All Things Transgendered Thread

[troph 24,563]

This thread made my day. I’m serious. I mean I have spanky on ignore he’s one of only a very few ... I have zero interest in listening to anyone that thinks I’m creepy or is adamant about how accepting they are but then insists I’m really a dude. So I haven’t been able to read some of this thread.

And another guy said we were weird or something like that. Actually, we can be as normal as anything out there. You know, three kids, little league, drive throughs for dinner laced with guilt, homework, important legal matters with clients everyone knows and respects. Heck even employees and friends. Maybe even cis gender mom friends who ask advice about how to deal with teens. Happy hours with skinny margaritas instead of beer because fucking-A estrogen slows the metabolism down and weight gain is a thing now. Normal with feelings and insecurities and worries. My life now is the same it was except I don’t live with a fucking jackhammer pounding the pavement in my head all day long. I want to live. I want to grow and learn and love. I play tennis and I take piano lessons, Spanish lessons and I read again. I paint and I want to do more. Before, I just drank and escaped.

I lost a lot. But I’m happy. I lost the love of my life. We don’t even talk anymore. I’ve got a lesbian girlfriend that loves me more than I can imagine and she loves my boys too. We have a nice life together. I lost a total catch of a straight gal and gained a total catch of a lesbian gal. That’s as much proof about the topic as you need.

It’s been four years now. Wow. Came out to you assholes in 2015. A lot has changed. I’m in awe of how fantastic most of you are. The trolls continue to dwindle. Yeah I get bent out of shape on the lulz threads and for a reason - lots of my people aren’t as fortunate as I am. And I continue to want to be good about the issues for them. But in this thread I don’t have anything else to add. Y’all are just bad ass. Thank you.

I once thought the best decision I ever made was finding Jesus. Truth is I thought he’d take the gay and the lgbtq away. He didn’t. Transitioning was the best decision I ever made. Estrogen and my therapies related to my transition turned the lights on, made it all become worth it.

Yeah, I’m a woman. I went to the mat to earn it. I ran a gauntlet to get here and there were days I didn’t know if I had it in me. I used to think being a man meant being strong. Maybe. But the strongest people I know are women. Yeah I’m a woman. And there’s not anything the spankies of the world can do to take that away.

[Kyle 207]

6 minutes ago, Fudge Nuggets said:

Annoying thread is annoying. 

I'm sitting back waiting for folks to start aborting babies based on predisposition to homosexuality or inability to pick a potty - that fun will be the Thermonuclear Identity Politics Culture War. That will basically make the Trans-TERF War (see what I did there) look like November 1914 to its November 1918.

[David Dennison 18,659]

4 minutes ago, troph said:

Yeah, I’m a woman. I went to the mat to earn it. I ran a gauntlet to get here and there were days I didn’t know if I had it in me. I used to think being a man meant being strong. Maybe. But the strongest people I know are women. Yeah I’m a woman. And there’s not anything the spankies of the world can do to take that away.

But facts. And Ben Shapiro.

 

[Spankytoes 1,736]

27 minutes ago, troph said:

This thread made my day. I’m serious. I mean I have spanky on ignore he’s one of only a very few ... I have zero interest in listening to anyone that thinks I’m creepy or is adamant about how accepting they are but then insists I’m really a dude. So I haven’t been able to read some of this thread.

And another guy said we were weird or something like that. Actually, we can be as normal as anything out there. You know, three kids, little league, drive throughs for dinner laced with guilt, homework, important legal matters with clients everyone knows and respects. Heck even employees and friends. Maybe even cis gender mom friends who ask advice about how to deal with teens. Happy hours with skinny margaritas instead of beer because fucking-A estrogen slows the metabolism down and weight gain is a thing now. Normal with feelings and insecurities and worries. My life now is the same it was except I don’t live with a fucking jackhammer pounding the pavement in my head all day long. I want to live. I want to grow and learn and love. I play tennis and I take piano lessons, Spanish lessons and I read again. I paint and I want to do more. Before, I just drank and escaped.

I lost a lot. But I’m happy. I lost the love of my life. We don’t even talk anymore. I’ve got a lesbian girlfriend that loves me more than I can imagine and she loves my boys too. We have a nice life together. I lost a total catch of a straight gal and gained a total catch of a lesbian gal. That’s as much proof about the topic as you need.

It’s been four years now. Wow. Came out to you assholes in 2015. A lot has changed. I’m in awe of how fantastic most of you are. The trolls continue to dwindle. Yeah I get bent out of shape on the lulz threads and for a reason - lots of my people aren’t as fortunate as I am. And I continue to want to be good about the issues for them. But in this thread I don’t have anything else to add. Y’all are just bad ass. Thank you.

I once thought the best decision I ever made was finding Jesus. Truth is I thought he’d take the gay and the lgbtq away. He didn’t. Transitioning was the best decision I ever made. Estrogen and my therapies related to my transition turned the lights on, made it all become worth it.

Yeah, I’m a woman. I went to the mat to earn it. I ran a gauntlet to get here and there were days I didn’t know if I had it in me. I used to think being a man meant being strong. Maybe. But the strongest people I know are women. Yeah I’m a woman. And there’s not anything the spankies of the world can do to take that away.

Of course you have me on ignore. Like many on the Left, the only position worth listening to is those that agree with you. Free discussion and open dialogue are your kryptonite because it violates your safe space. You know, like the one you created in 2015 when you felt so liberated and your ex-wife was just so supportive of your declaration and you were convinced that no one suspected that you were really a dude in drag? Or when several posters had to beg you to stop trying to oversell your womanhood with your newly found girly-but-not-gay posting style back on Shaggy? Or your sense of humor when a now famous internet meme of a “m’am” throwing a tantrum at GameStop gets posted because it violates your sense of self worth indirectly? Or the countless threads you used to start that you later had deleted because you didn’t get 100% reassurance that your expectations were based in reality? Truth be told, I do hope that you are happy. I also hope that you are receiving the help you apparently need, however you take that to mean.

But you do you, because you’re above it all and life is a bed of roses, no thanks to intolerant assholes like me that refuse to pretend for your benefit on a message board.

Edited February 14, 2019 by Spankytoes

[hayden_horn 11,360]

Yall do know that spanky gets off on this trolling act of his, right?

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20,344]

5 minutes ago, Pokemon said:

He just said "safe space". Omfg, that's the lamest thing I've ever seen.

 

Hi Purgatory!

[Bama Chick 28,596]

You rock@troph.

And, yes sister, I would have totally warned you about the downsides of estrogen.

Mayhaps we should shitpost this thread into a makeup and skincare thread?

[Kyle 207]

7 hours ago, Pokemon said:

Every thread is this. 

Even this thread has an "every thread is this".

Fair enough. I give this troop of shit throwing emojis too much credit.

[ndawg 1,242]

16 hours ago, Spankytoes said:

I am open to facts, statistics or anything else worth merit for the discussion. I’m not interested in social acceptence or feelings, which typically reflect YOUR feelings, not mine. Trans people really don’t affect my life or self-worth. I know that’s not a good bumper sticker slogan, but at least it’s intellectually honest. Mental illness is a serious topic, but I think enabling behavior is more destructive. 

The problem with your point of view is that you've based it on a completely unverified assumption -- that you know more about why transgendered people reject their biological sex than they do.

[safe sex 11,683]

6 hours ago, Bama Chick said:

You rock@troph.

And, yes sister, I would have totally warned you about the downsides of estrogen.

Mayhaps we should shitpost this thread into a makeup and skincare thread?

Ugh, I have been trying to muster up the energy to make a makeup/skincare thread for a week or so now, but work has been rough and I haven't had the energy. I knocked over a fucking BRAND NEW bottle of expensive skin oil right after I opened it this morning when I got home. Fuming. 

[Js1 85,110]

16 hours ago, Spankytoes said:

I am open to facts, statistics or anything else worth merit for the discussion. I’m not interested in social acceptence or feelings, which typically reflect YOUR feelings, not mine. Trans people really don’t affect my life or self-worth. I know that’s not a good bumper sticker slogan, but at least it’s intellectually honest. Mental illness is a serious topic, but I think enabling behavior is more destructive. 

 

Holy shit, how sad must your actual life be then? You've been in a day-long pissing match about something you just admitted doesn't affect your life. 

[bad_teammate 13,132]

A guy too dumb to spell words feels empowered to dismiss the validity of varying branches of scientific pursuit. The Internet is a wonderful place.

The distinction between the biological and social constructs of "man" and "woman" are pretty easy to demonstrate.

In any given social context, this is a woman...

To call her "he" or "sir" would be a violation of social custom, and wouldn't just be rude, it would be false. It would be an inaccurate use of language as you would be confusing the people around you. You would be misgendering this person, because our normal, everyday use of these words has nothing to do with a DNA-level analysis of the person involved. Unless something strange is happening, you don't actually know the genital/DNA situation of 99% of the people you deal with day-to-day.

However, if you are a doctor and this is your patient, then you need to know the biology of the situation.

That is a woman who is hard to clock. Right now you can look at her and notice/pretend to notice cues because of the context of this post. However, out in the world, she would pass right by you and if you had any reaction at all it would be to find her attractive.

So what about those who are NOT hard to clock?

If the woman above is a woman in every sense that is meaningful to 99.99% of the world around her, what about this woman?

Within 50 yards most people are clocking her as transgender, right? The Austin Powers gif would pop up in your head and you would have all kinds of feelings different than the unclockable woman above. The biological sex of these two humans is the same. Both were born with a traditionally male karyotype.

So what do we call this woman?

We call her "her" and "ma'am". Why? Not only is it the polite thing to do (which actually does matter) and what this woman prefers (which actually does matter), it is the most accurate thing to do. Most others will say "her" and "ma'am" (also out of politeness), so to go with "him" and "sir" will confuse/disturb those other people.

Also, and this is very important, there are biological women who are misclocked. There are biological women in the world who, through various confluences of biology, are confused for men.

How many jokes did we in the Longhorn universe make about Brittney Griner being a man?

It's certainly not because of her karyotype, which is traditionally female, but because of her social presentation and the signs we think we clocked.

--------------------------------

My uncle told me a story about coming back from WWII and being in NYC. He was a Northeast Texas boy, born and bred. He built rail lines from 13-17 and joined the Army to fight the Nazis. Came up through North Africa during Operation Torch and was a POW for years. When he got back, he was in NYC and went out on leave. He went to a bar full of what he described as, "The most beautiful women you've ever seen." He was chatting one up at a bar when a buddy realized that these were transgendered women and drag queens. Once the buddy started making trouble, some pistols came out and my fresh-off-the-farm uncle ran on home.

Edited February 15, 2019 by bad_teammate

[troph 24,563]

Ugh, I have been trying to muster up the energy to make a makeup/skincare thread for a week or so now, but work has been rough and I haven't had the energy. I knocked over a fucking BRAND NEW bottle of expensive skin oil right after I opened it this morning when I got home. Fuming. 

Ive almost stated a “shaggy chick” thread a couple of times but figured it would be a ghost town of real convo and would then be inundated with comments like “sugartits” and debates about whether side boob or under boob is the better view (side duh). Or creeper phone pics of anonymous women from behind at target, or calls for “pics or GTFO” instead of a decent thread. I mean husbands gotta do stupid shit too right? An all encompassing thread might be nice even if it’s full of harassment that mirrors the real world nonsense. But I ain’t starting it. Heh.

[troph 24,563]

[mention=880]bad_teammate[/mention] -

 

great post. And I’ll say that the stereotype of trans women as either a trap or a man in a dress leaves out thousands of us that blend well and range from a 6-8 on the traditional attractiveness scale.

 

And that is the irony of all of this - when I hear folks talk about trans people and they assume there are none in their life. That’s nonsense. In any major metro I guarantee you’ve had more than one - probably multiple and significant interactions with garden variety blended trans woman - meaning enough time for you to tell based on your stated trans radar clocking skills. And it didn’t raise one hint of “teh trans”. Heck I’m as tall as any woman you’ll find out there and it never gets past “did you play volleyball or basketball”.

 

And I think for me at least this points to a very similar issue cis gender women face - bias in favor of beauty - though don’t be too attractive or you’ll be marginalized too. Women who would rank a 6-8 on a traditional attractive scale have a MUCH easier go at life than those who are considered “ugly” and the truth is of the two trans women you highlight - one is a 10 (too attractive)!and will be nothing but a sex object - and let’s be clear even more of a sex object for some men when they find out her history - and the other will be treated the exact opposite and marginalized as some one not desirable and someone so worthless in all respects BECAUSE they they don’t want to fuck her. The aspect that is trans for the latter is just an additional trait that augments the fact that she is not a 6-8 by traditional beauty standards.

 

 

[Spankytoes 1,736]

44 minutes ago, ndawg said:

The problem with your point of view is that you've based it on a completely unverified assumption -- that you know more about why transgendered people reject their biological sex than they do.

Mental illness and depression within the trans community is not an unverified assumption. There are plenty of published studies speaking to the correlation of these issues. Do you have any data to combat this? It's a dumb argument targeted towards men. 

[HenryJames 65,890]

46 minutes ago, trauma babe said:

Ugh, I have been trying to muster up the energy to make a makeup/skincare thread for a week or so now, but work has been rough and I haven't had the energy. I knocked over a fucking BRAND NEW bottle of expensive skin oil right after I opened it this morning when I got home. Fuming. 

Sounds...traumatic.

[Kyle 207]

51 minutes ago, trauma babe said:

Ugh, I have been trying to muster up the energy to make a makeup/skincare thread for a week or so now, but work has been rough and I haven't had the energy. I knocked over a fucking BRAND NEW bottle of expensive skin oil right after I opened it this morning when I got home. Fuming. 

White privilege gonna privilege.

[troph 24,563]

Sounds...traumatic.

Tone.

[RomaVicta 29,793]

16 hours ago, Pokemon said:

A pronouncement of victimization for not being allowed to openly discriminate.

Victim? Victim? No victim! I'm the victim!!

All forced to tolerate and be polite and shit. 

As stated, no objection to Jews transgenders as an idea.

[Chrispy 132]

It’s all fun and games until you check underneath  the hood. 

[Mole 4,320]

I think most people are happy to oblige requests to use preferred pronouns and names, but dropping “sugar tits” from the lexicon is a bridge too far. There’s polite and respectful and there’s lingual-fascism. Some hills are worth dying on.

[David Dennison 18,659]

38 minutes ago, Spankytoes said:

Mental illness and depression within the trans community is not an unverified assumption. There are plenty of published studies speaking to the correlation of these issues. Do you have any data to combat this? It's a dumb argument targeted towards men. 

Mental illness and depression within the trans community is mainly due to the way they are treated.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-truth-about-exercise-addiction/201612/why-transgender-people-experience-more-mental-health

[zork 629]

https://www2.bc.edu/christopher-kenaley/bio3030/Brand.pdf

Quote

...

Discrimination, recognition, and identification The ability of human beingsto recognize an individual odorant is very limited, and the difficulty of identifying with the correct name a particular odour is a major characteristic of olfaction compared to the othersensory systems. Early differences have been described: identification scores (five odorants were tested: baby powder, bubble gum, candy cane, fish, orange) tended to be better for girls than for boys throughout childhood, from 3.5 to 13 years of age (Richman, Post, Sheehe, & Wright, 1992). Adult abilities in identification have also been investigated by the NGSS (Wysocki&Gilbert, 1989).When therewas a sex difference, it was always in favour of the females. Engen (1987) found similar results. The difference was also greaterforthe older subjects (80–90 years of age). Otherstudiesinvolving a large population (nearly 4000 people) have been carried out using the University of Pennsylvania Smell Identification test (UPSIT). This “scratch and sniff” test is standardized, has high reliability, and includes 40 microencapsulated odorants.Differences are obviousforthe youngest and the oldest people: 5 to 9 years of age and over 60 years (Doty, 1997). The decrease in the olfactory ability with age is in part attributed to structural modifications in the olfactory system (Meisami, Mikhail, Baim, & Bhatnagar, 1998). In the first published longitudinal study assessing olfaction in adulthood, Ship, Pearson, Cruise, Brant, and Metter (1996) replicated and extended earlier cross-sectional results (Ship & Weiffenbach, 1993) by showing that the pattern of deterioration in odour identification with age was similar in males and females, but delayed by approximately 20 years in women: Males experienced a more precipitous and earlier decline, by the age of 55 years, in smell identification than did women, by the age of 75 years.Recent workssuggestthat healthywomen up to 80 years of age showonly slight changes in sensory functioning in relation to younger females (Larsson & Bäckman, 1993, 1997). The superiority of women has been confirmed whatever the ethnic or cultural background: white, black, Korean Americans, and native Japanese (Doty, 1997; Doty, Applebaum, Zusho, & Settle, 1985; Doty, et al., 1984). This difference was also confirmed not only in forced-choice tests, as was the case of UPSIT, but also in free recall tests (Cain, 1982). These identification abilities could have a stronger genetic basisin men than in women as wassuggested by Segal et al. (1995). They found a reduced resemblance between the UPSIT scores of monozygotic female twins compared to that of monozygotic male twins. These results are also interpreted by these authors as an increased sensitivity of the female identification ability to environmental and endocrinological influences.

...

So there is one example of clear and possibly entirely and completely measurable difference between the sexes. 

In the future you will be categorized by how you pass the smell test, similar to the Gattica blood testing.  Ultimately so insurance companies can better rate you for health insurance and also the all important driving insurance rate differential.

[RomaVicta 29,793]

10 hours ago, troph said:

It’s been four years now. Wow. Came out to you assholes in 2015. A lot has changed. I’m in awe of how fantastic most of you are. The trolls continue to dwindle. Yeah I get bent out of shape on the lulz threads and for a reason - lots of my people aren’t as fortunate as I am.

Tolerance is so little to ask of anyone. I am glad to read your story and of your path to a happier life. The path should not be lined with hostile strangers.

[hayden_horn 11,360]

2 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Mental illness and depression within the trans community is mainly due to the way they are treated.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-truth-about-exercise-addiction/201612/why-transgender-people-experience-more-mental-health

(hint: he knows this.)

(second hint: he'll pretend he doesn't.)

[tantric superman 4,667]

I prefer under boob.

[troph 24,563]

It’s all fun and games until you check underneath  the hood. 

But then it can amp up to 11. The sexual universe is thankfully not defined by the square Christian heterosexual male experience. Trans women can be fantastic lays, or so I’ve been told.

[tantric superman 4,667]

9 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

Tolerance is so little to ask of anyone.

Well, more often than not, you have to teach it, and not just ask it.

I often feel like I am intellectually tolerant, but tolerance is like mindfulness.  Too easy to follow a path that is neither.

[Spankytoes 1,736]

7 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Mental illness and depression within the trans community is mainly due to the way they are treated.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-truth-about-exercise-addiction/201612/why-transgender-people-experience-more-mental-health

Mental illness and chronic depression are results of a chemical imbalance. How people treat you can enhance these pre-existing factors, but they are not the root cause. If you believe they are, then tell me a solution. A trans person living today will never see complete acceptance in society the same way that a black guy will wonder if a comment was made due to his skin color. You don't learn mental illness nor do you get rid of it. It can only be treated to a reasonable degree. One of the many reasons I treat trans people with respect, save our resident narcissist, as I've proclaimed many times. Me calling you a "she" and treating you with respect is all I'm willing to go on that journey. My inability to placate a trans woman on how brave she is and pretend that she isn't a man with a penis and a dress is intellectually dishonest, which is why I don't do it. In the 5 years I have had trans friends, this discussion hasn't come up once. Why? Because my personally held view is irrelevant to their worth as a human being and certainly not something I would offer freely out of politeness. Same reason I have gay friends but no desire to ask them if they are a bottom or a top. There's more to people than their sexuality.

[Cheeseweasel 26,437]

My thoughts:

You do you. Let everyone else do them. Live and let live.

[tantric superman 4,667]

1 minute ago, jason jason jason said:

You don't practice that.

One can't practice that in society.  The line is somewhere between "Live and Let Live" and "Stamp out Intolerance".

 

[Spankytoes 1,736]

2 minutes ago, jason jason jason said:

You should busy yourself with things you know about. Not this. You've never spent any time with a trans person. You're an authority on nothing but yourself.

Except you're wrong, a few people on here that I know outside of the board know you're wrong, and I don't waste more than 1 reply on socks that don't have the balls, or vagina...no judgment, to speak their minds out in the open.

[David Dennison 18,659]

Just now, Spankytoes said:

Mental illness and chronic depression are results of a chemical imbalance. How people treat you can enhance these pre-existing factors, but they are not the root cause. If you believe they are, then tell me a solution. A trans person living today will never see complete acceptance in society the same way that a black guy will wonder if a comment was made due to his skin color. You don't learn mental illness nor do you get rid of it. It can only be treated to a reasonable degree. One of the many reasons I treat trans people with respect, save our resident narcissist, as I've proclaimed many times. Me calling you a "she" and treating you with respect is all I'm willing to go on that journey. My inability to placate a trans woman on how brave she is and pretend that she isn't a man with a penis and a dress is intellectually dishonest, which is why I don't do it. In the 5 years I have had trans friends, this discussion hasn't come up once. Why? Because my personally held view is irrelevant to their worth as a human being and certainly not something I would offer freely out of politeness. Same reason I have gay friends but no desire to ask them if they are a bottom or a top. There's more to people than their sexuality.

That's the half-assed version of mental illness. By that logic, everyone suffering from PTSD had pre-existing factors that the trauma just enhanced, and voila! Mental illness.

Mental illness is much more complex than just "chemical imbalance." Environment matters. Nature and nurture work together. 

[troph 24,563]

That's the half-assed version of mental illness. By that logic, everyone suffering from PTSD had pre-existing factors that the trauma just enhanced, and voila! Mental illness.
Mental illness is much more complex than just "chemical imbalance." Environment matters. Nature and nurture work together. 

Having a romantic partner, family that’s remains close, job security, housing security, and good physical health solve almost all of the problems. Just like everyone else. I guarantee if he couldn’t find a job mental illness by his definition would be crawling up his ass.

[safe sex 11,683]

"Straight" dudes would have a lot more fun and enjoyment in their lives if they'd get over their fear of thinking that fucking a trans woman makes them gay. As if. 

Or if more of them could admit to themselves that they're less straight than they try to tell themselves. 

[Chrispy 132]

17 minutes ago, troph said:

But then it can amp up to 11. The sexual universe is thankfully not defined by the square Christian heterosexual male experience. Trans women can be fantastic lays, or so I’ve been told.

Luckily for me, it’s hip to be square. As long as both parties know the score, more power to you.

[GHOSTUSER 361]

1 hour ago, jason jason jason said:

Wood!

Is that Aubrey Kate? If you don’t that think beauty is a woman you need to have your head examined. Look at her vids on transsexualangel.com. Some of the hottest porn I have ever watched.

On a serious note, the discrimination against the transgendered community, especially by those mean spirited bathroom bills sickened me. I made sure to vote for the Democratic opponents of Danny Goeb and Ken Paxton because of it.

Edited February 14, 2019 by Iconoclast Texan

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20,344]

27 minutes ago, jason jason jason said:

Wood!

 

Pretty sure your anti-depressants would interfere.

Hi Purgatory!

[Spankytoes 1,736]

1 hour ago, trauma babe said:

"Straight" dudes would have a lot more fun and enjoyment in their lives if they'd get over their fear of thinking that fucking a trans woman makes them gay. As if. 

Or if more of them could admit to themselves that they're less straight than they try to tell themselves. 

Define "trans woman". A trans woman that is post-op and has a vagina or a trans woman that still needs to be checked for testicular cancer? Should there be a distinction? Are you straight if you fuck a trans woman with a dick in the ass because you both identify her as a woman? There are men that would be all for doing that that identify as gay and straight. But, what about those sympathetic to the plight of trans people? Is it intolerant to not want a chick with a dick to give you a blowjob? On the reverse, Tropheus has said in the past that she likes women. If she docks with a straight guy, is she straight, despite being a biological male that identifies as a woman...which makes now make her a lesbian?

A flowchart would help here. Actually, scratch that. 

[David Dennison 18,659]

2 minutes ago, Spankytoes said:

Define "trans woman". A trans woman that is post-op and has a vagina or a trans woman that still needs to be checked for testicular cancer? Should there be a distinction? Are you straight if you fuck a trans woman with a dick in the ass because you both identify her as a woman? There are men that would be all for doing that that identify as gay and straight. But, what about those sympathetic to the plight of trans people? Is it intolerant to not want a chick with a dick to give you a blowjob? On the reverse, Tropheus has said in the past that she likes women. If she docks with a straight guy, is she straight, despite being a biological male that identifies as a woman...which makes now make her a lesbian?

A flowchart would help here. Actually, scratch that. 

Why does any of that matter to you? 

[Spankytoes 1,736]

1 hour ago, Chrispy said:

Luckily for me, it’s hip to be square. As long as both parties know the score, more power to you.

100% agree. What two dudes/chicks/whatever do in the bedroom between consenting adults is not my business. What I find puzzling is why a trans woman wouldn't feel compelled to disclose that info to not violate the rights of their partner before hitting the sheets. I wouldn't purposely serve green beans with bacon to a Jew because I personally don't think eating pork is a big deal and I find it ridiculous that it is religiously verboten. That's not my right to impose my beliefs.

[Spankytoes 1,736]

Just now, David Dennison said:

Why does any of that matter to you? 

Because I'm on a thread titled "All Transgendered Things" and am asking a question relating to transgendered things? I've been married for almost 20 years. None of this matters to me nor does it to you. I think it's a relevant question to have if your intent on creating this thread is what you imply it to be. (Which it's not) 

[David Dennison 18,659]

Just now, Spankytoes said:

Because I'm on a thread titled "All Transgendered Things" and am asking a question relating to transgendered things? I've been married for almost 20 years. None of this matters to me nor does it to you. I think it's a relevant question to have if your intent on creating this thread is what you imply it to be. (Which it's not) 

You already know the answers to all of those questions. You just don't like them.

 

[Spankytoes 1,736]

9 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

You already know the answers to all of those questions. You just don't like them.

 

Actually I don't, which is why I am asking them. Help me understand:

Biological male that identifies as a woman is a woman. Biological male that has had gender reassignment surgery to physically appear as a woman is also a woman. One has a penis, the other has a vagina but both are women. Is one more woman than the other? I think Leo DiCaprio is an attractive man. I would not be interested in having sex with him if he identified and made himself appear as a woman. Shouldn't I have the right to know what's between his legs or am I supposed to be denied my rights as a straight guy that doesn't believe your terms of social constructs? Despite popular opinion on this thread, intolerance isn't a one-way street. You certainly wouldn't advocate that religion should be the default despite the law. (At least I hope you wouldn't)

I know the answers to those questions in the sense that I don't buy the premise that a man can become a woman based on a subjective feeling. I would consider the guy fucking a trans woman as either gay or bi, which is perfectly fine. At best, he's curious. I know my answer already. I'm interested in yours.

Edited February 14, 2019 by Spankytoes

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20,344]

3 minutes ago, the devil inside said:

 

4 minutes ago, the devil inside said:

 

Hi Purgatory, Jason Jason Jason, ADHD, Canada, Hannibal etc...

 

[David Dennison 18,659]

Just now, Spankytoes said:

Actually I don't, which is why I am asking them. Help me understand:

Biological male that identifies as a woman is a woman. Biological male that has had gender reassignment surgery to physically appear as a woman is also a woman. One has a penis, the other has a vagina but both are women. Is one more woman than the other? I think Leo DiCaprio is an attractive man. I would not be interested in having sex with him if he identified and made himself appear as a woman. Shouldn't I have the right to know what's between his legs or am I supposed to be denied my rights as a straight guy that doesn't believe your terms of social constructs? Despite popular opinion on this thread, intolerance isn't a one-way street. You certainly wouldn't advocate that religion should be the default despite the law. (At least I hope you wouldn't)

If you're really worried about it, ask.

[Spankytoes 1,736]

Just now, David Dennison said:

If you're really worried about it, ask.

Should I expect an evasive answer like you are doing to avoid the question because you've been tripped up on your own logic?

[David Dennison 18,659]

1 minute ago, Spankytoes said:

Should I expect an evasive answer like you are doing to avoid the question because you've been tripped up on your own logic?

If you are really concerned that a woman you are interested in might have a penis, ask whether she has a penis. 

[Spankytoes 1,736]

16 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

If you are really concerned that a woman you are interested in might have a penis, ask whether she has a penis. 

Fair enough.

Now, what is your view with regards to the what I asked? 

[ndawg 1,242]

3 hours ago, Spankytoes said:

Mental illness and depression within the trans community is not an unverified assumption. There are plenty of published studies speaking to the correlation of these issues. Do you have any data to combat this? It's a dumb argument targeted towards men. 

Why would I need any data to defend my position? The trans community (particularly within academia) is the world's foremost authority on what it's like to be a trans person. You and I are not. And you would need to have studied the subject matter to a comparable depth as they have in order to bring an argument worth their consideration, because otherwise you'd just be talking out your ass and saying things that sound right in your head.

And there's nothing wrong with talking out one's ass, by the way, it's the reality for most of us laymen participating in political discussions like this. But I do take issue with posturing as if your position was reached after thorough, impartial analysis and research -- which is exactly what I think you're doing when you ask me for data that would refute your highly speculative position. You're essentially saying, "I'll only be convinced by a compelling argument," which suggests that you've already been convinced by some other compelling argument. I don't think you have, though.

Here's the problem I have with your argument: so long as you perceive the trans community as a political one, you are prone to ignore any research and analysis that led them to their conclusion. Climate science works the same way in the political arena -- because the issue has been perverted into a political one, many deniers refuse to consider the arguments brought forth by scientists because of a perceived political bias.

Once you've actually made an effort to understand what transgendered people experience, I suspect that you'll find on your own that your argument isn't tenable.