Stranger throws 5-year old child from the 3rd floor of Mall of America

[immortal13 4,059]

The fuck?

[TKthunder2 4,997]

32 minutes ago, Newdoc said:

If this guy has the mental capacity to know what he was doing then yes, he should go away for a long time, maybe forever. If not then a mental institution would be appropriate and likely ling term. If the kid dies, then yes, he should face the death penalty. But y’all have no real insight into the perp’s mental capacity. 

Let’s say you drive like an asshole and cut my family off and they wreck causing injuries. Does someone have the right to instantly be judge and jury and put a “bullet in the back of your skull.” Because I sure would want to, but this crazy concept of the legal system prevents you internet keyboard warriors and me from legally and morally distributing instant justice.

In what way is driving like an asshole equivalent to throwing a 5 year old over a 3 story ledge?

[TwiceHorn 31,535]

4 hours ago, TxEx99 said:

No amount of therapy can fix his obviously warped view of the world. 

I may not disagree with the bulk of your post, but this is a fairly astonishing statement.

It's wild, non-evidence-backed assertions like this that got us the shit criminal justice and mental health systems we've got.

[TwiceHorn 31,535]

37 minutes ago, Newdoc said:

If this guy has the mental capacity to know what he was doing then yes, he should go away for a long time, maybe forever. If not then a mental institution would be appropriate and likely ling term. If the kid dies, then yes, he should face the death penalty. But y’all have no real insight into the perp’s mental capacity. 

Let’s say you drive like an asshole and cut my family off and they wreck causing injuries. Does someone have the right to instantly be judge and jury and put a “bullet in the back of your skull.” Because I sure would want to, but this crazy concept of the legal system prevents you internet keyboard warriors and me from legally and morally distributing instant justice.

The bolded is basically the legal standard, but I'm not sure it should be.  It was articulated in England nearly 200 years ago when we knew even less (i.e. next to nothing) about psychology and psychiatry.  I'm not sure what the test should be exactly, but I'd like to think that we could come up with something better.

Of course, this guy apparently was referred to a mental health diversion program and that didn't seem to help matters.  Depressing as fuck.

[Newdoc 3,453]

2 hours ago, TKthunder2 said:

In what way is driving like an asshole equivalent to throwing a 5 year old over a 3 story ledge?

What if the outcome is the same? The audacity of the crime doesn’t make the results different. Both are purposeful acts. Do you really want to put more relative morality into our justice system? There’s a reason Justitia wears a blindfold. Yeah, it’s a sick crime and falls way outside human behavioral norms but a critical injured child is an injured child no matter the mechanism. Do we punish people based on how much the crime creeps us out or causes outrage?

[clapclapclap 9,000]

1 hour ago, Newdoc said:

Do we punish people based on how much the crime creeps us out or causes outrage?

In Minnesota, apparently 'Yes':

https://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2019/04/15/charges-emmanuel-deshawn-aranda-planned-to-kill-someone-before-throwing-boy-over-balcony-at-moa/

MINNEAPOLIS (WCCO) — A 24-year-old Minneapolis man had planned to kill an adult the day before he threw a 5-year-old boy over a balcony at Mall Of America, critically injuring him, according to charges just filed in Hennepin County.

Emmanuel Deshawn Aranda faces one felony count of attempted premeditated first-degree murder in connection to the incident at MOA Friday.

Related: Child Thrown From MOA Balcony; Suspect Emmanuel Aranda Has Past Convictions Connected To Mall

According to the criminal complaint, Aranda went to the mall on Thursday with the intent to kill someone, but said it didn’t “work out.” He allegedly returned the next day, planning to kill an adult, but instead chose the boy. Charges say he threw the boy from the third-floor balcony outside the Rainforest Café.

The mother of the boy told authorities Aranda approached them and, without warning, picked the boy up and threw him over the side of the balcony. The complaint does not say why the boy was chosen by Aranda.

The boy fell about 39 feet and landed on the first floor in front of numerous people. The complaint says medical personnel responded and began treating the boy, who was bleeding from the head and had massive head trauma. He also suffered multiple fractured arm and leg bones.

“This crime has shocked the community,” Hennepin County Attorney Mike Freeman said. “That a child, with his mother, at a safe public area like a mall, could be violently attacked for no reason is chilling for everyone. Our victim advocates are working with the family during this very difficult time for them. We charged Mr. Aranda with the most severe crime that the evidence allowed.”

Related: Boy Thrown From Mall Of America Balcony ‘Continuing To Fight’

In an interview with police, Aranda said that he had come to the mall for the past few years to talk with women, but was rejected multiple times. He said the rejection made him aggressive. Surveillance video at the mall shows Aranda walking in the mall on the third floor, looking over the balcony several times, before approaching the victim and his mother.

Aranda had been banned from Mall of America in the past, and was charged and convicted of misdemeanors in two separate incidents at the mall in 2015. In July of that year, Aranda was charged with causing damage inside stores, throwing items off of a balcony to a lower level and resisting arrest. Aranda was then charged in October of that year for throwing a glass of water and a glass of tea at a woman inside of Twin City Grill after she refused to buy him food.

Aranda was also charged in August of 2015 with destroying computers in a north Minneapolis library. According to the criminal complaint, Aranda told officers that “he has some anger issues,” and that, “it does not happen all the time.”

Aranda is expected to make his first court appearance Tuesday afternoon and prosecutors will be seeking bail of $2 million. Prosecutors are intending to pursue a longer sentence based on the aggravating factors of particular cruelty, including the vulnerability of the boy and committing the violent act in front of the boy’s mother and other children.

“The family sincerely appreciates the outpouring of support from the community,” Freeman said. “The child is currently in critical condition and the family is beginning a long journey to recovery. Please respect their great need and desire for privacy during that journey and do not attempt to contact them for additional information or interviews. All condition updates moving forward will be provided by the Bloomington Police Department.”

The boy was taken to Children’s Hospital and, according to the complaint, remains in critical condition.

 

 

[TwiceHorn 31,535]

1 hour ago, Newdoc said:

What if the outcome is the same? The audacity of the crime doesn’t make the results different. Both are purposeful acts. Do you really want to put more relative morality into our justice system? There’s a reason Justitia wears a blindfold. Yeah, it’s a sick crime and falls way outside human behavioral norms but a critical injured child is an injured child no matter the mechanism. Do we punish people based on how much the crime creeps us out or causes outrage?

Fuck yeah we do.  Our criminal laws and justice system are almost entirely fear driven.  Has to be the least rational of the various legal systems in the US.

[DaggerHorns 3,086]

Lulz at depending on our criminal laws and/or justice system.

Anyone can name many people that got away with shit and we’re clearly guilty.

[ajax 2,620]

So he was angry because women rejected him? He attacked a woman because she refused to buy him food?

Sounds like he has a sense of entitlement. This guy just sets off the most profound sense of disgust in me. He should be charged with attempted murder and locked away for a long time.

I don't really care what happens to him. He's irredeemable in my eyes. He's a helpless little baby lashing out at the world. An absolute waste of space.

 

[TxEx99 31]

Driving recklessly is in no way comparable to let's throw a kid, a complete stranger of a kid, off a 3rd story balcony.  He has a lengthy history of abhorrent behavior that led up to this.  Drunk driving or even drag racing has the possibility of others getting hurt.  It's not a certainty and those people aren't intentionally setting out to harm anyone.  Throwing anyone off a 3rd floor balcony is always going to result in grevious bodily injury.  One is stupid and reckless, the other is malicious and quite frankly evil.  

[Texas_Rocks 347]

He “planned to kill an adult” the day before but it “didn’t work out”...so it’s pretty safe to say that was trying to kill this kid.

[Gatorubet 30,312]

On 4/12/2019 at 6:15 PM, Asithappens said:

If you're going to blame the Somalis, you need to first blame the Lutherans. 

We all do.

[Gatorubet 30,312]

5 hours ago, TKthunder2 said:

In what way is driving like an asshole equivalent to throwing a 5 year old over a 3 story ledge?

Either way, the victim's mom is not going to screw you?.

[immortal13 4,059]

Tie his balls to the third floor balcony rail, then throw him off to the first floor. 

 

 

[Jkwellborn 6,737]

If this guy has the mental capacity to know what he was doing then yes, he should go away for a long time, maybe forever. If not then a mental institution would be appropriate and likely ling term. If the kid dies, then yes, he should face the death penalty. But y’all have no real insight into the perp’s mental capacity. 
Let’s say you drive like an asshole and cut my family off and they wreck causing injuries. Does someone have the right to instantly be judge and jury and put a “bullet in the back of your skull.” Because I sure would want to, but this crazy concept of the legal system prevents you internet keyboard warriors and me from legally and morally distributing instant justice.

Was this guy some kin to you? Because that’s a shitty piss poor comparison. Had you said that someone intentionally went the wrong way on the interstate and rammed your family’s car, then yeah kill the fucker.

[Newdoc 3,453]

18 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Fuck yeah we do.  Our criminal laws and justice system are almost entirely fear driven.  Has to be the least rational of the various legal systems in the US.

We now run it that way. It wasn’t designed that way however. 

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

1 minute ago, Newdoc said:

We now run it that way. It wasn’t designed that way however. 

It's not about rehab, it's about warehousing, and stock prices.

[Errestaurants 2,570]

He has admitted to doing it and knew it was wrong. Wanted to kill an adult a day earlier but was a pussy so he came back and attacked a 5 year old. Ive got a 4 year old. Hang him. Ill provide the rope and tree. 

[MrPhlegm 3,413]

So does this guy have any eligibility left?

Asking for a aggy "friend".

[Newdoc 3,453]

9 hours ago, Jkwellborn said:

Was this guy some kin to you? Because that’s a shitty piss poor comparison. Had you said that someone intentionally went the wrong way on the interstate and rammed your family’s car, then yeah kill the fucker.

The comparison is to outcome and seeking vigilante justice. Where did this discussion pivot to motive? And you’re depending on news reports to determine facts of this case? The news is highly unreliable.

I’ll agree that my analogy ends up being manslaughter vs homicide but that wasn’t the original part of the discussion. The discussion was about the mob mentality and instantaneous justice and however imperfect our criminal justice system is it still beats witnessing a crime and distributing your own justice on the spot.

And so if the facts are as reported then yes, this guy should go away forever.  If his actions were purposeful result in the death of another person and he is not insane then he should face the death penalty. 

 I don’t have any amicable feelings towards this guy. He appears to be a blight on society. However, I find it disturbing that the mob mentality is to drag a guy out to the parking lot and shoot him in the head. 

[JohnnyRage 1,617]

As someone who has a three year old and is on a later in life spiritual journey, it's difficult to mentally wrap ones mind around an all powerful loving God. It's similar to thinking about a helpless child being left in their car seat on a blistering hot day.

 

This is almost makes me want to welcome our facial recognition overlords.

[Newdoc 3,453]

1 hour ago, JohnnyRage said:

As someone who has a three year old and is on a later in life spiritual journey, it's difficult to mentally wrap ones mind around an all powerful loving God. It's similar to thinking about a helpless child being left in their car seat on a blistering hot day.

 

This is almost makes me want to welcome our facial recognition overlords.

That is a question that will most likely  never get a good discussion on this board. I’d suggest you google that up if you are serious about you’re statement.

[Pam Cummings 9,659]

2 hours ago, Newdoc said:

The comparison is to outcome and seeking vigilante justice. Where did this discussion pivot to motive? And you’re depending on news reports to determine facts of this case? The news is highly unreliable.

I’ll agree that my analogy ends up being manslaughter vs homicide but that wasn’t the original part of the discussion. The discussion was about the mob mentality and instantaneous justice and however imperfect our criminal justice system is it still beats witnessing a crime and distributing your own justice on the spot.

And so if the facts are as reported then yes, this guy should go away forever.  If his actions were purposeful result in the death of another person and he is not insane then he should face the death penalty. 

 I don’t have any amicable feelings towards this guy. He appears to be a blight on society. However, I find it disturbing that the mob mentality is to drag a guy out to the parking lot and shoot him in the head. 

This is where i am as well. It disturbs me that people are so eager to be violent. It comes off like they don't care about the kid at all and just want an excuse to hurt somebody.

[ajax 2,620]

2 hours ago, Newdoc said:

The comparison is to outcome and seeking vigilante justice. Where did this discussion pivot to motive? And you’re depending on news reports to determine facts of this case? The news is highly unreliable.

I’ll agree that my analogy ends up being manslaughter vs homicide but that wasn’t the original part of the discussion. The discussion was about the mob mentality and instantaneous justice and however imperfect our criminal justice system is it still beats witnessing a crime and distributing your own justice on the spot.

And so if the facts are as reported then yes, this guy should go away forever.  If his actions were purposeful result in the death of another person and he is not insane then he should face the death penalty. 

 I don’t have any amicable feelings towards this guy. He appears to be a blight on society. However, I find it disturbing that the mob mentality is to drag a guy out to the parking lot and shoot him in the head. 

That's just silly. People are naturally protective of children so of course they're going to have harsher feelings toward this guy than a guy who drives recklessly. You being disturbed at some folks letting out their anger and frustration on a message board makes no sense. Nobody's leading a mob to storm his jail cell.

[irishtexan 11,522]

3 hours ago, Newdoc said:

The comparison is to outcome and seeking vigilante justice. Where did this discussion pivot to motive? And you’re depending on news reports to determine facts of this case? The news is highly unreliable.

I’ll agree that my analogy ends up being manslaughter vs homicide but that wasn’t the original part of the discussion. The discussion was about the mob mentality and instantaneous justice and however imperfect our criminal justice system is it still beats witnessing a crime and distributing your own justice on the spot.

And so if the facts are as reported then yes, this guy should go away forever.  If his actions were purposeful result in the death of another person and he is not insane then he should face the death penalty. 

 I don’t have any amicable feelings towards this guy. He appears to be a blight on society. However, I find it disturbing that the mob mentality is to drag a guy out to the parking lot and shoot him in the head. 

That would be too generous.

This vile piece of shit threw a 5 year old off a three story building to try to kill him. That, combined with a documented history of being a contemptible and repeated nuisance is all I need to know about this dude. Put him and gen pop for life and let the rest take care of itself. 

[UTEX90 589]

On 4/15/2019 at 8:09 AM, Newdoc said:

If this guy has the mental capacity to know what he was doing then yes, he should go away for a long time, maybe forever. If not then a mental institution would be appropriate and likely ling term. If the kid dies, then yes, he should face the death penalty. But y’all have no real insight into the perp’s mental capacity. 

Let’s say you drive like an asshole and cut my family off and they wreck causing injuries. Does someone have the right to instantly be judge and jury and put a “bullet in the back of your skull.” Because I sure would want to, but this crazy concept of the legal system prevents you internet keyboard warriors and me from legally and morally distributing instant justice.

He had the mental capacity to try to get away.

[Hate 20,145]

What if we called it an extremely late term abortion? Would that get you people questioning his immediate demise on board?

[elfenix 34,332]

8 minutes ago, Hate said:

What if we called it an extremely late term abortion? Would that get you people questioning his immediate demise on board?

huh.  apparently hate is tony tinderholt.

[Hate 20,145]

I had to look up who he was as I had no idea.  And no, I am not him.  I may be a degenerate, but I'm no politician.  While morally I don't like abortion for birth control purposes, I can recognize that socially we are probably better off allowing it.  I can't understand any way we are socially better off letting this person to continue to live. 

[Pam Cummings 9,659]

5 minutes ago, Hate said:

I had to look up who he was as I had no idea.  And no, I am not him.  I may be a degenerate, but I'm no politician.  While morally I don't like abortion for birth control purposes, I can recognize that socially we are probably better off allowing it.  I can't understand any way we are socially better off letting this person to continue to live. 

Because if we fly off the handle for this dude, we will continue doing so for others, and eventually an innocent person will be mob justiced for no good reason.

Edited April 16, 2019 by Pam Cummings

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

8 minutes ago, Hate said:

I had to look up who he was as I had no idea.  And no, I am not him.  I may be a degenerate, but I'm no politician.  While morally I don't like abortion for birth control purposes, I can recognize that socially we are probably better off allowing it.  I can't understand any way we are socially better off letting this person to continue to live. 

Yeah, you'll only blow a blood vessel trying to peel that onion of bizzarro world.

[SHOOTER12 8,828]

3 hours ago, Pam Cummings said:

This is where i am as well. It disturbs me that people are so eager to be violent. It comes off like they don't care about the kid at all and just want an excuse to hurt somebody.

Let's test your theory. come to my family and hurt one of my children or grandchildren we'll see where it winds up.

Or maybe that's not such a good idea. I know, let's put the shoe on the other foot and we'll come to your family and hurt one of your children or grandchildren. Then we'll see if you still feel the same way.

Not trying to be a smart-ass but, idealism and reality are sometimes very far apart.

Edited April 16, 2019 by SHOOTER12

[ajax 2,620]

4 hours ago, Pam Cummings said:

This is where i am as well. It disturbs me that people are so eager to be violent. It comes off like they don't care about the kid at all and just want an excuse to hurt somebody.

Yeah, this is a terrible take. First of all, people are not eager to be violent. People are eager to do nothing. The fact that people are eager to do nothing should disturb you because there's always a price to be paid at the end.

What do you think human nature is? I'll tell you, it's not to sit back and let ourselves and our children get hurt.

[texashorne 1,178]

A quick death penalty would put the guy out of his misery.. And yes, he's in a state of misery. It's far more humane IMO than dying in prison by shank after years of gang rape.

  

[Lhorn 4,960]

5 hours ago, ajax said:

That's just silly. People are naturally protective of children so of course they're going to have harsher feelings toward this guy than a guy who drives recklessly. You being disturbed at some folks letting out their anger and frustration on a message board makes no sense. Nobody's leading a mob to storm his jail cell.

There’s also the quite obvious point to be made that things said on a message board are often glib, reactionary and at times intentionally over the top. Were these people faced with this indicent in real life I doubt their primary focus would be getting revenge. 

Be disturbed that a guy tried to kill a kindergartner by throwing him off a third story balcony, not that anonymous message board people are talking out their asses. 

Edited April 16, 2019 by Lhorn

[ChickenSandwich 9,852]

Is cheap facial recognition software the only way Paul Blart could stop this?

 

 

[Jkwellborn 6,737]

Was the perp muslim? I saw somewhere but didn’t care enough to look it up.

[FondrenRoad 4,378]

On 4/12/2019 at 8:53 PM, immortal13 said:

As the father, I would have killed that guy if I got to him before the police did

Yep.  But even if the police got there first, they'd have to kill me to stop me from killing him.

[FondrenRoad 4,378]

On 4/15/2019 at 9:09 AM, Newdoc said:

If this guy has the mental capacity to know what he was doing then yes, he should go away for a long time, maybe forever. If not then a mental institution would be appropriate and likely ling term. If the kid dies, then yes, he should face the death penalty. But y’all have no real insight into the perp’s mental capacity. 

Let’s say you drive like an asshole and cut my family off and they wreck causing injuries. Does someone have the right to instantly be judge and jury and put a “bullet in the back of your skull.” Because I sure would want to, but this crazy concept of the legal system prevents you internet keyboard warriors and me from legally and morally distributing instant justice.

When you drive like an asshole, your intent is to drive like an asshole.  In doing that, you up the chance of you killing someone, but you never intend to kill someone.   An asshole driver is more comparable to someone that runs around or horseplays near the balcony and accidentally knocks a 5 year old off.  And that person probably shows instant remorse.  Something that is evident to any enraged father on the scene.

What happened is more comparable to someone getting into a car and intentionally trying to run someone over at high speed on the sidewalk.

The mens rea is entirely different.  If he is mentally ill, that is also different.  However, this guy has been caught multiple times throwing shit off the balcony.

As far as the death penalty goes, I'm always against it.  As a father, however, if I see some guy intentionally throw my 5 year old off a 3rd story balcony, either he or I have less than 5 minutes to live and I wouldn't care what his mental state was.

Edited April 17, 2019 by FondrenRoad

[Pig Bellmont 8,738]

I’m of the camp that you handcuff the guy to a chair in a room alone with the child’s father. If he survives, then he can face the justice system 

[phdhorn 6,224]

10 hours ago, Jkwellborn said:

Was the perp muslim? I saw somewhere but didn’t care enough to look it up.

He's Somali.  Bizarre shit, he actually posted an article on LinkedIn about an Israeli operation on a mosque in Jerusalem (note the "janitor" occupational tag, I know a lot of janitors who are excellent political observers).

https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/israeli-settlers-once-again-storm-al-aqsa-mosque-emmanuel-aranda/

But I don't think anything particularly religious motivated this guy.  He's just a shitbag who deserves a few shovels to the head, then his nuts to be cut off.

[clapclapclap 9,000]

52 minutes ago, phdhorn said:

He's Somali.   

https://www.apnews.com/afs:Content:4443160033

Man accused of throwing boy off Minneapolis mall balcony was born in U.S., not Somalia....

[TXSooner518 2,438]

I dunno yo, usually Muslims choose names from the Christian Bible, like Emmanuel. STAY WOKE

[High Plains Drifter 11,052]

10 hours ago, FondrenRoad said:

  As a father, however, if I see some guy intentionally throw my 5 year old off a 3rd story balcony, either he or I have less than 5 minutes to live and I wouldn't care what his mental state was.

 

As a father, if I see some guy throw any 5 year old off a balcony...

[Newdoc 3,453]

23 minutes ago, High Plains Drifter said:

 

As a father, if I see some guy throw any 5 year old off a balcony...

Then what? You get arrested and charged with battery and possibly murder? 10’s of thousands of dollars to a defense attorney later and your ass possibly in jail so your family doesn’t have you at home for 10 plus years.

You have a right to use force to make a perp stop and detain for police. You don’t have the right to kill him especially after the crime has been committed.

I guess it’s okay to vent on a message board and I hope this is mostly just bravado.

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

Just now, Newdoc said:

Then what? You get arrested and charged with battery and possibly murder? 10’s of thousands of dollars to a defense attorney later and your ass possibly in jail so your family doesn’t have you at home for 10 plus years.

You have a right to use force to make a perp stop and detain for police. You don’t have the right to kill him especially after the crime has been committed.

I guess it’s okay to vent on a message board and I hope this is mostly just bravado.

Yeah this ^^^^ take him down and "subdue" him....wink wink nudge nudge...

He broke his jaw and arms during the takedown officer.

[Sbbruin 21,886]

1 minute ago, Newdoc said:

Then what? You get arrested and charged with battery and possibly murder? 10’s of thousands of dollars to a defense attorney later and your ass possibly in jail so your family doesn’t have you at home for 10 plus years.

You have a right to use force to make a perp stop and detain for police. You don’t have the right to kill him especially after the crime has been committed.

I guess it’s okay to vent on a message board and I hope this is mostly just bravado.

A jury may not be so quick to throw the book at you.  I know if I was on a panel I would look for every legal reason to let a father go for doing that, or minimize the sentence.

[Gene Parmesan 4,014]

If it wasn't my kid, I'd probably just write a sternly worded letter to him

[Newdoc 3,453]

Just now, Sbbruin said:

A jury may not be so quick to throw the book at you.  I know if I was on a panel I would look for every legal reason to let a father go for doing that, or minimize the sentence.

I actually agree but I wouldn’t want to take that chance. I’ve seen a lot of zealous prosecutors go after some seemingly justifiable actions.  

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

1 minute ago, Sbbruin said:

A jury may not be so quick to throw the book at you.  I know if I was on a panel I would look for every legal reason to let a father go for doing that, or minimize the sentence.

No reason to chance it. Let his fellow inmates do the dirty work.