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Things seem to be going quite well for Joe Biden

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Alright T-tom. I am going to address this post because I am the best one for the job. I will address it number by number. 1) I am assuming that marginalized group you are talking about is us, Bla

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Somebody should write a song about the privileged fortunes of being a senator's son because this is a totally new phenomenon.  Somebody with musical talent, because it ain't me.  

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As you continue to ponder hypocrisy, please also refuse to address the following: T-Mobile spending over $195,000 at Trump Hotel while it lobbied for approval of its merger with Sprint, despite

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Hank Kingsley

Hank Kingsley 20702

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

Done?  Like out of the race?  I'll take that bet.

Not officially out of the race, but not considered a real contender anymore. 

But I'm happy to make a wager he's not the nominee. I'd be willing to give 4-1 or 5-1 odds.  Or open to any other ideas. 

 

 

 

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F250

F250 28688

Posted
Posted
47 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Sure.  The difference for me is that I'm not going to advocate ejecting every Dem candidate for prior actions that were more in the grey zone  at the time they were committed.  Anyone who thinks there isn't a smear campaign lined up for every D candidate is a fool, and it's quite important not to fall for the bait.

Here are some examples:  Al Franken could run for POTUS, and I'd be fine with it.  Joe Biden?  Fine with it.  Etc.

If the Republicans aren't going to reject Donald Trump, I'm sure as hell not gonna reject Joe Biden.  That's just fucking stupid.  (Well, I'll reject him, but not for allegations of being a creepy dude who did what he's been accused of.  Fuck that.)  If the opposition gets to vote for the philandering pussy grabber who can't go 5 minutes without lying, much less avoid financial dealings with the enemy, then I'm just not going to reject an old creep on those grounds alone.  I've said it 100 times -- the Dems HAVE TO learn to play dirty.  Their pathological need to take the high road is incongruous with getting people into the Oval Office.  I'm shocked Obama pulled it off.

To be fair, the Republicans have never included women's rights in their platform. When they support pussy grabbing it isn't hypocritical, to pine for a return to the 1950's is part of being a social conservative. As they see it, it is their duty to resist social change. The Democrats can't behave like the Republicans without being hypocrites.

 

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Onboard 2.0

Onboard 2.0 9083

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Not officially out of the race, but not considered a real contender anymore. 

But I'm happy to make a wager he's not the nominee. I'd be willing to give 4-1 or 5-1 odds.  Or open to any other ideas. 

 

 

 

Old School, white guy, Beltway insider ?  Doubtful, the nominees gonna be young'ish, and or maybe female.  

Or is Biden an independent vote getter which would change the equation a bit.

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Jhawk

Jhawk 1075

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

Sure.  The difference for me is that I'm not going to advocate ejecting every Dem candidate for prior actions that were more in the grey zone  at the time they were committed.  Anyone who thinks there isn't a smear campaign lined up for every D candidate is a fool, and it's quite important not to fall for the bait.

Here are some examples:  Al Franken could run for POTUS, and I'd be fine with it.  Joe Biden?  Fine with it.  Etc.

If the Republicans aren't going to reject Donald Trump, I'm sure as hell not gonna reject Joe Biden.  That's just fucking stupid.  (Well, I'll reject him, but not for allegations of being a creepy dude who did what he's been accused of.  Fuck that.)  If the opposition gets to vote for the philandering pussy grabber who can't go 5 minutes without lying, much less avoid financial dealings with the enemy, then I'm just not going to reject an old creep on those grounds alone.  I've said it 100 times -- the Dems HAVE TO learn to play dirty.  Their pathological need to take the high road is incongruous with getting people into the Oval Office.  I'm shocked Obama pulled it off.

So do you think it is logical that if the dems didn't reject Bill Clinton then the republicans sure as hell don't have to reject Trump?

See where this goes?  Nowhere.. it goes absolutely nowhere but feigned outrage by both sides.  The only solution is for both parties to look at themselves and say "why do we have scumbags at the top?"  But rather than do that you have the party insiders reinforcing the ability for the scum to stay at the top, like the dems have done with super delegates and whatever AOC is bitching about with vendors and sponsors of new candidates being blackballed.  I'm sure the repubs have their version of this as well.  It's all garbage.  Be outraged at the machines, not the other party for not admonishing their shitty people.

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45558

Posted
Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, Jhawk said:

So do you think it is logical that if the dems didn't reject Bill Clinton then the republicans sure as hell don't have to reject Trump?

The Pubs can do what they want.

 

Quote

See where this goes?  Nowhere.. it goes absolutely nowhere but feigned outrage by both sides.  The only solution is for both parties to look at themselves and say "why do we have scumbags at the top?"  But rather than do that you have the party insiders reinforcing the ability for the scum to stay at the top, like the dems have done with super delegates and whatever AOC is bitching about with vendors and sponsors of new candidates being blackballed.  I'm sure the repubs have their version of this as well.  It's all garbage.  Be outraged at the machines, not the other party for not admonishing their shitty people.

#bothsides

Fuck that.  I support the Dems getting exactly as dirty as the Republicans.  They won't do it, but that's what I support.  I want Trump, McConnell, Graham, Nunes, and all the other bitches out of office.  Now.  I don't care how we get there, we can "clean up" DC after they're gone.  What matters right now is getting the shit flushed out.  It's just too important.

I eagerly await your silly retort that the Dems are just as bad, right now.  You'd be wrong, SO wrong, but you should be used to it by now.

Edited by jimmyjazz
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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13132

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

I support the Dems getting exactly as dirty as the Republicans.

If this were a month before the general election, fine, get nasty I guess, but we're a year away from the primaries and we've already got far better choices than Joe.

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45558

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

If this were a month before the general election, fine, get nasty I guess, but we're a year away from the primaries and we've already got far better choices than Joe.

Sure, but the Dems are already falling all over themselves to discredit Harris, Booker, O'Rourke, etc.  This overwrought pious high road has to stop.  They're politicians.  Hell, they're adults.  They're gonna have some questionable things in their past.  Letting the 'pubs give their asshats a free pass while crucifying their own will get the Dems exactly where they are now -- 4 more years of Trump.

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tantric superman

tantric superman 4667

Posted
Posted

If Joe Biden was a great candidate I would be willing to overlook this.  He's not.  This issue isn't what makes me not want him to win the nomination.  It's just a reminder that a weak candidate can have only so many distractions.  

I think the whole Al Franken thing was stupid and he should have gone to a couple months of counseling and then I would have been okay with it. 

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tantric superman

tantric superman 4667

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Sure, but the Dems are already falling all over themselves to discredit Harris, Booker, O'Rourke, etc.  This overwrought pious high road has to stop.  They're politicians.  Hell, they're adults.  They're gonna have some questionable things in their past.  Letting the 'pubs give their asshats a free pass while crucifying their own will get the Dems exactly where they are now -- 4 more years of Trump.

Trump certainly changes everything.  I normally would advocate for getting all the dirt out now, but that approach only really works when the other side is doing the same thing to their candidates.  I see the wisdom in an approach that cares nothing about these side issues, but on the other hand, Trump is sui generis in his strange, unfathomable (to most of us) grotesque charisma.  I think the best approach is to take this shit seriously, but not make it a zero tolerance issue.  All things being equal, I'd rather a person with less skeletons in the closet go against Trump than more. 

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13132

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Sure, but the Dems are already falling all over themselves to discredit Harris, Booker, O'Rourke, etc.  This overwrought pious high road has to stop.  They're politicians.  Hell, they're adults.  They're gonna have some questionable things in their past.  Letting the 'pubs give their asshats a free pass while crucifying their own will get the Dems exactly where they are now -- 4 more years of Trump.

There is nothing from Dems against any of these people that's anything like what's going against Biden right now.

The only professional behavior thing I can think of is Klobuchar using her campaign staff as punching bags and target practice, but Dems aren't on the public attack about that.

As for personal behavior, Dems aren't hitting Beto on when he caused an accident while driving drunk and tried to leave the scene of the accident, and that's the only personal behavior thing I can think of off-hand.

There is a lot on policy and values, however, which there should be.

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13132

Posted
Posted
Just now, Hank Kingsley said:

lulz 

 

*Hillarybots malfunction, stack overflow, sparks flying out of their ears*

*as smoke billows from its gaping mouth, one raspy word escapes amid the screech of gears grinding into dust*

"BEEEEEERNIEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE"

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45558

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

As for personal behavior, Dems aren't hitting Beto on when he caused an accident while driving drunk and tried to leave the scene of the accident, and that's the only personal behavior thing I can think of off-hand.

There is a lot on policy and values, however, which there should be.

No, it's the Pubs who are doing that, and I guarantee the Dems will follow suit.  It's going to get ugly, and stupid, and Trump will get another 4 years, when ANY ONE OF THESE CANDIDATES would be better than Trump.  All 20 of them.  Watch.

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13132

Posted
Posted
Just now, jimmyjazz said:

No, it's the Pubs who are doing that, and I guarantee the Dems will follow suit.  It's going to get ugly, and stupid, and Trump will get another 4 years, when ANY ONE OF THESE CANDIDATES would be better than Trump.  All 20 of them.  Watch.

Maybe just don't have candidates who are sex creeps?

Shouldn't our goal be a Sex-Creep-Free caucus?

Seriously, if it comes out that my beloved Saint Bernie has been creepin' for decades then we need to put him out to pasture so he can rant at chickens and haystacks about thuh billiuhnaiiihs.

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45558

Posted
Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Maybe just don't have candidates who are sex creeps?

Sure.  But after that they''ll be wailing about the inside stock traders, or those who didn't report a consulting job, or who hired illegal immigrants as house cleaners, or who have a DUI, or who were in a frat in college that hosted a blackface party, or . . . or . . . or . . .

The Republicans are lining up every foible imaginable for each of these candidates.  Until the response is "fuck it, our guy is still better than your guy" the panty-waist leftie brigade will gleefully assist in shooting down every viable candidate, because that's what they do.  "Perpetually Missing the Forest for the Trees" might as well be the party motto, and it's maddening.  

We're talking about politics.

Politics is by definition dirty.

Don't play the game if you're not willing to play dirty.  It's like my son's soccer coach tells his team:  at certain times, your opponent is just going to be a downright dirty bunch of assholes who were coached to be exactly that, and your only recourse is to play just as dirty as them, and more often than not they will fold, because all bullies fold when they see resistance. 

Democrats are like the chess club in the lunch room -- the fight is over before it starts.

Edited by jimmyjazz
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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13132

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, jimmyjazz said:

Sure.  But after that they''ll be wailing about the inside stock traders, or those who didn't report a consulting job, or who hire illegal immigrants as house cleaners, or who have a DUI, or who were in a frat in college that hosted a blackface party, or . . . or . . . or . . .

It's always been this way. Always. I don't know why you're acting like this is new.

Quote

The Republicans are lining up every foible imaginable for each of these candidates.  Until the response is "fuck it, our guy is still better than your guy" the panty-waist leftie brigade will gleefully assist in shooting down every viable candidate, because that's what they do.  "Perpetually Missing the Forest for the Trees" might as well be the party motto, and it's maddening.

Rejecting Biden has nothing to do with Republicans or Republican accusations. We should be talking about his fitness as a candidate completely separate from what they do or even what they are saying. I would reject Biden right now even if every single Republican was saying, "Ah, this is fine, whatever, women are too sensitive. They need to leave Old Joe alone!" It doesn't matter.

If a potential candidate has a recorded and obvious history of using his power to be sexually assertive and inappropriate with women then he's cancelled. Bye. We don't need him. We can find another candidate.

And if we can't, then that's an indictment of the party. We are stocked to the brim with women and men who aren't sex creeps.

Quote

Don't play the game if you're not willing to play dirty.  It's like my son's soccer coach tells his team:  at certain times, your opponent is just going to be a downright dirty bunch of assholes who were coached to be exactly that, and your only recourse is to play just as dirty as them, and more often than not they will fold, because all bullies fold when they get resistance.

When you "play dirty" you hit the opposing team, not random women in the stands or even on your own side.

Going after Lucy Flores for telling her experience isn't "playing dirty" to beat the Republicans. It's "playing dirty" to beat a liberal woman.

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NotActuallyALonghorn

NotActuallyALonghorn 4968

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, F250 said:

To be fair, the Republicans have never included women's rights in their platform. When they support pussy grabbing it isn't hypocritical, to pine for a return to the 1950's is part of being a social conservative. As they see it, it is their duty to resist social change. The Democrats can't behave like the Republicans without being hypocrites.

 

To be fair, if you are going to state something as fact, the facts better back it up. Republicans were much better about supporting women's suffrage and getting the 19th amendment passed than Democrats were, although it wasn't divided strictly along party lines. Of course, the Republican party of today really doesn't resemble the party of 100 years ago, but facts are facts and we shouldn't try and delude ourselves with idiotic statements like that.

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45558

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Rejecting Biden has nothing to do with Republicans or Republican accusations. We should be talking about his fitness as a candidate completely separate from what they do or even what they are saying. I would reject Biden right now even if every single Republican was saying, "Ah, this is fine, whatever, women are too sensitive. They need to leave Old Joe alone!" It doesn't matter.n't "playing dirty" to beat the Republicans. It's "playing dirty" to beat a liberal woman.

I'd reject Joe Biden because he's a lousy candidate, regardless of his creepiness.

The problem is when the Dems reject every candidate for reasons that their Republican counterparts completely overlook in their own candidates.  You are espousing the very perspective that gets the Dems beat over and over.  "If we can't field someone good enough to survive every purity test, we don't deserve to win."  That's stupid.  What if every single Republican option fails to pass those same purity tests?  You're willing to say it's better for the country that we elect a shitheel just because he's not OUR shitheel?

That's absurd.

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EuroHorn

EuroHorn 3204

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, bad_teammate said:

If this were a month before the general election, fine, get nasty I guess, but we're a year away from the primaries and we've already got far better old white male with privilege choices than Joe.

 

...

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 104622

Posted
Posted

Biden was a poor candidate who failed to get the nomination when he really wanted it.  Folks seem to forget that for two, related reasons.

1 -- he spent 8 years under Obama being VP.  That role is easy to make people warm and fuzzy -- he didn't really do anything, and thus didn't have much opportunity to piss anyone off.  And hey, someone who was around for 8 years and didn't piss me off must be okay, right?

2 -- he is associated with Obama (including via the delightful Obama-Biden memes), and many people, and most Dems, are looking back on Obama with a nostalgia they didn't think possible. It's amazing how that polite, plain looking gal you went out with last night seems like a beauty queen next to the drunken hag who pissed all over your car seats tonight and then blamed you for it happening, in between her rants at you about how you are a loser and she usually dates guys 100X better than you and you better not think of touching me tonight that steak you bought me tonight was undercooked and they ran out of ketchup to make it edible and oh my God is your friend a mexican I don't want to meet up with them later he'll just try to rape me and if you had a nicer car I wouldn't have pissed in it and don't take that turn to fast because I'm gonna PUUUUKE!  Yeah.  That plain gal is Miss America compared to tonight's gal.  So, the nostalgia for her makes everything associated with her seem WAY better than it really is.

The "good things" about Biden are that he was a reasonably innocuous guy who worked with Obama who looks WAY better than we thought he did because Trump is so awful.  That's hard to fit on a bumper sticker.  And message-wise, it's not much better than "it's her turn."

Don't get me wrong -- if Biden gets the nomination, he's getting my enthusiastic support, because dude......that hag pissed in my car.

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F250

F250 28688

Posted
Posted
55 minutes ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

To be fair, if you are going to state something as fact, the facts better back it up. Republicans were much better about supporting women's suffrage and getting the 19th amendment passed than Democrats were, although it wasn't divided strictly along party lines. Of course, the Republican party of today really doesn't resemble the party of 100 years ago, but facts are facts and we shouldn't try and delude ourselves with idiotic statements like that.

Right, I should have said never in modern history because people still confuse the party of Lincoln with the current post Southern strategy Republican party.

 

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 104622

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, F250 said:

Right, I should have said never in modern history because people still confuse the party of Lincoln with the current post Southern strategy Republican party.

 

Comparing today's Republicans to the pre-Southern Strategy Republicans is like saying that we should all look to Greece's present government as a model to be admired because Greece is the birthplace of democracy.

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13132

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, jimmyjazz said:

I'd reject Joe Biden because he's a lousy candidate, regardless of his creepiness.

The problem is when the Dems reject every candidate for reasons that their Republican counterparts completely overlook in their own candidates.  You are espousing the very perspective that gets the Dems beat over and over.  "If we can't field someone good enough to survive every purity test, we don't deserve to win."  That's stupid. 
That's absurd.

Yes, the bizarre situation you just invented and that isn't real at all is absurd.

"Don't sexually creep on women" is a solid plank in a purity test and one that shouldn't be too high a bar to clear. If you're someone who has made a habit of abusing your power and status to get creepy with women, whether it's in a degrading paternalistic way or an overtly sexual way (not that the two are actually disconnected), then we don't need you.

You can still be a great person and we love you and we'll even let you paw us a little bit, but you don't get to be in charge of everyone. At least half of our members are people you either overtly sexualize or use to satisfy your paternalism with via physical inappropriateness. Sorry, not sorry. Don't make this awkward.

Quote

What if every single Republican option fails to pass those same purity tests?  You're willing to say it's better for the country that we elect a shitheel just because he's not OUR shitheel?

What the fuck are you talking about? 

If it was Joe v. Trump I'd either not vote or vote Biden.

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13132

Posted
Posted

Holy shit.

Yes, feel free to attack the Tweeter as a Toilet Paper USA dummy, but pictures and video are pictures and video.

The one person in all of these things that is equal to Joe in power is Jeff Sessions and the Evil Keebler Elf is watching for Creepy Joe's antics and literally swats Joe's fucking hand away from his granddaughter.

Everyone else just takes it and smiles because that's what you're supposed to do and Joe is very powerful and famous. If ANYONE has paid any fucking attention to the #MeToo movement they would have lightbulbs popping like the goddam lights at the end of The Natural.

Think about this shit seriously for a second, Russia-brain-damaged libs, think about what it would take for you to be that guarded of your grandchild. What would you have to know about a guy to be able to predict that he was going to do that and then feel compelled to physically disrupt his advances?

I have no concept of how you guys think this guy is not disqualified. I don't even know how to talk to you.

I'm joking, I've been dealing with brain-wormed Dems for decades now and they'll never not be garbage.

This shit is disturbing.

Just let it go. Go stan for Beto. Become a Buttgieger. Elizabeth Warren is dying for your help.

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Holy shit.

Yes, feel free to attack the Tweeter as a Toilet Paper USA dummy, but pictures and video are pictures and video.

The one person in all of these things that is equal to Joe in power is Jeff Sessions and the Evil Keebler Elf is watching for Creepy Joe's antics and literally swats Joe's fucking hand away from his granddaughter.

Everyone else just takes it and smiles because that's what you're supposed to do and Joe is very powerful and famous. If ANYONE has paid any fucking attention to the #MeToo movement they would have lightbulbs popping like the goddam lights at the end of The Natural.

Think about this shit seriously for a second, Russia-brain-damaged libs, think about what it would take for you to be that guarded of your grandchild. What would you have to know about a guy to be able to predict that he was going to do that and then feel compelled to physically disrupt his advances?

I have no concept of how you guys think this guy is not disqualified. I don't even know how to talk to you.

I'm joking, I've been dealing with brain-wormed Dems for decades now and they'll never not be garbage.

This shit is disturbing.

Just let it go. Go stan for Beto. Become a Buttgieger. Elizabeth Warren is dying for your help.

Its become pretty obvious you have an agenda here and are not speaking as a disinterested observer. 

So what is it? 

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

Posted
Posted (edited)

Ah. I think its the Bernie support. Someone who I supported in 2016. 

But unlike you BT I’m not gonna start tearing down other dem candidates so Bernie can win. The goal should be defeating trump, but maybe some of us have different goals. 

Edited by JimmyJames
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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

Posted
Posted (edited)

Didn’t think all that much of Pelosi during her first term as speaker. This second time though she is doing a great job leading  and preventing a party that loves to destroy itself if it can. 

Edited by JimmyJames
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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13132

Posted
Posted
46 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

Its become pretty obvious you have an agenda here and are not speaking as a disinterested observer. 

So what is it? 

I'm definitely not a disinterested observer. No one is. There's literally no such thing as some robotic entity that has no beliefs or ideas or preferences. You aren't. Hugo isn't. No one is. Anyone who pretends to be a "disinterested observer" is a liar.

I am very honest and open about my beliefs.

Can y'all actually deal with the issue, or is it solely about attacking the people who bring the issue up?

Quote

So bad teammate doesn’t support Biden and may actually vote for trump instead of him if he’s the dem nominee? 

B_T literally 40 fucking minutes ago: "If it was Joe v. Trump I'd either not vote or vote Biden."

I am trying really hard to not be ableist here, but you guys are handicapped in your brains.

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, bad_teammate said:

I'm definitely not a disinterested observer. No one is. There's literally no such thing as some robotic entity that has no beliefs or ideas or preferences. You aren't. Hugo isn't. No one is. Anyone who pretends to be a "disinterested observer" is a liar.

I am very honest and open about my beliefs.

Can y'all actually deal with the issue, or is it solely about attacking the people who bring the issue up?

B_T literally 40 fucking minutes ago: "If it was Joe v. Trump I'd either not vote or vote Biden."

I am trying really hard to not be ableist here, but you guys are handicapped in your brains.

Not vote if Biden is the nominee?  Even against Trump? I guess that’s what I had the problem with. 

And yes nobody is completely disinterested. I supported Bernie in 2016, and will do so again in 2020 if he is somehow the nominee. 

But I do know one thing I’m not gonna do, and that’s fwd fwd fwd crappy disingenuous republican talking points about other dem potential nominees to shit on them because I want one dem nominee to win over the other.

I suppose you disagree. ? 

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