized there was a legitimate effort to put on a music festival. The only people I feel sorry for are the locals that got screwed. The rest hardly come off as sympathetic and I really don't see how they aren't more culpable. Especially the people that were on site. The ticket buyers got screwed, but they got their epic story and are a part of history which is likely worth more to them than had the festival had been as advertised.

This. Watched it last night to kill time.

The only thing that made that effort so hard was the location/logistics and not enough resources/infrastructure. Im sure ACL time planning.

That old dude that almost gave a BJ should be embarrassed..taking orders like a tool. wtf. As if he was struggling to make ends meet and needed that check.

Bartles · January 26, 2019

Neonmoon · January 26, 2019

https://www.billboard.com/articles/business/8495113/kendall-jenner-models-fyre-festival-promo-video-face-subpoenas

I would love it if Kendall Jenner had to give the money back

satyanash · January 27, 2019

23 hours ago, utxmike05 said:

That old dude that almost gave a BJ should be embarrassed..taking orders like a tool. wtf. As if he was struggling to make ends meet and needed that check.

I think that episode showed Billy's magnetic power as a conman. He was able to convince his followers to do unbelievable things to further his vision.

XYZ · January 27, 2019

On 1/25/2019 at 1:46 PM, Dewey said:

El Chopo?

Is that the one who chops his victims?

52-80 · January 27, 2019

8/10 of the people featured in both docs are highly culpable. basically I only pity the locals, and the stage production guys. the rest of them claimed they saw the dumpster fire but went along for the ride.

that guy who was supposed to be the advising "adult" was the worst. he's supposed to be the sensible one behind it and yet he behaved like an intern.

and Billy got his genius first idea for making a metal magnises card in 2012 or 2013? Amex had been doing that for at least a decade and Chase was giving one to everybody on main Street for 5

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