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Things seem to be going quite well for Joe Biden

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13226

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, Js1 said:

Senility fucking sucks. 

It's not senility, it's centrism.

4 minutes ago, 6th Street said:

At this point all that's left for Biden to do is name Kamala Harris as his running mate and he's the next President. 

i don't like his odds against Donald

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As you continue to ponder hypocrisy, please also refuse to address the following: T-Mobile spending over $195,000 at Trump Hotel while it lobbied for approval of its merger with Sprint, despite

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13226

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, David Dennison said:

That only happens if Democrats don't vote.

Will you vote for Joe Biden, Democratic nominee for president?

I will, but I'm not who you need to worry about.

If his message going in is "Republicans are going to work with us in a bipartisan way and we're going to try to make sure we don't scare them off with progressive ideas" then he is going to depress the youth and black turnout (like Hillary did) and run an unreasonable risk of losing (like Hillary did) to a complete moron and joke of a candidate (which Trump is).

You have to give people something to vote for.

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Js1

Js1 85614

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6 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

So could Hillary. But she didn't.

Why didn't she?

I don't think people are going to not turn out this time - Trump, as President, is a bigger turnout threat for Democrats than Trump as a candidate (as we saw in 2018). 

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Biff Tannen

Biff Tannen 45750

Posted
Posted
18 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

It's not senility, it's centrism.

i don't like his odds against Donald

Yep.  This kind of thinking is dangerous in today's climate.  The Rs are who we thought they were.  They aren't going to have an epiphany.  I think they already did and we are seeing the fruits of that.

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Js1

Js1 85614

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8 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

Yep.  This kind of thinking is dangerous in today's climate.  The Rs are who we thought they were.  They aren't going to have an epiphany.  I think they already did and we are seeing the fruits of that.

Yeah, the epiphany was they could get their way by refusing to work with anyone, slamming the brakes of the government to a dead stop until they got the majority and then crash the car into a ditch. 

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David Dennison

David Dennison 18951

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Js1 said:

Yeah, the epiphany was they could get their way by refusing to work with anyone, slamming the brakes of the government to a dead stop until they got the majority and then crash the car into a ditch. 

It must be a coincidence that this governing philosophy does not adversely affect you if you have money.

If you don't, well, too bad.

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Js1

Js1 85614

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Posted
27 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Joe is right; it IS disrespectful to talk about policy while it is raining outside.

 

Jesus.

Come on Kamala and Booker, go in on him.  You're uniquely positioned in this race to cut him into pieces over the crime bill and pull the black vote out from under him.  He's not sorry for that bill.  Joe Biden doesn't apologize.  Not to Anita Hill, not to all the people who ended up in prison from his shitty bill. 

 

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hpslugga

hpslugga 4062

Posted
Posted
On 5/14/2019 at 11:30 AM, bad_teammate said:

So could Hillary. But she didn't.

Why didn't she?

It hurts the feelers of the diehard D's to hear/read, but the truth is that with Hillary, as with Biden, the race isn't some paradigmatic conservative vs. liberal clash, whether you're looking at it from a factual/reality standpoint or from the far more important standpoint of voter perception. With either of them vs. Trump, it's correctly seen as Trump vs. Trump Lite. Outside of immense personal greed, I cannot for the life of me understand why the DNC is so hellbent on pushing candidates like this especially when the most popular political figure in the fucking country is running to be their nominee. 

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13226

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3 hours ago, hpslugga said:

 Outside of immense personal greed, I cannot for the life of me understand why the DNC is so hellbent on pushing candidates like this especially when the most popular political figure in the fucking country is running to be their nominee. 

Democrat loyalists would rather maintain status within the Democratic Party and have the Party lose than have the Party win but it cost them their status within that party.

If/when Bernie wins, the entire donor class loses tremendous swaths of influence.

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David Dennison

David Dennison 18951

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, hpslugga said:

I cannot for the life of me understand why the DNC is so hellbent on pushing candidates like this especially when the most popular political figure in the fucking country is running to be their nominee. 

Probably because Joe Biden is more popular than Bernie Sanders.

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RomaVicta

RomaVicta 30033

Posted
Posted
15 minutes ago, Js1 said:

 

There are reasons to criticize Biden as a Dem for not endorsing the Dem candidate in this race. However, this type of blurb about him "campaigning" for Upton for a fee is the kind of willful distortion that makes following elections revolting to me.

From Slate referring to the NY Times:

Quote

A few mitigating factors: While the race in Michigan’s 6th Congressional District was considered competitive, Upton was the clear favorite even before Biden came to town. And while a GOP-friendly group, the Economic Club of Southwestern Michigan, paid the former veep a total of $200,000—$150,000 as an appearance fee, plus $50,000 for travel—there’s nothing in the Times report to suggest that lauding Upton was an explicit requirement of the deal. As the paper puts it: “There is no evidence Mr. Biden was motivated to praise the lawmaker by anything other than sincere admiration, stemming from Mr. Upton’s role in crafting the 21st Century Cures Act after the death of Mr. Biden’s elder son, Beau, from cancer in 2015.”

I suspect that there is more to his rain excuse than has been presented, but this is what political discourse has become. Disagreeing isn't enough. Voting against isn't enough. We must stoop to amateur political operative status where we invent or pass on distortions to generate ridicule.

Biden is not my favored candidate. His voting record, plagiarism, and whatever else of that ilk can be brought up is fair game. I've always kind of liked the guy, but his day may be past.

Warren and Buttigieg appeal most to me. I know more about Warren. The takes I refer to here make the horse race coverage of politics unpalatable to me.  We shouldn't even really be discussing electability at this point. Just pay attention and pick a candidate and do what you can for that candidate. If they fall out of the race, to go plan B.

I sort of hate what our system has become. The impact of the Iowa caucus is absurd. That we're gearing up in Iowa for a 2020 race is absurd. 

That candidates face trivial, distorted twitter attacks is counterproductive.

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13226

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

There are reasons to criticize Biden as a Dem for not endorsing the Dem candidate in this race. However, this type of blurb about him "campaigning" for Upton for a fee is the kind of willful distortion that makes following elections revolting to me.

So you read this:

And while a GOP-friendly group, the Economic Club of Southwestern Michigan, paid the former veep a total of $200,000—$150,000 as an appearance fee, plus $50,000 for travel—there’s nothing in the Times report to suggest that lauding Upton was an explicit requirement of the deal.

And your thought was, "Good point!"?

And while the man paid the escort $5,000 after she arrived at his hotel room - there's nothing to suggest that sex was an explicit requirement of the deal.

lol

I'm with you that everyone's-a-pundit is killing discourse and democracy itself, that's not what this is. You're just being naive.

 

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Js1

Js1 85614

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Posted (edited)

Biden still took $200k to appear for an anti-abortion Republican in a critical Congressional race in a state Democrats need to win in 2020 (Obama to Trump district) - Upton won by 13,000 votes after winning in 2016 by 73,000 and 32,000 votes in 2014. 

He also called Dick Cheney a good guy.  Let's spin that one.

Biden is the consummate Democrat who will try to work with Republicans bEcAuSe BiPaRtiSaNsHiP iS aWeSoMe and he has "so many friends across the aisle" and get his agenda stonewalled for 4 years and be flabbergasted he couldn't just have a beer with McCarthy and McConnell and his so-called Republican "friends" and "work out our differences." 

Edited by Js1
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housious

housious 468

Posted
Posted
On 5/9/2019 at 7:54 AM, bad_teammate said:

I said before that I don't think Biden will be able to maintain the same media focus that Trump can because Trump is so outrageous and such a unique character. I think that's still largely true, but ... wow ...

"Hordes"

 

He's not wrong

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13226

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5 minutes ago, Doc Sam Beckett said:

Biden fucking sucks as a candidate, and it's unfortunate that a few shitkicker states with early primaries are going to give him an insurmountable lead. A Trump vs Biden election in 2020 is so fucking depressing 

He won't win Iowa and New Hampshire if the no-Biden-please people volunteer, organize, and donate to the serious threats (Bernie, Kamala, Elizabeth).

But the divided field will lead to a lot of angry dead-enders who will continue to push unrealistic options (basically everyone else except maybe Pete but not really even him).

And it will be a Biden/Bernie battle.

And Biden will win it close.

And then lose to Trump.

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

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RomaVicta

RomaVicta 30033

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47 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

You're just being naive.

Fuck you.

The original article says he was campaigning for Upton for money. Period. The NYT says: "There is no evidence Mr. Biden was motivated to praise the lawmaker by anything other than sincere admiration, stemming from Mr. Upton’s role in crafting the 21st Century Cures Act after the death of Mr. Biden’s elder son, Beau, from cancer in 2015.”

This mitigating evidence exposes the distortion I address. That's all I was addressing.

Your embrace of a persona of pedantic cynicism is a viable coping mechanism for dealing with the current state of American politics. Avoid assuming people who don't jump headfirst into your mindset are naive simps; it will allow you to be open to perspectives other than your own.

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13226

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2 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

Fuck you.

lol

Quote

The original article says he was campaigning for Upton for money. Period.

He was. That's why he was paid $200k to be there. That's what that is.

Quote

Your embrace of a persona of pedantic cynicism is a viable coping mechanism for dealing with the current state of American politics. Avoid assuming people who don't jump headfirst into your mindset are naive simps; it will allow you to be open to perspectives other than your own.

Why did they pay Joe Biden $200k to come speak? What was their intent?

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RomaVicta

RomaVicta 30033

Posted
Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

lol

He was. That's why he was paid $200k to be there. That's what that is.

Why did they pay Joe Biden $200k to come speak? What was their intent?

For the last time, the NYT concludes that it's likely he was there as a result of "sincere admiration, stemming from Mr. Upton’s role in crafting the 21st Century Cures Act after the death of Mr. Biden’s elder son, Beau, from cancer in 2015.”

To say "Biden campaigned for anti-abortion Republican Fred Upton in Michigan last year and got paid $200,000 to do it." is clearly a distortion intended to convey a notion that Biden supports anti-abortion stances and that Biden did more than make a speech admiring Upton.

I'm not a Biden apologist. I don't care that much about him. I've said that there are substantive issues through which he could be attacked.

Sorry I don't buy your little hit of the day. It's small. It's not honest.

Feel free to lol and pat yourself on the back.

Edited by RomaVicta
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Jhawk

Jhawk 1075

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Doc Sam Beckett said:

Biden fucking sucks as a candidate, and it's unfortunate that a few shitkicker states with early primaries are going to give him an insurmountable lead. A Trump vs Biden election in 2020 is so fucking depressing 

It won't be the early states that give him the insurmountable lead.  It will be the super delegates, boxing out of certain candidates, favorable press treatment, and possibly even corruption in the DNC that will give biden the insurmountable lead.  Just like those influences gave Hillary the nomination.

Edited by Jhawk
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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, bad_teammate said:

He won't win Iowa and New Hampshire if the no-Biden-please people volunteer, organize, and donate to the serious threats (Bernie, Kamala, Elizabeth).

But the divided field will lead to a lot of angry dead-enders who will continue to push unrealistic options (basically everyone else except maybe Pete but not really even him).

And it will be a Biden/Bernie battle.

And Biden will win it close.

And then lose to Trump.

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

Biden won't lose to Trump, but he will suck.

I'm hoping that we end up with BIden vs. Bernie vs. a third option consolidated from the rest of the field by the time it gets serious. Whether that's Warren, Pete, Harris, or Beto (lol) I don't care, but I at least want the option to vote for someone I like.

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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

Posted
Posted
Just now, bad_teammate said:

Biden will get some of the Obama->Trump voters back but he'll do worse than Hillary among women and minorities.

Saying "I prefer Biden to Trump" on the phone and actually making the effort to go out and vote are two wildly different things.

I don't believe he'll do worse amongst women and minorities where it counts (the midwest).

He'll probably do worse in California and NY and states that don't matter, but there are a lot of frumpy midwestern folks of all genders who didn't like Hillary because she's "bitchy" or was "ordained". Hell there's a poster who just made a post in one of these threads that his wife was like that. 

 

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henrygandorf

henrygandorf 29197

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Posted

biden would crush trump.

i've said it multiple times, but trump is about to experience what it's like to be the "unlikable option" on the ballot.

biden is a knucklehead, but he's seen as a generally likable guy, even through all the gropes (somehow).  put him up there next to trump after almost 4 years of this shit, and yeah.  trump is toast.

On 5/17/2019 at 8:59 AM, bad_teammate said:

Biden will get some of the Obama->Trump voters back but he'll do worse than Hillary among women and minorities.

i haven't seen any polling that would make me think biden will have a problem courting the women/minority vote. 

and if what you're saying is true, then you're saying there are minorities and women who voted for hillary in 2016, and are going to turn around and vote for trump in 2020.  i don't know how many people fit that description, but it can't be a big number.  certainly not as big as the people who voted for trump and have since regretted it.  maybe those people (women/poc) could stay home i suppose (is that what you're suggesting?) but it still wouldn't be the difference.

i would love for it to be literally anybody else, but i have a bad feeling we're stuck with uncle joe.  at least it'll only be for four years.

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13226

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Posted

turnout, obviously

White women will go majority-Trump again, and Trump will do as bad/worse among the minorities who choose to turn out. however, Biden isn't motivating people and negative turnout won't matter that much in populations used to being shit on by the government.

Bernie Bros & Peteheads agree: Biden is garbage

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23367

Posted
Posted

current MSM play on repeat:

1.  Display polls that show voters care most about defeating Trump instead of ideas. 

2.  Display polls showing Biden is most likely to defeat Trump while conveniently ignoring that he’s riding on 50%+ name recognition.

3.  Keep talking about how awesome Joe Biden is because I don’t know why.

4.  See step 1

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henrygandorf

henrygandorf 29197

Posted
Posted (edited)
17 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

current MSM play on repeat:

1.  Display polls that show voters care most about defeating Trump instead of ideas. 

2.  Display polls showing Biden is most likely to defeat Trump while conveniently ignoring that he’s riding on 50%+ name recognition.

3.  Keep talking about how awesome Joe Biden is because I don’t know why.

4.  See step 1

1. it's not just polling.  people do really care about defeating trump more than a lot of major issues.  crazy but true.

2. elections are popularity contests, and have been since elementary school.

3. i have seen very few stories like this, but it's possible i'm watching the wrong channel.

28 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

turnout, obviously

White women will go majority-Trump again, and Trump will do as bad/worse among the minorities who choose to turn out. however, Biden isn't motivating people and negative turnout won't matter that much in populations used to being shit on by the government.

Bernie Bros & Peteheads agree: Biden is garbage

as uninspiring as biden is, i think trump will force a large turnout.  i also think middle america was not super stoked about their options a few months ago, and are actually excited about biden.  remember, people are simple.

it'll also be largely up to the other democratic options (and their legions of fans) to do the rest.

the only way trump keeps this close is a hugely depressed turnout.  even then i don't think any type of math supports it.

Edited by henrygandorf
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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13226

Posted
Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, 6th Street said:

You guys are forgetting that Trump won PA, MI, and WI by a COMBINED 70k votes. Biden should easily get that and win the general. 

No one is forgetting that. Obviously the clearest path to victory is by regaining the Blue Wall. I think Bernie is the obvious choice to actually achieve that given his success vs. Clinton there in the primaries (he won Michigan and Wisconsin over Hillary).

5 minutes ago, henrygandorf said:

i also think middle america was not super stoked about their options a few months ago, and are actually excited about biden.  remember, people are simple.

No, they aren't. Small donor numbers lag significantly behind multiple contenders. Crowd turnouts are anemic. He gave his launch speech in Philadelphia to about 5-6k people. I was among 10k for Beto here in Houston.

They'll say "Biden" in a phone poll because that sounds right in their heads, but there is not a popular movement to love Joe and advocate for him. It's more resignation and acceptance than excitement.

Quote

even then i don't think any type of math supports it.

Let's at least pretend we learned from 2016.

Edited by bad_teammate
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