Mass College Admission Cheating Scandal

[woohorn 1131]

So Einstein, gonna be more or less than a month?

[Armybrat 40914]

9 hours ago, woohorn said:

So Perry Mason, gonna be more or less than a month?

Fify

[Nice Guy Eddie 13523]

I don’t see how putting felicity huffman away for too long will serve the public. I do think some jail time is warranted as she used her money to cheat the education system. She has the means to buy her kid as many tutors as needed. If your kid still cant get the job done, then a top school isn’t for her.

and just fining Huffman isn’t enough.  However it would be interesting to know how much a Hollywood star would pay to avoid 30 days in jail. My guess is that she would go up to a million $ to avoid a month.  

[Armybrat 40914]

A few weeks in a county jail plus a hefty fine.... with said fine (after court costs) going to several full ride scholarships for deserving kids.

[BabaYaga 15320]

On 8/2/2019 at 1:16 PM, crash_davis said:

hold that investment for about 20-30 years.  after that time, it starts going negative on returns.

 

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Inverse POON-CURVE

 

[BabaYaga 15320]

Good job mom - way to make your kid a pariah.  No matter what school the kid does wind up going to they are going this is going to hang over their head indefinitely.  Your job as parent isn't to grease the skids.  Your job isn't to nerf the world for them.  Your job is to prepare them.  To not raise someone helpless.  To teach them how to handle adversity and facilitate the message that the world isn't fair and you are not "owed" a damn thing.  They're just engendering a new generation of entitled assholes.  

[Catpfish 618]

You knew it was coming.  Lifetime network to debut a movie based on the scandal next month.

[phdhorn 6224]

1 minute ago, Catpfish said:

You knew it was coming.  Lifetime network to debut a movie based on the scandal next month.

Should be ok, but personally I'm holding out for the El Diablo Videos of San Joaquin, California version.

[Newdoc 3453]

11 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

It's kind of appalling,

Ummm, it’s “uphauling”

[Machinator 32099]

 

[Guest Lobo]

Literally the first school out of the gate with a sweeping, commanding, and total investigation that involved terminations, consequences, proactive measures, and transparency.  And a national championship to boot.  Fenves delivers leadership as usual! 

Having said that, when does Aunt Becky hit the showers?  

Edited September 9, 2019 by Lobo

[AUS-97HORN 11823]

in regards to the Fenves tweet,  wasnt there supposed to be a 2nd Tennis student admitted because of the bribe?  i thought the whole point of us getting caught up in this investigation was because Center agreed to accept another Tennis kid in 2018????

 

edit, obviously im aware of the first kid from 2015 referenced in the Fenves tweet, but I thought Center was recorded about "doing the same thing" with whoever was accepted in 2018 because thats when this investigation actually started

Edited September 9, 2019 by AUS-97HORN

[SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861]

8 minutes ago, Lobo said:

Literally the first school out of the gate with a sweeping, commanding, and total investigation that involved terminations, consequences, proactive measures, and transparency.  And a national championship to boot.  Fenves delivers leadership as usual! 

Having said that, when does Aunt Becky hit the showers?  

i like it, but i feel like i remember stanford telling everyone involved to literally fuck their own faces the second the scandal hit the presses.  they were very on top of things too.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13523]

51 minutes ago, AUS-97HORN said:

in regards to the Fenves tweet,  wasnt there supposed to be a 2nd Tennis student admitted because of the bribe?  i thought the whole point of us getting caught up in this investigation was because Center agreed to accept another Tennis kid in 2018????

 

edit, obviously im aware of the first kid from 2015 referenced in the Fenves tweet, but I thought Center was recorded about "doing the same thing" with whoever was accepted in 2018 because thats when this investigation actually started

this is the statement from Fenves: we can report that no other student-athletes were found to have been improperly admitted to UT beyond the facts identified in the legal filings against Mr. Center

did the legal filings only discuss one or multiple student-athletes? Fenves didn't state the number of student-athletes admitted and didn't imply it was only one.

[Tailgate 3024]

2 hours ago, AUS-97HORN said:

in regards to the Fenves tweet,  wasnt there supposed to be a 2nd Tennis student admitted because of the bribe?  i thought the whole point of us getting caught up in this investigation was because Center agreed to accept another Tennis kid in 2018????

 

edit, obviously im aware of the first kid from 2015 referenced in the Fenves tweet, but I thought Center was recorded about "doing the same thing" with whoever was accepted in 2018 because thats when this investigation actually started

I thought the same...it’s been so damn long. Still think about how f*ed up that FBI raid at 5am with the family home was. Dude made the mistake of a lifetime.

[Not a cat 5704]

20 minutes ago, Tailgate said:

I thought the same...it’s been so damn long. Still think about how f*ed up that FBI raid at 5am with the family home was. Dude made the mistake of a lifetime.

What's the rationale for a predawn home raid for a tennis coach accused of a white collar crime (other than some feds wanting to play SWAT and be billy badass)?  Surprising someone at their house while they are asleep and their family is home seems to actually increase the odds of someone getting shot.  Just walk up and arrest him at work or as soon as he leaves the house.

[Guest Lobo]

Because he was also suspected of Racket-eering?  I'll see myself out...

[Steel Shank 9432]

Women behind bars, you say?

Wheelhouse, I say.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

Just now, Steel Shank said:

Women behind bars, you say?

Wheelhouse, I say.

with a full size spare.

[BabaYaga 15320]

14 minutes ago, Lobo said:

Because he was also suspected of Racket-eering?  I'll see myself out...

[Grade of D as in David 13253]

18 minutes ago, Lobo said:

Because he was also suspected of Racket-eering?  I'll see myself out...

Heard he could be serving 15 to 30.

 

 

[Guest Lobo]

At least he's not getting any Luv in the center court.  Well, maybe afterwards in the shower.  Again, all about how the balls bounce.  Or don't bounce.  What's that middle strip in tennis called?  The taint?  

[TexasEd 8077]

"Felicity Huffman serve a month in jail for her roll "  Kolache talk continues?

[Deej 76926]

On 8/3/2019 at 9:05 AM, Armybrat said:

But she’s not Asian, she’s Czech.

 

So, she's your Czech mate?

[Armybrat 40914]

And Queen.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

If anyone ever needed a pair of red hot knitting needles up their asshole it's that guy ^^ And fuck you for making me laugh.

[Deej 76926]

Sorry.

[TwiceHorn 31537]

21 hours ago, woohorn said:

So Einstein, gonna be more or less than a month?

Dunno, I aint the judge.  I think "sending a message" is overplayed and kind of stupid.  We have all these draconian prison sentences that send no message.  It is true that it would be unfortunate for a rich whitey to get a minor sentence, AGAIN, but the problem isn't solved by throwing the book at the rich whitey.  It's solved by taking a shitload of pages out of the book and gluing it to the desk so it can't be thrown at anyone.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

5 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Dunno, I aint the judge.  I think "sending a message" is overplayed and kind of stupid.  We have all these draconian prison sentences that send no message.  It is true that it would be unfortunate for a rich whitey to get a minor sentence, AGAIN, but the problem isn't solved by throwing the book at the rich whitey.  It's solved by taking a shitload of pages out of the book and gluing it to the desk so it can't be thrown at anyone.

It might be overplayed, but gott damn it's some good fucking schadenfreude.

[TwiceHorn 31537]

The most substantive article on it yet.  https://sentencing.typepad.com/sentencing_law_and_policy/2019/09/feds-recommending-incarceration-terms-from-1-to-15-months-for-parents-involved-college-bribery-scand.html

Recommended terms of 1 to 15 months, with amounts in controversy of $15k to $300k.  

Also, all you needed to know. https://www.justice.gov/usao-ma/investigations-college-admissions-and-testing-bribery-scheme

[Murfdogg21 4428]

So did the kid from 2015 (if he already graduated) have his degree pulled by UT?

[hayden_horn 11365]

19 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Dunno, I aint the judge.  I think "sending a message" is overplayed and kind of stupid.  We have all these draconian prison sentences that send no message.  It is true that it would be unfortunate for a rich whitey to get a minor sentence, AGAIN, but the problem isn't solved by throwing the book at the rich whitey.  It's solved by taking a shitload of pages out of the book and gluing it to the desk so it can't be thrown at anyone.

agreed. jail time just for the sake of jail time is fucking stupid. 

we should only really lock up dangerous people, imo. that includes a danger to your property as well, again, just my opinion. this crime was stupid, and petty, but these ladies are not a danger to fucking society necessitating removing them and putting them in prison.

[tx 3 putt 77432]

1 hour ago, Murfdogg21 said:

So did the kid from 2015 (if he already graduated) have his degree pulled by UT?

What’s his surely Id ?

[TwiceHorn 31537]

19 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

agreed. jail time just for the sake of jail time is fucking stupid. 

we should only really lock up dangerous people, imo. that includes a danger to your property as well, again, just my opinion. this crime was stupid, and petty, but these ladies are not a danger to fucking society necessitating removing them and putting them in prison.

I have done a bit of prison ministry and 12-step work.  It serves something of a purpose in that many who get prison sentences swear they will do anything to avoid going back.  And while some of that may be "foxhole prayers," most of it is pretty sincere.  While for others, prison life isn't markedly worse than life outside and in some cases, not only that, but they're "institutionalized."  You hear both of these from addicts whose crimes were drug-fueled, but where they fall on the spectrum mostly depends on their economic circumstances before prison (and what their prospects might be afterward, e.g. family support).

It is my sense, however, that six months would do, when 6 or 60 years is the sentence.

[Johnny Sack 8397]

21 hours ago, hayden_horn said:

agreed. jail time just for the sake of jail time is fucking stupid. 

we should only really lock up dangerous people, imo. that includes a danger to your property as well, again, just my opinion. this crime was stupid, and petty, but these ladies are not a danger to fucking society necessitating removing them and putting them in prison.

I agree with this.  I'd rather non-dangerous criminals be forced to make restitution 2x or 3x to the financial issues they caused.  And for drugs to be completely decriminalized.  That is such a waste of resources and counter productive.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13523]

Disagree that white collar criminals shouldn't face jail time. Jail isn't only about separating violent people from society.

You can't allow a wealthy person to only face financial penalties if their crime mainly related to finance or fraud. If so, then  their risk is relatively low at that point especially if they have plenty of wealth already.   "I have a billion net worth. I can start some shady businesses and as long as any damage doesn't exceed $100 million, you can't touch me."

Prison is much more of a threat or penalty to a wealthy person. If Oscar Wyatt had thought that prison was a possibility, I doubt he would have broken the law.

Offer Aunt Becky a $1 million penalty and I bet she pleads guilty tomorrow but she didn't learn any lesson. The threat of jail time is a real deterrent for wealthy people. but it has to be a real threat.

[CooterBrown 18031]

1 hour ago, Johnny Sack said:

 I'd rather non-dangerous criminals be forced to make restitution 2x or 3x to the financial issues they caused.  

IIRC, this is what they do in Japan. Garnish your wages until you've made financial restitution.

 

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

8 minutes ago, CooterBrown said:

IIRC, this is what they do in Japan. Garnish your wages until you've made financial restitution.

 

She can pay those restitutions back with a cash in of a couple savings bonds.  There needs to be a harsher penalty when you have the dollars in your back pocket.

[Brisketexan 105346]

Disagree that white collar criminals shouldn't face jail time. Jail isn't only about separating violent people from society.
You can't allow a wealthy person to only face financial penalties if their crime mainly related to finance or fraud. If so, then  their risk is relatively low at that point especially if they have plenty of wealth already.   "I have a billion net worth. I can start some shady businesses and as long as any damage doesn't exceed $100 million, you can't touch me."
Prison is much more of a threat or penalty to a wealthy person. If Oscar Wyatt had thought that prison was a possibility, I doubt he would have broken the law.
Offer Aunt Becky a $1 million penalty and I bet she pleads guilty tomorrow but she didn't learn any lesson. The threat of jail time is a real deterrent for wealthy people. but it has to be a real threat.

This. The problem is people with “fuck you” money. They’ll just pay the money. And say “fuck you.”
Jail time - something they can’t buy their way out of - is an actual deterrent to them.

[Armybrat 40914]

Martha Stewart would probably agree.

[ImissWallyPryor 9046]

10 hours ago, CooterBrown said:

IIRC, this is what they do in Japan. Garnish your wages until you've made financial restitution.

 

That happens every day in every jurisdiction in the USA. If you mean it isn’t consistently the remedy of choice, then I get you. We are about to start receiving restitution for a break in that occurred almost 2 years ago. I also personally know a guy who did some real stupid shit when he was 19 or 20, tagging along with some guys 5 years older than him. He ended up paying the whole tab because the older guys couldn’t stay out of trouble/jail. Restitution took him 10 years to pay off.

[TwiceHorn 31537]

12 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Disagree that white collar criminals shouldn't face jail time. Jail isn't only about separating violent people from society.

You can't allow a wealthy person to only face financial penalties if their crime mainly related to finance or fraud. If so, then  their risk is relatively low at that point especially if they have plenty of wealth already.   "I have a billion net worth. I can start some shady businesses and as long as any damage doesn't exceed $100 million, you can't touch me."

Prison is much more of a threat or penalty to a wealthy person. If Oscar Wyatt had thought that prison was a possibility, I doubt he would have broken the law.

Offer Aunt Becky a $1 million penalty and I bet she pleads guilty tomorrow but she didn't learn any lesson. The threat of jail time is a real deterrent for wealthy people. but it has to be a real threat.

Mmmm.  Nah.

For anything, prison, death by bobu, whatever, the perp has to think they're going to get caught.  That element is missing in a lot of this analysis, by both rich whiteys and poor browns.

Regardless, most of our prison terms are really based on two things, retribution and incapacitation.  And the incapacitation notion seems to constantly forget that most of the time they're gonna get out anyway, so then what?

Whoever said in this particular case that it's nearly 100% schadenfreude was dead on.

Edited September 12, 2019 by TwiceHorn

[CooterBrown 18031]

On 9/11/2019 at 11:42 PM, TwiceHorn said:

For anything, prison, death by bobu, whatever, the perp has to think they're going to get caught.  That element is missing in a lot of this analysis, by both rich whiteys and poor browns.

I don't think negative consequences play into the thought process for most criminals.  If so, the death penalty would be a deterrent to murder but it's not.  When the average Joe is faced with the choice of doing something illegal, it's not the punishment he thinks about, it's the ethical dilemma. Is this right or wrong? Is this good or bad for me, others, society? Etc.  The average person doesn't have the thought of fuck it, it's only 10 years in the slammer. Worth it.

 

 

[TwiceHorn 31537]

35 minutes ago, CooterBrown said:

I don't think negative consequences play into the thought process for most criminals.  If so, the death penalty would be a deterrent to murder but it's not.  When the average Joe is faced with the choice of doing something illegal, it's not the punishment he thinks about, it's the ethical dilemma. Is this right or wrong? Is this good or bad for me, others, society? Etc.  The average person doesn't have the thought of fuck it, it's only 10 years in the slammer. Worth it.

 

 

Yep.  Agreed.  And if someone is in danger of making the wrong ethical choice, I think it's usually the whole arrested, tried, embarrassed, rather than "hmm, will I get 6 months or six years if I do this and get caught."

And of course that discounts the defendants that commit crimes to feed themselves, family, and/or an addiction.  Their thinking doesn't transcend the moment.  And then you have the complete psychos who don't engage in anything resembling a normal thinking process with an ethical component.

In this particular case, I don't think most of the defendants thought this was legally wrong, so they never considered any legal penalty.  Pretty sure they considered it at least morally compromised, but not differentiable from donating a wing to the business school.

Any message that needs to be sent has already been sent by the publicity.  The rest of it is schadenfreude and vengeance.  Americans love em some vengeance, especially for things that didn't injure them at all.

Edited September 13, 2019 by TwiceHorn

[HRSchenker 2274]

14 days in prison or as I like to call it "Texas A&M freshman orientation"

[Kyrie Eleison 9312]

On 9/11/2019 at 1:12 PM, Brisketexan said:

This. The problem is people with “fuck you” money. They’ll just pay the money. And say “fuck you.”
Jail time - something they can’t buy their way out of - is an actual deterrent to them.

this.  as a criminal lawyer, shit gets real extra fast when one of our more affluent clients realizes that life in the grey bar motel is on the horizon.

it's enough of a deterrent that only a certain segment commits prison worthy offenses, mostly those who are already institutionalized...but that's another conversation altogether.

[Continental Op 3934]

If I had a dumb kid and tons of money I'd probably do 14 days in the slammer to get them into Harvard or whatever.  

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

2 minutes ago, Continental Op said:

If I had a dumb kid and tons of money I'd probably do 14 days in the slammer to get them into Harvard or whatever.  

So both you, and the kid get fucked.... brilliant.

[Updawg 2286]

After 14 days she will be out of the spotlight and it will be 100% on Aunt Becky. Aunt Becky has to be pissed / shitting bricks

[Continental Op 3934]

I'm pretty sure the Huffman/Macy clan will be fine going forward.