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Saying Yessir and Yes Mam

LCHorn

By LCHorn
in Can You Help Me With This?

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Onboard 2.0

Onboard 2.0 9,083

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1 hour ago, Bernard said:

Your wife is right. No sure about the "poor" part, but definitely country/redneck/unsophisticated.

I guess I'm in the minority here. I wasn't raised to say it. Would never encourage a kid to say it. Sounds silly to me. 

Bernard

How do you like living in an unheated barn with all the other animals ?  

Country, redneck, unsophisticated ?  Yeah no, polite, respectful and good manners.  

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RDCanecutter

RDCanecutter 26,473

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37 minutes ago, Spur08 said:
2 hours ago, RDCanecutter said:
And then there's the cop-handling "sir". Being able to drop it fluently kept my druggie roommates out of jail. Hell, I got a pass on a frisbee full of pot by using "sir". Dude made us dump it out, but still.

So, did you just pick it up off the ground after he left?

OK, so it wasn't even my pot, I'm a drunk, not a stoner. The whole story went like this:

Cop shows up to our backyard party, noise complaint. I get called forward to talk to the cop. We're turning down the music, sir. OK.

Then he points to our burning fire pit, and says he's not the Fire Dept., but if the Fire Dept. does show up, we're looking at a $300 fine. We're dousing the fire right now, sir. OK.

He's about to go when he catches the frisbee in the flashlight beam, and says he can't just walk away with "that" sitting there.

It's not mine, sir. OK, but he still can't walk away while "that" sits there.

I see my buddy Clint nearby, and yell "CLINT! This frisbee is DIRTY! CLEAN this frisbee!" So Clint tosses the pot errwhichway.

Cop seems happy, leaves.

Me, I was mainly happy that nobody had busted the piñata hanging on the tree behind me, the piñata full of various controlled substances. It wasn't mine either, I'm a drunk, not a pill-head, but still.

After the cop left I told my friends I was done, I went back to the far shadows to drink my beer, if another cop showed up, they were on their own.

 

In the morning I spotted one dirt hippy crawling on hands and knees where Clint had cleaned the frisbee. I assume he wasn't the first.

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JSB

JSB 677

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Posted

Wife and I have had the same conversation about our kids. I was raised that way and teach my kids the same, to an extent. I don't need my son to say "yes sir" to me when I ask him if he has to use the bathroom, but if anyone else of authority asks him something, I expect it. My wife was fine with that, until my kids went to stay a week with my parents, and they really hammered it home with them. "Yes sir, yes ma'am" to every single question. That is what annoyed my wife, but not because she thought it was archaic. She didn't like the kids calling her ma'am all the time, because it made her feel old.  

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Reagan1k

Reagan1k 3,024

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Was taught to say yes sir / ma'am, no sir / ma'am, please and thank you.  That was not optional.  My kids were taught the same growing up and it has served them well.

"Yeah" to an adult or person of authority or respect was / is unacceptable.....But - We always lived in the South.

I do have some friends from GA who moved to NYC. 

They had to teach their kids to be "bi-lingual".  Not saying ma'am or sir up there, but it was expected when they went home to visit family and friends. 

For them is was basically a matter of respecting the culture...no different than if they visited a foreign country.  When in Rome.....

Going against the grain in one's prevailing culture has implications - whether the OP's wife views it as right or wrong...one does what is the social norm where they are or there are consequences - rightly or wrongly.

If she were a Euro,  then there are probably customs or practices that she and her family would expect were you to visit / live there. 

If you are living in the South or areas where sir and ma'am are the norm and not the exception, then I would think she should respect that.

Would you teach your kids to ignore the custom of removing ones shoes if you lived in Japan?

 

 

Edited by Reagan1k
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Nivek

Nivek 16,986

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Yeah cause the young's are all a great group of manner filled folks who don't even know to remove their fucking hat indoors or say yes sir or yes ma'am to their elders.....who are typically more polite than the average 20 somethings out there today.  Course your results may vary.  Coming from a guy in his mid 50's who tries to treat everyone the same whenever possible.

You are about 10 years my senior. I grew up in S. Florida where the olds banned skateboarding, underfunded education, and got into fist fights over parking spaces while lecturing me at my part time job about working at a grocery store forever.

I learned long ago many people were cunts and the notion of sweet old folks was limited to my grandfather and a few others.

It is situational. I am raising my kids to not think anyone is better than them. Not even their parents. But that isn’t a license for disrespect.
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Onboard 2.0

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2 minutes ago, Nivek said:


You are about 10 years my senior. I grew up in S. Florida where the olds banned skateboarding, underfunded education, and got into fist fights over parking spaces while lecturing me at my part time job about working at a grocery store forever.

I learned long ago many people were cunts and the notion of sweet old folks was limited to my grandfather and a few others.

It is situational. I am raising my kids to not think anyone is better than them. Not even their parents. But that isn’t a license for disrespect.

The olds in Florida are assholes from my experience. 

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horn4life

horn4life 3,783

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What's the harm?  

I tend to say yes ma'am and sir, regardless of age, and sometimes I feel as if I may be offending some middle aged women.  However, that's there issue not mine.  I think for young kids it's simply giving them a foundation of decorum. the fact that every adult they come in contact with is a man or a woman who can (and should) be addressed formally. I also open dorrs for everyone and tend to let folks into traffic.  i'm also no country bumpkin but you don't have to lack teeth to have good manners! 😉

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Nivek

Nivek 16,986

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The olds in Florida are assholes from my experience. 

Yeah, but I kind of understood that too. They were mostly from the NE, their family lived away, some didn’t want to be surrounded by other olds. Some saw themselves as a burden and not contributing.

My favorite was the guy who cut me off on a 4 lane road with no other cars around. I honked and had to maneuver around. Once we got to the light he started in on me and asked me how we wanted to settle it, while his old lady wife kept trying to calm him down. I was 19. I offered to race, considering I was in my 87 GN. He frowned. It was weird. He had to be in his 70s.

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Stunns38

Stunns38 3,558

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My wife is a New York Yankee with that Bronx accent and yells at our 5-year daughter when she says “yes ma’am” because she doesn’t want her sounding “southern”. Her kindergarten teacher is teaching all her students to be southern prim and proper which is annoying too. Now our daughter says it just to piss her off. That’s my girl!

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Onboard 2.0

Onboard 2.0 9,083

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On 1/16/2019 at 11:30 PM, Stunns38 said:

My wife is a New York Yankee with that Bronx accent and yells at our 5-year daughter when she says “yes ma’am” because she doesn’t want her sounding “southern”. Her kindergarten teacher is teaching all her students to be southern prim and proper which is annoying too. Now our daughter says it just to piss her off. That’s my girl!

Gimme a polite southern redneck over a NY asshole anyday.

Edited by Onboard 2.0
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Onboard 2.0

Onboard 2.0 9,083

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17 hours ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

Do y'all have to argue about whether or not to allow your kids to say y'all as well? Might as well teach them to stomp on every bluebonnet they see.

Oh fuck, if you say y'all yer a cow fucking inbred, redneck named Cleetus. Right ?

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Sandman

Sandman 3,412

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18 hours ago, horn4life said:

What's the harm?  

I tend to say yes ma'am and sir, regardless of age, and sometimes I feel as if I may be offending some middle aged women.  However, that's there issue not mine.  I think for young kids it's simply giving them a foundation of decorum. the fact that every adult they come in contact with is a man or a woman who can (and should) be addressed formally. I also open dorrs for everyone and tend to let folks into traffic.  i'm also no country bumpkin but you don't have to lack teeth to have good manners! 😉

I will call most men "sir" if I think they're actual adults, as in college aged and up. For women, I use "ma'am" if I think they're married adults or over 30, I go with "miss" for those I think are under 30 and single.

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RDCanecutter

RDCanecutter 26,473

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13 hours ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

Do y'all have to argue about whether or not to allow your kids to say y'all as well? Might as well teach them to stomp on every bluebonnet they see.

Well, I might want to ape the manners of some angry stranger who screamed at me once over the phone, instead of those local yokels foolish enough to have loved me and protected me when I was a child.

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gsoda3

gsoda3 3,282

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On 1/16/2019 at 3:07 PM, RDCanecutter said:

Do y'all go with "Ni hao?", or full-on "Nin hao ma?"

ni hao = hello

ni hao ma = asking the question of "how are you" and expecting an answer.

 

we teach our kids yes sir and yes ma'am.  we get grief from our non-texan family about it though.

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Asithappens

Asithappens 974

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On 1/15/2019 at 3:57 PM, LCHorn said:

So the wife and I are on opposite sides on the appropriateness of this-she feels like the terms are antiquated and “kind of country, poor folks” and don’t want our children raised to default to them with elders, bosses, etc.

 

I’m on the other side, but I grew up in the country around folks who worked with their hands and served in the military, where deferential salutations aren’t just customary but are requirement.  I further think proper etiquette, regardless of class,  is to address clear superiors with a polite “mam” or “sir”.  

 

What say the board?  She claims if we take a Facebook poll the vote would overwhelmingly go in her favor, but her friend group is largely comprised of upwardly-mobile college educated urbanites and that’s probably a population least likely to agree with me on this.

Your wife is correct.

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Reagan1k

Reagan1k 3,024

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In my world, we not only say sir or ma'am, we also go out of our way to hold doors open and we stand when a woman approaches or rises to leave a table; only sitting if she asks you to.

When I was about 25, there was a female manager in my division. 

On multiple occasions we would have lunch / dinner with colleagues or customers and whenever she approached the table or left the table I always stood. 

One day she pulled me aside and said that I didn't need to feel obligated to do that as a subordinate.

I told her that unless it made her uncomfortable I would prefer to stand anyway because my mother had the ability to kick me in the shin from 500 miles away if I didn't stand.

She laughed and said that she appreciated the gesture and to carry on...that the world needed more gentlemen. 

It's been my experience that when I consistently show respect and am courteous, I get respect back...maybe not in every situation, but on balance it seems to work out that the scales level. 

If someone is offended by a "ma'am" I respect that too and oblige in the future.  That's the other side of the same coin, but it doesn't change the way I approach others.

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Posted
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On 1/15/2019 at 3:57 PM, LCHorn said:

So the wife and I are on opposite sides on the appropriateness of this-she feels like the terms are antiquated and “kind of country, poor folks” and don’t want our children raised to default to them with elders, bosses, etc.

 

I’m on the other side, but I grew up in the country around folks who worked with their hands and served in the military, where deferential salutations aren’t just customary but are requirement.  I further think proper etiquette, regardless of class,  is to address clear superiors with a polite “mam” or “sir”.  

 

What say the board?  She claims if we take a Facebook poll the vote would overwhelmingly go in her favor, but her friend group is largely comprised of upwardly-mobile college educated urbanites and that’s probably a population least likely to agree with me on this.

Just one guy’s opinion, and yes, I was poor country folk...

Raise your kids to do what’s right, including being courteous and aware of others.  It doesn't come down to polling or what the ‘in’ thing is that month.  Can you live with how your kids turn out? What if they treat others like you do( they will...,) would you bust their ass for that behavior?

 

FTR, I never required our boys to address their mother or I as Sir or Ma’am.  They were not however, allowed to answer with a trailing off ‘yeah’  or ‘ mmm, hmmm.’  A standard yes, no, or substantive answer was expected.  They were taught to address elders as sir or ma’am.

 

One thing I’ve run into in the real world is when I am meeting with a buyer or decision maker of a client, I always address them as Sir or Ma’am out of respect for their doing business with us, even if I am older than they are.   Some of the ladies mildly object, but they still appreciate the respect.

 

People are not going to fault you for being respectful, and if they do, it’s something I damned sure can live with.  It beats the hell out of the alternative...

 

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Celery Man

Celery Man 20,996

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Women hate ma'am.  When appropriate or possible I like to use their first name.  Which I guess is on a different set of formality rules, but saying "Thanks so much for your help, Patsy." yields better results than "Thanks so much for your help", and Patsy is in her late 40s and prefers being treated with friendship as a cherished peer/team member rather than deferentially as an elder.

I say sir all the time, whether it's to a work superior, work friend, or teenager sacking my groceries.

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5 minutes ago, Celery Man said:

Women hate ma'am.  When appropriate or possible I like to use their first name.  Which I guess is on a different set of formality rules, but saying "Thanks so much for your help, Patsy." yields better results than "Thanks so much for your help", and Patsy is in her late 40s and prefers being treated with friendship as a cherished peer/team member rather than deferentially as an elder.

I say sir all the time, whether it's to a work superior, work friend, or teenager sacking my groceries.

The wifes' home town calls all the adults by their first name, but they say Mr. Billy or Miss Betty.  Kinda cool, but it doesn't play if folks aren't accustomed to it.

I haven't run across ma'am being an issue more than a few times, but it does happen.  Could also be a regional thing, southern folks are more used to the usage.

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ernest_t_bass

ernest_t_bass 1,196

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On 1/15/2019 at 5:24 PM, crash_davis said:

it's a sign of respect for your elders 

I think it is a sign of respect for everyone.  I don't teach my kids to do it, but I lead by example instead.  I don't care if I'm at a restaurant, store, regular public, etc.  I always address ANYONE as Sir or Ma'am.  

Thank you sir

Excuse me, ma'am.

Good day, sir.

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Nice Guy Eddie

Nice Guy Eddie 13,523

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On 1/18/2019 at 7:53 AM, Reagan1k said:

In my world, we not only say sir or ma'am, we also go out of our way to hold doors open and we stand when a woman approaches or rises to leave a table; only sitting if she asks you to.

When I was about 25, there was a female manager in my division. 

On multiple occasions we would have lunch / dinner with colleagues or customers and whenever she approached the table or left the table I always stood. 

One day she pulled me aside and said that I didn't need to feel obligated to do that as a subordinate.

I told her that unless it made her uncomfortable I would prefer to stand anyway because my mother had the ability to kick me in the shin from 500 miles away if I didn't stand.

She laughed and said that she appreciated the gesture and to carry on...that the world needed more gentlemen. 

It's been my experience that when I consistently show respect and am courteous, I get respect back...maybe not in every situation, but on balance it seems to work out that the scales level. 

If someone is offended by a "ma'am" I respect that too and oblige in the future.  That's the other side of the same coin, but it doesn't change the way I approach others.

If a meeting is about to start at work, you stand up when every woman walks into the room?  What if a woman shows up 15 minutes late, you still stand, interrupting the meeting even more?  

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Seger78

Seger78 258

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Posted

I have been a constant user of  sir/ma'am for most of my life, but I have got it wrong a few times (recently called a young overweight woman with short hair "sir" accidently") and felt terrible about it. Lately I have tried to switch to yes please, no thank you, thank you very much, appreciate you, etc. 

The olds still get ma'am and sir. 

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Onboard 2.0

Onboard 2.0 9,083

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17 minutes ago, ernest_t_bass said:

I think it is a sign of respect for everyone.  I don't teach my kids to do it, but I lead by example instead.  I don't care if I'm at a restaurant, store, regular public, etc.  I always address ANYONE as Sir or Ma'am.  

Thank you sir

Excuse me, ma'am.

Good day, sir.

..... fuck you sir,  Just rounding out the list of acceptable uses.

Edited by Onboard 2.0
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Reagan1k

Reagan1k 3,024

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29 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

If a meeting is about to start at work, you stand up when every woman walks into the room?  What if a woman shows up 15 minutes late, you still stand, interrupting the meeting even more?  

I stand in a meal or social setting.  

My example involved meals at restaurants outside of the office. 

An  actual working environment in an office or conference room with co-workers is a different matter clearly.  

I will rise and offer my chair if we are short on seats, etc.  but  No- I don’t think it is expected or appropriate to stand when Cathy from HR waddles in 20 minutes late to the conference room on Tuesday morning. 

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