Worst Playoff Officiating (Non) Call Ever

[aggie08 21445]

Just now, SwanderedTalent said:

 

I bet that makes Kansas City fans feel a lot better

The refs gave them a make-up no call two plays later when the DB held Gronk all down the sideline, forcing 3rd and 10.

The Saints have real beef with the officiating. Kansas City does not.

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

3 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

The refs gave them a make-up no call two plays later when the DB held Gronk all down the sideline, forcing 3rd and 10.

The Saints have real beef with the officiating. Kansas City does not.

So it didn't matter because Kansas City wouldn't have stopped them anyway and then it ALSO doesn't matter because there was uncalled holding on 2nd down. Are there any other reasons it doesn't matter?

[aggie08 21445]

1 minute ago, dcar00 said:

hmm. OK thought it was 3rd down.  yeah, unlikely they stop them but you never know, and still horrendous call.  the exact same thing or worse happened to Mahomes in the EZ earlier, no call.

Agreed. I know they have to go overboard protecting players' heads--especially quarterbacks and especially Brady--but I have no idea how you can make that call. Even if he did get hit in the head--which he didn't, really--it's a defensive lineman reaching over an offensive lineman just trying to get to the ball or Brady's arm. His only option would have been to give up.

[aggie08 21445]

Just now, SwanderedTalent said:

So it didn't matter because Kansas City wouldn't have stopped them anyway and then it ALSO doesn't matter because there was uncalled holding on 2nd down. Are there any other reasons it doesn't matter?

I didn't say that it didn't matter. Both were awful. The roughing call moreso. But the refs didn't rip the game from them like they did New Orleans. Kansas City had questionable calls go their way late as well (the blatant OPI that allowed Watkins to run free down the sidelines comes to mind) that they took advantage of. It happens.

[Sgt Hulk 13648]

As much as I give players a hard time today about being drama queens or bitch asses. I give all the props on earth to that WR.  Super bowl on the line obviously fucked over and with professionalism he went back to the huddle and didn’t remove his helmet and completely try to decapitate that fucker.  The level of restraint needs to be rewarded. I mean not even a fist thrown 

[PittsburghTiger 6151]

1 hour ago, BradInATX said:

"Bang bang play"

GTFO



Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
 

 

1 hour ago, Wally Pryor said:

 

42 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

He absolutely thought there was no doubt the flag was coming. Watch this angle and his reaction when he realizes it wasn't thrown.

It's also possible he was gathering himself at first considering the pass interference looked like it included a helmet-to-helmet shot.

I don't think there is any way the NFL can adequately respond to this other than firing referees. It was nowhere near bang-bang. The Saints run the clock down to about 12 seconds or so and kick a field goal and go to the Super Bowl.

The roughing/hit to the head call against KC was bad, not as bad as the Saints no-call. But bad. The Chiefs had the lead, the previous possessions had seen the Chiefs hold NE to a punt, FG, downs & INT. Then the phantom call with Chiefs leading, 21-17. Suppose they make a stop on 3rd down and go on and score another TD. Things are mightily different.

[Nivek 16873]

You realize the NFL hired Arron EcK after his stellar performance for fixing games in the b12?

[Armybrat 40755]

Ok, so it was just a regular size asterisk.

Guess you people are happy with the Big 12 refs and accept the quality of the officiating like we saw in the okielite game several years ago, not to mention Grant Teaff's last game against UT.

[Vic Mackey 46937]

Saints lost this game on their own, not because of one bad call. Hell they took a fucking lead after this play but their defense allowed the Rams to march down for a FG. They get the ball first in OT and fail. At the end of the game, they don't even try to move the ball to attempt a long FG when you have nothing to lose.

But of course they are going to scream the league is now rigged and whatever. I get being in the moment but that one call was not why they lost. They lost because they never put the Rams away for good. Rams were begging the Saints to bury them and have that game be a route. But nope.

[PittsburghTiger 6151]

15 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

Saints lost this game on their own, not because of one bad call. Hell they took a fucking lead after this play but their defense allowed the Rams to march down for a FG. They get the ball first in OT and fail. At the end of the game, they don't even try to move the ball to attempt a long FG when you have nothing to lose.

But of course they are going to scream the league is now rigged and whatever. I get being in the moment but that one call was not why they lost. They lost because they never put the Rams away for good. Rams were begging the Saints to bury them and have that game be a route. But nope.

I think everyone understands that. But the no-call still happened. It still prevented the Saints from running down the clock and then kicking a 22-yard FG to win the game. 

[pwinger 35]

This was a New Orleans Screwjob.  Who knew Earl Hebner was working for the NFL now?

[Irish Wrist Watch 1349]

2 hours ago, JBJ said:

Faceguarding is sticking your hand in the opponents face and is only illegal at the highschool level.

You are allowed to play the receiver without playing the ball.

I think the term faceguarding evolved to include more than putting your hands in receiver's face, but probably not so far as to include "playing the receiver," which is basically what I was referring to. Playing the receiver is lazy-assed bullshit, and inevitably leads (at least half the time) to hitting or grabbing the receiver's arm before the ball gets there. Another third of the time, the defender runs into the receiver and keeps him from getting to the ball, which hits the defender in the back, and there's no call. And I think it ought to be re-examined by the competition committee. So you've got your back to the QB and you grab the receiver's arm, then at the last second you turn your head - fuck that. Yet half the time it isn't called because the guy turned his head. Lazy-assed officiating too.

 

Edited January 21, 2019 by Irish Wrist Watch

[Irish Wrist Watch 1349]

33 minutes ago, PittsburghTiger said:

I think everyone understands that. But the no-call still happened. It still prevented the Saints from running down the clock and then kicking a 22-yard FG to win the game. 

And it kept two living legends from facing off against each other in the upcoming SB, both having led their teams to victory in amazing games. Brees made the plays. He made the throw that should have won the game, and the officials shit all over the Saints by not doing their job. They should be fired.

Edited January 21, 2019 by Irish Wrist Watch

[Zavala 1384]

Shitty officiating at the end of both championship games, both OvErTiMe games too! Wowwie cant wait for this Brady bowl

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

51 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

Saints lost this game on their own, not because of one bad call. Hell they took a fucking lead after this play but their defense allowed the Rams to march down for a FG. They get the ball first in OT and fail. At the end of the game, they don't even try to move the ball to attempt a long FG when you have nothing to lose.

But of course they are going to scream the league is now rigged and whatever. I get being in the moment but that one call was not why they lost. They lost because they never put the Rams away for good. Rams were begging the Saints to bury them and have that game be a route. But nope.

And you still can't remove the galactically bad blown call. It pretty much ended the game 

[dcar00 14043]

IMO, the NFL needs to figure out a way to be more clear on holding and PI.  I'd be OK with you can do anything above the waist within 5 yards but if you grab with the hand its a hold.  arm bar is OK as long as it is above the waist.

On PI - pick plays are legal if the pick is within 5 yards, above the waist, but that player becomes ineligible if he initiates contact with the defender.  hand/arm fighting is legal after 5 yards but push/hit/grab is not.

I'm sure there are holes in this but they need to really try to simplify what the ref needs to look for.  they also need to get rid of the BS adage of "the guy closest didn't see PI and no one else threw a flag so we can't discuss a PI judgement call." the only way that saints call is not PI is if a) the ball is past the receiver or b) it was too far away to be catchable.

dude swallowed his flag in another old BS adage of not wanting to decide the game. he knew that flag would give the Saints the Super Bowl. by not throwing it, Saints make FG and win or lose because they couldn't stop the Rams.  The NFL needs to make if perfectly clear that penalties will be called regardless of time on the clock and this will result in ugly unsatisfying endings.  my guess is if the Rams had all 3 TO's he throws the flag.

Edited January 21, 2019 by dcar00

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

2 minutes ago, dcar00 said:

IMO, the NFL needs to figure out a way to be more clear on holding and PI.  I'd be OK with you can do anything above the waist within 5 yards but if you grab with the hand its a hold.  arm bar is OK as long as it is above the waist.

On PI - pick plays are legal if the pick is within 5 yards, above the waist, but that player becomes ineligible if he initiates contact with the defender.  hand/arm fighting is legal after 5 yards but push/hit/grab is not.

I'm sure there are holes in this but they need to really try to simplify what the ref needs to look for.  they also need to get rid of the BS adage of "the guy closest didn't see PI and no one else threw a flag so we can't discuss a PI judgement call." the only way that saints call is not PI is if a) the ball is past the receiver or b) it was too far away to be catchable.

dude swallowed his flag in the old BS adage of not wanting to decide the game. he knew that flag would give the Saints the Super Bowl.  by not throwing it. Saints make FG and win or lose because they couldn't stop the Rams.  The NFL needs to make if perfectly clear that penalties will be called regardless of time on the clock and this will result in ugly unsatisfying endings.  my guess is if the Rams had all 3 TO's he throws the flag.

If he's even thinking along those terms he should be fired. His job his not to decide outcome, but to make calls regardless of the time in the game, the teams, timeouts, score, or the game itself.

[Vic Mackey 46937]

4 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

And you still can't remove the galactically bad blown call. It pretty much ended the game 

How?? There was a lot of football played after that game.

It's the same concept of the Dez catch/no catch in 2014. That call did not lose us the game. Tons of shit beforehand cost us the game. And the Packers converted 3 or 4 third downs after that call.

Saints blew this game themselves. Hell they had a lead right after that call.

The right team won the game.

[Machinator 32098]

 

[dcar00 14043]

5 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

If he's even thinking along those terms he should be fired. His job his not to decide outcome, but to make calls regardless of the time in the game, the teams, timeouts, score, or the game itself.

yes he should be fired.

[dcar00 14043]

2 minutes ago, Machinator said:

 

ha NFL is going to jump the shark.  now if we can make sure this involves pick plays and get holding reviewed OU may never win another game.

[Wally Pryor 5245]

7 minutes ago, Machinator said:

 

It will go beyond "consideration".   This will happen - has to after yesterday.   The spot nature of a PI call makes this even more mandatory, when you can have 50 yard penalties in the blink of an eye.

The NFL needs to modify the PI penalty anyway.  I've always thought it should be the lesser of the two - 15 yards or spot of the foul.

[Huckleberry 32710]

11 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

How?? There was a lot of football played after that game.

It's the same concept of the Dez catch/no catch in 2014. That call did not lose us the game. Tons of shit beforehand cost us the game. And the Packers converted 3 or 4 third downs after that call.

Saints blew this game themselves. Hell they had a lead right after that call.

The right team won the game.

Stop being dumb. I know it's hard for you when you decide you're going to be the cool contrarian, but sometimes the popular view is popular because the contrarian view is stupid. This is one of those times.

You're right that there was a lot of football played after that call, but the important thing is that there would not have been a lot of football played after that call if it had been made properly. I think you're smart enough to realize that, but keep playing your role I guess.

[Eskimohorn 5621]

 

PI is done on almost every play. Only objective calls should be challenged. Seeing ticky tack PI called after replay will suck.

[BradInATX 9208]

I don't want that to happen, and I'm a Saints fan. The game already drags on too long as it is, and has too many commercials. It won't undo yesterday's shitshow, and it will hurt game flow.

 

I don't know what you do. I have no idea what to make of it. I'm not a conspiracy guy and don't think it was rigged, but damn. Two refs were standing within 5 yards looking directly at the play. That crew should never work again (narrator: they will). The whole thing doesn't make any sense.

 

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

 

 

 

[4th&Five 41462]

The idea of being able to challenge one call a half would work for me. Or it’s challengable under 2 minutes. Ridiculous to put so much time and money into the sport and then fuck it up when it was so easily fixable. 

 

[Keef 758]

I might quit football all together if Texas lost a chance to play for the NC on a blown call that bad.  It's worse than the Poona hold because it was just so obvious/out in the open.

[4th&Five 41462]

3 minutes ago, Keef said:

I might quit football all together if Texas lost a chance to play for the NC on a blown call that bad.  It's worse than the Poona hold because it was just so obvious/out in the open.

I was pretty fucking pissed yesterday and told my wife if something ever happens like that with Texas in a semifinal we better hope the home owners insurance is up to date. 

[Murfdogg21 4412]

Reviewing all or most PI calls is way too much stoppage in play. Maybe have a review guy in the booth with the ability to buzz in on egregiously bad calls that are otherwise not challengeable. 

 

Also wouldnt mind going to 15 yard penalty for PI to reduce the number of stupid ass back shoulder fade routes thrown with no intention of a completion but just to draw a flag. 

[Armybrat 40755]

2 hours ago, Red Five said:

That ref had the best view out of everyone in the Superdome. Outside of blatant corruption, I'm guessing from that viewpoint he thought it was uncatchable. Unless he just had no idea where the ball was and assumed the defender and the ball got there at the same time. 

Helen Keller could’ve made that call.

[Machinator 32098]

Just now, Murfdogg21 said:

Reviewing all or most PI calls is way too much stoppage in play. Maybe have a review guy in the booth with the ability to buzz in on egregiously bad calls that are otherwise not challengeable. 

 

Also wouldnt mind going to 15 yard penalty for PI to reduce the number of stupid ass back shoulder fade routes thrown with no intention of a completion but just to draw a flag. 

Making it reviewable doesn't mean all PI calls would be reviewed.

[Moby Ric 2058]

I can only imagine the screaming in the sports books in Vegas during the blown calls in both games.  Had to be great.

[JBJ 3649]

I think the term faceguarding evolved to include more than putting your hands in his face, but probably not so far as to include "playing the receiver, which is basically what I was referring to. Playing the receiver is lazy-assed bullshit, and inevitably leads (at least half the time) to hitting or grabbing the receiver's arm before the ball gets there, and I think it out to be re-examined by the competition committee. So you've got your back to the QB and you grab the receiver's arm, then at the last second you turn your head - fuck that. Yet half the time it isn't called because the guy turned his head. Lazy-assed officiating too.

 

But that's not how that works.  Facing the ball gives the defender some benefit of the doubt when illegal contact is made that the contact was part of a play on the ball.  It is an indicator for an exception to the penalty. 

You can still make illegal contact when facing the ball and still make incidental contact without facing the ball.

This is illegal:

This is legal:

This is more subjective (depending on whether you think the left hand was incidental contact or not), but a flag was thrown then picked up:

 

And this is OPI on the WR:

Edited January 21, 2019 by JBJ

[Born Burnt 6169]

There is only one thing we can be sure of going forward: For the next 100 years, wearing Rams gear in New Orleans will get you an ass whoopin'.

[Horn80 6079]

45 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

How?? There was a lot of football played after that game.

It's the same concept of the Dez catch/no catch in 2014. That call did not lose us the game. Tons of shit beforehand cost us the game. And the Packers converted 3 or 4 third downs after that call.

Saints blew this game themselves. Hell they had a lead right after that call.

The right team won the game.

Up to the non-call, all things you say were factored into the score.  The non-call was a fork in the road with one being Saints probably have 99% chance win and other is 50:50 chancewith the non-call.  I think 50:50 because PI are spot fouls and large chunks of field position can be quickly changed on just one play.  Don’t see how you can think Saints blew this game when the refs failed to make proper call with less than 2 minutes and ball spotted on 5 yard line.  I blame the ref crew because seems likely another ref had to see the non-call was incorrect and didn’t speak up at the time. 

[Beau Vine 54016]

14 hours ago, Ignatius said:

You're missing out.  The NBA is far more entertaining than it was 15 years ago...

I don't know if it's more entertaining, but the officiating is not as obviously crooked as it used to be.  You can no longer guess which lackeys (Dick Bavetta, Bennett Salvatore, and Joey Crawford) will be assigned to crucial playoff games.  

[Beau Vine 54016]

1 hour ago, pwinger said:

This was a New Orleans Screwjob.  Who knew Earl Hebner was working for the NFL now?

Damn, you're old.  Most people would have said Dave Hebner.  

[Beau Vine 54016]

16 minutes ago, Murfdogg21 said:

Reviewing all or most PI calls is way too much stoppage in play. Maybe have a review guy in the booth with the ability to buzz in on egregiously bad calls that are otherwise not challengeable. 

Coach's challenge.  Just like the CFL does it -- you can challenge anything -- You can challenge penalties; you can challenge penalties not called.  Makes way too much sense for the NFL, though.  

[Bone3421 716]

Saints lost this game on their own, not because of one bad call. Hell they took a fucking lead after this play but their defense allowed the Rams to march down for a FG. They get the ball first in OT and fail. At the end of the game, they don't even try to move the ball to attempt a long FG when you have nothing to lose.
But of course they are going to scream the league is now rigged and whatever. I get being in the moment but that one call was not why they lost. They lost because they never put the Rams away for good. Rams were begging the Saints to bury them and have that game be a route. But nope.

Nah...big difference from 5 sec fg to 1:40 or whatever it was

[Beau Vine 54016]

[clapclapclap 9000]

You can increase replay use while reducing the game's length by restructuring the whole officiating system.  Move the decision making on all calls to the booth.

Put the head of officials plus 2 or 3 replay officials/assistants in the booth, with the booth having the final call on every infraction.  Instead of the field refs wasting so much time running to confer and then get back into position, have most infractions addressed by the field ref(s) that are making the call confer directly with the booth over their radios.  The booth can contact other refs if more discussion is needed, meanwhile the replay refs are simultaneously confirming or clarifying.  Field refs call in infractions, the booth reviews and makes decisions while the field refs prep for the next play.  Less wasting time trying to figure out where the ball goes if an initial call is overturned, since replay (with all the angles if necessary) is already in use from the start on every call.  With the booth watching in real time, many of the calls will be immediately upheld when called in, so less clock stoppage waiting for discussion and a decision.

Edited January 21, 2019 by clapclapclap
Upon further review, excessive use of 'booth'

[Red Five 40695]

Maybe there needs to be some kind of nuclear option in playoff games, where objectively wrong calls are overturned regardless of whether or not they're reviewable. And yeah, I know, slippery slope on what objective looks like. 

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

1 hour ago, Vic Mackey said:

How?? There was a lot of football played after that game.

It's the same concept of the Dez catch/no catch in 2014. That call did not lose us the game. Tons of shit beforehand cost us the game. And the Packers converted 3 or 4 third downs after that call.

Saints blew this game themselves. Hell they had a lead right after that call.

The right team won the game.

Are you daft? Again, if the PI is called, the Saints keep the ball, run the clock down to a few seconds, and kick the go-ahead FG. There wouldn't have BEEN "a lot of football played" after that. 

[Vic Mackey 46937]

1 hour ago, SwanderedTalent said:

Are you daft? Again, if the PI is called, the Saints keep the ball, run the clock down to a few seconds, and kick the go-ahead FG. There wouldn't have BEEN "a lot of football played" after that. 

So yes, let's ignore them blowing a 13pt lead, calling a bone headed 1st down pass that was incomplete when all you had to do was run the ball 3 times, kick the FG and leave the Rams less than 40 seconds. Defense blowing it at the end. Then the OT interception. Boo hoo, bad calls happen. Go out there and make it not matter. They had the chance to do that not once but twice.

How about the refs missing the blatant facemask on Goff the drive before that would have given them 1st and goal from the 2? Rams would have punched it in for a TD and been up 4. Causing the Saints to need a TD on the final drive to win it. That was a terrible missed call that caused the Rams to settle for the tie.

Saints had every opportunity to put that game away well before the call. They had 2 opportunities to make that missed call something no one would even remember. But they didn't and now their whiny fanbase is crying rigged. And it's funny as hell.

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

14 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

So yes, let's ignore

No, dude. Let's ignore all the football that happened after the officiating error. That's all you gotta ignore. That's the only point most people are making here. If the error hadn't happened, New Orleans would have won the game. The error is inexcusable and shouldn't have happened, therefore New Orleans should have won the game.

You don't come across as smart and analytical by pointing out that wasn't the only inflection point in the game. People have been doing that in sports since heavyweight boxing was a thing at the turn of the 20th century. Possibly since the Aztecs invented basketball. People are talking about one inflection point in yesterday's game specifically, so there's no need to change the subject by what-abouting the things that went New Orleans' way. I doubt many on this thread really care who won that game-- I'm not a Saints fan, I wouldn't care if they never played another down.

There is no need to chuck up a BLUE LIVES MATTER TOO rejoinder to the assertion that "that PI/targeting non-call cost the Saints the game, what a screwjob". The NFL is a multi-billion dollar business. It doesn't need fanboy message board cheerleaders to protect it when something that undermines its integrity happens. It has ESPN for that.

[0xdeadbeef 1627]

7 hours ago, Steamboat1874 said:

This....

That was a lot closer than everyone is claiming.

I can only assume that some of you guys don't watch much football, in which case, the events probably do seem very bang-bang.  On the other hand, watch football every weekend for 10 years or more and no, that was no close.  That no call was egregious. 

[lemonandaturd 4285]

5 hours ago, Nivek said:

You realize the NFL hired Arron EcK after his stellar performance for fixing games in the b12?
 

That is one sorry ass crooked son of a bitch.  Fuck him and his daddy, Walt Anderson.  

[4th&Five 41462]

53 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

So yes, let's ignore them blowing a 13pt lead, calling a bone headed 1st down pass that was incomplete when all you had to do was run the ball 3 times, kick the FG and leave the Rams less than 40 seconds. Defense blowing it at the end. Then the OT interception. Boo hoo, bad calls happen. Go out there and make it not matter. They had the chance to do that not once but twice.

How about the refs missing the blatant facemask on Goff the drive before that would have given them 1st and goal from the 2? Rams would have punched it in for a TD and been up 4. Causing the Saints to need a TD on the final drive to win it. That was a terrible missed call that caused the Rams to settle for the tie.

Saints had every opportunity to put that game away well before the call. They had 2 opportunities to make that missed call something no one would even remember. But they didn't and now their whiny fanbase is crying rigged. And it's funny as hell.

Bad calls do happen. There were bad calls on the rams that weren’t called too. At least equal to those you listed. This wasn’t a bad call. It was the worst call ever. 

[Irish Wrist Watch 1349]

5 hours ago, dcar00 said:

IMO, the NFL needs to figure out a way to be more clear on holding and PI.  I'd be OK with you can do anything above the waist within 5 yards but if you grab with the hand its a hold.  arm bar is OK as long as it is above the waist.

On PI - pick plays are legal if the pick is within 5 yards, above the waist, but that player becomes ineligible if he initiates contact with the defender.  hand/arm fighting is legal after 5 yards but push/hit/grab is not.

I'm sure there are holes in this but they need to really try to simplify what the ref needs to look for.  they also need to get rid of the BS adage of "the guy closest didn't see PI and no one else threw a flag so we can't discuss a PI judgement call." the only way that saints call is not PI is if a) the ball is past the receiver or b) it was too far away to be catchable.

dude swallowed his flag in another old BS adage of not wanting to decide the game. he knew that flag would give the Saints the Super Bowl. by not throwing it, Saints make FG and win or lose because they couldn't stop the Rams.  The NFL needs to make if perfectly clear that penalties will be called regardless of time on the clock and this will result in ugly unsatisfying endings.  my guess is if the Rams had all 3 TO's he throws the flag.

Now we're talking.

I once saw a referee cross an entire football field to throw a flag on an especially egregious non-call. It was one satisfying sight.

[Armybrat 40755]

Look how close those two refs were and both had clear eyeball views of the play. No excuses for those two shits.

Edited January 22, 2019 by Armybrat