Texas teacher pay raise.

[Larry T. Spider 1740]

1 minute ago, Winona's Big Orange Bevo said:

Yes, Austin sucks for teacher pay. Don't know why. I'm in NB and starting is not at about 50k with the surrounding area being about equal. The one outlier is Schertz-Cibolo which is about 3K higher with a longer scale increase. 

Recapture is raping central Texas.

[Johnny Sack 8397]

Just now, Larry T. Spider said:

Recapture is raping central Texas.

What is recapture?

[Larry T. Spider 1740]

Robin Hood. Austin is paying in roughly 600 million a year causing budget cuts and depressed teacher salaries compared to other cities. We are cutting 30 million this year. It’s possible that the legislature will re-do education finance this year, which could greatly benefit AISD and surrounding districts.

[TexEx15 17480]

HB9 is the competing House bill.  It’s a larger school finance bill.  Does not include across the board raises.  Author says it significantly increases minimum salary schedules (based on funding formulas) but leaves specific raises up to districts.

[Llano Estacado 1257]

Recapture is raping central Texas.

Edgewood ISD was the plaintiff the ruling that initiated “Recapture” in the 90s.

It was a property tax issue then. It’s a property tax issue now.

[Larry T. Spider 1740]

22 minutes ago, TexEx15 said:

HB9 is the competing House bill.  It’s a larger school finance bill.  Does not include across the board raises.  Author says it significantly increases minimum salary schedules (based on funding formulas) but leaves specific raises up to districts.

Raises would be great but I’m much more interested in a better school finance system than is sustainable for the long term with our population growth. 

[Druggist 303]

Glad they added librarians.  In the state of Texas, librarians at public schools are required to be teachers with at least 2 years of classroom experience plus an additional certification that requires a masters degree.  If librarians were making 5k less than teachers, it would be really hard to fill those positions out of what is already a small pool of qualified candidates.

Most importantly, my wife just became a certified librarian so she’ll get a raise.

[TexEx15 17480]

52 minutes ago, Larry T. Spider said:

Raises would be great but I’m much more interested in a better school finance system than is sustainable for the long term with our population growth. 

Agreee but also believe that teachers are underpaid in Texas.  Education is a wicked problem in Texas because politicians for too long have turned a blind eye to the situation.  That’s how we end up with a broken finance system and underpaid teachers.

[txhorns 2408]

My wife is a teacher.  She teaches a high school Functional Living Skills class.  That is the severe Special Ed class for thenyone wondering.  She started in 2012.  She will make just over $40k this year which includes a $1k special ed stipend.  

In her class she has 12 students with 2 aids to support her.  I could tell you some absolutely crazy stories about stuff that has happened in her class.  Most of it you wouldn't believe.  To spare time I will only share one though.  She has a student right now that is very violent.  He punches himself in the face multiple times a day.  Worse though, is that he charges after and hits the teachers in the room.  They have gotten good at avoiding this by now thankfully.  He will charge at my wife 5 or 6 times a day.  His mom drops him off at 7 and picks him up at 4.  He clearly can't roam the halls so my wife has to be there that whole time.  Awhile back he charged at my wife while she was helping another student, he hit her knocking her down into a desk face first.  He was restrained, cops called, escorted off campus and parents picked him up.  The next day he was back in her class like nothing happened because they couldn't punish him in any way for fear of lawsuits.  The bruising was so bad that someone pulled her aside later and asked if I was abusing her.

On top of dealing with all of that my wife has done so much to improve her student's lives.  She has paid out of pocket for them to be able to participate in special Olympics.  She coaches the special olympics on Saturdays.  She does a ton, all without complaining about anything.

They are many teachers just like her.  Anyone bashing teachers and my wife can go to fucking hell.  You are an ignorant fool.

[gsoda3 3236]

19 hours ago, bad_teammate said:

If gsoda is to be believed, and we actually do have a glut of good teachers available, the fact that we have any class with a higher than 15:1 student:teacher ratio is a moral crime.

student:teacher ratio isn't a good predictor of success/failure for kids.  the singapore and nordic systems regularly have ratios around 45:1.  the thought is good teachers will differentiate whether it's 6 kids or 50.  obviously there's a point at which they're overloaded, but our current class sizes of mid to low 20s is nowhere near that.  

 

the real problem is the inability to get rid of ineffective teachers, either by firing or improving their skill set.  teachers who can't differentiate material to a class of 23 usually aren't able to do so because they lack the skills to.  you can either fire them (a process that is arduous in Texas and most of the time doesn't happen) or build them up (the rise of instructional coaches in Texas public schools has been a tremendous boon to these teachers and schools).  having smaller class sizes is inefficient and doesn't solve the problem.  

[Larry T. Spider 1740]

1 minute ago, txhorns said:

My wife is a teacher.  She teaches a high school Functional Living Skills class.  That is the severe Special Ed class for thenyone wondering.  She started in 2012.  She will make just over $40k this year which includes a $1k special ed stipend.  

In her class she has 12 students with 2 aids to support her.  I could tell you some absolutely crazy stories about stuff that has happened in her class.  Most of it you wouldn't believe.  To spare time I will only share one though.  She has a student right now that is very violent.  He punches himself in the face multiple times a day.  Worse though, is that he charges after and hits the teachers in the room.  They have gotten good at avoiding this by now thankfully.  He will charge at my wife 5 or 6 times a day.  His mom drops him off at 7 and picks him up at 4.  He clearly can't roam the halls so my wife has to be there that whole time.  Awhile back he charged at my wife while she was helping another student, he hit her knocking her down into a desk face first.  He was restrained, cops called, escorted off campus and parents picked him up.  The next day he was back in her class like nothing happened because they couldn't punish him in any way for fear of lawsuits.  The bruising was so bad that someone pulled her aside later and asked if I was abusing her.

On top of dealing with all of that my wife has done so much to improve her student's lives.  She has paid out of pocket for them to be able to participate in special Olympics.  She coaches the special olympics on Saturdays.  She does a ton, all without complaining about anything.

They are many teachers just like her.  Anyone bashing teachers and my wife can go to fucking hell.  You are an ignorant fool.

Yeah but Rush said there are some lazy teachers that can’t be fired and government schools are indoctrination camps. 

[txhorns 2408]

1 minute ago, Larry T. Spider said:

Yeah but Rush said there are some lazy teachers that can’t be fired and government schools are indoctrination camps. 

Well he can burn in hell as Satan fucks him with his rusty pitchfork.

[Larry T. Spider 1740]

7 minutes ago, gsoda3 said:

student:teacher ratio isn't a good predictor of success/failure for kids.  the singapore and nordic systems regularly have ratios around 45:1.  the thought is good teachers will differentiate whether it's 6 kids or 50.  obviously there's a point at which they're overloaded, but our current class sizes of mid to low 20s is nowhere near that.  

 

the real problem is the inability to get rid of ineffective teachers, either by firing or improving their skill set.  teachers who can't differentiate material to a class of 23 usually aren't able to do so because they lack the skills to.  you can either fire them (a process that is arduous in Texas and most of the time doesn't happen) or build them up (the rise of instructional coaches in Texas public schools has been a tremendous boon to these teachers and schools).  having smaller class sizes is inefficient and doesn't solve the problem.  

Nordic and Asian school systems are so vastly different than ours, it’s hard to make comparisons. We take all comers and don’t have tracking systems where people are put on a non-degree earning path very early. We should (and are) increasing vocational tracks to some extent but that is a completely separate conversation.

Bad teachers in Texas can be fired. It can be a pain and it can cost the principal some political capital but it can be done. Most will resign rather than potentially having a non-renewal on their record. The main problem is the amount of BS administration has to deal with that doesn’t involve teacher quality. I agree on instructional coaches. My campus doesn’t have one and it would help teacher development, especially for the young ones. 

[kevwun 15647]

13 minutes ago, txhorns said:

My wife is a teacher.  She teaches a high school Functional Living Skills class.  That is the severe Special Ed class for thenyone wondering.  She started in 2012.  She will make just over $40k this year which includes a $1k special ed stipend.  

In her class she has 12 students with 2 aids to support her.  I could tell you some absolutely crazy stories about stuff that has happened in her class.  Most of it you wouldn't believe.  To spare time I will only share one though.  She has a student right now that is very violent.  He punches himself in the face multiple times a day.  Worse though, is that he charges after and hits the teachers in the room.  They have gotten good at avoiding this by now thankfully.  He will charge at my wife 5 or 6 times a day.  His mom drops him off at 7 and picks him up at 4.  He clearly can't roam the halls so my wife has to be there that whole time.  Awhile back he charged at my wife while she was helping another student, he hit her knocking her down into a desk face first.  He was restrained, cops called, escorted off campus and parents picked him up.  The next day he was back in her class like nothing happened because they couldn't punish him in any way for fear of lawsuits.  The bruising was so bad that someone pulled her aside later and asked if I was abusing her.

On top of dealing with all of that my wife has done so much to improve her student's lives.  She has paid out of pocket for them to be able to participate in special Olympics.  She coaches the special olympics on Saturdays.  She does a ton, all without complaining about anything.

They are many teachers just like her.  Anyone bashing teachers and my wife can go to fucking hell.  You are an ignorant fool.

A friend was telling me about a similar situation at the school where she teaches.  They have a special ed kid there who has made multiple threats against students and faculty.  He has tried to stab a teacher with a pair of scissors.  Luckily he's only 10 or 11 and the teacher was able to get them away from him before he hurt her.  Somehow the kid is still in school.

[atomheartbevo 89427]

2 hours ago, Winona's Big Orange Bevo said:

Yes, Austin sucks for teacher pay. Don't know why. I'm in NB and starting is at about 50k with the surrounding area being about equal. The one outlier is Schertz-Cibolo which is about 3K higher with a longer scale increase. 

Putting aside recapture, AISD benefits from a lot of married teachers (whose spouses’ salaries help them to afford to stay here) and UT grads who want to stay in the area   

If Austin were a less-desirable city, the retention rate for teachers would be much worse.  They’d head elsewhere if they wanted to teach.   

[bad_teammate 13132]

5 minutes ago, gsoda3 said:

student:teacher ratio isn't a good predictor of success/failure for kids. 

This is some BS administrations and politicians are trying to sell to taxpayers to justify pathetic educational investments. Even worse, this is garbage sold by places like the Brookings Institute to justify laying off teachers.

There is literally zero research that shows that larger class sizes are beneficial. A lot shows it is positive, some is mixed, and some show no impact.

Furthermore, school is about more than test scores.

Quote

the real problem is the inability to get rid of ineffective teachers, either by firing or improving their skill set.  teachers who can't differentiate material to a class of 23 usually aren't able to do so because they lack the skills to.

Again, this is garbage sold to admins, school districts, and politicians in order to justify not properly funding education.

[Larry T. Spider 1740]

44 minutes ago, kevwun said:

A friend was telling me about a similar situation at the school where she teaches.  They have a special ed kid there who has made multiple threats against students and faculty.  He has tried to stab a teacher with a pair of scissors.  Luckily he's only 10 or 11 and the teacher was able to get them away from him before he hurt her.  Somehow the kid is still in school.

Very hard to get special ed kids out. Tons of laws protecting them. Can only be away from services for a max of 10 days per year. Also, if their behavior was a result of their disability, they can’t be sent to an alternative school in most cases. If it’s a learning disability, it’s easy. If the kid has an emotionally disturbed label....good luck.

[kevwun 15647]

She was saying that there is a special ed coordinator in their district who dictates everything they do with the kid.  To her knowledge this person has never actually met or  talked to the child, even though he is a huge problem and someone that legitimately has the teachers there scared about what he'll do next.  It's not a huge district either.  It's a 4A (3A before the change) school in a small town.

Edited March 5, 2019 by kevwun

[Incredulity 11564]

I have lived in several states and these aren't questions meant to troll.  

 

Has anyone on this board ever lived in an area that didn't, according to teachers, have massive funding/teacher pay issues?  Anyone been teaching long enough to have perspective on a better time?

 

I haven't experienced it.

[Foosters 17731]

5 minutes ago, Larry T. Spider said:

Very hard to get special ed kids out. Tons of laws protecting them. Can only be away from services for a max of 10 days per year. Also, if their behavior was a result of their disability, they can’t be sent to an alternative school in most cases. If it’s a learning disability, it’s easy. If the kid has an emotionally disturbed label....good luck.

Not that this is the better way, but in my state, kids are arrested, detained, and criminally charged all the time for assaults on teachers in special ed classes. Shit, I represented a kid charged with Felony ADW for motioning towards his special ed teacher with a folded metal coat-hanger. 

[Larry T. Spider 1740]

That can happen for sure. I’m an elementary admin so it’s a little different. 

[Winona's Big Orange Bevo 197]

9 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

I have lived in several states and these aren't questions meant to troll.  

 

Has anyone on this board ever lived in an area that didn't, according to teachers, have massive funding/teacher pay issues?  Anyone been teaching long enough to have perspective on a better time?

 

I haven't experienced it.

Probably not as long as males began entering the profession in larger numbers. When it was mostly women they had husbands or people didn't care unfortunately. The thinking has to be that public education is the preparation of our children citizens into adult citizens. What kind of adult citizens do we want to have?  Unfortunately, public education is tied to politics and we get jerked around by the collar by politicians on every level who want to use us to their advantage. If were not getting demonized to make pols look good, we're being saddled with the latest "data driven teaching methods" in order to justify someone's job. 

  This isn't  like other jobs where if the product is defective we can just scrap it and start all over. Our "products" are on a time schedule and we have to battle every little negative influence in their lives in order to try to pack information into their heads (some needed, some not) so they can make a score on a standardized test in order to show that we are doing a good job. 

Every level is trying to show the next level above them everything is running smooth so that no-one triggers an avalanche of b.s. bureaucracy that makes their job even more chock full of b.s. bureaucracy. Now I'm not saying that teachers manipulate test scores cause that would be stupid and not worth it. But when your admins start loading you with paperwork on why you have a greater than 10% fail rate, what do you think most teachers fail rate is going to be? It's a lot of dog and pony show so everyone can say that everything is as it should be. 

We need academic graduation plans starting in middle school that are tracked to post secondary, ones that are general diploma geared toward a possibility of post-secondary and a vocational track. This everyone needs to go to college b.s. standard is crap. 

Sorry for the possibly incoherent rant. I just "babysat" 130  eleven to thirteen year olds all day trying to get them to write TELPAS essays after 4 days of benchmark testing. Mind is mush.

[gsoda3 3236]

1 hour ago, bad_teammate said:

This is some BS administrations and politicians are trying to sell to taxpayers to justify pathetic educational investments. Even worse, this is garbage sold by places like the Brookings Institute to justify laying off teachers.

There is literally zero research that shows that larger class sizes are beneficial. A lot shows it is positive, some is mixed, and some show no impact.

Furthermore, school is about more than test scores.

Again, this is garbage sold to admins, school districts, and politicians in order to justify not properly funding education.

i didn't say larger class sizes are beneficial, that's what you read.  

 

there are increasing #s of studies coming out showing a smaller class size has no correlation to student success.  you can google them.  here are the first three results.  

National Bureau of Economic Research

Harvard

Campbell Collaboration

[gsoda3 3236]

2 hours ago, Larry T. Spider said:

Nordic and Asian school systems are so vastly different than ours, it’s hard to make comparisons. We take all comers and don’t have tracking systems where people are put on a non-degree earning path very early. We should (and are) increasing vocational tracks to some extent but that is a completely separate conversation.

Bad teachers in Texas can be fired. It can be a pain and it can cost the principal some political capital but it can be done. Most will resign rather than potentially having a non-renewal on their record. The main problem is the amount of BS administration has to deal with that doesn’t involve teacher quality. I agree on instructional coaches. My campus doesn’t have one and it would help teacher development, especially for the young ones. 

i'm speaking from an elementary grade level POV.  the asian and danish systems at this point are similar in that they don't differentiate tracks until later.  you do have a point about our heterogeneous population, especially in austin.  it feels like you work in a middle or high school and that's your context?

 

i disagree with most bad teachers resigning.  maybe it's a function of the good old boys/girls system, but most bad teachers seem to find another position at another school, either through an internal district transfer through a friend or as a result of admin trying to get rid of them any way possible, or they find work at another school district over a newer higher because they have experience or they have a certification that a "better" teacher doesn't have (ESL being the most common).

[scottsins 1953]

2 hours ago, kevwun said:

A friend was telling me about a similar situation at the school where she teaches.  They have a special ed kid there who has made multiple threats against students and faculty.  He has tried to stab a teacher with a pair of scissors.  Luckily he's only 10 or 11 and the teacher was able to get them away from him before he hurt her.  Somehow the kid is still in school.

I have several cases involving this scenario.  CPS steps in, and the parents either agree to send the kid to a residential treatment facility, and if they do not cooperate, the State takes legal custody and places him/her there.

Additionally, the juvenile justice system seems like an option too.  Neither of these options is ideal, or desired, but they are miles better than having  a bunch of people get injured or worse by children with those issues.

I see mention of the school fearing lawsuits.  They should also be concerned about lawsuits filed on behalf of people injured by kids who were not appropriately dealt with in the first place.

[Larry T. Spider 1740]

3 minutes ago, gsoda3 said:

i'm speaking from an elementary grade level POV.  the asian and danish systems at this point are similar in that they don't differentiate tracks until later.  you do have a point about our heterogeneous population, especially in austin.  it feels like you work in a middle or high school and that's your context?

 

i disagree with most bad teachers resigning.  maybe it's a function of the good old boys/girls system, but most bad teachers seem to find another position at another school, either through an internal district transfer through a friend or as a result of admin trying to get rid of them any way possible, or they find work at another school district over a newer higher because they have experience or they have a certification that a "better" teacher doesn't have (ESL being the most common).

 I will just put it this way. I do not have any trouble getting rid of the bad teachers. Many of them may end up somewhere else because they resign and do not have their contract non-renewed. The main reason I can do this is because of my campus has very few serious behavior problems.  This gives me enough time to devote to the issue. 

Certification matters to a certain extent but every kid coming out of college now has an ESL certification. It is more of a job requirement than a bonus. The one certification that will get you a job faster than anything else is bilingual. If you are bilingual and special education certified schools will be begging for you.

[bad_teammate 13132]

Those linked studies actually confirm that smaller class sizes are either beneficial or have no negative impact. That's the point. They either help or don't hurt. Meanwhile, there is nothing helpful about increasing class sizes. The best you can hope for out of larger class sizes is no harm done.

The question of teacher quality is irrelevant to a discussion of class sizes. It's pathetic excuse-making.

[Larry T. Spider 1740]

4 minutes ago, scottsins said:

I have several cases involving this scenario.  CPS steps in, and the parents either agree to send the kid to a residential treatment facility, and if they do not cooperate, the State takes legal custody and places him/her there.

Additionally, the juvenile justice system seems like an option too.  Neither of these options is ideal, or desired, but they are miles better than having  a bunch of people get injured or worse by children with those issues.

I see mention of the school fearing lawsuits.  They should also be concerned about lawsuits filed on behalf of people injured by kids who were not appropriately dealt with in the first place.

 The problem isn’t the will to have these special ed kids go to a more appropriate setting. Administrators want that  as we are usually the one cleaning up the mess. The problem is the parents fighting it, taking it to a manifestation determination hearing, and the kid getting sent back to us after hours of work on the deal. 

[kevwun 15647]

I think the State stepping in is what will happen at my friend's school.  The teacher who he tried to stab is apparently thinking about pressing charges to force the issue since the school isn't doing anything about it.

[Incredulity 11564]

1 hour ago, Winona's Big Orange Bevo said:

Probably not as long as males began entering the profession in larger numbers. When it was mostly women they had husbands or people didn't care unfortunately. The thinking has to be that public education is the preparation of our children citizens into adult citizens. What kind of adult citizens do we want to have?  Unfortunately, public education is tied to politics and we get jerked around by the collar by politicians on every level who want to use us to their advantage. If were not getting demonized to make pols look good, we're being saddled with the latest "data driven teaching methods" in order to justify someone's job. 

  This isn't  like other jobs where if the product is defective we can just scrap it and start all over. Our "products" are on a time schedule and we have to battle every little negative influence in their lives in order to try to pack information into their heads (some needed, some not) so they can make a score on a standardized test in order to show that we are doing a good job. 

Every level is trying to show the next level above them everything is running smooth so that no-one triggers an avalanche of b.s. bureaucracy that makes their job even more chock full of b.s. bureaucracy. Now I'm not saying that teachers manipulate test scores cause that would be stupid and not worth it. But when your admins start loading you with paperwork on why you have a greater than 10% fail rate, what do you think most teachers fail rate is going to be? It's a lot of dog and pony show so everyone can say that everything is as it should be. 

We need academic graduation plans starting in middle school that are tracked to post secondary, ones that are general diploma geared toward a possibility of post-secondary and a vocational track. This everyone needs to go to college b.s. standard is crap. 

Sorry for the possibly incoherent rant. I just "babysat" 130  eleven to thirteen year olds all day trying to get them to write TELPAS essays after 4 days of benchmark testing. Mind is mush.

Thanks for the response.  I think there are alot of great tidbits in this post.  Really interesting thought about males in the teaching profession.

I certainly believe “teaching to the test” is real and completely predictable based on the pressures to produce results on said specific test.

[Larry T. Spider 1740]

18 minutes ago, kevwun said:

I think the State stepping in is what will happen at my friend's school.  The teacher who he tried to stab is apparently thinking about pressing charges to force the issue since the school isn't doing anything about it.

 Depending on the situation, the school may not be able to do anything about it. I think it is insanity but the laws are written in a way that will always favor the special education student over the teacher. I would much rather be able to handle the situation as an administrator rather than get the police involved to get a kid to the right environment. 

https://www.parentcenterhub.org/manifestation/

[gsoda3 3236]

3 hours ago, bad_teammate said:

The question of teacher quality is irrelevant to a discussion of class sizes. It's pathetic excuse-making.

No you're completely missing the boat.  Good teachers will be effective with a class size of 25 or 45.  Bad teachers won't.  

[Larry T. Spider 1740]

I will agree that teacher quality matters more than class size. My best teacher would be better with 30 than my worst with half of that. However, we aren’t typically talking about either end of the spectrum. Your average teacher is going to do better with fewer students, especially at the elementary level. They are going to be able to pull more small groups for more individualized instruction, deal with fewer behaviors, and maybe just keep their sanity a little longer. 

We need to take a long look at job quality for teachers and what we are asking of them. The pay sucks and we lose a lot due to that. However, quality of life is listed more often as a reason for leaving. We lose 50% of our teachers in their first 5 years of service. I know people want to act like it’s a sweet gig and you get 5 months off a year and just babysit for the other 7. So why is the retention rate so low for this dream job?

[Nolacycling 893]

Glassdoor

The typical Austin ISD Teacher salary is$46,000. Teacher salaries at Austin ISD can range from $38,000 - $54,000. 

 

[Larry T. Spider 1740]

https://www.austinisd.org/sites/default/files/dept/hr/docs/2018-19 Teacher-Librarian Salary Schedule.pdf

Here is the salary schedule. Year 16 is pretty sweet, you can finally crack 50k!

[Nolacycling 893]

Klein

Employees in this category with a doctorate will receive an incentive of $2,000 
(Masters - $1,000 + Doctorate - $1,000 = $2,000 Total)
Minimum Control Point Maximum
$52,600 $54,000 $67,000 +

How many years would it take to pay off your graduate degree?

Cue "having an advanced degree does not mean you'd be a better teacher"[

 

[Nolacycling 893]

El Paso

$48,300.00

[bad_teammate 13132]

36 minutes ago, gsoda3 said:

No you're completely missing the boat.  Good teachers will be effective with a class size of 25 or 45.  Bad teachers won't.  

In order to offset the disadvantage of too-large classrooms, 100% of classrooms would have to have "good teachers". It is magical thinking.

And what even makes a "good teacher"? Someone who excels at getting high test scores while being underfunded, undersupported, and overworked? How would higher pay, better resources, smaller classes, and more down time/collaborative time impact the quality of teachers?

Look at the elite private schools and the standards they demand. Why do they want 15 kids in a classroom? Why do they reject standardized testing? Is it because those wealthy, highly-educated parents are too dumb to realize that huge classes are actually great?

[Larry T. Spider 1740]

https://www.mansfieldisd.org/uploaded/main/departments/HR/assets/SalarySchedule_Teachers1819.pdf

You have to teach 23 years in Austin isd before getting to a starting teacher salary in Mansfield. This is why I’m saying that fixing the school finance system is more important than the raise. The 5k raise should happen but not as a coverup for the major issues out there that need to be addressed. AISD is paying around 600 million into recapture this year. That is projected to grow to 700 million in the near future. Those teachers with that 5k raise might need electricity and running water to do their jobs...

[Incredulity 11564]

25 minutes ago, Nolacycling said:

Glassdoor

The typical Austin ISD Teacher salary is$46,000. Teacher salaries at Austin ISD can range from $38,000 - $54,000. 

 

The bottom line: The TEA says Texas spent $9,150 per student for the 2016 fiscal year — a slight increase from the year prior when Texas spent $8,937 per student. The NEA says Texas spent $10,456 per student for the 2017-18 school year — a number $2,300 below the national average.

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.texastribune.org/2018/05/15/texas-student-teacher-spending-average/amp/

 

so what happens to the other 250k per classroom?

[Larry T. Spider 1740]

From AISD on recapture:

AISD is considered a property-rich school district. In FY2018, approximately 55 percent of AISD revenue generated beyond the protected “golden pennies” (the first 6 cents per dollar that is generated above a district’s compressed tax rate) will be sent to the state for redistribution to property-poor school districts. It is estimated that nearly 51 percent of all local revenue collected from property taxes will be subject to recapture in FY2019.

In FY2019, AISD anticipates the district will submit $669.6 million to the state in recapture funds. This amount is expected to increase by $115 million in FY2020, as a result of a projected increase in the district’s taxable property value and tax collection and the recalculation of the state funding formulas. From FY2002 to FY2019, AISD will have paid the state of Texas more than $3.7 billion in recapture payments.

[Larry T. Spider 1740]

1 minute ago, Incredulity said:

The bottom line: The TEA says Texas spent $9,150 per student for the 2016 fiscal year — a slight increase from the year prior when Texas spent $8,937 per student. The NEA says Texas spent $10,456 per student for the 2017-18 school year — a number $2,300 below the national average.

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.texastribune.org/2018/05/15/texas-student-teacher-spending-average/amp/

 

so what happens to the other 250k per classroom?

For an elementary campus, we have to pay for the following beyond the home room teacher:

Buildings, electricity, water, books, other educational materials, busses, maintenance employees, campus administrators, district administration, custodians, teachers assistants, music teacher, art teacher, pe teacher, special education employees, counselor, diagnostician, etc.

[Nolacycling 893]

Insurance and lawyers. 

[Larry T. Spider 1740]

Front office staff, speech teacher, intervention teacher, reading specialists, instructional coach, we could go on and on. 

[ruitxn 295]

1 hour ago, gsoda3 said:

No you're completely missing the boat.  Good teachers will be effective with a class size of 25 or 45.  Bad teachers won't.  

Agree, good teachers will do their best to teach the students they have.  Let me ask you.  Do you think good teachers would rather teach a class of 25 or  45?  Do you think it takes the same amount of time, the same mental and physical planning and remediation for 25 students  as it does for 45?  If you have ever had the responsibility of teaching school age children all day long, surely you realize 25 students is a daunting task.  Excellent teachers should be respected by having class sizes that are productive and manageable.  I certainly agree with current expectations of near 25 students in a classroom.  

It is not just about teachers though.  As a parent,  I want my kids in as small a classroom as possible.  Put my kids with a quality teacher and 24 students, go ahead and put your kids with the same teacher and 44.  Suits me!!

Edited March 6, 2019 by ruitxn

[Incredulity 11564]

21 minutes ago, Larry T. Spider said:

For an elementary campus, we have to pay for the following beyond the home room teacher:

Buildings, electricity, water, books, other educational materials, busses, maintenance employees, campus administrators, district administration, custodians, teachers assistants, music teacher, art teacher, pe teacher, special education employees, counselor, diagnostician, etc.

Anyone know of any examples of a school granular “financial statement” that represents these costs vs per student spending?

[DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt 12301]

On 3/4/2019 at 5:55 PM, Continental Op said:

 

 

Just because you fuck kids or wish you could doesn't mean everyone else does.

 

That’s exactly what’s going on there. Dude watches kiddie porn. Fact.

[Cacti 191]

This site compares—by state—teacher salaries, public school expenditures, math and science achievement, and much more. Some of the most interesting stats: Texas ranks in the 2nd quartile for 4th and 8th grade math and science performance. Not bad when one considers Texas ranks in the 4th quartile for expenditures per pupil and in the 3rd quartile for teacher salaries.

[Winona's Big Orange Bevo 197]

11 hours ago, ruitxn said:

Agree, good teachers will do their best to teach the students they have.  Let me ask you.  Do you think good teachers would rather teach a class of 25 or  45?  Do you think it takes the same amount of time, the same mental and physical planning and remediation for 25 students  as it does for 45?  If you have ever had the responsibility of teaching school age children all day long, surely you realize 25 students is a daunting task.  Excellent teachers should be respected by having class sizes that are productive and manageable.  I certainly agree with current expectations of near 25 students in a classroom.  

It is not just about teachers though.  As a parent,  I want my kids in as small a classroom as possible.  Put my kids with a quality teacher and 24 students, go ahead and put your kids with the same teacher and 44.  Suits me!!

Yes. I compare the academic year to a slow moving train. You can jump off for a little while and catch back up but anymore than a few days and your screwed whether your a student or teacher. The train has to keep moving because you have to be at a certain point at the end of the year. So imagine a class of 25 kids that are mixed with high achievers, special ed, English as a second language and your average students. Mix in some behavior issues.  Now try delivering material to those students in 50 minutes of class time that is supposed to meet the individual learning needs of each student. Small classrooms please. 

Education is modeled on perfect world scenarios and too often don't want to acknowledge real world problems cause its too expensive or someone might get mad or offended. 

[Incredulity 11564]

Quote

Education is modeled on perfect world scenarios and too often don't want to acknowledge real world problems cause its too expensive or someone might get mad or offended. 

QFT.

Single track educational philosophy sucks, particularly compounded by our delicate snowflake culture.  We end up with  alot of the lowest common denominator. 

 

Anecdotally, I certainly had 50 minute classes that felt like 10 min.  Never enough time......so much interesting material.   Then I had classes that 50 min of time was a soul crushing ad-nauseum snooze fest that had so much wasted time.