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Leaving Neverland (HBO Michael Jackson Documentary)

Neonmoon

By Neonmoon
in Movies and TV

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Wally Pryor

Wally Pryor 5,198

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Neonmoon said:

This might end people playing his music 

Well, the cat's been out of the bag for a while now that the dude was a vile predator of the lowest form.   Weird that in today's society where sneezing in the wrong direction can get you blacklisted, yet Jackson's basically continued to get a hall pass even though he's about as bad as it gets.

Wake me up if / when this documentary changes anything.  

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Aqua Buddha

Aqua Buddha 13,905

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Wally Pryor said:

Well, the cat's been out of the bag for a while now that the dude was a vile predator of the lowest form.   Weird that in today's society where sneezing in the wrong direction can get you blacklisted, yet Jackson's basically continued to get a hall pass even though he's about as bad as it gets.

Wake me up if / when this documentary changes anything.  

R Kelly says hi.

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Aqua Buddha

Aqua Buddha 13,905

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Posted
2 minutes ago, GhostOfTomJoad said:

He was a master manipulator & a monster. Was able to sell the kids' parents & family on the dream world he lived in. And they gave their sons to him in order to chase that fantasy.

I feel nauseated.

He wasn't that much of a master.  He just paid them all off.

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GhostOfTomJoad

GhostOfTomJoad 9,096

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8 hours ago, Aqua Buddha said:

He wasn't that much of a master.  He just paid them all off.

He spent the better part of a decade playing "make believe" with little boys all over the world. The media celebrated him as a real life Peter Pan, praising his love for children & their innocence, accepting the little children around him as the muse that helped him create his music. Whenever anyone questioned even remotely the improper nature of these relationships, Joe Jackson was brought up & the story of Michael not being allowed to have a childhood due to performing at such a young age. The world bought into the romantic figure of being a talented bazillionaire who was truly just a kid at heart.

Michael Jackson Inc made hundreds of millions of dollars. Adults throughout the organization looked the other way. Parents offered up their kids like toys to him. How did it ever get to that level?

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GhostOfTomJoad

GhostOfTomJoad 9,096

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Posted
Should have given Dr. Conrad Murray a commendation instead of a jail sentence. 

I for one won't be surprised if it's ever revealed that members of Jackson's family were assisting Murray with MJ's addiction. They all knew how leveraged he was & his finances were almost in ruins. Dying was a great boon for Michael Jackson Inc. Someone made a lot of $.

 

Edit. Had to look it up. Jackson was a half billion in debt when he died. Seven years later the estate was sitting on $500 mil cash, a $1 billion turnaround.

 

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CurlyDumps

CurlyDumps 4,408

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Wow.  What difficult watch.

The similarities to the Sandusky story are spine-chillingly similar.

Guy who was described as “goofy,” “playful,” “kid at heart” who just loved being around kids, playing, doing kid things.

 Sandsusky founded his charity for the exact same reason Michael built Neverland - to give him an excuse to be around kids and find/groom victims. 

Sandusky took his victims on special trips (bowl games) to isolate them from parents and get them into beds with him.  

Nobody questioned Sandusky being around kids all the time - in this cas it was just a part of his honest-to-goodness charity work. 

In studying these cases, you  start to see how these predators operate. As hard as these stories are to stomach, it’s good to be informed so adults and people in authority positions can spot these red flags and stop these predators before they damage and destroy countless more victims.

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Deej

Deej 76,081

Posted
Posted
15 minutes ago, GhostOfTomJoad said:

I for one won't be surprised if it's ever revealed that members of Jackson's family were assisting Murray with MJ's addiction. They all knew how leveraged he was & his finances were almost in ruins. Dying was a great boon for Michael Jackson Inc. Someone made a lot of $.

 

Edit. Had to look it up. Jackson was a half billion in debt when he died. Seven years later the estate was sitting on $500 mil cash, a $1 billion turnaround.

 

There were some claiming he was murdered for that very reason.

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PittsburghTiger

PittsburghTiger 6,049

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, GhostOfTomJoad said:

He spent the better part of a decade playing "make believe" with little boys all over the world. The media celebrated him as a real life Peter Pan, praising his love for children & their innocence, accepting the little children around him as the muse that helped him create his music. Whenever anyone questioned even remotely the improper nature of these relationships, Joe Jackson was brought up & the story of Michael not being allowed to have a childhood due to performing at such a young age. The world bought into the romantic figure of being a talented bazillionaire who was truly just a kid at heart.

Michael Jackson Inc made hundreds of millions of dollars. Adults throughout the organization looked the other way. Parents offered up their kids like toys to him. How did it ever get to that level?

I'm not going to watch the shows. But today at the gym, while I was warming up on the treadmill, that Wendy gal who has a morning TV talk show used that as her reasoning for not believing any of the show that ran.

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Deej

Deej 76,081

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Posted
19 minutes ago, cabowabo said:

I wonder how much Macaulay Culkin and that other dude were paid by Jackson or his estate to keep quiet.  This dude stuck his tongue in the asshole of a 7 year old boy.  Let that sink in for a second or two.  

He settled over that one kid for $23 million. 

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GhostOfTomJoad

GhostOfTomJoad 9,096

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He settled over that one kid for $23 million. 
That was Jordan Chandler. He's referring to Brett Barnes, another young boy who was a companion of Jackson. Barnes and Culkin claim they were never molested.

Either Robson or Safechuck said last night that they were replaced by Culkin and/or Barnes.

The Sandusky comparison is spot on. Especially them befriending kids of little to no means. Makes it easier for the boys & parents to go along. Not only are the kids getting shit they could never have, but the parents were flown around the world first class, put up in suites, outfitted, bought fax machines so he could send them drunken love notes all day, etc. And nobody but the grandmother and older brother of the aussie seemed to catch on.

What did Robson say? How he went from almost having to beg to be able to get one toy at the store with his parents to Michael telling him to take EVERYTHING.
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CurlyDumps

CurlyDumps 4,408

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1 hour ago, GhostOfTomJoad said:

The Sandusky comparison is spot on. Especially them befriending kids of little to no means. Makes it easier for the boys & parents to go along. Not only are the kids getting shit they could never have, but the parents were flown around the world first class, put up in suites, outfitted, bought fax machines so he could send them drunken love notes all day, etc. And nobody but the grandmother and older brother of the aussie seemed to catch on.
 

Yup.  And this is why I doubt Mikey ever tried to seduce Macaulay Culkin.  Way too risky. His parents couldn’t be wooed or manipulated with money and access like these other kids from middle-class backgrounds.

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Junior Miller

Junior Miller 1,502

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57 minutes ago, pepper brooks said:

this is just sad, disturbing and sick.  I cannot even imagine letting me kid hang out with a grown man like that.  just crazy the parents were ok with this, and didn't think it was odd.  

It was a simpler time before the internet when the world didn't know everyone was always full of shit. Well, approx 30 percent still don't know but the rest found out and now everyone is super suspicious of everything. 

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JimmyHoffa

JimmyHoffa 1,188

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2 hours ago, longhornmatt said:

I think the public just decided they liked his music too much to give it up even knowing he’s a child rapist.  I think most people have believed the allegations going back to around the mid-90s.

 

 

Penn State liked their football too much........

Hollywood loved Harvey's movies too much..........

USA gymnastics loved their gold medals too much.........

Water is wet. Adults with otherwise good and sound judgement just close their eyes to the truth in front of them because it's easier to look the other way than do what is right. Sad but true. 

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Dilligas

Dilligas 647

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Posted

I want to believe he was a sick bastard but my cynical self says these are money grubbing fucks making up stories. It would be so easy considering Jackson’s actions. Show me those videos in the closet within the closet.

Guess I have no faith in humanity anymore. If these parents let their kids stay with a grown man would they balk at lying to make millions?

Havent watched more than 30 minutes so I may be proven an idiot, but that won’t be the first time. I always thought he was that way so I’m not sure why I’m questioning it now.

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GhostOfTomJoad

GhostOfTomJoad 9,096

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Pretty clear that both of the mothers were all but complicit in the abuse their sons were subjected to. Neither of the victims came to terms with what had happened to them until they became fathers. 

Ms. Safechuck admitting that Jackson gave them money, cars & a loan for a big, beautiful home--a loan which was forgiven once their son testified in Jackson's defense--and brushing these acts of generosity off as coincidence had me raging. At the end of the doc she admits that her son is fucked up (her words) because she didn't protect him. But never once did I sense either she or Ms. Robson would do anything differently.

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aggie08

aggie08 20,213

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Posted
12 hours ago, Dilligas said:

I want to believe he was a sick bastard but my cynical self says these are money grubbing fucks making up stories. It would be so easy considering Jackson’s actions. Show me those videos in the closet within the closet.

Guess I have no faith in humanity anymore. If these parents let their kids stay with a grown man would they balk at lying to make millions?

Havent watched more than 30 minutes so I may be proven an idiot, but that won’t be the first time. I always thought he was that way so I’m not sure why I’m questioning it now.

It's too bad that two of the dads committed suicide for seemingly no reason before they could cash in.

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Deej

Deej 76,081

Posted
Posted
12 hours ago, Dilligas said:

I want to believe he was a sick bastard but my cynical self says these are money grubbing fucks making up stories. It would be so easy considering Jackson’s actions. Show me those videos in the closet within the closet.

Guess I have no faith in humanity anymore. If these parents let their kids stay with a grown man would they balk at lying to make millions?

Havent watched more than 30 minutes so I may be proven an idiot, but that won’t be the first time. I always thought he was that way so I’m not sure why I’m questioning it now.

I guess we should let Sandusky out, since we have no video...Baylor should be completely exonerated, since we have no video...

I haven't seen any videos of Larry Nassar sexually abusing any gymnasts, either. Let him go, I guess. 

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CurlyDumps

CurlyDumps 4,408

Posted
Posted (edited)
12 hours ago, Dilligas said:

I want to believe he was a sick bastard but my cynical self says these are money grubbing fucks making up stories. It would be so easy considering Jackson’s actions. Show me those videos in the closet within the closet.

Guess I have no faith in humanity anymore. If these parents let their kids stay with a grown man would they balk at lying to make millions?

Havent watched more than 30 minutes so I may be proven an idiot, but that won’t be the first time. I always thought he was that way so I’m not sure why I’m questioning it now.

Way too many coincidences.  Multiple victims. Corroborating stories that not only fit patterns of sexual abuse to a T, but include intimate details about Jackson's sexual proclivities and fetishes. (You really think these guys got together and conspired to say that Jackson liked nipple play?) And above all else, Jackson's behavior which has all the red flags of a child sexual predator.  The evidence is overwhelming.

Take a look at these recent cases -  Sandusky, Nassar, R. Kelly, Jackson - and the eerily similar patterns of behavior will leap out at you.

Edited by CurlyDumps
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Gene Parmesan

Gene Parmesan 3,951

Posted
Posted
12 hours ago, Dilligas said:

I want to believe he was a sick bastard but my cynical self says these are money grubbing fucks making up stories. It would be so easy considering Jackson’s actions. Show me those videos in the closet within the closet.

Guess I have no faith in humanity anymore. If these parents let their kids stay with a grown man would they balk at lying to make millions?

Havent watched more than 30 minutes so I may be proven an idiot, but that won’t be the first time. I always thought he was that way so I’m not sure why I’m questioning it now.

I think that's actually retardation not cynicism. 

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A-Tex Devil

A-Tex Devil 2,406

Posted
Posted (edited)
17 hours ago, JimmyHoffa said:

 

Penn State liked their football too much........

Hollywood loved Harvey's movies too much..........

USA gymnastics loved their gold medals too much.........

Water is wet. Adults with otherwise good and sound judgement just close their eyes to the truth in front of them because it's easier to look the other way than do what is right. Sad but true. 

In 6th grade in the 80s our intermediate school (5th and 6th grade) got a new Vice Principal.  He was awesome engaging and we all thought he was pretty cool. He’d show off his cool new Mac, etc.  (this is 1986ish).  

He became assistant coach of our little league team that spring.  At least two or three kids on that team would crash at his place from time to time (always multiple kids, as I recall, so I guess that’s why the adults never said anything).  My parents never let me and I remember not understanding why.  He was also a hunting and fishing good ole boy Vietnam vet (as I recall, may have been BS) so the coaches and dads on the baseball team liked him.   

Three or four years later when I am in high school he gets busted for Sandusky stuff   One of the kids on that team turned him in, which probably aligned with the time he aged out of that the guy’s victim profile.   I recall how he’d drive that kid to school in the mornings quite often and there were a couple of kids not on the baseball team that supposedly used to hang out at his house.  

Parents see an adult of authority/fame taking an interest in their kids and they seem to lose all fucking common sense is my take.   As a parent (and a sane adult, I guess), it is clear that it is never normal when an adult without same age kids wants to spend unsupervised time with a kid away from his parents.    He can do everything else perfectly, but when the question: “Can your son come on this trip with me?  It will be a great learning experience,” fucking say “No” then ask some hard questions of your kid.  

 

 

Edited by A-Tex Devil
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WBT

WBT 20,132

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Posted
21 hours ago, longhornmatt said:

I think the public just decided they liked his music too much to give it up even knowing he’s a child rapist.  I think most people have believed the allegations going back to around the mid-90s.

This was in the same era as OJ, and I guess for whatever reason America was ok with celebrities being above the law for even the most heinous crimes back then.  I don’t think there was even a political or racial angle with Michael Jackson like there was with OJ,  as Michael was already making himself look like a freakish white person at that point and wasn’t exactly the king of the black music scene or culture anymore.  Nor were there any racist cop stories.  

Superfans just went into denial, but it was like the rest of the public agreed it was true and decided they’d rather make jokes about child molestation but didn’t want anything real to happen that might make them feel bad about listening to Thriller.

 

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