Texas Catholic Church Sex Abuse Report: The Local Ecclesiastical Boogaloo

[El Diablo 4232]

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion, too

 

Imagine all the people
Living life in peace

 

You, you may say I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you will join us
And the world will be as one

 

Imagine no possessions
I wonder if you can
No need for greed or hunger
A brotherhood of man

[Asithappens 974]

4 minutes ago, El Diablo said:

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion, too

 

Imagine all the people
Living life in peace

 

You, you may say I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you will join us
And the world will be as one

 

Imagine no possessions
I wonder if you can
No need for greed or hunger
A brotherhood of man

And, if I may add:

With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things.  But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.

[El Diablo 4232]

3 minutes ago, Asithappens said:

And, if I may add:

With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things.  But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.

Good people have hidden in the shadows while evil ran rampant since the dawn of time. People fear for their safety and the lives of those the love. They won't rock the boat or declare the king has no clothes. They will save their own asses while the world burns. Is that evil?

[Asithappens 974]

1 minute ago, El Diablo said:

Good people have hidden in the shadows while evil ran rampant since the dawn of time. People fear for their safety and the lives of those the love. They won't rock the boat or declare the king has no clothes. They will save their own asses while the world burns. Is that evil?

Seriously? 

Yes.

[El Diablo 4232]

2 minutes ago, Asithappens said:

Seriously? 

Yes.

Well shit. What am I going to do with all of these rocks now?

[Guest Lobo]

I think we can all agree to save for the critiques of organized religions for another thread.  This is about the latest round of reports, particularly those in Texas which obviously has come into close orbit with some posters on here.  I'll reiterate what I said on the last post of the previous page. 

[Armybrat 41037]

Who said the hierarchy is beyond reproach?

I think the kiddie & adult rapers should be executed and the enablers imprisoned. 

The haters of all things Catholic here are overboard with the pitchforks & torches.

 

 

Edited February 6, 2019 by Armybrat

[tbone_ 14299]

I think the kiddie & adult rapers should be executed and the enablers imprisoned.
 
 

Do this and see how much there is left. Enablers is the key word.

I don’t hate all things Catholic. I don’t hate anything Catholic. What I hate are people that rape kids and people that cover it up. And this organization is disgustingly guilty of both.

[Guest Lobo]

Yeah, even a succinct definition of the word "enablers" is gonna leave a lot less people out of prison than most Catholics realize.  

[Not that Bob 739]

I am not defending the Catholic church. Nowhere did I say they are "beyond reproach." I think it would serve the greater good if they could get their shit together so they can stop doing bad and continue doing good. If you don't think fixing a huge problem in a world wide organization with millions of members is "complex" then I've got nothing for you, but y'all have some introspection. You don't give one shit if the bass biters reform. You just want the doors closed. 

[tbone_ 14299]

I think the kiddie & adult rapers should be executed and the enablers imprisoned. 
 
 

Also, when would this start? How much more time is needed to get this going? I guess centuries wasn’t enough. Could we go ahead and start now?

[El Diablo 4232]

38 minutes ago, tbone_ said:

 

 

Also, when would this start? How much more time is needed to get this going? I guess centuries wasn’t enough. Could we go ahead and start now?

 

While a lot of them are deceased there's a published list of offenders. Shouldn't be too terribly hard to figure out who covered for them or was their superior. So now we've got a list to start with. Vigilante justice. Just don't ask me to do it 'cause blood will stain my fine garments.

[tbone_ 14299]

The church quit killing foreign peoples for their failure to convert.  
The church quit extorting businesses and individuals for operating overhead.
The church quit condoning the hitting kids in schools for not behaving correctly.
Surely, the church can quit letting grown men put their dicks in people's faces.  
And the UT example is bullshit.  If some social organizations do some bad shit, we advocate closing down UT?  The fuck is wrong with you.  Higher Education and Organized Religion...two massive institutions in our society that have done tremendous good for themselves and millions they will never directly meet.  We get it.  The difference, and I cannot fucking believe some of you don't get this, every large institution has bad people that do evil shit and yet we need them to endure.  What's different about the Catholic Church is they just reshuffled the issue for a thousand years.  Not one diocese.  Not one decade.  For a thousand years, a global "empire" moved tens of thousands of child rapists from one area to another.  When a college does it, like Michigan State or Penn State, the hammer is dropped on them.  Criminal charges, jail time, public humiliation, civil charges, terminations, lawsuits, dads beating the shit out of administrators, public vilification, loss of revenue, dilution of the brand, more jail time.  It goes on and on.  When I meet somebody from Penn State at a conference to this day...I still think, "Did this very influential alumni know something about what was going on there?"  And he is forever stained to me.  But somehow, people still advocate that because of a Loaves & Fishes truck in East Austin, that the Catholic Church can't be beaten down. 
The church enabled tens of thousands of clergy and staff to abuse and rape child and adult alike to a millennium.  A full thousand years of fear and anal tearing.  But they are beyond reproach because of orphanages?  Even the Mob draws the line at kiddy rape.  

On top of all that, they do it in the name of being your ticket to eternal salvation. Pretty sure that’s the most insidious concept in human history.

[Guest Lobo]

And not just the bishop/archbishop/et. al. that reassigned them, but the dipshits in the next parish over who never bothered to ask, "Oh, Father Smith..Welcome to the Boise Diocese...what brings to our part of the country?"  

[Llano Estacado 1257]

Now we’re getting somewhere. In this hypothetical where the priests is assigned a new parish and doesn’t bother to have even an introductory conversation outside of mass with his new parishioners;
Are the hypothetical dipshits in the next parish over on the Pastoral Council, (assuming the parish has such, their votes and resolutions would be non-binding and consultative anyways)?
Does the hypothetical Father Smith fall apart under such fierce conversational new guy questioning?

[Guest Lobo]

I take the stance of the Church on this topic about as seriously as I take Uncle Leo's doctor when asked about a rash.

Pastoral Council: "Father Smith, we've noticed a number of priests coming and going lately all over the region much earlier than their typical 10-year assignments."

Father Smith: "Yes, well...there's been a bit of that going around.  Would you excuse me for a moment...Paloma?"  

[Armybrat 41037]

2 hours ago, tbone_ said:

 

Also, when would this start? How much more time is needed to get this going? I guess centuries wasn’t enough. Could we go ahead and start now?

 

You have my blessing. Start with the kiddie rapists who have been defrocked or “transferred”. 

[Armybrat 41037]

1 hour ago, tbone_ said:

On top of all that, they do it in the name of being your ticket to eternal salvation. Pretty sure that’s the most insidious concept in human history.

No, you know they are not doing the raping that reason. They are doing it for evil personal gratification. To argue otherwise is just nothing but anti-Catholic bigotry.

[Guest Lobo]

The first thing they did after V-E day was execute the local collaborators who helped the Nazis.  Sure most knew what was going on but they were powerless and got a pass.  But those that actively helped even with the excuse that they were saving themselves or accomplishing a greater good...they were the first to die.  

The legal system will eventually vet out who moved which rapists.  My attention is now shifted to the collaborators.  The Catholics who weren’t giving orders or following orders but still chose to not question the blistering pace at which priests were being moved around; and instead chose to welcome them without question and turn their own children over to them happily.  

I’m gonna vomit the next time I hear someone say, “oh father so and so was on the list?  Yeah that figures, we always kinda knew he would do shit like that.”   You are either lying that you knew in hindsight or you are a collaborator.  

When you suspect a parent is abusing their kid and you stay silent to avoid getting up in people’s family business , that’s one thing.  When you suspect a person who is left alone every week with doZens of kids and you sit idle and then play Monday Morning SVU, you are morally complicit.  The rapists and their travel agents need to die.  And you need to switch churches, not because you’re not a good Catholic...but because you aren’t really a Christian.  

[Llano Estacado 1257]

So it’s the victims’ and their families’ fault, got it.

Should have been more untrusting of a thousand year old spiritual institution with roots to the son of God’s primacy, the rock, Simon Peter, and his rank & file, In Persona Christi.

Morally complicit the whole flock, they should have known the wolf was wearing Shepard clothes.

[Llano Estacado 1257]

The other thing to remember is lots of the victims affected especially their parents pre-date Vatican II. So the idea that little Suzy homemaker from Backwater TX is going to challenge a man of the cloth if he’s ever played grab ass with the alter boy is laughable. We’re at #metoo movement in 2018 and you think kids and parents are going to push back against apostolic succession in the 60s 70s. The Holy See down to every traveling priest shares blame and can and will rot in hell even if they aren’t judged on this planet.

But please keep the victim shaming and blaming up.

[El Diablo 4232]

This coverup is bigger than the moon landing and that involved all of NASA and thousands of co-conspiratorial contractors.

[Guest Lobo]

1 hour ago, El Diablo said:

This coverup is bigger than the moon landing and that involved all of NASA and thousands of co-conspiratorial contractors.

Whuh?   

[tbone_ 14299]

No, you know they are not doing the raping that reason. They are doing it for evil personal gratification. To argue otherwise is just nothing but anti-Catholic bigotry.

Of course that’s not the reason they are raping. But they are absolutely doing under the guise of an organization that promises eternal salvation through said organization. That kind of promise brings an expectation of a significant level of responsibility on its purveyors. The undermining of that expectation by the buttfuckers and their enablers is what’s so insidious. There is noting anti catholic in that argument at all. If you can’t see that then you are probably part of the enablers.

[Armybrat 41037]

I quit the Church 45 years ago for various reasons, so you are wrong on that one.

[pearlandhorn 3333]

Grew up in Tyler.  Hard to believe there was only one priest from Tyler that was accused with evidence (a decade after I was born).  Dude fled to Ecuador and was extradited 8 years later back to the US.

The bishop who wrote the letter is a good dude.  He was a newer priest when I remember going to church and was appointed Bishop after I left Tyler.  I haven't been back since 2008?

[tbone_ 14299]

I quit the Church 45 years ago for various reasons, so you are wrong on that one.

Fair enough. So you get the distinction though.

[hayden_horn 11374]

this, by the way, is a massively underrated movie:

 

[Guest Lobo]

Anybody ever hear the reply to when you inquire about why you just can't raise your children outside of an organized church...something to the effect of, "Well maybe not Catholicism, but you have to raise them in some kinda church...otherwise where will they get their sense or morality, or right and wrong, of being human?"  

[tbone_ 14299]

I don’t know, maybe by the example you set as a parent?

[Guest Lobo]

I agree.  But levity aside, have we all not heard at some point as new parents heard something along the lines of, “you have to give them some kinda foundation for a moral life.”?   Usually from an elder family member or an annoying stranger.  

[tbone_ 14299]

Yes many times. And I get the irony and the hypocrisy. I also get the ideal. It would be nice to try to teach my kid how to be in world that didn’t constantly reenforce the opposite.

 

[Message Board User 12397]

Newsflash:  diddling little kids in the name of God was not just confined to the Catholic church.

 

[Guest Lobo]

Great, there are no shortage of meathooks on which to hang enemies of the faith.  I'm genuinely interested to learn about how they moved their rapists around in the Baptist faith considering they have far fewer resources with a much smaller footprint.  They do, however, benefit from an even more gullible flock.  

[El Diablo 4232]

Meathooks? ISWYDT.

[Asithappens 974]

19 hours ago, Message Board User said:

Newsflash:  diddling little kids in the name of God was not just confined to the Catholic church.

 

Yeah, this is bad.

And, to be brutally blunt about it, the Baptists intentionally organized themselves in a manner and fashion that turned out to be eerily reminiscent of a terrorist cell.

All this "local control and autonomy" shit was used by the Baptists to NOT create a database of offenses and offenders. They used this aspect of their organizational structure to not do the right thing. 

Incredible. Or as we've already seen from the Catholics, not so incredible at all.

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4980]

14 hours ago, Lobo said:

Great, there are no shortage of meathooks on which to hang enemies of the faith.  I'm genuinely interested to learn about how they moved their rapists around in the Baptist faith considering they have far fewer resources with a much smaller footprint.  They do, however, benefit from an even more gullible flock.  

Since Southern Baptist Churches are all independent of each other that really isn't even possible. If anything it would be more like if a teacher gets caught getting too handsy with a student and is allowed to resign without anything said about the reasons for said resignation.

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4980]

1 minute ago, Asithappens said:

Yeah, this is bad.

And, to be brutally blunt about it, the Baptists intentionally organized themselves in a manner and fashion that turned out to be eerily reminiscent of a terrorist cell.

All this "local control and autonomy" shit was used by the Baptists to NOT create a database of offenses and offenders. They used this aspect of their organizational structure to not do the right thing. 

Incredible. Or as we've already seen from the Catholics, not so incredible at all.

It seems you are alleging that there was some conspiracy to cover this type of stuff up in SBC leadership, which is kinda impossible.

[Asithappens 974]

7 minutes ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

Since Southern Baptist Churches are all independent of each other that really isn't even possible.

Bullshit.

They could've done this. To say it is impossible is completely and totally wrong, imo. Would it have been easy? No. Would it have been difficult? Yes. 

Would it have been impossible? Impossible? Bullshit.

 

[Asithappens 974]

6 minutes ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

It seems you are alleging that there was some conspiracy to cover this type of stuff up in SBC leadership, which is kinda impossible.

Not necessarily a conspiracy.

But if that's the only way you can interpret this, then you do you.

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4980]

That's organizationally equivalent to claiming that UT is responsible for for helping cover up kid diddling at Penn State since they are both members of the NCAA. The SBC has no authority over any local Baptist Churches whatsoever. If a church decides to leave the SBC there is nothing stopping them from joining the ABA, some other convention, or becoming a completely independent Baptist church. The local church owns and controls everything, including doctrine.

Now, could there have been a good old boy network where a pastor calls up another buddy pastor and says "hey I got a you minister who we need to get out for reasons and you are looking for one, so why don't you give him a shot," yeah, that can definitely happen.

[Asithappens 974]

Heard on the radio this am (assume the guy knew what he was talking about) that "only in rare instances" would the SBC come together as a unit (paraphrase) to act on something.

1. So it's clearly not impossible.

2. It appears that this sexual scandal wasn't important enough for the SBC to do anything.

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4980]

Anything the SBC chooses to do would be strictly voluntary for individual Baptist Churches. In addition, the lack of central organization means that the SBC would likely not even know about any such scandals. I would assume that they would however have the power to choose whether or not to kick any offending church out of the organization if they did find out, so there is potential for scandal there. I guess you could also have an issue with some of the mega churches like Second Baptist in Houston moving people around to different campuses as well.

[Apep 645]

The thing about the Southern Baptists is that they operate much like the public schools. They don't have to shift people around within their organization. They just let the abusers go and don't warn the next district. Same thing with the Baptists.

[Asithappens 974]

47 minutes ago, Apep said:

The thing about the Southern Baptists is that they operate much like the public schools. They don't have to shift people around within their organization. They just let the abusers go and don't warn the next district. Same thing with the Baptists.

I guess the Baptists (along with others) have a different interpretation of Jesus' saying "suffer little children".

 

[Message Board User 12397]

Here's a searchable database of all the SBC pedos - Great Hills Baptist in North Austin has at least 1.

https://projects.houstonchronicle.com/2019/southern-baptist-abuse/

[Asithappens 974]

Just this am on NPR in an interview with the head of Baptist ethics (or whatever his office is called), Russell Moore (who was pretty good) was told that there appears to be one accused sexual predator who is still in his church position. To his credit he basically said this is outrageous. 

The point was also raised that (some) Baptist churches have used their lack of organization structure as a convenient excuse to not do the right thing. 

[Guest Lobo]

Welp, the Texas delegation and a couple of gals from Nigeria came strong to the Vatican.  But, in the end, it looks as if the action-items post-conference will be about as effective as me leaving an investment summit telling 7 people, "Yeah, let's follow up next month..." 

Took 2,000 years to have a C-Level "Let's agree to not face-fuck children" and best they came up with is, "Yeah, there's a problem here."  

Also, if you had a drink every time a Bishop, Cardinal, Laity-member, or Pope said "Concrete" in any language...you're drunk and should probably check your butthole after you wake up from your blackout.  

[Jiggy-Z 3470]

On 1/31/2019 at 6:58 PM, Deej said:

I went to school at St. Louis while he was there. No funny business with me...that I remember. Glad I wasn't an altar boy.

I was there and attended the private school from K-6th grade.  I was an alter boy my last two years.  No funny business from Fr. Louis. though.

I remember his sermons were not very good and he always seemed to be talking about budgets.

The scuttlebutt among the alter boys was that you did not want Father Louis saying your mass. He was a real standoffish curmudgeon and dare I say, a real hard ass.

No idea what his flavor was.    Of all the priest, I have ever come in contact with, he would have been the one I least suspected of any shenanigans.  I wonder what his perversion was/is? 

[Guest Lobo]

Either controlling people or ejaculating in kids faces.  Distant third would be spreading faith.