The Surly Mountain Biking Thread

[Pescado_Rojo 19262]

33 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Interdasting.  In doing bike research, I am seeing a lot of hate for Fox forks and shocks.  I had considered the Fox stuff on the Ripley to be an upgrade, and I'm sure it is over the entry level RS stuff on the Marin, at least in terms of adjustability, if not outright function.

I have this feeling that I may really miss the Marin and maybe even regret not replacing it with a Marin.   From a purely sentimental standpoint, I already miss it.  But replacing it with the same bike wouldn't be much fun.

Interesting about the Fox hate. Anything specific, or just generalities? I've always kind of heard there was Fox Factory>>>Everything else, including other Fox products. Probably just a Ford vs Chevy thing I guess? 

[TwiceHorn 30851]

2 hours ago, Pescado_Rojo said:

Interesting about the Fox hate. Anything specific, or just generalities? I've always kind of heard there was Fox Factory>>>Everything else, including other Fox products. Probably just a Ford vs Chevy thing I guess? 

Lots of complaints about the Fit dampers, which are supposed to be upgrades over Grip.  Bad small bump compliance.  Hard to tune.  Seems more related to the "guts" of them, and it's not confined to the OEM Rhythm type, it's everything, although the 36 seems to be much better than the 34.  But a lot of generality along the line of "Fox is just resting on their reputation."

But, one thing you do see is a lot of recommendations of Avalanche suspension for "maintenance."  They not only rebuild, but change out the guts and the valving for about the same cost as a Fox factory rebuild, which gets trashed a lot too.

People seem to tend to favor Pike and Lyrik and a lot of love for DVO stuff.  And for Manitou pretty much everything.

[KuЯdt 248]

I can only speak to my own experience, and I haven't ridden Rockshox in many years.  But I didn't get along with the 34 and fit4 damper on my Occam.  If I tried to make it a bit more plush, I'd end up bottoming it out on bigger hits.  It would be too harsh if I tuned it for big hits.  I started playing with volume spacers, but then went to angelfire and that was it for me.  It was just overwhelmed there, which I suppose is to be expected for a 34 in a bike park.

After that I wanted to upgrade, and was going to get a Lyrik or a Pike just to switch things up.  But all I could get at the time was a 36 so that's what I went with.  That fork has been great, and has the fit4.  The Grip2 damper is the best they offer, and I think has a better rep than the fit4.  But my 36 has a fit4 and i have no complaints.

About a month ago a buddy and I switched bikes for a ride out at Pedernales Falls.  he had the 34 with Grip2 damper, and I thought it felt great.  better than my old 34.  

I believe the Grip and Grip2 damper may actually have been developed my Marzocchi, which Fox now owns.

[TwiceHorn 30851]

38 minutes ago, KuЯdt said:

I can only speak to my own experience, and I haven't ridden Rockshox in many years.  But I didn't get along with the 34 and fit4 damper on my Occam.  If I tried to make it a bit more plush, I'd end up bottoming it out on bigger hits.  It would be too harsh if I tuned it for big hits.  I started playing with volume spacers, but then went to angelfire and that was it for me.  It was just overwhelmed there, which I suppose is to be expected for a 34 in a bike park.

After that I wanted to upgrade, and was going to get a Lyrik or a Pike just to switch things up.  But all I could get at the time was a 36 so that's what I went with.  That fork has been great, and has the fit4.  The Grip2 damper is the best they offer, and I think has a better rep than the fit4.  But my 36 has a fit4 and i have no complaints.

About a month ago a buddy and I switched bikes for a ride out at Pedernales Falls.  he had the 34 with Grip2 damper, and I thought it felt great.  better than my old 34.  

I believe the Grip and Grip2 damper may actually have been developed my Marzocchi, which Fox now owns.

Yeah, I see the Marzocchi Bomber getting a fair amount of love.  I seem to recall that when Marzocchi and Manitou kind of "re-entered" the suspension space a couple of years back, they were pretty economical.  Not so much anymore.   People gushed all over the Manitou Mattoc, and you could pick one up for $500.  They also seem to love the Mara shock.

I might guess that whatever valving Fox uses doesn't work so well on the smaller-diameter 34 because the 36 doesn't get the same hate.

Lots of competition in the suspension space these days.

Hopefully, i can get the fork dialed for small bump compliance.  Other than being kind of a fatass, I don't have many big hits.  It appears to have the Grip damper, but information is conflicting and parts substitution is rampant.

It's supposed to come with Dissector F and DHR rear, but I am getting Nobby Nic front and Hans Dampf rear, which don't seem to be "Texas" tires, really.  The tread pattern looked good/familiar though (been riding Rekon), but I bet they are slow rollers.

Edited March 11, 2022 by TwiceHorn

[wd40 1976]

my Fox experience is limited, basically ending in 2009 with the 80mm air fork I spec'd on my SS.  have never loved it, but I don't hate it, exactly.  it would be unrealistic to expect a fork like that to make a hardtail feel plush over the rocky stuff we ride here in Austin.  I liked the Vanillas I had, at least until the springs wore out.   main reason I never gave Fox another shot is pricing.  just never seemed like a good value.  and those Talas forks of theirs, packed with "features" like adjustable travel.  I just want smooth functionality with low maintenance; and all that fancy stuff just seemed counter to that MO.

I assume they're easier tune now than they used to be.  

I had a Zoke for a while.  liked it a lot; much more than the Foxes.  sort of a custom Frankenstein build by a former employee of theirs that started a side business doing rebuilds and refurbs of their stuff.  when I went up to 29" wheels on the trail bike, it just became a wall hanging in the garage.

academic, because I love my Lyrik.  never thought I'd say that about a fork.  performs great, I got a nice deal on it, and it's super-easy to tune and maintain.

good luck with the new ride, 2X.  I probably would have stuck with the Marin for the SLX drive train, but that's upgradable on the Ibis, if you're patient and watch for deals (eBay can be a good source).

[TwiceHorn 30851]

7 hours ago, wd40 said:

good luck with the new ride, 2X.  I probably would have stuck with the Marin for the SLX drive train, but that's upgradable on the Ibis, if you're patient and watch for deals (eBay can be a good source).

Yeah, if I could have found one, I would have gotten it, most likely.  You hear pretty good things about Deore 12, though.  A lot of people sub in the XT shifter, which gives 3 up, but apparently is stiff as hell.  Even the Shimano fanbois concede that SRAM shifters are better across the board, and I guess that's a possibility, also.

I don't really "deserve" much upgrade in componentry.  We'll see if I can make any use of any of it.  The theft and replacement value insurance (as opposed to trying to sell an old bike) presented a "unique" opportunity to upgrade a little.

[wd40 1976]

don't deserve?  because you stored your bike outside? 😜

SLX checks all my boxes:  tough, reliable, relatively cheap.

[TwiceHorn 30851]

1 hour ago, wd40 said:

don't deserve?  because you stored your bike outside? 😜

SLX checks all my boxes:  tough, reliable, relatively cheap.

Well, that and I'm a shitty rider.  

[destroya 358]

17 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Yeah, if I could have found one, I would have gotten it, most likely.  You hear pretty good things about Deore 12, though.  A lot of people sub in the XT shifter, which gives 3 up, but apparently is stiff as hell.  Even the Shimano fanbois concede that SRAM shifters are better across the board, and I guess that's a possibility, also.

I don't really "deserve" much upgrade in componentry.  We'll see if I can make any use of any of it.  The theft and replacement value insurance (as opposed to trying to sell an old bike) presented a "unique" opportunity to upgrade a little.

I’ve got shimano xt shifters and the ergonomics and shifting are way way better than the equivalent sram shifters on the bikes I demo’d. YMMV. 
 

and fuck all that bs about deserving nice parts. Nice bikes are nice to ride and nicer bikes are even nicer to ride. 

[wd40 1976]

that.  not wondering if your shit will work in fast-moving situation will free you up to be a better rider.

[Braff Zacklin 13299]

Mountain biking is a hobby, a pastime, a release, a fitness routine. These sort of things seldom make for sound financial investments, but they can provide immeasurable rewards in terms of quality of life.

I frequently advise people not to spend unnecessarily on upgrades because I'm cheap and because most of that new componentry isn't going to improve your riding. But if it gets you excited to ride, and if riding rewards your heart, lungs and soul ... then it is absolutely money well spent.

With that in mind, I'd say this to @TwiceHorn: You're a lawyer and seem financially stable, so what does $2K or $3K here or there matter? What else are you saving that money for? Besides friends and family, where could it be better spent than on something that brings you joy and health?

Sure, you might not ride a $6K bike any better than you would a $3k one, but if the $6K one makes you feel better, then go for it. Be sure to post pics and share your first impressions.

Just don't leave it outside overnight.

Spoiler

(Too soon?)

[TwiceHorn 30851]

4 hours ago, Braff Zacklin said:

Mountain biking is a hobby, a pastime, a release, a fitness routine. These sort of things seldom make for sound financial investments, but they can provide immeasurable rewards in terms of quality of life.

I frequently advise people not to spend unnecessarily on upgrades because I'm cheap and because most of that new componentry isn't going to improve your riding. But if it gets you excited to ride, and if riding rewards your heart, lungs and soul ... then it is absolutely money well spent.

With that in mind, I'd say this to @TwiceHorn: You're a lawyer and seem financially stable, so what does $2K or $3K here or there matter? What else are you saving that money for? Besides friends and family, where could it be better spent than on something that brings you joy and health?

Sure, you might not ride a $6K bike any better than you would a $3k one, but if the $6K one makes you feel better, then go for it. Be sure to post pics and share your first impressions.

Just don't leave it outside overnight.

  Reveal hidden contents

(Too soon?)

The upgrade to the FS Marin was kind of out of the blue, but it did make me ride more, and was justifiable as a moderate expense at $1900.

The theft and insurance reimbursement is making this one possible, as I am not sure I would spend even the relatively moderate cost of the Ripley AF, but for this occurrence.

As a real duffer rider, I can't justify any more than that.  Which is what I meant by "deserved."  I may "grow" into the somewhat improved components of the Ripley, but I doubt I will ever want or need a carbon bike or spend today's $5k on a bike.  And, frankly, for my purposes, carrying around an extra 3-4 lbs on the bike is a benefit, considering it's about 1% of the total package.

As far as I know, the NX/NX and NX/GX combo never failed me when I needed them.  Nor did the entry-level suspension.  Maybe the Ripley will open up another "world" of riding that the Marin did, but I rather doubt it.  I harbor some hope that it helps my climbing some, because I have actually seen a couple of comparos that say it's easier getting up rooty, rocky stuff on the Ripley than the Marin, but the Marin was a pretty efficient pedaling platform, despite the simple suspension.

I am personally very resistant to the "arms race" that men's hobbies that involve equipment generally devolve into.  Part of that is because I am a cheapskate, and part of it is that I subscribe to the ride up grades, not upgrades philosophy.  I need to feel a pretty firm conviction that hardware is holding me back somehow before I go upgrading in most things. I might maybe have "outgrown" my old-school hard tail, but I didn't really know it.  I don't think I was anywhere near outgrowing the Marin.  And aging is probably going to keep me from really improving my riding sooner than later.

Edited March 13, 2022 by TwiceHorn

[TwiceHorn 30851]

Here's a question.  The Ripley comes with Schwalbe Hans Dampf 2.6 front and rear.  By most accounts, it's a pretty decent all-around tire.  But no one rides them in Texas, as far as I can tell, and they're 200g heavier, EACH, than the Rekons I was running.

I don't know shit from fuck, much, but I am pretty sure I am going to hate that weight.  But I'm not looking forward to dropping another 200 on a set of Maxxis.

I guess I could ask the shop if they could give any consideration on the Schwalbes, but probably not since no one rides them around here.  And that also means that I probably can't sell them either.  

ETA:  Like the above post, I'm not sure that I am a competent/confident enough rider to immediately go replacing components on a brand new bike.  I feel like I should give "new" things a try, at least.  So, I strongly suspect that I will not be thrilled with the weight and slow-rolling nature of the HD.  It does seem to be one of the "fattest" 2.6s on the market though.  So, I will probably give them a few rides F/R, and, rather than replace both, use the HD up front and maybe put a Rekon, XR4, or something out back at a 2.4 or 2.35.

Edited March 15, 2022 by TwiceHorn

[TwiceHorn 30851]

New bike day.  Collarbone park open even after last night's rain and hail.

Ummm.  HOLY SHIT.  This bike is significantly more composed over the kind of mild shit we ride than the Marin.  Katie Jackson Black Loop is basically non-stop roots.  It varies a little depending on how washed out the dirt is, but is always bumpy as hell.  No problemo. They even added a bypass for the "worst part," and I just glided right over it.  I should add that the Marin never gave me problems on this loop, either, but the Ibis lets me go faster and is less jarring.  I suppose that's the better fork as much as anything else.  I really didn't think most of Dallas trails would really expose the RS Recon, but something was mucho better.

My first lap on the bike, when I wasn't feeling particularly steezy, and was being kind of ginger about things, was a PR.  And this was using factory setup, hardly any tweakage, and just using same tire pressure on the 2.6s that are supposed to be heavy and slow-rolling that I was using on the Rekons on the Marin.

Besides being smoother and more composed over roots and rocks, the most noticeable thing was hub engagement.  I had read that the Ibis hubs were pretty decent, but they kick the living shit out of the Formulae on the Marin.  I don't ratchet through rock gardens or anything, but the complete lack of clunk after coasting was remarkable.  Of course, everything on the Marin was nearly four years old except the frame, so that could be part of it, although I had the fork and shock rebuilt summer 20.

The DeOre was fine and shifted about like you'd expect brand new to.  Funny thing, at times, I wished for some adjustability on the NX shifter because I felt like I had to reach with my thumb to upshift.  The upshift on the DeOre doesn't have that problem and is actually slightly in the way.  It's the ispec thing, so I will have to figure that out.

Also, I think the 44mm offset on this fork removes a bit of that slop/flop that annoyed me on the Marin, might also be the shorter stem.  In the pic above, for example, the wheel on the Marin probably would have been nearer 90 degrees because of flop.  I even felt a little sharper in the twisties.

I really didn't think I would get a whole lot out of the upgrades on this bike.  I was wrong.

Edited March 15, 2022 by TwiceHorn

[Pescado_Rojo 19262]

Damn nice looking bike, 2X

[TwiceHorn 30851]

I like the silver better than I thought I would.  Had I had choices, I might have gone with the "pond scum green," but I'm pretty ok with it.

I was wrong about the Hans Dampf f/r, the Nobby Nic in back is a lighter, faster rolling tire.  It was a little hard to tell about that on this one ride.  It wasn't hero dirt, but it wasn't dry and crusty either.  The HD is a beast though as far as big knobs and it even looks fatter than the Rekon 2.6 I had on the Marin.  I think I'm gonna be ok with the tires.

I tried bedding the brakes in the parking lot, but they were still a little squirrely for the first mile or so, but I did some trail bedding and they were fine by the end.

[Stinkpalm 675]

Hadn’t had time to check in on this thread in a while (or ride either, unfortunately). Sorry to hear about the theft, Twice. But it sounds like the upside of the new bike is far outweighing the downside of having the old one stolen. My mojo came with the same tire combo, and I had plans to swap even before taking delivery… but like you, I’ve been pleasantly surprised by them. They’ve treated me well on every type of trail so far, from hard pack, to sandy Northshore, to bike parks in Colorado. They’ve just flat out worked. And to throw in my two cents about the Fox suspension talk further up thread, it seems that the hate was mostly confined to the fit4 damper. Fox, thankfully, took note and mostly went back to the grip dampers. My factory came with the grip2 and it’s handled everything I’ve thrown at it. If your performance came with the grip or grip2, and you’re already liking it (which appears to be the case), you’re gonna love it once it’s fully broken in. Bike looks great! And the top tube graphics are dope!

[TwiceHorn 30851]

Yeah, it's definitely the Grip, thankfully.  And, either way, since I rarely bottom the suspension, I may not have the troubles some have had with the tuning, spacers, etc. that Kurdt and others have had.

Not being able to ride for a week was a constant reminder of the "violation" of the theft, and my own stupidity at leaving it on the porch.  But it had been that way for years without incident.  So, yeah, now I can start to move past it.

Also, the bike is sitting in the living room, with wife's consent, until I figure out a better storage/locking option.  I could put it in the garage, which is not attached, but there's nothing to lock it to.  I can lock it to a column on the back porch, which I preferred (no climate advantage over the garage) just because I could see it.  It was literally two feet from the back door on a deep, covered porch.  Fuckers.

Edited March 16, 2022 by TwiceHorn

[Braff Zacklin 13299]

22 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

So, yeah, now I can start to move past it.

[Al_4_ISU 12376]

It seems like it's weirdly taking time for our trails to dry out in spring thaw.  I tried to ride on some crushed limestone (non singletrack) with my fat bike last night and it was just mush, so I stuck to actual roads (which I don't much care for).  There were spots with better sun hit that were fit, but the wet stuff seemed like it would never turn.

We have great weather in the forecast, but not for the trails unfortunately.

[midtown 3339]

On 3/13/2022 at 9:50 PM, TwiceHorn said:

Here's a question.  The Ripley comes with Schwalbe Hans Dampf 2.6 front and rear.  By most accounts, it's a pretty decent all-around tire.  But no one rides them in Texas, as far as I can tell, and they're 200g heavier, EACH, than the Rekons I was running.

this is what came on my bike. I've been riding them with no issues but Im kind of a newb to mtn bikes.  I have some Maxxis to put on soon

[TwiceHorn 30851]

1 hour ago, midtown said:

this is what came on my bike. I've been riding them with no issues but Im kind of a newb to mtn bikes.  I have some Maxxis to put on soon

I can't find much reference to Texas folk riding or preferring Schwalbe tires on the various fora.  They *seem* to be a tad more downhill oriented and heavy than what people usually want/need around our parts, even accounting for the differences between nawf, central, and sawf Texas.

I liked my Rekons pretty well and it's a little early to tell on the Schwalbes as far as rolling resistance etc., but it seems promising.  Hell, I liked the Vee Crown Gems that came on the Marin pretty well, but the side knobs tore pretty quickly.

[TwiceHorn 30851]

Bleh.  I am messing around with the shift lever and can't get it any further inboard without moving the brake in, which I am hesitant to do.

The upshift lever on the Deore is pretty long, and my thumb hits it on the way to the downshift lever and to get in front of the upshift lever.  Probably no big deal in the long run, I'll get used to it, but it's strange.  And it's the extension for hitting it with your index finger that basically causes the problem.  And that's useless to me, because I keep my index finger on the brake.  

[Pescado_Rojo 19262]

3 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

I can't find much reference to Texas folk riding or preferring Schwalbe tires on the various fora.  They *seem* to be a tad more downhill oriented and heavy than what people usually want/need around our parts, even accounting for the differences between nawf, central, and sawf Texas.

I liked my Rekons pretty well and it's a little early to tell on the Schwalbes as far as rolling resistance etc., but it seems promising.  Hell, I liked the Vee Crown Gems that came on the Marin pretty well, but the side knobs tore pretty quickly.

I had Schwalbe Racing Ralphs on the Yeti when I got it. They were super light, but I shredded them pretty quickly on CenTex limestone. Then I went to Specialized Ground Controls, that were a tad heavy, but lasted really well. I'm on Rekons now and like them a lot, but they seem to be wearing fast. 

[Al_4_ISU 12376]

There's a shit ton of limestone in northeast Iowa and I've been on the same set of Maxxis tires for what will be the start of my 3rd season here.  And I put a lot of miles on in '20 and '21 on said limestone.

[Pescado_Rojo 19262]

Well shit. The Velofix guy just finished up with a service and chain replacement on my bike and found a crack on the top of the BB housing. I replaced the rear triangle in 2020 just before Covid lockdown and it cost me around $800 with the rear triangle, bearing and race kit, and labor. I'm afraid she might be done for this time. He put a sharpie mark on the end of the crack so I can keep an eye on it, but I think it's definitely in hospice care. 

[TwiceHorn 30851]

So, also gone with the bike were a CO2 inflator, a little multitool, a tube, and tire levers.

I never used anything but the multitool on the trail, but it lacked a chainbreaker, which I have never had to use but would feel better about.  I've never had a flat since tubeless, but did have a burp event once when running pressure too low.

Hardly any of the trails I ride are more than a mile or two walkout, at worst.  Should I even bother with anything but the tool?

And, any tool recos?  I had a smallish Topeak with basically the allen head, a phillips or two and a flat head.

Seems like maybe bacon is worth carrying, too, with a little tool, but I have never had to use.

[wd40 1976]

10 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Yeah, it's definitely the Grip, thankfully.  And, either way, since I rarely bottom the suspension, I may not have the troubles some have had with the tuning, spacers, etc. that Kurdt and others have had.

Not being able to ride for a week was a constant reminder of the "violation" of the theft, and my own stupidity at leaving it on the porch.  But it had been that way for years without incident.  So, yeah, now I can start to move past it.

Also, the bike is sitting in the living room, with wife's consent, until I figure out a better storage/locking option.  I could put it in the garage, which is not attached, but there's nothing to lock it to.  I can lock it to a column on the back porch, which I preferred (no climate advantage over the garage) just because I could see it.  It was literally two feet from the back door on a deep, covered porch.  Fuckers.

unless you like to keep your garage open all the time, it should be fine for storing your bike without locking it to something.  thieves look for targets of opportunity; which means visible and easily accessible.  gararaging your bike is fine, as long as you keep the door down when you're not in it our outside, near it.  if thieves have the time to hack through chains to get to your bike, you got much bigger problems.

I carry a Crank Bros multi-tool.  it's heavy, especially for the (little) use I get out of it.  but it has a chain tool, fwiw.

a bacon kit is mandatory, imo (unless you're running tubes).  

[TwiceHorn 30851]

50 minutes ago, wd40 said:

unless you like to keep your garage open all the time, it should be fine for storing your bike without locking it to something.  thieves look for targets of opportunity; which means visible and easily accessible.  gararaging your bike is fine, as long as you keep the door down when you're not in it our outside, near it.  if thieves have the time to hack through chains to get to your bike, you got much bigger problems.

I carry a Crank Bros multi-tool.  it's heavy, especially for the (little) use I get out of it.  but it has a chain tool, fwiw.

a bacon kit is mandatory, imo (unless you're running tubes).  

Carry an inflator of any kind?

And, I think you're right about targets of opportunity.  I may just get a cable for the porch, also.

[jw4381 3044]

The west rim of Taos gorge  

 

 

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[jw4381 3044]

The west rim of Taos gorge  

 

 

 

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[wd40 1976]

2 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Carry an inflator of any kind?

And, I think you're right about targets of opportunity.  I may just get a cable for the porch, also.

in my little Dakine pack, I carry a very minimalist Lezyne CO2 trigger.  in my Blowfish pack, I have an old Blackburn manual pump and one of those black and green plastic CO2 deals.  can't remember the brand.

on your porch storage obsession:

[TwiceHorn 30851]

43 minutes ago, wd40 said:

in my little Dakine pack, I carry a very minimalist Lezyne CO2 trigger.  in my Blowfish pack, I have an old Blackburn manual pump and one of those black and green plastic CO2 deals.  can't remember the brand.

on your porch storage obsession:

Haha, obsession? ETA:  misread, I thought you wrote "pouch."  The cable, or maybe chain, is for the furniture and grill, and maybe a bike occasionally.

My little bag of crap was part influenced by pre-tubeless and part post-tubeless.  I'm taking this opportunity to sort of update it.

Used the multitool several times.  I think I donated a tube once to another rider and some CO2.

And, "fuck all that shit" would be an acceptable answer, too.  

Edited March 17, 2022 by TwiceHorn

[jw4381 3044]

Ok, this ain't working. Sorry my dudes.

Edited March 17, 2022 by jw4381

[KuЯdt 248]

Congrats on the new bike, Twice.  Sounds like you're gonna really dig it.

 

As for storage options, this needs to be you:

[Al_4_ISU 12376]

I carry a manual pump, tube, multi tool, and tire changing kit in my camelback.  They might combine to weigh 2 lbs.  Maybe.  Haven't needed it with the mountain bike, and that doesn't feel like a coincidence.  Take out an insurance policy and you'll never cash in on it.

[TwiceHorn 30851]

7 minutes ago, KuЯdt said:

Congrats on the new bike, Twice.  Sounds like you're gonna really dig it.

 

As for storage options, this needs to be you:

Lulz.  Not far from the truth.

[TwiceHorn 30851]

1 minute ago, Al_4_ISU said:

I carry a manual pump, tube, multi tool, and tire changing kit in my camelback.  They might combine to weigh 2 lbs.  Maybe.  Haven't needed it with the mountain bike, and that doesn't feel like a coincidence.  Take out an insurance policy and you'll never cash in on it.

For whatever reason, I don't like riding with a pack very much and only do it in the hottest temps, or maybe if I anticipate a really long ride.  It's really I think more the idea of it than the reality (having to fill it, etc.).  So I keep this stuff in a little under-saddle bag that very slightly interferes with my dropper.

[Al_4_ISU 12376]

10 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

For whatever reason, I don't like riding with a pack very much and only do it in the hottest temps, or maybe if I anticipate a really long ride.  It's really I think more the idea of it than the reality (having to fill it, etc.).  So I keep this stuff in a little under-saddle bag that very slightly interferes with my dropper.

I usually ride for an hour at a minimum and frequently go for up to 2 hours on weekends.  I would be hard pressed to go 45 minutes without having that water access.

It's one of those things where I didn't think I ever needed it, and then I tried it and have no desire to ever go back to not using one.  I use it on road rides and hikes too.  I almost don't notice that I'm wearing it, and it absolutely helps me with hydration and subsequently performance.

I'm not trying to proselytize, but I've found the advantages to be light years ahead of the inconvenience of filling it before you leave the house.

[midtown 3339]

I have to have a pack.   Like the poster above I am usually dirking water within 10-15 mins of riding even on a cool day.   Might be gross but mine is pretty much stays full.  I try to ride my mtn bike 2x a week so I just end up dumping a cup full of ice in it when I go out.   Also the advantage of having my spare tube and tools.  Also I keep my phone in it for strava

[Al_4_ISU 12376]

28 minutes ago, midtown said:

I have to have a pack.   Like the poster above I am usually dirking water within 10-15 mins of riding even on a cool day.   Might be gross but mine is pretty much stays full.  I try to ride my mtn bike 2x a week so I just end up dumping a cup full of ice in it when I go out.   Also the advantage of having my spare tube and tools.  Also I keep my phone in it for strava

Phone storage is another advantage that I had forgotten about.  I used to just through my phone in my jersey pouch, but it always ends up too sweaty to use the screen.  This is a freaking headache when you're on unfamiliar trails and trying to keep your head straight via Trailforks.  I keep a little cloth in there to dry my fingers off too.

[TwiceHorn 30851]

Don't get me wrong, I carry a 24 oz water bottle, so I drink.

Ride 2 down at Harry Moss (spent yesterday buying four new tires for el carro, among other things).  The orange loop there is 2.1 miles of twisty.  There's probably no more than 20 contiguous yards on that loop that is straight.  I felt like the steering through that was more "balanced" than on the old bike.   You can't really lean your turns because it's so tight, so it's almost all steering with the bars.

I really do believe the steering works better for me on this bike than the Marin.  I would initially attribute it to the 44mm offset of the fork, which I think mitigates a bit of the slack geo.  The other possibility, I guess, is the 32mm fork on the Marin flexing some.  I wouldn't think my trails and riding style would stress a fork too much, but I am 200 lbs.

The other sort of acidy test is the first half of the blue loop.  It has a series of little punchy climbs that crest around a tree or group of trees and are rooty.     So, you have to go up the climb, which is not steep enough to be hard, but those roots at the crest can stop you dead and you have to turn left pretty sharply to go around the tree(s) and then descend over the roots on the other side.  It's not a 180 switchback, but maybe 100 or 120 degrees "around." You can try to take a "wide" line to avoid some of the roots, but that makes the turn harder to execute, as it's pretty tight. As @sasquatch69 can attest, it's pretty tricky.

Right or wrong, expecting the Fox 34 to do better, I hit the roots pretty hard (no wide line) and felt more positive turning around the tree(s) to head back down.  However, on the last one, that may have been a mistake because my pedal hit on the root I was going over twice and stopped me in a different way than usual.  Otherwise, I cleaned it, which was kind of unexpected on the new bike.

I got the shifter to a spot where the upshift lever doesn't bother me much, so that's nice.  I still graze it with my thumb some, but that just locates it for me.

Also, the trail was pretty dry and I didn't feel like the tires were super-heavy, they seemed to roll pretty well.  And I think they offer more cornering bite than the Rekons, so that's going to be kind of fun, I think.  It may be a different story when it's tackier.  The Hans Dampf is really a fat sumbitch and I can probably lower the pressure some to make it even easier over the roots.

 

[Your Mom 4763]

I only carry a hip pack when it's really hot out.  In cold or moderate temps I'll do up to 2 hours on a single tallboy bottle in the cage.  Mtb shorts with a multi-tool in one pocket and phone in the other.   Tube, lever, CO2, and bacon in a Dakine gripper thingy on the frame.  If I'm really isolated, alone, and out of town somewhere I'll take a bigger camelbak with a snack, a bladder, and some quickclot gauze, tape and a splint.  But on basic rides around town I love having as little as possible on me.

Enjoy the new Ripley!

I'm going to try to make it to Moab and Fruita again next month.  I invited the girlfriend just to be nice, thinking she couldn't get that much time off work, but it looks like she can so...  She doesn't ride so I'll be riding solo while she hikes.

[TwiceHorn 30851]

Ok, Dumb question time.  I got a multitool with a chainbreaker in part because of sasquatch's chain break posts above.

I have never had a chain incident, but was thinking how fuct I would be.  Now that I have it, I'm thinking about on-trail chain repairs.

So, I guess in the normal case, you'd have a link pop and probably lose the side plate, or pin, or maybe not.  So you remove the damaged link, put it back together one link short and stay out of big cogs on the way home. Yes?  Or maybe can reassemble the busted link if the pin or plate hasn't gone flying.

I see some people carry "quicklinks" or the like, in which case they just replace the busted link with the  quicklink and I guess can complete the ride?  Still might need a chain breaker to get rid of the "pieces" of the busted link?  Looks like the Shimano Quick Link is not exactly toolless, so that may be no solution at all unless you want to add pliers to your kit?  I think theoretically, chain tension will "fix" the Quick Link, but it appears to be hit or miss.

Any insight here?

[TwiceHorn 30851]

I guess, too, I will ask about bacon and tubeless repairs generally.  As mentioned, I started carrying a tube and levers when I was still tubed.

I was also of the understanding that inserting a tube was a viable repair for a tubeless flat.  But after I gained more experience with tubeless, and saw what the inside of a tire looked like after running sealant for months, with the bead stuck to the rim, etc. I began to question that.  Seems like an unholy mess that would be that much worse trailside.  But, I continued to carry a tube and levers.

But I assume if you are running tubeless and get a puncture that won't seal, its location is pretty obvious.  So you cram the bacon in there and leave it hanging out?  Trim it later?

Do you treat the bacon repair as semi-permanent or try to patch the tire after?  Or is it toast?

[wd40 1976]

2 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Ok, Dumb question time.  I got a multitool with a chainbreaker in part because of sasquatch's chain break posts above.

I have never had a chain incident, but was thinking how fuct I would be.  Now that I have it, I'm thinking about on-trail chain repairs.

So, I guess in the normal case, you'd have a link pop and probably lose the side plate, or pin, or maybe not.  So you remove the damaged link, put it back together one link short and stay out of big cogs on the way home. Yes?  Or maybe can reassemble the busted link if the pin or plate hasn't gone flying.

I see some people carry "quicklinks" or the like, in which case they just replace the busted link with the  quicklink and I guess can complete the ride?  Still might need a chain breaker to get rid of the "pieces" of the busted link?  Looks like the Shimano Quick Link is not exactly toolless, so that may be no solution at all unless you want to add pliers to your kit?  I think theoretically, chain tension will "fix" the Quick Link, but it appears to be hit or miss.

Any insight here?

you're on the right track.  just need a chainbreaker to remove the busted link.  I carry a couple sets of quicklinks, as you call them.  when you damage a link, it seems to increase the likelihood of another link also being compromised.  quicklinks are light.  I would rather not run a shortened chain, but it can be done in an emergency.  

no need for the special quicklink pliers on the trail.  they're really only necessary to disengage the quicklink when you want to remove your whole, undamaged chain.  to lock the quicklink after the chain has been re-wrapped onto the cogs, squeeze the brake and give the pedals a firm spin.

as far as bacon, it depends.  a lot of times, it can be a permanent repair.  a sidewall puncture, or a particularly big tread puncture is likely to be problematic, so you'll end up replacing the tire sooner rather than later.

a tube repair on a tubeless tire, imo, is a "just get me back to the truck" thing.  I don't carry one in my regular pack---only in my Blowfish, which really only sees use in bad weather to hold a jacket, lonnnng hot ride days when I need the extra water, or when I'm carrying a folding saw for trail work.  I also have a piece of heavy downhill tube to help support big sidewall tears and keep the real tube inside from herniating.

[Pescado_Rojo 19262]

17 minutes ago, wd40 said:

you're on the right track.  just need a chainbreaker to remove the busted link.  I carry a couple sets of quicklinks, as you call them.  when you damage a link, it seems to increase the likelihood of another link also being compromised.  quicklinks are light.  I would rather not run a shortened chain, but it can be done in an emergency.  

no need for the special quicklink pliers on the trail.  they're really only necessary to disengage the quicklink when you want to remove your whole, undamaged chain.  to lock the quicklink after the chain has been re-wrapped onto the cogs, squeeze the brake and give the pedals a firm spin.

as far as bacon, it depends.  a lot of times, it can be a permanent repair.  a sidewall puncture, or a particularly big tread puncture is likely to be problematic, so you'll end up replacing the tire sooner rather than later.

a tube repair on a tubeless tire, imo, is a "just get me back to the truck" thing.  I don't carry one in my regular pack---only in my Blowfish, which really only sees use in bad weather to hold a jacket, lonnnng hot ride days when I need the extra water, or when I'm carrying a folding saw for trail work.  I also have a piece of heavy downhill tube to help support big sidewall tears and keep the real tube inside from herniating.

Back in the day I made it from Hill of Life all the way to my apartment at 45th and Duval with a dollar bill in my sidewall to keep the tube in. 

[KuЯdt 248]

^^ what they said.  however, if you do carry tire levers with you (and I usually do in my hip pack) then you can get a set of these which double as quick link pliers.

If you don't want to wear a pack, you can get a frame strap and squeeze a number of things into it (tube + co2 canister/inflator+ levers, multitool + bacon cartridge, or just a taco).  I do that a lot of times on rides where I'm only bringing one water bottle and no pack.

[TwiceHorn 30851]

Haha, I guess I have to concede that the Fox 34 and Ripley AF are not a magic carpet.

I've been banging some good-sized roots and rocks head on on the theory that I can get away with that, but it appears that I cannot.

Also had to dial in some rebound, cuz they were bucking me pretty good, too.

The dropper seems to have a tendency to drop 1/4-1/2 inch without prompting, so I'm gonna have to do something about that.

[TwiceHorn 30851]

Ok, I will mostly shut up after this.  But yesterday, I went and rode Harry Moss in the morning.  It was intended to be a short ride because we had to go to open houses starting at 1.  

So, I did a typical route in which I skipped the first half of blue (the tricky part) and red.  My previous ride on the Ripley at Moss was a bit tentative as I was still feeling things out.  This ride was not tentative, but fairly smooth.

And was 1 mph faster than I have ever been.  And 2+ mph faster than the rides I was bitching about a couple of weeks ago when I thought I should have put down a decent "time," but did not.  This was not one of those rides where I thought I ripped it, but it wasn't any sort of death march either.  Just kind of a regular ride.  And I had a similar number of the little stops (drink, pee) here and there that I think penalize speed some on my GPS (even though it purports to measure ride time and overall time).

This bike is within a pound of the Marin.  The trail is not chunky enough that the suspension confers much of an advantage in terms of maintaining speed over rough stuff.  It doesn't have any major climbs, just a few 10-20 foot up-downs.  I might be a hair more confident on small descents and turns, laying off the rear brake more.

The only things I can think of are that the steering (reduced offset, shorter stem) is more precise for my purposes in the twisties. I do feel like I can take less wide lines in those kind of turns on the Ripley, and come closer to clipping trees that I turn around than on the Marin.

And the pedaling platform is more efficient.  The Marin wasn't "boggy," though, even on pavement, the difference there is very subtle in terms of "feel."  The Ripley does feel like it accelerates pretty well, but I really didn't sense that a lot of effort was going into compressing the suspension on the Marin.

The only other thing is hub engagement.  Other than that, I think the drivetrains are pretty comparable.  And, on Moss, moreso than Katie Jackson, I can feel a little more slack in the hub, but not as bad as the Marin's.

Finally, I don't feel less fatigued on the Ripley vs. the Marin as I did going from the hardtail to the Marin.  The Ripley is better over certain types of high-frequency chunk, but there's not enough of that on most Dallas trails to make a whole lot of difference in that department.

The engineer in me wants to know why I'm faster on the Ripley.  I might have expected this on a carbon bike with an upper tier drivetrain, but I am a bit shocked by this.