The Surly Mountain Biking Thread

[Knoxtnhorn 6312]

22 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Yes, there's a park off to the left with a paved trail through it.  That was the bypass for the heavy-duty off-camber section.

Things for me are always worse the first time I see them, but I was very "whoa" about it today.

The dirt on those sections was pretty firm today, but I don't have much experience with extreme off-camber stuff and feared sliding (even while walking) and pedal strikes on the high side with dire results.

And, ravines of 10-20 feet are pretty common in DFW, but this one was probably 20-40 feet, on both sides. 

Having looked at the map and some elevations, the loop seems to start off mostly at creek level, with 10-20 foot climbs and drops, but then works its way up to the side of that ravine.  Then, where I mentioned that hairy-looking descent, drops back to more or less creek level.  It appears that descent is about 50 feet with a -10 to 12% grade, so that kind of confirms my depth estimates.  And, as usual since collarbone, the descent only made me a little nervous, especially with the leaves covering up roots and things, but it was the hard right in the runout that was a dealbreaker.  

Yep.  Last time I was there, I almost slid in while walking.

[KuЯdt 248]

Well, I am now experienced with modern bike geometry.  I had a couple of demo bikes over the last few days, and got in 2 rides with each.  Both were 2020 models with slack HTA (66 degrees) and steep seat tube angles (76-77).  And wide bars.

Coming from my tallboy with a 71 degree HTA, it felt weird as fuck at first.   Front end felt long.   And I definitely noticed the "flopping" of the front wheel at low speed that Twice has mentioned.  However, 2 or 3 miles into my first ride it started to feel natural.   I was even used to the 780mm bars pretty quickly. 

Both bikes were about 2 lbs heavier than my tallboy which I thought was going to be a huge issue, but I didn't really notice it out on the trail and they were good climbers.  Even set a few PR's.  I guess there is no stopping it now...new-bike-itis has a hold of me.

[KuЯdt 248]

Also, wide bars are wide.

[TwiceHorn 32108]

Where the steering still fuzzles me a bit is going up a steep short climb and having to turn sharply either as sort of a switchback to descend or in a couple of spots you can go left or right for your descent and for me right is preferable and it's a fairly hard right when you aren't going very fast having lost momentum on the climb.  And in both cases there are close-in trees so you not only have to watch your line but your bars (which I guess is more of a bar problem than a steering problem).

On my steeper bike, it felt more point and shoot, I have to be pretty mindful of it now.  But I have gotten used to it again.  Re-learning it after the collarbone was annoying as hell though.

[Loco 3754]

you know, I used to think I was pretty good with a bike...

 

[Al_4_ISU 12665]

Hitting hitting the trails at sun up.  First time since September.  Ground is froze and we have less than a inch of snow cover. Should be prime fatty conditions.

I was so jacked I woke up at 4:30 and couldn't fall back asleep.

[Al_4_ISU 12665]

Felt good getting after it. Conditions were very good, all things considered. Didn’t do anything crazy, but hit a few tree gates, and some punchier stuff. Kept my eyes through the gates, and it felt right. Muscles were definitely out of biking shape, but coulda been worse.

[TwiceHorn 32108]

What do you wear on those kind of rides? 

Right now its 40s in the morning, 50s-60s in the afternoon.  Once you get going, I find you need no extra clothing in the upper 50s, just shorts and a tee are fine.  In the 40s and low 50s, getting the clothes right is a bit of a challenge.  A light fleece can be too much.

Related topic, I prefer riding without a pack, just a bottle.  I willingly wear a hydration pack when its hot, but when it's not, I like to avoid it, so I don't have any place to stick a jacket or layer.

I rode collarbone park (Katie Jackson) yesterday.  The dirt was a hair wetter than hero dirt so kind of sticky.  Instead of that moist noise, the dirt there was kind of granular and kicking up behind my wheels, hitting me and my frame.  Between the reduced riding frequency of fall/winter weather and the increased pedaling effort, it was a kind of meh ride.

[Al_4_ISU 12665]

I start with my summer riding gear (singlet and jersey) and layer over that with dry fit work out gear. I have leggings and a jacket for winter exercise. Thick wool socks, gloves, and a gator for my neck, ears, and face.

10 degrees is where I bail. It was about 20 this morning. Next week looks like highs in the 30’s, low of 20. Which ain’t bad

[TwiceHorn 32108]

57 minutes ago, Al_4_ISU said:

I start with my summer riding gear (singlet and jersey) and layer over that with dry fit work out gear. I have leggings and a jacket for winter exercise. Thick wool socks, gloves, and a gator for my neck, ears, and face.

10 degrees is where I bail. It was about 20 this morning. Next week looks like highs in the 30’s, low of 20. Which ain’t bad

Yeah I have some long pants made of softshell type material that are good, but too warm for anything above  40s.

I understand cross country ski pants, with waterproof fronts and breathable backs are good for cold rides.

[Al_4_ISU 12665]

Yeah I have some long pants made of softshell type material that are good, but too warm for anything above  40s.
I understand cross country ski pants, with waterproof fronts and breathable backs are good for cold rides.

40’s are a temp range I rarely ride in, actually. That window in the fall I’m working, and that window in the spring is usually part of the freeze thaw cycle.

I would probably ride with leggings and a long shirt under my bike jersey.

A lot of the stuff I wear is used for cross country skiing, actually.

[Braff Zacklin 13676]

2 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Yeah I have some long pants made of softshell type material that are good, but too warm for anything above  40s.

I understand cross country ski pants, with waterproof fronts and breathable backs are good for cold rides.

XC ski pants are great for winter riding. Or, a pair of tights with built-in chamois layered under your usual biking shorts works great, too.

I'm mildly surprised we have more snow than you right now, @Al_4_ISU, but we did just get (and are still receiving) a fresh delivery ...

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

Is it's 80 in San Antonio today.  To hot to ride.  

[Al_4_ISU 12665]

XC ski pants are great for winter riding. Or, a pair of tights with built-in chamois layered under your usual biking shorts works great, too.
I'm mildly surprised we have more snow than you right now, [mention=1238]Al_4_ISU[/mention], but we did just get (and are still receiving) a fresh delivery ...

I would imagine you typically get more snow than us, but we get colder air temps.

[Braff Zacklin 13676]

1 minute ago, Al_4_ISU said:

I would imagine you typically get more snow than us, but we get colder air temps.

 

We don't get a ton of snow (technically classified "high desert" here), but it tends to stay on the ground for a while. October was cold and unpleasant af, but November and December have been relatively mild.  We're right at freezing today and will be in the high- and low-20s for the next several days.

[Pescado_Rojo 19593]

Well, I got some terrible news yesterday. Had the Yeti in for a service and my mechanic found a crack in the the rear triangle suspension mount. Currently combing Ebay and the Yeti facebook groups for a replacement rear triangle. Wasn't really budgeting for a new bike this Christmas....

Edited December 18, 2019 by Pescado_Rojo

[Loco 3754]

4 minutes ago, Pescado_Rojo said:

Well, I got some terrible news yesterday. Had the Yeti in for a service and my mechanic found a crack in the the rear triangle suspension mount. Currently combing Ebay and the Yeti facebook groups for a replacement rear triangle. Wasn't really budgeting for a new bike this Christmas....

Have you called Yeti? 

[Pescado_Rojo 19593]

2 minutes ago, Loco said:

Have you called Yeti? 

I'm not the original owner. I bought it in like new condition with <100 miles on it from a bike shop employee. That shop is now closed and the other Yeti dealer in town doesn't think they will do anything for me, but he was going to call them and let me know. It's 6 years old and they don't make the SB95 anymore, so I'm probably SOL unless I can find a rear triangle somewhere. 

[Loco 3754]

1 minute ago, Pescado_Rojo said:

I'm not the original owner. I bought it in like new condition with <100 miles on it from a bike shop employee. That shop is now closed and the other Yeti dealer in town doesn't think they will do anything for me, but he was going to call them and let me know. It's 6 years old and they don't make the SB95 anymore, so I'm probably SOL unless I can find a rear triangle somewhere. 

I'd at least give them a call myself and be nice, ask them for help tracking down a part or if they could repair

[Pescado_Rojo 19593]

10 minutes ago, Loco said:

I'd at least give them a call myself and be nice, ask them for help tracking down a part or if they could repair

yea, I plan on it. My mechanic said they might offer me a deal on a new frame, which I wouldn't be totally opposed to, but I hate that there's so much of my current kit that won't easily move over. The current bike is pretty sweet. SRAM XX drivetrain, XTR Brakes, Fox Float Kashima Coat shock and fork, etc. 

[Braff Zacklin 13676]

Shitty situation, @Pescado_Rojo. Is the rear triangle carbon? I've yet to see any carbon rear triangle design that holds up to long-term abuse, but aluminum ones crack all the time, too.

[Pescado_Rojo 19593]

1 minute ago, Braff Zacklin said:

Shitty situation, @Pescado_Rojo. Is the rear triangle carbon? I've yet to see any carbon rear triangle design that holds up to long-term abuse, but aluminum ones crack all the time, too.

nope, it's aluminum. There's a Size L carbon rear for sale on Ebay right now for around $250. My mechanic is checking to see if it's the same geometry as the XL, but he doesn't think it is. Meanwhile, a new SB130 with a comparable build is 7 grand, and even the entry level bike is 5 grand...ouch. 

[Loco 3754]

Yeah,

I think that's why you need to chat up the folks at Yeti.  I have a hard time wrapping my head around the prices of new MTBs.   It's crazy...  

[Pescado_Rojo 19593]

Talked to a guy at Yeti tech support. The rear triangles are all the same size/geometry so I could buy the one on Ebay, but the guy I talked to said that even though I'm not the original owner and don't have a warranty they would still honor a crash replacement claim and sell me a new rear triangle. He's checking to see what they have in stock and will let me know later today, so I feel a lot better about my options. Also, it's pretty clear my local shop hasn't been selling Yeti very long (just started last year) because almost everything my tech told me has been wrong*. 

*Maybe just trying to sell me a new bike, IDK. 

[Al_4_ISU 12665]

Great ride this morning. 1.5 hours. Sore as hell, and a sluggish start. Warmed up 30 minutes in and rode really well for the next 30. Tacked some flat miles on the end of the ride just to get a little more distance.

Conditions were surprisingly good. 25 degrees, no wind. Ground is froze, but there was hardly any snow. There was one snow covered shaded climb that spun me out, but that was all. Attempted to take some selfies of cold riding gear to give an idea. It’s always a great day when you ride.

[Al_4_ISU 12665]

Worked a ride into Xmas Eve errands. Took the FIL with who has never rode singletrack in his life. He is an avid road biker who bought a decent mountain bike in the 90’s but never got into it, really.

Went to a system with about 10 miles of super flowy singletrack just north of Waterloo. Built in an old Boy Scout camp, this was a great system. Fast, flowy, and well marked. It’s about an hour from home (my regular trails are about 20 minutes) and will be part of my roster going forward. The FIL was sore as shit, and we started hitting bars on the way back. Stay posted in the holiday drama thread (it won’t be that bad).

[TwiceHorn 32108]

Props on the Eve ride.  Was going to myself, but just couldn't get off my ass.  Did ride yesterday.

[Al_4_ISU 12665]

Props on the Eve ride.  Was going to myself, but just couldn't get off my ass.  Did ride yesterday.

 

When it’s 50 degrees on Xmas Eve in Iowa, you make the most of it. I’ve ridden 3 of the last 4 days, including one day of fat biking on groomed snow in Minnesota.

 

I think you would love this trail system. If you ever have to litigate in Waterloo, IA for some absurd reason, bring your bike.

[TwiceHorn 32108]

Just now, Al_4_ISU said:

 

When it’s 50 degrees on Xmas Eve in Iowa, you make the most of it.

I think you would love this trail system. If you ever have to litigate in Waterloo, IA for some absurd reason, bring your bike.

 

No doubt.  Looks sweet except the damp leaves.

[Al_4_ISU 12665]

Christmas Day ride in the bag. 45 degrees here. Hard to imagine a better present.

I’m not sure I’ll ever get to ride 4 outta 5 consecutive days in December again.

[Braff Zacklin 13676]

It's been unusually warm here in Idaho, as well. Trails aren't rideable, but mid 40s on Christmas day is still very unusual.

Merry Christmas, you surly fucks.

[Al_4_ISU 12665]

It's been unusually warm here in Idaho, as well. Trails aren't rideable, but mid 40s on Christmas day is still very unusual.
Merry Christmas, you surly fucks.

I had to cut my ride shorter than I wanted because the trails started thawing and getting muddy in spots.

Long term forecast is favorable for riding. Rain this weekend - which is fine because I’ll be occupied with football all weekend - and then frozen but not stupid cold the weekend after New Year’s.

[Al_4_ISU 12665]

I'm guessing it's been covered in here, but I don't want to dig back through that much.

Where is everyone on dropper posts?  I ride enough long, steep descents, that I think having the ability to crouch more easily will help me out a lot.  Everyone I know that has one loves it, but I'm sure they aren't all created equal and there are certain things you need to watch for.

[Braff Zacklin 13676]

Love them, don't enjoy riding trails without them, and generally speaking, more drop is better but that depends on height, style, and preference.

Started with a 4-incher but still had trouble getting my thighs behind the seat or back into position after drops, so next one was the 5-incher that has been relegated to my hardtail. Run a 6-incher on my squishy.

(And, yes, are we not doing phrasing any more? /archer)

I've had four droppers since 2012, and even though I probably adjust saddle height more than I shift gears, I haven't had any issues with mine once properly installed and adjusted. First was a 4-inch mechanical from Gravity Dropper--the O.G. of dropper posts--that will probably last forever. It's relatively lightweight and works great but looks goofy because of the rubber boot over the stanchion.

Next was a 4-inch KS eTen that came with the squishy I purchased in late 2015. Works fine but weighs a ton and there's lots of cable movement because it's actuated at the top of the post. Besides, I wanted more drop, so picked up a 5-inch KS Lev DX. Light, relatively cheap, and externally routed so it will work on any bike. Also, no cable movement because it's actuated at the bottom of the post.

In 2017, I decided I wanted even more drop, so I picked up a 6-inch KS Lev DX. Both Lev DXes set me back about $260, brand new.

So that's my story, and here's my advice:

First, figure out if you really want a dropper. Does your bike have a quick-release seatpost clamp and, if so, do you drop your saddle for those long, steep descents? It's going to feel weird at first, but you will get addicted to the freedom, and having the saddle out of the way will make it easier to throw your body and the bike around.

If you know you want a dropper, then the next step would be to focus on the features you want. How much drop do you need to get the saddle completely out of the way? How important is component weight? How much do you want to spend? Do you want to go with a trusted brand or a Chinese knockoff? Do you want internal (stealth) routing, or can you live with external, or would you rather skip cables altogether and go wireless? Do you want infinite adjustment or can you live with fixed heights (i.e., climb, trail, descend)?

(Incidentally, my GD post came with three fixed heights, and the three KS posts are infinitely adjustable, but I find my use is almost entirely boolean--they are either up or down without any in-between. YMMV, of course.)

 

[Knoxtnhorn 6312]

Well, getting back on the bike today.  Hopefully, my back will hold up.  I'm actually going to road bike today and ease back onto the MB.  I'm wondering if I have something amiss in my lower back which gets aggravated by the bumping around on the MB.  Nevertheless, I'm excited.  I'd bike to work every day if there was a safe way to do so in Garland/Rowlett.

[TwiceHorn 32108]

The cheap TransX/BrandX droppers work pretty well.  Really about as well as the reports on the more expensive ones.

https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/us/en/brand-x-ascend-120mm-150mm-dropper-seatpost/rp-prod149024

I'm still not used to using it much.  I'm also skinny fat and must have a big thigh gap because I don't have much trouble getting behind my seat ad needed. Also I seem to need to pedal/climb after most descents so it feels super awkward. 

I am doing more standing pedaling than I used to. But the strength I have acquired also makes it easier to climb seated. 

Edited December 26, 2019 by TwiceHorn

[Al_4_ISU 12665]

41 minutes ago, Braff Zacklin said:

Love them, don't enjoy riding trails without them, and generally speaking, more drop is better but that depends on height, style, and preference.

Started with a 4-incher but still had trouble getting my thighs behind the seat or back into position after drops, so next one was the 5-incher that has been relegated to my hardtail. Run a 6-incher on my squishy.

(And, yes, are we not doing phrasing any more? /archer)

I've had four droppers since 2012, and even though I probably adjust saddle height more than I shift gears, I haven't had any issues with mine once properly installed and adjusted. First was a 4-inch mechanical from Gravity Dropper--the O.G. of dropper posts--that will probably last forever. It's relatively lightweight and works great but looks goofy because of the rubber boot over the stanchion.

Next was a 4-inch KS eTen that came with the squishy I purchased in late 2015. Works fine but weighs a ton and there's lots of cable movement because it's actuated at the top of the post. Besides, I wanted more drop, so picked up a 5-inch KS Lev DX. Light, relatively cheap, and externally routed so it will work on any bike. Also, no cable movement because it's actuated at the bottom of the post.

In 2017, I decided I wanted even more drop, so I picked up a 6-inch KS Lev DX. Both Lev DXes set me back about $260, brand new.

So that's my story, and here's my advice:

First, figure out if you really want a dropper. Does your bike have a quick-release seatpost clamp and, if so, do you drop your saddle for those long, steep descents? It's going to feel weird at first, but you will get addicted to the freedom, and having the saddle out of the way will make it easier to throw your body and the bike around.

If you know you want a dropper, then the next step would be to focus on the features you want. How much drop do you need to get the saddle completely out of the way? How important is component weight? How much do you want to spend? Do you want to go with a trusted brand or a Chinese knockoff? Do you want internal (stealth) routing, or can you live with external, or would you rather skip cables altogether and go wireless? Do you want infinite adjustment or can you live with fixed heights (i.e., climb, trail, descend)?

(Incidentally, my GD post came with three fixed heights, and the three KS posts are infinitely adjustable, but I find my use is almost entirely boolean--they are either up or down without any in-between. YMMV, of course.)

 

I've never tried adjusting my seat during the ride, because my descents aren't anywhere near as long as yours and I don't want to stop twice in a minute's time to adjust my seat.  Hence the desire for the dropper.

I can live with external routing, assumed a budget of approximately $250, and if the cheaper knock offs aren't complete pieces of shit, would have no issue going that route.

I'm above average height (6' 1) with fairly long legs, so I like a high saddle for climbing or relatively level ground.  On the fatty, the wheel base is long enough that I don't have to squat that low to get my weight sufficiently far enough back for descents, and the saddle was never the issue.  With the shorter wheelbase on the hard tail, having the saddle at an appropriate climbing height makes it an obstacle to getting my weight distributed for descents.

4" would make a big difference, but I'd have to measure the current height of my mount.  I know I'm setting my post a little lower than I'd prefer for climbing just to make it easier to clear on descents.  Maybe 6" is what I need?

(we're not doing phrasing anymore)

[Braff Zacklin 13676]

Don't feel like the extra inch would hurt (TNWSS).

I'm an honest 6'0" and find the extra inch helps, especially on my squishy, because the geo is a bit different. Less of an issue on the HT.

[Braff Zacklin 13676]

49 minutes ago, Knoxtnhorn said:

Well, getting back on the bike today.  Hopefully, my back will hold up.  I'm actually going to road bike today and ease back onto the MB.  I'm wondering if I have something amiss in my lower back which gets aggravated by the bumping around on the MB.  Nevertheless, I'm excited.  I'd bike to work every day if there was a safe way to do so in Garland/Rowlett.

Take 'er easy. I've had lower back issues (bulging L3 disc) for three years now. They are probably here to stay, although I've found a way to cope, primarily through stretching.

 

[TwiceHorn 32108]

3 hours ago, Al_4_ISU said:

I've never tried adjusting my seat during the ride, because my descents aren't anywhere near as long as yours and I don't want to stop twice in a minute's time to adjust my seat.  Hence the desire for the dropper.

I can live with external routing, assumed a budget of approximately $250, and if the cheaper knock offs aren't complete pieces of shit, would have no issue going that route.

I'm above average height (6' 1) with fairly long legs, so I like a high saddle for climbing or relatively level ground.  On the fatty, the wheel base is long enough that I don't have to squat that low to get my weight sufficiently far enough back for descents, and the saddle was never the issue.  With the shorter wheelbase on the hard tail, having the saddle at an appropriate climbing height makes it an obstacle to getting my weight distributed for descents.

4" would make a big difference, but I'd have to measure the current height of my mount.  I know I'm setting my post a little lower than I'd prefer for climbing just to make it easier to clear on descents.  Maybe 6" is what I need?

(we're not doing phrasing anymore)

Well, your seat tube poses something of a limitation.  Is your seatpost 6" out of the seat tube?  Because you can only go down as far as your seatpost projection.  Also beware of bends and bottle lugs on the seat tube, which can put a limit on INSERTION DEPTH (no phrasing) as droppers generally go deeper than regular seatposts.

Looking at your photos, seems like your seatpost is way out.  Also seat tube is straight, so probably ok there, but it's short so you might not get the full 6".

Edited December 26, 2019 by TwiceHorn

[Al_4_ISU 12665]

32 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Well, your seat tube poses something of a limitation.  Is your seatpost 6" out of the seat tube?  Because you can only go down as far as your seatpost projection.  Also beware of bends and bottle lugs on the seat tube, which can put a limit on INSERTION DEPTH (no phrasing) as droppers generally go deeper than regular seatposts.

That's about what it seems, but I need to measure it.

[KuЯdt 248]

Since I'm living in the dark ages over here, the first time I rode with a dropper was a couple weeks ago on a demo bike I had.  I forgot to even use it most of the time, but did drop it down a bit on some gnarly descents at BCGB.  It is a bit awkward for me still, as I'm used to kind of using the seat for stability holding it between my legs (more phrasing?) and when it is dropped down it feels like I lost my safety net, in a way.

I can see how it would be a benefit though once I get used to it.   I'll hold off getting one until I get a new bike, which will undoubtedly come with it.

[TwiceHorn 32108]

21 minutes ago, KuЯdt said:

Since I'm living in the dark ages over here, the first time I rode with a dropper was a couple weeks ago on a demo bike I had.  I forgot to even use it most of the time, but did drop it down a bit on some gnarly descents at BCGB.  It is a bit awkward for me still, as I'm used to kind of using the seat for stability holding it between my legs (more phrasing?) and when it is dropped down it feels like I lost my safety net, in a way.

I can see how it would be a benefit though once I get used to it.   I'll hold off getting one until I get a new bike, which will undoubtedly come with it.

Samesies.  I think if you actually have to maneuver much to stay on line or turn at all is when it really shines.  It's my perception that it helps with the lateral movement as much as the rearward movement.

Edited December 26, 2019 by TwiceHorn

[TwiceHorn 32108]

Well, I had a squeak emanating from the drivetrain.  My diagnosis was bottom bracket or  jockey wheels.  Bottom bracket as a result of having had some problems there before, unlikely as it might be.  Well, before I took it in (I'm coming down with a cold so I figured maybe take it in for the time I'm down), I decided I had better listen to it good and the derailleur was a little cranky.  So I get it upside down and start listening.  Seems to be coming from both the jockey wheels and the crank/bb.  It's the CHAIN, stupid.  

I use dry lube, sometimes White Lightning, currently Squirt, because it seems to attract less dust/crud during my mostly dry, dusty riding.  I am also conscious about overusing the stuff.  I usually reapply every two weeks fairly generously the day before a ride.  Anyway, I have had a couple of damp rides of late, although no submersion of the chain.  I know after a couple of em, I rinsed the bike and re-lubed, but not as generously as the every two week job.

So I guess that damp riding did it.  Don't believe I have ever had a squeaky chain before, I guess because I'm pretty habitual with the lube.  I have had things get kind of clanky with a dry chain, but never squeaks like that.  

[Pescado_Rojo 19593]

Heard back from Yeti. $450 for a new alloy rear triangle and $175 for a replacement A-Link, which it turns out is also cracked. Parts will be in next week. Crazy I'm going to be dropping a grand just to fix a bike (including the service items it was in for in the first place), but it's 6X less expensive than a new one. {Shrug} 

[wd40 1976]

On 12/26/2019 at 2:27 PM, KuЯdt said:

Since I'm living in the dark ages over here, the first time I rode with a dropper was a couple weeks ago on a demo bike I had.  I forgot to even use it most of the time, but did drop it down a bit on some gnarly descents at BCGB.  It is a bit awkward for me still, as I'm used to kind of using the seat for stability holding it between my legs (more phrasing?) and when it is dropped down it feels like I lost my safety net, in a way.

I can see how it would be a benefit though once I get used to it.   I'll hold off getting one until I get a new bike, which will undoubtedly come with it.

I rarely drop mine more than a couple inches.  which is to say never, unless I'm just sitting on it to shoot the shit with my bros, when I would otherwise sit on the top tube. 

same deal, I like knowing where it is, leaning on it at mid-thigh.  I feel lost on the bike if it's slammed.  just enough to get it out of the way.

2x, you might try RocknRoll Gold.  it's been my goto for 15 years.  a lot less dirt build up vs White Lightning and other waxy lubes.

Edited December 28, 2019 by wd40

[TwiceHorn 32108]

3 hours ago, wd40 said:

I rarely drop mine more than a couple inches.  which is to say never, unless I'm just sitting on it to shoot the shit with my bros, when I would otherwise sit on the top tube. 

same deal, I like knowing where it is, leaning on it at mid-thigh.  I feel lost on the bike if it's slammed.  just enough to get it out of the way.

2x, you might try RocknRoll Gold.  it's been my goto for 15 years.  a lot less dirt build up vs White Lightning and other waxy lubes.

Good to hear that a skilled rider needs to feel that saddle somewhere.  Even trying to carve turns, I tend to like to feel it on my leg.

But then you think of BMX and trials types that never sit (why do they even have saddles??) and you start to think you're a weak cycling idiot, which fully applies to me.

Also, it's hard to imagine cleaner than the old WL or this new (to me) Squirt stuff.  I just get some gray dry stuff if I wipe the chain and everything stays nice and clean.  I had always heard that it was no bueno in wet conditions, but I assumed that meant wet crossings and whatnot, but apparently includes just humid riding conditions and maybe some damp dirt spray.  I'll just be more conscious of lubing early if I have "damp" rides.

The other thing I have heard about the dry/waxy lubes is that after a chain cleaning or really wet ride, you may need to apply heavy and/or more than once. but if you stay dry, pretty light applications are fine.  So, again, I probably need to recalibrate my definition of "wet ride."  Plus, I did rinse my bike lightly after a couple of these rides, so I probably did remove more lube than I thought.  I did the usual "re-up" early after those washes and dirty/damp rides that provoked them, but apparently not enough.

Fun fact, Braff has been riding droppers longer than I've been riding MTB.

Edited December 28, 2019 by TwiceHorn

[Loco 3754]

On 12/19/2019 at 11:46 AM, Pescado_Rojo said:

Talked to a guy at Yeti tech support. The rear triangles are all the same size/geometry so I could buy the one on Ebay, but the guy I talked to said that even though I'm not the original owner and don't have a warranty they would still honor a crash replacement claim and sell me a new rear triangle. He's checking to see what they have in stock and will let me know later today, so I feel a lot better about my options. Also, it's pretty clear my local shop hasn't been selling Yeti very long (just started last year) because almost everything my tech told me has been wrong*. 

*Maybe just trying to sell me a new bike, IDK. 

I was gonna be sad if Yeti didn't help you out...  they have always been a great company with a great product that they stand behind.  Glad to hear you have more options

[Braff Zacklin 13676]

18 hours ago, wd40 said:

I rarely drop mine more than a couple inches.  which is to say never, unless I'm just sitting on it to shoot the shit with my bros, when I would otherwise sit on the top tube. 

You'd probably use it more if you mounted the lever correctly.

[wd40 1976]