The Surly Mountain Biking Thread

[Stinkpalm 687]

1 hour ago, Wiler77 said:

Sorry I'm just now seeing this.  I've been in CB for 7 weeks, with 1 more to go.  I've biked the mountain just twice, but have done a ton of the trails in the area.  And my 2 oldest boys (9 and 7) have been doing bike camp on the mountain twice a week.  They are now officially better than me.

Curious as to your comment "they don't have a ton of runs".  What are the other mountain bike destinations in the US in terms of downhill runs?  I've always thought the CB mountain had a good number of runs with a wide variety of difficulty, but I've never been anywhere else to purely mountain bike.  So I don't have much to compare to.  I'm extremely fortunate that my in-laws own a condo up here, so there's never really a debate as to where we go in CO each summer, but I'd still like to know for future reference, guys trip, etc.

BTW, where did you camp and fly fish?  Been doing quite a bit of that over the past 2 months as well.  Well, the fly fishing at least.  Too bad work gets in the way, but I've managed a few 3-4 day weekends.

First off, that’s awesome about the kids. I was amazed at the number of kids I saw riding the trails (likely part of the bike camp.) 

CB definitely had fun runs and I thoroughly enjoyed my day there, so there was certainly no disappointment in the variety (if it came off that way). That said, there just weren’t many offshoot trails that branched off the main runs, and midway down the mountain most of the trails begin to merge down to a green runout and a black runout. So while there’s decent variety at the top, whatever you choose will have you riding the same couple of runouts for a good bit of your run. I compare that to places like Vail or Angel Fire, where you might have the same number of options at the top, but then there are short offshoot and transfer trails all throughout  the runs and they all only merge once you near the very bottom. I will say, that double black diamond there (forget the name), looked insane. Rode everything else multiple times, but I probably wouldn’t even walk down that run! (Attached a pic of the visible part of that trail from the lift for others)

for a mtb specific trip (at least for us Texans making a road trip), I’d say Breckenridge area as a central location is a fun trip, and one I’ve done several times. Vail is an hour down the road, keystone is fun, and copper mtn has a new bike park that I haven’t been on yet but looks to be pretty good. And then there are some really good traditional trails right around Breckenridge that will challenge your lungs going up, and are a blast going down. Angel fire is another great one. And then there’s always Bentonville, where the Waltons have donated millions of dollars to build that area into a mtb Mecca. That’s a must-do for any dfw mtb-er, IMO, given the relatively close proximity to dfw (compared to driving out west).

We camped outside of Almont, up near the Taylor Reservoir and focused on the Taylor River. I plan to go back to that area and explore more of the Gunnison, but the fishing was just too good on the Taylor this trip. We caught a lot nice fish and lost some monsters, but the dry fly bite was phenomenal. If you haven’t ventured up that way, make the drive up to the catch and release area just below the reservoir and look over the bridge. It’s like looking down into an aquarium. Large trout stacked on top of each other. It’s unreal. 

[Stinkpalm 687]

Just to add, this is by far the best pic that came out of that trip. After heading back from CB bike park, we stopped off at camp just long enough to drop the bike and grab the fishing gear. Decided to give the C&R area a go, and ended up getting into some nice fish that evening. As I’m holding this one up for a pic, the four month old reached out and gave the fish a feel. Proud F’ing dad! (And just for reference, that’s a small fish in that stretch of the Taylor)

[TwiceHorn 31495]

10 hours ago, Stinkpalm said:

First off, that’s awesome about the kids. I was amazed at the number of kids I saw riding the trails (likely part of the bike camp.) 

CB definitely had fun runs and I thoroughly enjoyed my day there, so there was certainly no disappointment in the variety (if it came off that way). That said, there just weren’t many offshoot trails that branched off the main runs, and midway down the mountain most of the trails begin to merge down to a green runout and a black runout. So while there’s decent variety at the top, whatever you choose will have you riding the same couple of runouts for a good bit of your run. I compare that to places like Vail or Angel Fire, where you might have the same number of options at the top, but then there are short offshoot and transfer trails all throughout  the runs and they all only merge once you near the very bottom. I will say, that double black diamond there (forget the name), looked insane. Rode everything else multiple times, but I probably wouldn’t even walk down that run! (Attached a pic of the visible part of that trail from the lift for others)

for a mtb specific trip (at least for us Texans making a road trip), I’d say Breckenridge area as a central location is a fun trip, and one I’ve done several times. Vail is an hour down the road, keystone is fun, and copper mtn has a new bike park that I haven’t been on yet but looks to be pretty good. And then there are some really good traditional trails right around Breckenridge that will challenge your lungs going up, and are a blast going down. Angel fire is another great one. And then there’s always Bentonville, where the Waltons have donated millions of dollars to build that area into a mtb Mecca. That’s a must-do for any dfw mtb-er, IMO, given the relatively close proximity to dfw (compared to driving out west).

We camped outside of Almont, up near the Taylor Reservoir and focused on the Taylor River. I plan to go back to that area and explore more of the Gunnison, but the fishing was just too good on the Taylor this trip. We caught a lot nice fish and lost some monsters, but the dry fly bite was phenomenal. If you haven’t ventured up that way, make the drive up to the catch and release area just below the reservoir and look over the bridge. It’s like looking down into an aquarium. Large trout stacked on top of each other. It’s unreal. 

[TwiceHorn 31495]

On 8/5/2021 at 10:19 PM, sasquatch69 said:

rode loop 1 to the temp bypass, then 8-12, then back down to 2-5 on the south side (I'd heard 6 was totally overgrown so I skipped it).

That's one of the best "long" rides in the metro, imo.  I suppose Northshore lets you put something together that long.  Good mix of fast flat flow and some climby droppy stuff.  I like that the climby droppy stuff happens "in the middle" with 9-11.  You're warm and good to go, but not starting to tire.  And you don't have to repeat anything.

[Wiler77 1566]

13 hours ago, Stinkpalm said:

First off, that’s awesome about the kids. I was amazed at the number of kids I saw riding the trails (likely part of the bike camp.) 

CB definitely had fun runs and I thoroughly enjoyed my day there, so there was certainly no disappointment in the variety (if it came off that way). That said, there just weren’t many offshoot trails that branched off the main runs, and midway down the mountain most of the trails begin to merge down to a green runout and a black runout. So while there’s decent variety at the top, whatever you choose will have you riding the same couple of runouts for a good bit of your run. I compare that to places like Vail or Angel Fire, where you might have the same number of options at the top, but then there are short offshoot and transfer trails all throughout  the runs and they all only merge once you near the very bottom. I will say, that double black diamond there (forget the name), looked insane. Rode everything else multiple times, but I probably wouldn’t even walk down that run! (Attached a pic of the visible part of that trail from the lift for others)

for a mtb specific trip (at least for us Texans making a road trip), I’d say Breckenridge area as a central location is a fun trip, and one I’ve done several times. Vail is an hour down the road, keystone is fun, and copper mtn has a new bike park that I haven’t been on yet but looks to be pretty good. And then there are some really good traditional trails right around Breckenridge that will challenge your lungs going up, and are a blast going down. Angel fire is another great one. And then there’s always Bentonville, where the Waltons have donated millions of dollars to build that area into a mtb Mecca. That’s a must-do for any dfw mtb-er, IMO, given the relatively close proximity to dfw (compared to driving out west).

We camped outside of Almont, up near the Taylor Reservoir and focused on the Taylor River. I plan to go back to that area and explore more of the Gunnison, but the fishing was just too good on the Taylor this trip. We caught a lot nice fish and lost some monsters, but the dry fly bite was phenomenal. If you haven’t ventured up that way, make the drive up to the catch and release area just below the reservoir and look over the bridge. It’s like looking down into an aquarium. Large trout stacked on top of each other. It’s unreal. 

Psycho Rocks. Never in a million years will I do that one.

Very familiar with the Taylor and that stretch below the dam. The fish have their PhDs in fly identification.  I've had really good luck on the East River this trip.

We're heading up Spring Creek to the reservoir today. Will stop and wet a line along the way. Also want to scout potential camp sites for future reference.

[TwiceHorn 31495]

Also, tell me about saddles.  I have had a WTB that I don't recall and the OEM Marin saddle, both of which have been perfectly comfortable.  I don't seem to have a sensitive ass and also rarely ride longer than an hour and a half.

My inclination is WTB Silverado or Volt.  I'll measure the current one to figure out "size."

[Stinkpalm 687]

Psycho Rocks. That was it. No telling how many collarbones that run has claimed. 
 

Yeah, they’ve definitely seen it all on that river. They’ll make you run through your entire fly box looking for the right fly, and even with the right fly it takes multiple perfect drifts, especially in the C&R stretch. We actually did quite well all up and down that river, to my surprise. There were so many emergences while we were there, And we wore them out on dries. This was my first trip to that area of Colorado, so I had planned on hitting quite a few rivers in the area, including the East. But with the newborn, it ended up being easier to just run up and down the Taylor since we were camping on it. I may have to pick your brain before our next trip up there since I wasn’t able to scout out the other streams in the area.

[wd40 1976]

2x:  I perch on an Origin8 (off Amazon), nowadays.  I loved the fit of the WTB RocketV for years, but figured out the stitching was wearing out the seams in my shorts.  new saddle is similar shape so comfortable, but without big seams.  everyone's sit bones are different.  ymmv.

Stink:  Psycho Rocks looks like fun in that pic.  youtubes of it further up show some serious pucker factor.

family trip to NM, mostly to use up an airbnb we had booked during The Fucking Blizzard and had to reschedule.  I got one day at Angel Fire, tho.  monsoon conditions, and dealing with tendonitis in my forearm.  preride mode on the double blacks.

oh, @KuЯdt, thanks for the route intel.  been meaning to do an urban assault at SWT for years (saw a video long time ago, but no satellite maps, back then).  scratch one off the bucket list (getting close).

 

 

 

 

[sasquatch69 603]

Did ~30 more miles on the 29er this weekend - at Erwin, Katie Jackson, RCP and Horseshoe - and feeling more and more used to it. 

I decided to try out Strava to start officially tracking my rides, and for the most part the functionality is exactly what I'm looking for.  However, the mileages across the board are lower than both my bike computer and the official distances listed on Trailforks.  For example, the total loop at Erwin is just over 9mi, but the Strava app said it was 8; combined loops at Horseshoe total 5mi, but Strava said 3.8.  

Dug online a bit and it looks like iOS is notorious for GPS shorting distances for tracking apps like this, and they recommend using a Bluetooth cadence tracker and pairing it via the Wahoo Fitness app.  Anyone have experience with this?  Any advice?

[Bigpoppapump 531]

3 minutes ago, sasquatch69 said:

Did ~30 more miles on the 29er this weekend - at Erwin, Katie Jackson, RCP and Horseshoe - and feeling more and more used to it. 

I decided to try out Strava to start officially tracking my rides, and for the most part the functionality is exactly what I'm looking for.  However, the mileages across the board are lower than both my bike computer and the official distances listed on Trailforks.  For example, the total loop at Erwin is just over 9mi, but the Strava app said it was 8; combined loops at Horseshoe total 5mi, but Strava said 3.8.  

Dug online a bit and it looks like iOS is notorious for GPS shorting distances for tracking apps like this, and they recommend using a Bluetooth cadence tracker and pairing it via the Wahoo Fitness app.  Anyone have experience with this?  Any advice?

All I can say is I have a wahoo chest band and like it.

[TwiceHorn 31495]

20 hours ago, sasquatch69 said:

Did ~30 more miles on the 29er this weekend - at Erwin, Katie Jackson, RCP and Horseshoe - and feeling more and more used to it. 

I decided to try out Strava to start officially tracking my rides, and for the most part the functionality is exactly what I'm looking for.  However, the mileages across the board are lower than both my bike computer and the official distances listed on Trailforks.  For example, the total loop at Erwin is just over 9mi, but the Strava app said it was 8; combined loops at Horseshoe total 5mi, but Strava said 3.8.  

Dug online a bit and it looks like iOS is notorious for GPS shorting distances for tracking apps like this, and they recommend using a Bluetooth cadence tracker and pairing it via the Wahoo Fitness app.  Anyone have experience with this?  Any advice?

I think almost all the GPS driven things are short.  The twisties and shade challenge the receivers and algorithms.

Segments in Strava annoy me (as they don't always or even often correspond to certain loops), as does the competitive aspect.  Cooter Brown recommended AllTrails as a GP ride tracker and I have been happy with it.  Using Android, it's still about 10% short, give or take. The Trailforks app itself I think does ride tracking.  I have even on occasion used the map location on Alltrails to get myself unlost, or find a short route back to the trailhead, most recently when my relative "expired" two miles into Boulder (there are a lot of trails that come close to each other at different points, but hard to figure out which ones/direction will get you to the trailhead fastest).

Also, on the 29er, and I don't know how much of this you have screwed around with, but drop the pressure in your front tire to 20 psi or so, depending on your weight.  With that, a decent fork, and the 29" wheels, you roll stuff that you think is at least going to be a good bump, like butta.

Edited August 10, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[Pato del Muerto 52516]

On 8/3/2021 at 12:47 PM, TwiceHorn said:

That Marin from Pinkbike is pretty much a steal.  Good frame and decent hardware, upgraded with an air fork and 12spd der.  Not very old, either.  Unless the frame is dinged up, that's going to be hard to beat for what you pay.

I contacted that seller, but looked at their sizing and I’m too tall for that frame. 
 

is this a good value for price?

https://www.bikesonline.com/2022-polygon-premier-4-27.5-inch-mountain-bike?gclid=CjwKCAjwpMOIBhBAEiwAy5M6YPbjLsx5zJcIBcJmv0QnV-qIA3AE_FaHp7xPqjRer4OCLCOjZKqGthoClOQQAvD_BwE

[TwiceHorn 31495]

8 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

I contacted that seller, but looked at their sizing and I’m too tall for that frame. 
 

is this a good value for price?

https://www.bikesonline.com/2022-polygon-premier-4-27.5-inch-mountain-bike?gclid=CjwKCAjwpMOIBhBAEiwAy5M6YPbjLsx5zJcIBcJmv0QnV-qIA3AE_FaHp7xPqjRer4OCLCOjZKqGthoClOQQAvD_BwE

You might give it a try anyway, it's a lot better bike for a little more money.  Not that there's anything wrong with Polygon.

That's the pretty standard coil fork, straight steerer, non-boost, 9mm QR hub hardtail that's sold for $5-600 new for five years.  It will get you on the trail, but it's not a bargain and it isn't upgradeable.

Edited August 11, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[Pato del Muerto 52516]

8 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

You might give it a try anyway, it's a lot better bike for a little more money.  Not that there's anything wrong with Polygon.

That's the pretty standard coil fork, straight steerer, non-boost, 9mm QR hub hardtail that's sold for $5-600 new for five years.  It will get you on the trail, but it's not a bargain and it isn't upgradeable.

https://www.bikeconnection.net/product/marin-bolinas-ridge-1-370485-1.htm?variations=156804,156806,156808?utm_source=google shopping&utm_medium=organic
 

?? same general idea?

[TwiceHorn 31495]

6 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

https://www.bikeconnection.net/product/marin-bolinas-ridge-1-370485-1.htm?variations=156804,156806,156808?utm_source=google shopping&utm_medium=organic
 

?? same general idea?

Yep.  The Polygon is actually preferable for two reasons.  2x drivetrain and hydraulic brakes.  The fork also has 20mm more travel, but that probably makes little difference, as it's coil.

[Pato del Muerto 52516]

Bike connection has a lot in the 500-600 dollar range. They’re all in that price point for a reason, just a matter of picking one I guess. 

[sasquatch69 603]

15 hours ago, Pato del Muerto said:

Bike connection has a lot in the 500-600 dollar range. They’re all in that price point for a reason, just a matter of picking one I guess. 

On a related note, the 29er I've been borrowing the past few weeks has been great, and I'm ready to take the plunge to buy my own - but the above (500-600) is my price range for now.

Locally, there's a guy selling a L 29" Specialized Rockhopper Sport, and another guy selling a L 29" Giant Talon 3, both for the same price.  I realize they're  considered entry-level, but they both meet a minimum standard of quality I expect.  The Giant seems to get slightly better reviews, and it's an 8x2 drivetrain (which I prefer over the 3 up front with the Specialized).  Some bike forum folks also say the Giant is more upgradeable.

Your thoughts?

[KuЯdt 248]

On 8/8/2021 at 9:47 PM, wd40 said:

oh, @KuЯdt, thanks for the route intel.  been meaning to do an urban assault at SWT for years (saw a video long time ago, but no satellite maps, back then).  scratch one off the bucket list (getting close).

 

 

 

 

 

lol, nice!  Yeah that's a good spot for an urban ride.  Back in the day we used to do "coaster" races there at night.  We'd start on the bridge above Comanche Street and race down to the Quad.  Only rule was no pedaling once you hit that first set of stairs.  Lots of fun on 90's era XC bikes.

 

Speaking of Angel Fire, I'll be up there 2 weeks from now.  Planning on a couple of park days, and also to ride the South Boundary Trail.  Has anyone here ridden it?  I'm gonna try to have my wife shuttle me, since our Airbnb is near the starting point and trying to estimate the time.  It's 21 miles with about 1800' ascent and 4400' descent, so I'm thinking it will take me 2-3 hours although it is at 10k feet for much of the ride.

Edited August 11, 2021 by KuЯdt

[KuЯdt 248]

On 8/7/2021 at 6:58 PM, TwiceHorn said:

Also, tell me about saddles.  I have had a WTB that I don't recall and the OEM Marin saddle, both of which have been perfectly comfortable.  I don't seem to have a sensitive ass and also rarely ride longer than an hour and a half.

My inclination is WTB Silverado or Volt.  I'll measure the current one to figure out "size."

I rode on a WTB Silverado for years and liked it a lot.   Last year I switched to an Ergon SM-Comp and I like it a bit better than the WTB.

[TwiceHorn 31495]

Well, hell.

As mentioned above, the guy that did my cable and housing thought the NX had a weak return spring, producing the increased inability to shift down from the big cog (11), and increasingly not from 10, or even 9.  It's great on the smaller cogs.  Because the cable and housing was replaced and the issue persisted (it has been bad going 11>>10 for some time, requiring a double-upshift to get out of 11) and worsened, it seemed to me reasonable that the der was kludgy.

Got the call that the GX was in to be swapped in and talked to another tech, who thought that the cassette might be the culprit.

I generally keep my shit clean and lubed.  I replaced the chain not too long ago, so I know that's not the issue and it wasn't very far gone.  

Also, I don't have chattering or slipping or any of that shit, just weak/nonexistent/slow shifts down the cassette in the big cogs.  I thought cassettes usually showed their wear by a) bad shifts to bigger cogs (opposite of my problem) because ramps and teeth are worn and b) general purpose chattering, grinding, and chain-slip, none of which I have.

The drivetrain has 1000 miles on it.

Edited August 11, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[wd40 1976]

7 hours ago, KuЯdt said:

 

lol, nice!  Yeah that's a good spot for an urban ride.  Back in the day we used to do "coaster" races there at night.  We'd start on the bridge above Comanche Street and race down to the Quad.  Only rule was no pedaling once you hit that first set of stairs.  Lots of fun on 90's era XC bikes.

 

Speaking of Angel Fire, I'll be up there 2 weeks from now.  Planning on a couple of park days, and also to ride the South Boundary Trail.  Has anyone here ridden it?  I'm gonna try to have my wife shuttle me, since our Airbnb is near the starting point and trying to estimate the time.  It's 21 miles with about 1800' ascent and 4400' descent, so I'm thinking it will take me 2-3 hours although it is at 10k feet for much of the ride.

I was wondering about the 'coaster' part of the video title.   I couldn't make even those minimal hucks without pedaling some.

SBT solo?  bring a good map and don't get too tired and zone out because there is some route finding to be done.  I stayed out of it, because what good was one more finger on the map gonna do?  specifically, there is a park for equestrian access, so you end up riding for a bit on a dirt road.  just took some thought as to which way to go, there.  we were also lucky in that there was a race a week before, so there were no downed trees to deal with.

the first climb from the trailhead on FSR 76 up to Osha Pass is brutal.  1.4 miles, and my Strava avg speed was 1.7mph.  I started out too fast, and didn't recover til we were over the pass.  but I'm a lowlander.  not bad at all after that.  second grind up 1000' was easy compared to the one at the start.  this was a few years ago, my first trip out there.  the guy driving the SBT ride wanted to start at the bottom of 76, but got easily overruled, esp after 3 days of park.  so the big guy not doing SBT hauled us all up there, packed into a chevy pickup.  at the other end, the condo owner we stayed with piled us into his cargo van with our bikes, and drove us to La Cueva in Taos for lunch.  epic day.

I think we saw maybe two people until we got to the last descent into Taos, where it was yabba-dabba-do time on the switchbacks to the end.  kind of a culture shock, plus dealing with kids and dogs on hairpins.

there's an awesome overlook, just before the final descent.  kinda subtle turn off at a dogleg, but it's a good spot to celebrate the achievement.

have fun.  be careful out there.  gets pretty chunky in spots, in the last 4 miles or so.

 

2x:  springs wear out.  very good chance it's shot, with that kinda mileage.  had it happen on my last der.  usually bend a cage before that happens.  not saying the cassette, chain and chainrings aren't due for replacement, but diagnosing the spring on the der should be pretty easy.  if there's a belly in the chain...

[TwiceHorn 31495]

8 hours ago, wd40 said:

I was wondering about the 'coaster' part of the video title.   I couldn't make even those minimal hucks without pedaling some.

SBT solo?  bring a good map and don't get too tired and zone out because there is some route finding to be done.  I stayed out of it, because what good was one more finger on the map gonna do?  specifically, there is a park for equestrian access, so you end up riding for a bit on a dirt road.  just took some thought as to which way to go, there.  we were also lucky in that there was a race a week before, so there were no downed trees to deal with.

the first climb from the trailhead on FSR 76 up to Osha Pass is brutal.  1.4 miles, and my Strava avg speed was 1.7mph.  I started out too fast, and didn't recover til we were over the pass.  but I'm a lowlander.  not bad at all after that.  second grind up 1000' was easy compared to the one at the start.  this was a few years ago, my first trip out there.  the guy driving the SBT ride wanted to start at the bottom of 76, but got easily overruled, esp after 3 days of park.  so the big guy not doing SBT hauled us all up there, packed into a chevy pickup.  at the other end, the condo owner we stayed with piled us into his cargo van with our bikes, and drove us to La Cueva in Taos for lunch.  epic day.

I think we saw maybe two people until we got to the last descent into Taos, where it was yabba-dabba-do time on the switchbacks to the end.  kind of a culture shock, plus dealing with kids and dogs on hairpins.

there's an awesome overlook, just before the final descent.  kinda subtle turn off at a dogleg, but it's a good spot to celebrate the achievement.

have fun.  be careful out there.  gets pretty chunky in spots, in the last 4 miles or so.

 

2x:  springs wear out.  very good chance it's shot, with that kinda mileage.  had it happen on my last der.  usually bend a cage before that happens.  not saying the cassette, chain and chainrings aren't due for replacement, but diagnosing the spring on the der should be pretty easy.  if there's a belly in the chain...

In this case, it's not the spring that rotates the cage, I don't think.  It's the spring in the der body that pulls it outward that's weak when it's stretched out the most.

I don't know why I'm kind of concerned about it.  It's not going to be massively expensive, either way.  I guess it's like going to the car shop, you don't want to be sold a bill of goods.  Maybe I should look at it as an opportunity to go from 11-42 up to 46.

[KuЯdt 248]

16 hours ago, wd40 said:

I was wondering about the 'coaster' part of the video title.   I couldn't make even those minimal hucks without pedaling some.

SBT solo?  bring a good map and don't get too tired and zone out because there is some route finding to be done.  I stayed out of it, because what good was one more finger on the map gonna do?  specifically, there is a park for equestrian access, so you end up riding for a bit on a dirt road.  just took some thought as to which way to go, there.  we were also lucky in that there was a race a week before, so there were no downed trees to deal with.

the first climb from the trailhead on FSR 76 up to Osha Pass is brutal.  1.4 miles, and my Strava avg speed was 1.7mph.  I started out too fast, and didn't recover til we were over the pass.  but I'm a lowlander.  not bad at all after that.  second grind up 1000' was easy compared to the one at the start.  this was a few years ago, my first trip out there.  the guy driving the SBT ride wanted to start at the bottom of 76, but got easily overruled, esp after 3 days of park.  so the big guy not doing SBT hauled us all up there, packed into a chevy pickup.  at the other end, the condo owner we stayed with piled us into his cargo van with our bikes, and drove us to La Cueva in Taos for lunch.  epic day.

I think we saw maybe two people until we got to the last descent into Taos, where it was yabba-dabba-do time on the switchbacks to the end.  kind of a culture shock, plus dealing with kids and dogs on hairpins.

there's an awesome overlook, just before the final descent.  kinda subtle turn off at a dogleg, but it's a good spot to celebrate the achievement.

have fun.  be careful out there.  gets pretty chunky in spots, in the last 4 miles or so.

 

2x:  springs wear out.  very good chance it's shot, with that kinda mileage.  had it happen on my last der.  usually bend a cage before that happens.  not saying the cassette, chain and chainrings aren't due for replacement, but diagnosing the spring on the der should be pretty easy.  if there's a belly in the chain...

awesome, thanks for the info.  That lines up with what I've read on the interwebs.  The first climb is the only part that concerns me, since it is the very first thing you do without even a chance to warm up the legs.  I read somewhere that if you follow the signs for 164 that should get you there. I'll also have the offline Trailforks map, so with luck I'll get down to Taos without issue.

[TwiceHorn 31495]

8 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

In this case, it's not the spring that rotates the cage, I don't think.  It's the spring in the der body that pulls it outward that's weak when it's stretched out the most.

I don't know why I'm kind of concerned about it.  It's not going to be massively expensive, either way.  I guess it's like going to the car shop, you don't want to be sold a bill of goods.  Maybe I should look at it as an opportunity to go from 11-42 up to 46.

Well, bike back with GX der and nothing else.  So, that apparently solved the problem.  Only $24 to install, but I paid retail for the der, which is ok given the parts shortage.  I had found one on amazon for about $30 less, but it was gone by the time I decided to do something.

I'm a bit ashamed that I didn't feel up to installing it myself.  I'm good with everything except B-gap/tension, which I think is tricky on the 1x, wide range cassettes.  Maybe it's only the Eagle 12.

I will probably be itching to install a GX shifter before long.  In looking at what the real differences are between the various SRAM and Shimano models, I discovered that the NX shifter is considerably lighter than all the mechanical shifters in their lineup, due to use of plastic.  I suppose if you're a real weight weenie, that might be useful info.

[Braff Zacklin 13617]

A thousand miles isn't that much for a drivetrain component. Shit happens, but a Shimano or SRAM part should last longer. If tension had already been troubleshot, my guess would've been L limit screw setting or a bend in the cage causing the chainline to be off.

Had a similar problem plaguing one of my RDs after spilling my bike last year, except it was on the other end (shifting into the hardest gear). Tension was fine, H limit was tip top, but the problem persisted. Finally got sick of it and took a closer look and noticed the chainline seemed off, so I pulled outward on the cage a bit and it's been shifting perfectly ever since.

[TwiceHorn 31495]

59 minutes ago, Braff Zacklin said:

A thousand miles isn't that much for a drivetrain component. Shit happens, but a Shimano or SRAM part should last longer. If tension had already been troubleshot, my guess would've been L limit screw setting or a bend in the cage causing the chainline to be off.

Had a similar problem plaguing one of my RDs after spilling my bike last year, except it was on the other end (shifting into the hardest gear). Tension was fine, H limit was tip top, but the problem persisted. Finally got sick of it and took a closer look and noticed the chainline seemed off, so I pulled outward on the cage a bit and it's been shifting perfectly ever since.

Well, I had made sure they checked the hanger alignment and I don't think I ever pranged it. H and L limits and alignment seemed pretty good. I suspected something was wonky (cable, that little frigging pulley/wheel on the der itself, the pivots, spring) with the der.  Just the slightest nudge with a finger would make it drop down, but the der itself couldn't seem to manage to do that without first double shifting and then, lately, it was just fucking bad.  I'd upshift til the cable was slack and nada, until several revs of the cranks.

And yeah, 1000 miles isn't a ton, really.  Just offered as a benchmark, and really for cassette more than anything else.  I accept that the NX failing is premature and probably some kind of defect.  The GX has rolling element bearings where the NX has bushings, so maybe that will help some.

Edited August 12, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[sasquatch69 603]

Well, you can disregard my request for advice above because today turned into New Bike Day for me.  Got a great deal on this Marin 29er, and it meets all my criteria for being incrementally upgradeable.  It's got a decent Shimano 2x9, which I'll likely eventually replace with an SRAM 1x12 once budget allows, and already has dropper post routing if I want to add that later.  But for now, I'm excited to ride it - and finally be the owner of a more current bike.

 

Edited August 12, 2021 by sasquatch69

[TwiceHorn 31495]

Congrats, man.

One of the first upgrades you may wish to look into is an air fork.

Suntour has had an upgrade program that lets you get into an air fork pretty cheap.  https://www.srsuntour.us/pages/upgrade-program

And their air forks are getting pretty rave reviews these days.

One thing, it looks like it may have a straight steerer, which will limit your upgrade opportunities there, especially for "used" take-off forks and whatnot.

The upgrade program should be able to find you a straight steerer fork with good air spring and dampers, and the Manitou Markhor is a soild entry level air fork that comes in straight steerer with 9mm dropouts.

 

Edited August 12, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[TwiceHorn 31495]

Ahahaha.

God dammit.

I didn't ride it at the shop.  It still is reluctant to come out of 11.  I'm going to take a look at the shifter to see if something's hanging up there.

I am reasonably certain that it shifted fine on the workstand.  

I should have gone to Dallas Bike Works for this, most likely.

[TwiceHorn 31495]

11 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Ahahaha.

God dammit.

I didn't ride it at the shop.  It still is reluctant to come out of 11.  I'm going to take a look at the shifter to see if something's hanging up there.

I am reasonably certain that it shifted fine on the workstand.  

I should have gone to Dallas Bike Works for this, most likely.

Well, the shifter is nicely oily inside and everything seems to "pop" and move freely, so I guess that isn't the problem.  It's meaningless, but eyeballing the hanger looks like it might be angling slightly outwardly, which one would think might cause the opposite problem.

This morning, it seemed to be coming out of 11 to a greater extent than yesterday, but still a mite sluggish.  It is pretty hard to generate any tension or load while or after shifting in that 42t cog, which seems to kind of affect it some.

Maybe because it's new, or maybe because GX, it is a bit crisper in the smaller cogs.

Question:  when the chain really thunks into the smallest cogs, say the last two upshifts, does that mean the cable needs more tension or something?  It still downshifts into bigger cogs just fine.  I can tighten it and smooth that out some, if it is a problem, but I don't know whether to consider it a problem or not. It's positive as hell, at least. And I think when it's tighter it risks "overshifts" in the middle cogs.

[sasquatch69 603]

17 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Congrats, man.

One of the first upgrades you may wish to look into is an air fork.

Suntour has had an upgrade program that lets you get into an air fork pretty cheap.  https://www.srsuntour.us/pages/upgrade-program

And their air forks are getting pretty rave reviews these days.

One thing, it looks like it may have a straight steerer, which will limit your upgrade opportunities there, especially for "used" take-off forks and whatnot.

The upgrade program should be able to find you a straight steerer fork with good air spring and dampers, and the Manitou Markhor is a soild entry level air fork that comes in straight steerer with 9mm dropouts.

 

Thanks - that's all good info. I'm probably going to hold off on any upgrades for now (other than the RaceFace Chesters that are being delivered today) and just enjoy it as is, but fork is likely the very first thing I'll upgrade.  It is indeed a straight steerer, which is weird given that it's a 2021 model, but Marin has always been a little idiosyncratic that way.  It looks like Suntour has a couple straight options, and that Manitou looks good too; the RockShox Judy Silver TK Solo Air is compatible as well.

Edited August 13, 2021 by sasquatch69

[TwiceHorn 31495]

36 minutes ago, sasquatch69 said:

Thanks - that's all good info. I'm probably going to hold off on any upgrades for now (other than the RaceFace Chesters that are being delivered today) and just enjoy it as is, but fork is likely the very first thing I'll upgrade.  It is indeed a straight steerer, which is weird given that it's a 2021 model, but Marin has always been a little idiosyncratic that way.  It looks like Suntour has a couple straight options, and that Manitou looks good too; the RockShox Judy Silver TK Solo Air is compatible as well.

Yeah, even a "bargain" fork is a chunk of cash.  Don't sleep on the Suntours.  I'd give one of their forks serious consideration if I were to upgrade from my RS Recon.  The upgrade program looks like it gives about $100 off, and your current fork doesn't have to be new, or even Suntour (at least in the past).

I don't think it's a Marin thing, really.  No one makes coil forks with a tapered steerer (except the $1500 ones), so if the choice is made to use a coil fork, then straight headtube it is.  The aforementioned relative bought a '21 Trek Marlin and it has a straight steerer.  Because the fork is probably the single most expensive component on a bike (after the frame), to achieve the price point, it's one of the first/primary things that's sacrificed, and the head tube follows the fork choice.

Edited August 13, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[TwiceHorn 31495]

3 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Well, the shifter is nicely oily inside and everything seems to "pop" and move freely, so I guess that isn't the problem.  It's meaningless, but eyeballing the hanger looks like it might be angling slightly outwardly, which one would think might cause the opposite problem.

This morning, it seemed to be coming out of 11 to a greater extent than yesterday, but still a mite sluggish.  It is pretty hard to generate any tension or load while or after shifting in that 42t cog, which seems to kind of affect it some.

Maybe because it's new, or maybe because GX, it is a bit crisper in the smaller cogs.

Question:  when the chain really thunks into the smallest cogs, say the last two upshifts, does that mean the cable needs more tension or something?  It still downshifts into bigger cogs just fine.  I can tighten it and smooth that out some, if it is a problem, but I don't know whether to consider it a problem or not. It's positive as hell, at least. And I think when it's tighter it risks "overshifts" in the middle cogs.

Perhaps against my better judgment, I rode it as-is (may cost me some consideration at the shop since it will be dirty and more "used").

I guess because new or GX, shifts on the trail were really quite nice.  All of the upshifts super fast and quiet, except 11-10.  That was becoming increasingly untrue with the NX, to an extent I probably didn't realize.  Don't think I got to the thunky last two cogs, though.  Still a bit sluggish coming out of 11, but it does, which is an improvement over the NX.  If I am actually able to pedal under some load in 11, then the shift is pretty much acceptable.  If I'm spinning out, it's pretty slow.

So, I guess I'll just leave it be for a while and see what happens.  

[TwiceHorn 31495]

Kind of a funny addendum to my derailleur saga.  Saturday, I rode Rowlett Creek.  On loop 10, there are some pretty steep up/downs, where the climb is really steeper than the descent, so gear management can become important; that is, the descent is not steep enough to generate sufficient momentum to get up the next climb, you're gonna have to pedal, and hopefully in a low enough gear.

So, I have thought that the 11-10 shift was non-critical because generally being in too low a gear is not a problem.

I did these two climb/drops on 10, negotiating them successfully, if barely so on the second.  I think on the downside of the second climb, I upshifted to be ready to pedal when I ran out of descent, maybe I didn't or maybe I didn't pedal enough to make the shift, or maybe that sluggish 11-10 upshift got me.

In any event, I rode out the descent, which leads to some off-camber, exposed stuff and reached the point where I needed to pedal. And the gear was so low that my pedaling effort sent me offline and I almost shot off the trail and down the side of the hill, which would have been kind of unpleasant, but it wasn't too brushy and didn't lead into a creek.  Needless to say I had to stop before flying off.  I think that's the first time I ever hosed myself by being in too low a gear.

And, I'm still futzing with the barrel adjuster to find the sweet spot and hopefully make that 11-10 shift smoother and faster.  Well, I must have fuct something up because I was tooling along and started getting this deep rumble, not the usual bad-index clicking.  I tried shifting out of it, but for whatever reason it wouldn't stop.  I actually thought the bottom bracket had failed.  But I got off the trail, inverted the bike, took the chain off and determined it wasnt the BB.  When I put it all back together, whatever it was was gone, never to recur.

[Al_4_ISU 12464]

I've been staying off Surly for obvious non-MTB related reasons, but figured I'd check in on this thread with a funny story.

A couple weeks ago I went riding up in the Twin Cities with my brother and a buddy, and we had a great day hitting 3 different parks and logging about 15-16 miles.  My brother was dinking around with my bike and thought the rear hub seemed loose, so we tightened it up and no biggie.

A week ago Friday, I'm riding at the normal spot in Decorah and had just finished a long climb out of the river bottoms up to the top of a large bluff where most of the XC style trails are, and was really feeling strong.  I decide to try a familiar trail in a different direction for a new challenge, and within 30' I hear a horrific noise, come to an abrupt stop, and go flying over my handle bars.

Somehow, my rear hub had worked itself fully loose, separated from the bike, and took the derailleur and chain flying into the wheel, destroying several spokes in the process.  The slot where the hub mounted to the body had become warped/bent in and that was allowing the hub to work itself loose pretty quickly.

Of course I was about 3.5 miles away from my car when this happened, so I had a pleasant rage hike back.

Thankfully my local shop was able to source a new hub, wheel, and derailleur and I was back at it yesterday.

[sasquatch69 603]

3 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Kind of a funny addendum to my derailleur saga.  Saturday, I rode Rowlett Creek.  On loop 10, there are some pretty steep up/downs, where the climb is really steeper than the descent, so gear management can become important; that is, the descent is not steep enough to generate sufficient momentum to get up the next climb, you're gonna have to pedal, and hopefully in a low enough gear.

So, I have thought that the 11-10 shift was non-critical because generally being in too low a gear is not a problem.

I did these two climb/drops on 10, negotiating them successfully, if barely so on the second.  I think on the downside of the second climb, I upshifted to be ready to pedal when I ran out of descent, maybe I didn't or maybe I didn't pedal enough to make the shift, or maybe that sluggish 11-10 upshift got me.

In any event, I rode out the descent, which leads to some off-camber, exposed stuff and reached the point where I needed to pedal. And the gear was so low that my pedaling effort sent me offline and I almost shot off the trail and down the side of the hill, which would have been kind of unpleasant, but it wasn't too brushy and didn't lead into a creek.  Needless to say I had to stop before flying off.  I think that's the first time I ever hosed myself by being in too low a gear.

And, I'm still futzing with the barrel adjuster to find the sweet spot and hopefully make that 11-10 shift smoother and faster.  Well, I must have fuct something up because I was tooling along and started getting this deep rumble, not the usual bad-index clicking.  I tried shifting out of it, but for whatever reason it wouldn't stop.  I actually thought the bottom bracket had failed.  But I got off the trail, inverted the bike, took the chain off and determined it wasnt the BB.  When I put it all back together, whatever it was was gone, never to recur.

That's bizarre.

On 9/10, did you do the little Glenn's Way extension shortly before you go back under the bridge to 1A?  That one nearly caused me to go OTB last time I rode there - there's a sharp right turn right near the end that goes right into a climb up with a bunch of roots.  Caught me totally by surprise, and left me humbled after navigating the climbs before that OK. 

[sasquatch69 603]

2 hours ago, Al_4_ISU said:

I've been staying off Surly for obvious non-MTB related reasons, but figured I'd check in on this thread with a funny story.

A couple weeks ago I went riding up in the Twin Cities with my brother and a buddy, and we had a great day hitting 3 different parks and logging about 15-16 miles.  My brother was dinking around with my bike and thought the rear hub seemed loose, so we tightened it up and no biggie.

A week ago Friday, I'm riding at the normal spot in Decorah and had just finished a long climb out of the river bottoms up to the top of a large bluff where most of the XC style trails are, and was really feeling strong.  I decide to try a familiar trail in a different direction for a new challenge, and within 30' I hear a horrific noise, come to an abrupt stop, and go flying over my handle bars.

Somehow, my rear hub had worked itself fully loose, separated from the bike, and took the derailleur and chain flying into the wheel, destroying several spokes in the process.  The slot where the hub mounted to the body had become warped/bent in and that was allowing the hub to work itself loose pretty quickly.

Of course I was about 3.5 miles away from my car when this happened, so I had a pleasant rage hike back.

Thankfully my local shop was able to source a new hub, wheel, and derailleur and I was back at it yesterday.

What a freak thing - glad you weren't seriously hurt.  That's one of those "I can laugh about it now" stories that could have easily gone the other way.

[Al_4_ISU 12464]

1 hour ago, sasquatch69 said:

What a freak thing - glad you weren't seriously hurt.  That's one of those "I can laugh about it now" stories that could have easily gone the other way.

100%.  I was thankful I was on a flat spot without any jagged limestone chunks around.  The repair bill wasn't bad either, especially considering how little I have into my hard tail money-wise.

I was fuming mad at the time, though.  It was early in what felt like it was going to be a really strong ride, and I had a fairly long hike back to my car.

Edited August 16, 2021 by Al_4_ISU

[TwiceHorn 31495]

1 hour ago, sasquatch69 said:

That's bizarre.

On 9/10, did you do the little Glenn's Way extension shortly before you go back under the bridge to 1A?  That one nearly caused me to go OTB last time I rode there - there's a sharp right turn right near the end that goes right into a climb up with a bunch of roots.  Caught me totally by surprise, and left me humbled after navigating the climbs before that OK. 

Last time I tried Glenns, the bottom of it was all soft bark and wood and stuff and as I powered up for that first climb, rear wheel spun out.  So, although I usually do ride Glenns, until that barky crap subsides, I am avoiding.

It does catch you by surprise, but I am no longer surprised by it.

[TwiceHorn 31495]

I have a dumb question. 

After my ride Saturday, I got rained on, bigtime bro.  Bike got a good washing.

When I got home, I took it off the rack and the brakes sounded like they were rubbing, making a gritty sound.  I have noticed this before on the fairly rare occasion that I go through some water on a creek crossing or whatever.  It dissipates pretty quickly and doesn't seem to make much difference whether I brake a little bit to "dry them off" and brake function doesn't seem diminished.

What's up with that?

[TwiceHorn 31495]

Holy geezus.  I bought a cheapass single-speed/fixie to ride when the trails are wet, the idea being that SS or especially fixie might be more fun to ride and less wear and tear on my tires.  It is a lot of fun and I think it will be a great purchase.

Its 44/16 ratio, which was surprisingly stiff.  I rode it around the neighborhood, which includes a few hills that I interval on, but didn't interval, just spun.  Maybe like four miles?  And, you'd think I didn't ride 100 miles last month at all.  I am sore as shit.  I was somewhat surprised that my sort of natural cadence lies right around 120 (hard to count it on the trail and I figured it had probably slowed a bit).  I haven't ridden a single speed bike since I was 11 and even then I mostly rode a 5-spd.

This thing may be a real boon for my fitness.  The psychology of not having a downshift available is great.

[Your Mom 4806]

I've got a SS I take out for coffee in the mornings.  It's only a mile away but sometimes I take the trail home and add a short local loop for a couple extra miles.  It's a whole 'nother world of bike riding.   It's a constant state of discomfort with either the irritability of spinning too fast or the pain of mashing too big a gear.  It's good for reminding yourself that not every problem needs to be solved with a bike upgrade.  Not what I'd want to spend the majority of my ride time on, but worthy of a spin every now and then.  

[TwiceHorn 31495]

39 minutes ago, Your Mom said:

I've got a SS I take out for coffee in the mornings.  It's only a mile away but sometimes I take the trail home and add a short local loop for a couple extra miles.  It's a whole 'nother world of bike riding.   It's a constant state of discomfort with either the irritability of spinning too fast or the pain of mashing too big a gear.  It's good for reminding yourself that not every problem needs to be solved with a bike upgrade.  Not what I'd want to spend the majority of my ride time on, but worthy of a spin every now and then.  

Well put.

My issue with road riding is that it bores me, basically.  It lacks the mental engagement of off-road riding.  I tend to stay in the hood or cross as few busy streets as possible to minimize the car-danger element, so I am somewhat limited as to where I can go and how far, and I feel like it isn't much of a workout for an hour's ride or so.

Single-speed changes that calculus, for sure.  If I flip it to fixie, that's a whole other world again, I'm sure.

[TwiceHorn 31495]

At risk of polluting the thread with road shit, I skipped a trail ride in favor of hair of the dog to loosen myself up.  The real mash on this SS is starting off, so I quit doing that and just toddled off like an old man, it's really kind of sad.  I actually walked a couple of busy street crossings because I didn't want to mash hard and get a quick start. I stayed away from hills, but they're unavoidable, I just tried not to mash, slow and steady.  And the gear is high enough that I cruise at pretty reasonable speed.  I passed up just about everyone I came across without trying.

I really figured I'd be really spinning on this thing, but I am not, at all.  I think I may actually be getting something of a workout without having to tear ass around, or ride for three hours, but it's not the kind of workout I was expecting.

And, I got a text from an occasional riding buddy about a slowish ride at Northshore Saturday morning, so I may pop my cherry there.

Edited August 24, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[Your Mom 4806]

16 teeth in the back is pretty hefty. Maybe try an 18. It’ll be a noticeable difference. 

[TwiceHorn 31495]

2 hours ago, Your Mom said:

16 teeth in the back is pretty hefty. Maybe try an 18. It’ll be a noticeable difference. 

I'm seeing that to be true, although among fixie fehgs, that's apparently pretty standard (44x16).  Hard to conceive of Dallas, Texas being regarded as hilly outside of maybe Oak Cliff/SW Dallas.

Also, I guess I lied because I have ridden, not extensively, a couple of single speed mountain bikes, but wasn't intelligent enough to ask the gearing.  They certainly seemed to be lower than this, which I suppose is fairly obvious.

Edited August 24, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[KuЯdt 248]

19 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

I'm seeing that to be true, although among fixie fehgs, that's apparently pretty standard (44x16).  Hard to conceive of Dallas, Texas being regarded as hilly outside of maybe Oak Cliff/SW Dallas.

Also, I guess I lied because I have ridden, not extensively, a couple of single speed mountain bikes, but wasn't intelligent enough to ask the gearing.  They certainly seemed to be lower than this, which I suppose is fairly obvious.

You going hipster on us?  lol

A 44x16 would be pretty nuts on a mtb.  I have a SS that I used to ride down to slaughter creek trail or just the southie trails in general.  I barely ride it anymore.  I think it is 32x20.  That gearing works fairly well on the trails, but you get spun out very quickly on the streets or longer flat sections.  The guy I bought it from said he rode the Enchilada Buffet on it (that's about an 80 mile ride of 5 or so major trail systems in Austin, riding the streets from one to the next). I assume he changed up the gearing for that ride as that would suck hard in its current config.

[TwiceHorn 31495]

11 hours ago, KuЯdt said:

You going hipster on us?  lol

A 44x16 would be pretty nuts on a mtb.  I have a SS that I used to ride down to slaughter creek trail or just the southie trails in general.  I barely ride it anymore.  I think it is 32x20.  That gearing works fairly well on the trails, but you get spun out very quickly on the streets or longer flat sections.  The guy I bought it from said he rode the Enchilada Buffet on it (that's about an 80 mile ride of 5 or so major trail systems in Austin, riding the streets from one to the next). I assume he changed up the gearing for that ride as that would suck hard in its current config.

It appears that maybe I am!  I am really kind of digging this thing.

Yeah, I was definitely expecting more of a spin-out experience than a mash experience.  I expected to get better at pedaling fast and standing, not stronger, but here it is.  I'm going to see how much stronger I get on this thing before I start dinking with the gearing.   I am super-wary of curbs and bumps in a way I haven't been in decades and am less annoyed by paved trails than I am on my MTB.  I must say it's quite fun being on a tiny frame with a vertical headtube and hard, skinny tires.  

[sasquatch69 603]

Been riding a lot lately, and really getting used to the new bike.  Got the bluetooth speed sensor and HR monitor up and running, which have really made me more conscious about the fitness aspect of it (especially w/r/t improving resting heart rate and cardio/fat burn rates).  We're also doing a scout campout next month focused on mountain biking, which should be really interesting (already got them going on the maintenance and safety aspects of the merit badge).

Did 6.5 this morning at Big Cedar - great to ride at sunrise, and had the place pretty much to myself.  Still kicked my butt.

 

[TwiceHorn 31495]

Well, as kind of indicated above, I have been traitorous to the dirt.  It was so hot last week that I just rode the SS on the street because it took zero preparation or travel time, pretty much 100% ride time.  

I was planning to hit Moss this morning because it's been pretty mild the last few days, but a service call came early and then I got balled up with work.  so, I just finished mashing the streets.  And I went out before noon and it was scorching compared to the last few days.

I'll be back on the dirt Thursday somewhere.