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Looks Like We Have Another Fake Hate Crime

Kyle

By Kyle
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ChickenSandwich

ChickenSandwich 9829

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, RomaVicta said:

Garage door rope formed into a noose found in black driver's garage

 

but that is the issue, it can't be a noose if it doesn't close, by definition.  It can be a type of knot that LOOKS like a noose, but a noose is a specific thing.  The continued use of that terminology is inflammatory and a catchy headline.  As we have seen on this thread, many knots that have actual functions can seem to look like a noose.  Should we stop using any knot that can be confused for a noose by appearance regardless of functionality?

 

Garage door rope with knot tied into a handle/loop, mistaken for a noose, found in black driver's garage.

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Cheeseweasel
Cheeseweasel

You Are Fake Noose

Js1
Js1

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH like the President of the United States? 

RDCanecutter
RDCanecutter

STFU Moron.

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ChickenSandwich

ChickenSandwich 9829

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

The police are murdering black men. The police are macing, teargassing, and beating peaceful protesters of the murdering police. Racist remarks and statements are on the rise from the white right.

Oh look, I think somebody was wrong when they said there was a noose in a black race car driver's garage. The press is stirring up trouble just like they always do to sell papers, push narratives, and hide their agendas. I'M HOPPING MAD ABOUT THAT, YOU FUCKING SHEEP!

Idiot World meet Disingenuous World meet Projection World

Fuck these guys. Fuck this way of doing things. Fuck everybody responsible for it.

being simply wrong was not the point

Painting a whole group of fans and people involved as simple minded racists before waiting for any investigation is the problem.

You seem very upset this didn't add to your personal narrative.

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105082

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, ChickenSandwich said:

but that is the issue, it can't be a noose if it doesn't close, by definition.  It can be a type of knot that LOOKS like a noose, but a noose is a specific thing.  The continued use of that terminology is inflammatory and a catchy headline.  As we have seen on this thread, many knots that have actual functions can seem to look like a noose.  Should we stop using any knot that can be confused for a noose by appearance regardless of functionality?

 

Garage door rope with knot tied into a handle/loop, mistaken for a noose, found in black driver's garage.

Well, I mean, I don't think that the crosses that the KKK used to burn in black people's yards were technically suited for crucifixions, either.

Getting hung up on the semantic of whether it was a fully functional hangman's noose is insanely pointless.  If it was hung there will ill intent, it was NOT done with the intent to actually hang Bubba Wallace -- it would have been placed there as a symbol of intimidation.  And you don't need functionality for that, just like the Klan didn't need their crosses to support the weight of a person.  That's just a silly point.  If it was intended as a symbol of intimidation, the final functionality is a non-issue.

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105082

Posted
Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, ChickenSandwich said:

Painting a whole group of fans and people involved as simple minded racists before waiting for any investigation is the problem.

To be fair, members of that group of fans responded to a banning of the confederate flag by.....hiring a plane to fly the confederate flag over the track.  As a group, NASCAR fans haven't acquitted themselves particularly well in the "not being confederate flag waving assholes" capacity.

Edited by Brisketexan
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BabaYaga

BabaYaga 15289

Posted
Posted
19 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

The police are murdering black men. The police are macing, teargassing, and beating peaceful protesters of the murdering police. Racist remarks and statements are on the rise from the white right.

Oh look, I think somebody was wrong when they said there was a noose in a black race car driver's garage. The press is stirring up trouble just like they always do to sell papers, push narratives, and hide their agendas. I'M HOPPING MAD ABOUT THAT, YOU FUCKING SHEEP!

Idiot World meet Disingenuous World meet Projection World

Fuck these guys. Fuck this way of doing things. Fuck everybody responsible for it.

Did this sound better when you practiced it at home in front of your cat?

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105082

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Axiom of Choice said:

 

This is why you need to develop the loop knot investigation standard.  You could cover these eventualities, as well as the principles to determine suspicious knot types, rope material, and guidance on the assessment on the intent of a loop knot.  It can also provide a list of allowable knots and would obviously forbid the use of knots with threatening appearance, such as the bimini loop and any other knot with coiled wraps.  No place in modern society for those.  

Or, you just act like a normal adult and evaluate a complete set of circumstances in the particular time and place in which they occur, instead of tying yourself in logically fallacious knots.  That seems like a better choice.

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ChickenSandwich

ChickenSandwich 9829

Posted
Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

Colossally brilliant argument. You've outdone yourself. Now, try applying that keen analysis, perspective, and articulation to something that matters. I don't know, maybe to:

  • hundreds of thousands of deaths due to GOP reckless endangerment or
  • recognizing and correcting systemic racist police brutality and murder or
  • Covid relief policies pipelining (without revealing specifically to whom!) money to big money interests or
  • constant dishonesty from the president or
  • graft in plain daylight by the president's appointees or
  • nepotism in the White House or
  • our declining (fully declined by now) international reputation or
  • various other res publica, affairs of the people?

I know, you're too busy making an absurd point about a minor story involving a racial issue to make it all seem small and silly to keep from facing a harsh reality about yourself and your beloved team. Wear the jersey proudly. Your descendants will surely remember you fondly.

Well it’s not a CR thread and we aren’t discussing these topics. 
 

Keep up your God complex though. Suits you. 

Edited by ChickenSandwich
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ChickenSandwich

ChickenSandwich 9829

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Or, you just act like a normal adult and evaluate a complete set of circumstances in the particular time and place in which they occur, instead of tying yourself in logically fallacious knots.  That seems like a better choice.

Is that how you believe the situation was handled?

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elfenix

elfenix 34227

Posted
Posted (edited)
40 minutes ago, Hate said:

Wouldn’t it be pretty easy to review the surveillance cameras to see when this “garage pull” was made into a “noose”? It would seem that the alleged offender would have to know Wallace would be assigned that stall and then gain access to the stall without anyone seeing to tie the “noose”. That doesn’t seem very plausible to me, but maybe there is some huge conspiracy to cover it all up by the powers that be in NASCAR.

 the FBI, nascar, and bubba wallace have all come out with the news that this wasn't an intentional act of intimidation. keep up.

Edited by elfenix
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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105082

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, ChickenSandwich said:

Is that how you believe the situation was handled?

Generally speaking, yes.  Based on the collective set of circumstances and information, NASCAR referred the matter to a third party for investigation.  That's exactly what should have happened.  

I do wish the media would have been more circumspect in their reporting, but that's a standing concern.

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Reagan1k

Reagan1k 3024

Posted
Posted

It's a pretty difficult balance to be both skeptical of everything you read/hear and yet open minded to anything being possible at the same time. 

Painting one's self into a corner by presupposing what individuals or groups on either side of any argument are capable of in these times is pretty easy.

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BabaYaga

BabaYaga 15289

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, Reagan1k said:

It's a pretty difficult balance to be both skeptical of everything you read/hear and yet open minded to anything being possible at the same time. 

Painting one's self into a corner by presupposing what individuals or groups on either side of any argument are capable of in these times is pretty easy.

48 rule needs to be mandatory

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Brew

Brew 3049

Posted
Posted
28 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Well, I mean, I don't think that the crosses that the KKK used to burn in black people's yards were technically suited for crucifixions, either.

Getting hung up on the semantic of whether it was a fully functional hangman's noose is insanely pointless.  If it was hung there will ill intent, it was NOT done with the intent to actually hang Bubba Wallace -- it would have been placed there as a symbol of intimidation.  And you don't need functionality for that, just like the Klan didn't need their crosses to support the weight of a person.  That's just a silly point.  If it was intended as a symbol of intimidation, the final functionality is a non-issue.

I’m quoting this just because. Intent and symbolism drives the whole issue not whether the noose functionally closes. You can get pretty far down the checklist of problems because of the circumstances around it. The fact it was there before potentially changes the intent, but it has to be investigated because of the checklist of the circumstances.

Again, the FBI has a division that specifically investigates potential hate crimes. They looked at the facts and circumstances and decided to investigate. The fact that some of you guys can’t see a problem with African American driver, noose like knot in rope (where the rope is or whether it closes makes zero difference in anything), all the things going on in the world, backlash against the Confederate flag policy, etc and not think it needed to be investigated is baffling.

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105082

Posted
Posted
Just now, Axiom of Choice said:

I think most adults would use it to pull the garage door.  

Got any other logical fallacies?  You're on a roll, no point in stopping now.

Especially being that this super-common pull loop (that is, the kind that looks like a hangman's noose to most eyes) has been shown to exist.....in ZERO other NASCAR garages.  So, DO go on...you're impressing the hell out of us.

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Jkwellborn

Jkwellborn 6695

Posted
Posted
It's a pretty difficult balance to be both skeptical of everything you read/hear and yet open minded to anything being possible at the same time. 
Painting one's self into a corner by presupposing what individuals or groups on either side of any argument are capable of in these times is pretty easy.
best you can do is assume any of this you hear is bullshit in the day.
, noose like knot in rope (where the rope is or whether it closes makes zero difference in anything),

Whether or not the loop closes makes the difference in it being a noose or a loop.
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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31440

Posted
Posted
39 minutes ago, Jkwellborn said:

best you can do is assume any of this you hear is bullshit in the day.

Whether or not the loop closes makes the difference in it being a noose or a loop.

I might guess that a loop that closes or pulls tight makes a less-good pull rope.  The 13 turns around the free end might make a pretty good handle, though.

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CHIEF

CHIEF 5078

Posted
Posted

I have garage doors at my shop, they all look like a noose, but they are uni-knots, because I am a fisherman.. The door springs are so heavy, you are not going to close them without sticking a pipe through the loop and hanging on the pipe. If the rope were a different material, the original may have snapped, hemp rope was all they had around to fix it, and if a pit crew member replaced it, he may have tied a loop to aid in pulling the door down if it was stubborn. It is, however, ironic that the only black NASCAR driver ended up with that stall, officials may want to do a "walk through" before assigning stalls next time.

CHIEF

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Hate

Hate 20107

Posted
Posted
You have something better for us to do?

Nope...absolutely nothing better to do than sit around arguing the point that a knot is indeed a noose even though everyone has said there is no intended “message” behind that noose.
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GringoSalado

GringoSalado 1651

Posted
Posted (edited)

That other pic upthread kinda sorta reminds me of this lanyard knot, which is the only lanyard knot I can tie.

spacer.png

 

 

I didn't realize it is basically a noose with the free end through the tightened loop (see panel #5 below)

 

edit: so in that case the visible "loop" portion is tied fast. It is basically an upside-down noose knot.

 

spacer.png

Edited by GringoSalado
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Judge Roybeanbag

Judge Roybeanbag 11819

Posted
Posted (edited)
44 minutes ago, Axiom of Choice said:

 

Just got off some calls, so here is my honest, non chickenshit/fraudulent response:

I think any reasonable group of adults could have handled and diffused this situation easily.  Just go check to see what the rope was for, pull on it to see if it is a noose or loop, find out who tied it that way and why.  They probably would have found some garage mechanic who said I tie loops that way sometimes and tied it a long time ago, and he could apologize for any offense and even apologize directly to Bubba if needed.  Whatever happened, the situation could have been resolved easily and answers could be given to any concerned party.  It is insanity to send in 15 federal agents for what could be resolved just by asking a few very obvious questions.  You may think this was the right course of action, but I disagree and do not think we need this amount of hand holding to act civilly and resolve issues.  

Regarding the impact, I think sensationalized stories like this only serve to further alienate and make various groups feel unwelcome in this country.  I think we all have the same end goals and would like for all groups, races, ethnicities, etc, to feel welcome here.  Obviously, we need to work on eradicating tribalism and racism, but we also need to not constantly broadcast fictitious racist incidents.  This works against our mutual end goals.  In the last few weeks, there have been a number of false stories about public hangings, nooses in parks, noose hanging in nascar garage, etc.  As soon as one story gets proven false, another replaces it.  None of these stories should have been given national attention, as they were all easily dismissed and they further send the message to minority groups that they are not welcome here.  I do not want that for our country.     

Well we could get a long way toward weeding out these occasional fictitious racial incidents if we could, you know, weed out the actual racial incidents.  Perhaps it’s not the media that’s the bulk of the problem.  Perhaps it’s the actual possibility of something like this commonly happening in 2020 America that’s the problem.  

Edited by Judge Roybeanbag
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Iceman

Iceman 2695

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Judge Roybeanbag said:

Perhaps it’s the actual possibility of something like this commonly happening in 2020 America that’s the problem.  

seeing shit where it isn't is also an absolute magnificent problem in its own right.

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Iceman

Iceman 2695

Posted
Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, Judge Roybeanbag said:

spacer.png

Ok.  They’re all fake hate crimes.  There is no racism here. Everyone should just laugh it off.  Why the fuck do you even care enough to read this thread and post then?  

2 days after the fact, you motherfuckers are still posting that it could have been...

 

sorry I ain't pissed about it.  Embrace your outrage or puddle of piss.   Either way, it isn't what you thought( or hoped) it was.   It's just a contest to prove your woketivity.

Edited by Iceman
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Reagan1k

Reagan1k 3024

Posted
Posted (edited)

I know several mariner types and even some old Eagle Scouts who can't stand seeing a rope without a knot in it.  They tie shit for fun / out of habit.

I also know there are ignorant assholes among us.

Until / unless there is video shown of the rope being tied, those of us out here reacting to news coverage will never know what the intent was at the race track. 

Some dolt may have thought they were playing an innocent prank, someone may have been OCD about ropes and tied a loop handle as they were standing there one day, someone may be an ignorant bigot, or someone may have been trying to sabotage NASCAR in the wake of the flag fallout. 

All one can hope for at this point is that more good than harm comes out of the entire debacle.

Edited by Reagan1k
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Judge Roybeanbag

Judge Roybeanbag 11819

Posted
Posted

I mean it’s like the whole Chicago thing.  “Hey guys! Black persons shoot other black persons!  Therefore we should not care about any black persons shot by non-black persons, regardless of motivation!”  

I try real hard to like you but you can be a real beating sometimes.  Kinda like you had a real hard upbringing, and came out ok, so fuck everybody else if I made it they can too or they’re losers.  That’s really insightful.  

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Iceman

Iceman 2695

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, Judge Roybeanbag said:

I mean it’s like the whole Chicago thing.  “Hey guys! Black persons shoot other black persons!  Therefore we should not care about any black persons shot by non-black persons, regardless of motivation!”  

I try real hard to like you but you can be a real beating sometimes.  Kinda like you had a real hard upbringing, and came out ok, so fuck everybody else if I made it they can too or they’re losers.  That’s really insightful.  

dismissing this episode hardly fucking eliminates racism.

 

Is that your fucking fear?

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Iceman

Iceman 2695

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Judge Roybeanbag said:

I don’t operate on fear.  I kinda would like a place where fear and anger don’t legislate.  Chill out brother.

you're the one taking personal shots and making up shit I didn't say.   just trying to understand the basis of hysteria vs reality.

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52-80

52-80 19147

Posted
Posted
17 minutes ago, Judge Roybeanbag said:

I don’t operate on fear.  I kinda would like a place where fear and anger don’t legislate.  Chill out brother.

Conjuring a non-story is exactly stoking fear and anger, where there was none before.

I'm 100% certain there are racists in the racing world just as there are dipshit officers wearing badges.  And I'm all for stomping them out.  But drumming up questionable incidents does a disservice to the cause.

 

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Brew

Brew 3049

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Judge Roybeanbag said:

Everyone has dismissed this episode except the people who dismissed it in the first place. Says more about them I would say.

Judge, I would let it lie at this point. If they don’t see that it was worth investigating at this point, to your point it says more about them at this point.

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