Game of Thrones Season 8 (Bookfags unite)

[bamachine 1230]

1 minute ago, Mojo Hand said:

Oh I completely agree with that.  He was definitely trying to poison Dany with the help of that girl.   I just meant that it made his treasonous statements to Tyrion and Jon all the more stupid. 

That is what they do, take smart characters and make them suddenly stupid.

[CurlyDumps 4439]

2 minutes ago, Mojo Hand said:

Yeah, if he had a poison plot going, what was the need to tell Tyrion and Jon what he was thinking? 

Like Tyrion, D&D had to make him dumb and sloppy to wrap this shit up in 8 seasons.  Varys was the craftiest, most cloak-and-dagger badass in the 7 Kingdoms...even outlasting Littlefinger...and suddenly he’s running up to Jon Snow of all people and yelling, “so - Treason!” With other soldiers within earshot lol 

[Pods 7528]

10 minutes ago, bamachine said:

That is what they do, take smart characters and make them suddenly stupid.

Varys kind of forgot that he was trying to poison Dany. 

[UTHornFan014 710]

also, can someone explain to me how Harrenhall has to be melted from the outside becuase the dragon couldn’t get though (and this was even referenced in the show) but now Drogon can just explode everything with his fire as if it’s some sort of bomb?

They upgraded Drogon's weapon system to include bunker-buster technology.

The only things worth a shit in that episode was the cinematography/acting, the Mountain exploding Qyburn's head, and The Hound exacting his revenge on the Mountain. Everything with Dany's storyline feels completely rushed. Jaime's storyline was a waste along with Euron's. Hopefully Arya just ends up killing everyone. At this point I won't be surprised if Ed Sheeran's character ends up in the throne.

And this all could have been avoided if Jon just would have fucked his aunt again.

[elfenix 34171]

So that's what happened every time I put a city to the sword in Total War

[Mdhorn 5911]

The stabs wounds to either side of Jaime didn't seem to amount to much in the end.  Guess they were just there so that Cersei could see the blood on her hands when she grabbed him.

[GabrielsHorn 2142]

8 hours ago, Michael Knight said:

They should have spent an entire season of Varys planting seeds and plotting against Dany  and then her finding out.

As is the problem with so much of the show, it seems that Varys will be trying to get fake Aegon on the throne in the books, and the writers decided that he just has to support Jon after he is revelead to take that place. Same with Cersei's plotline being non-sensical and KL still loving her after her walk of atonement. 

[Mileslong 4714]

The stabs wounds to either side of Jaime didn't seem to amount to much in the end.  Guess they were just there so that Cersei could see the blood on her hands when she grabbed him.

What is stabbed may never die...

[alincoln 2364]

9 hours ago, drewcifer said:

Brilliant spectacle... I already ranted to my wife about the many things I thought made zero sense. Fairly consistent with how absurd the post-GRRM era has been. That's all I have.

Exactly where I am.  The episode itself was an amazing spectacle.  The underlying plot developments that yielded said spectacle are best ignored at this point.  

[Mileslong 4714]

As is the problem with so much of the show, it seems that Varys will be trying to get fake Aegon on the throne in the books, and the writers decided that he just has to support Jon after he is revelead to take that place. Same with Cersei's plotline being non-sensical and KL still loving her after her walk of atonement. 

I started loving cersei after her walk of atonement, if you know what I mean...

[Viper 12030]

9 hours ago, naija said:

Which character was massacred the most, in the translation from the books to the show?

The top 2 have to be Jon and Tyrion.

Euron then Tyrion, then Jon

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

9 hours ago, naija said:

Which character was massacred the most, in the translation from the books to the show?

The top 2 have to be Jon and Tyrion.

Varys and Littlefinger 

[Viper 12030]

On 4/22/2019 at 8:48 AM, Viper said:

The Mad King wasn't always mad. There were hints and tendencies that eventually blossomed into "madness". Like a tendency to burn all her his enemies. 

Dany has shown signs and hints of madness, the destruction she caused in slavers bay, burning the tarleys alive, the whole "I am a dragon" thing she got from her brother, etc. I think they (book and show) are setting her up for this test with Jon (show) and fAegon (book) where she'll either be a worthy queen, or some mix of Aerys and Maekar. 

Emilia Clark has already talked about how Dany's ending traumatized her. Dany doing a heel turn could be the reason.

ahem. She broke bad even beyond what I imagined though. Was this the third "holy shit" moment? It really feels like the show writers didn't telegraph this change enough. They spent seasons playing up the girl power, and breaker of chains because people liked Dany, and then realized, oh shit, we only have 5 episodes to get her to crazy dragon-fire bombing MadQueen.

[Bookman 4610]

It seems like after six seasons the writers were forced to finish everything up in two seasons. And then budget concerns made those two seasons become thirteen episodes.

 

[Viper 12030]

6 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Varys and Littlefinger 

Good point about Varys. I didn't consider him because it was mostly a case of the writers not knowing what to do with him because his motivations in the books are completely different so they just had him sit in the background and do nothing until it was time to make Varys-kebabs.

[Bookman 4610]

And I guess this was Dany's betrayal for love? Love of the realm?

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

2 minutes ago, Viper said:

ahem. She broke bad even beyond what I imagined though. Was this the third "holy shit" moment? It really feels like the show writers didn't telegraph this change enough. They spent seasons playing up the girl power, and breaker of chains because people liked Dany, and then realized, oh shit, we only have 5 episodes to get her to crazy dragon-fire bombing MadQueen.

I don’t think it’s ever been all about being good or bad for Dany.  It’s always been about obtaining power and seeking revenge.  She knows she will have to rule through fear and one way to instill that message is to burn king’s landing to the ground.  

The main theme running through the whole story is the corruption of power and those that seek it.  That’s why I say the Iron Throne is a curse that devours whoever sits on it.   

[Burt Macklin 18998]

50 minutes ago, GabrielsHorn said:

As is the problem with so much of the show, it seems that Varys will be trying to get fake Aegon on the throne in the books, and the writers decided that he just has to support Jon after he is revelead to take that place. Same with Cersei's plotline being non-sensical and KL still loving her after her walk of atonement. 

I think everyone recognizes they had to simplify the plot to get to an end, but they didn’t have to make it this absurdly stupid. You can switch out Aegon for Jon without Varys just openly tell everyone he’s committing treason. They still could’be written Varys’ character to go about it in a cunning manner.

7 minutes ago, Bookman said:

It seems like after six seasons the writers were forced to finish everything up in two seasons. And then budget concerns made those two seasons become thirteen episodes.

 

 Nope. HBO gave the writers a basically unlimited budget and offered them more episodes. They declined. The writers had no clue how to end the show and instead of trying or bringing others in, they just rushed the whole thing to get to a shorty ending.

Edited May 13, 2019 by Burt Macklin

[Viper 12030]

13 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

I don’t think it’s ever been all about being good or bad for Dany.  It’s always been about obtaining power and seeking revenge.  She knows she will have to rule through fear and one way to instill that message is to burn king’s landing to the ground.  

The main theme running through the whole story is the corruption of power and those that seek it.  That’s why I say the Iron Throne is a curse that devours whoever sits on it.   

totally I agree, it's why she's really not that different than Cersei when you think about it. I am just saying the show writers seem totally oblivious to that. or at least for the first 6-7 seasons they did. I feel sorry for people watching that have never read the books. I totally expected this, though not to this degree, but for people who only watch the show, this has to be coming out of nowhere for them. Show only people are asking why the writers are assassinating her character and why they've ruined her.

Edited May 13, 2019 by Viper

[DigglerontheHoof 21061]

9 minutes ago, Burt Macklin said:

I think everyone recognizes they had to simplify the plot to get to an end, but they didn’t have to make it this absurdly stupid. You can switch out Aegon for Jon without Varys just openly tell everyone he’s committing treason. They still could’be written Varys’ character to go about it in a cunning manner.

 Nope. HBO gave the writers a basically unlimited budget and offered them more episodes. They declined. The writers had no clue how to end the show and instead of trying or bringing others in, they just rushed the whole thing to get to a shorty ending.

I read that they were forced to speed things up b/c one or more of the actors said they would absolutely not agree to another year or two. 

[Mojo Hand 4580]

17 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

I don’t think it’s ever been all about being good or bad for Dany.  It’s always been about obtaining power and seeking revenge.  She knows she will have to rule through fear and one way to instill that message is to burn king’s landing to the ground.  

The main theme running through the whole story is the corruption of power and those that seek it.  That’s why I say the Iron Throne is a curse that devours whoever sits on it.   

I agree that must be the writer's rationale, but it doesn't actually make sense.   She instilled a fuckton of fear by the time they surrendered, which is why they surrendered.   She just took back everything that had been taken from her family, and then destroys it all, including the castle her ancestors built?    It doesn't make sense and isn't in keeping with a character who has always cared about women and children.   And just saying "well she went mad and took it too far" seems like a cop out to me.   She never seemed all that crazy before now to me.  Ruthless to enemies, sure.  But that isn't the same as what she did street by street.   Hell, she roasted plenty of her own troops and almost killed Arya. 

What I thought was unfolding was, Cersei would ring the bells as a trick, and unleashes a surprise attack once Dany's forces lower their guard.   It fails, but Dany is furious and goes justifiably apeshit because the surrender was fake.    But what happened is that she got nearly everything that motivated her for years, and her response was to destroy virtually all of it. 

Edited May 13, 2019 by Mojo Hand

[Burt Macklin 18998]

2 minutes ago, Mojo Hand said:

I agree that must be the writer's rationale, but it doesn't actually make sense.   She instilled a fuckton of fear by the time they surrendered, which is why they surrendered.   She just took back everything that had been taken from her family, and then destroys it all, including the castle her ancestors built?    It doesn't make sense and isn't in keeping with a character who has always cared about women and children.   And just saying "well she went mad and took it too far" seems like a cop out to me.   She never seemed all that crazy before now to me.  Ruthless to enemies, sure.  But that isn't the same as what she did street by street.   Hell, she roasted plenty of her own troops and almost killed Arya. 

What I thought was unfolding was, Cersei would ring the bells as a trick, and unleashes a surprise attack once Dany's forces lower their guard.   It fails, but Dany is furious and goes justifiably apeshit because the surrender was fake.    But what happened is that she got nearly everything that motivated her for years, and her response was to destroy virtually all of it. 

Yep. Plus doesn't instilling fear work better if you leave some people alive to spread the story of what you did?

[Juicy 723]

would have made for a much better story if Jamie wouldnt have blown his whole redemption arc, making up with Cersei and would have killed her, rang the bells and then Dany went mad. 

The jamie death was the worst of last nights mistakes. 

[Mojo Hand 4580]

In the game of thrones, you win or you — head's up!  Falling rubble! 

[Burt Macklin 18998]

15 minutes ago, Juicy said:

would have made for a much better story if Jamie wouldnt have blown his whole redemption arc, making up with Cersei and would have killed her, rang the bells and then Dany went mad. 

The jamie death was the worst of last nights mistakes. 

yeah, last night made Jaime's entire arc since Season 2 seem like a waste. I get that not all characters will beocme good and find redemption in their arcs, but at least show more internal conflict for him if you're going to have him go back on it all. Same with all of dany's arc. Why spend so much time teaching her to rule in Essos if she's just gonna burn shit? Not to mention, they spent way more time developing her ruling style than they did alluding to doing something like burning all of KL. Bran's entire story was a waste. He was useless with the NK and has done nothing else. Tyrion doesn't even have an arc. He's just dumb now. 

I think they've done a good job with Arya's arc. Her whole point of life for a while was kill people on her list, but she had to abandon that to save what really matters to her: her family and, ultimately, humanity. She had to choose to go North instead of killing Cersei and then she had to choose to leave the Red Keep so she could live (and presumably play a role in killing the new Big Bad, Dany) instead of killing Cersei. She's learned to not let hate and revenge eat her up, even though she now has the physical skills to exact the revenge she dreamed of for so long.

Problem is there's way more characters with wasted story arcs than ones that developed. 

[bolverk 29399]

36 minutes ago, DigglerontheHoof said:

I read that they were forced to speed things up b/c one or more of the actors said they would absolutely not agree to another year or two. 

It wasn't an offer for more seasons but one that would allow them to have ten episodes in this final one but D&D wanted to stick to only six.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

37 minutes ago, Mojo Hand said:

I agree that must be the writer's rationale, but it doesn't actually make sense.   She instilled a fuckton of fear by the time they surrendered, which is why they surrendered.   She just took back everything that had been taken from her family, and then destroys it all, including the castle her ancestors built?    It doesn't make sense and isn't in keeping with a character who has always cared about women and children.   And just saying "well she went mad and took it too far" seems like a cop out to me.   She never seemed all that crazy before now to me.  Ruthless to enemies, sure.  But that isn't the same as what she did street by street.   Hell, she roasted plenty of her own troops and almost killed Arya. 

What I thought was unfolding was, Cersei would ring the bells as a trick, and unleashes a surprise attack once Dany's forces lower their guard.   It fails, but Dany is furious and goes justifiably apeshit because the surrender was fake.    But what happened is that she got nearly everything that motivated her for years, and her response was to destroy virtually all of it. 

 One of the best moments in the episode was when we saw absolute terror wash over Cersei’s face when Dany started indiscriminately killing civilians with the dragon.   Cersei wasn’t afraid for her people, she realized there was someone much more cruel and ruthless than she could be, that’s when she knew she was finished.  

It was always about power and Dany wanted to let everyone know her authority can never be challenged without complete and total destruction.

[Viper 12030]

so what was the deal with Varys' rings? Why'd he take them off? Some sort of sign to his accomplice that he's dead and to activate a contingency plan? do the letters get sent now or were they already sent? Who is there left to send letters to anyway? Maybe to all the lords of the other realms, Edmure Tully, Robert Arryn, Prince of Dorne guy, etc? Sort of like a redo of Stannis sending all those letters about Joffrey not being the rightful heir?

Edited May 13, 2019 by Viper

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

2 minutes ago, Viper said:

so what was the deal with Varys' rings? Why'd he take them off? Some sort of sign to his accomplice that he's dead and to activate a contingency plan? do the letters get sent now or were they already sent? Who is there left to send letters to anyway?

My Guess:

He’s a season 1 episode 1 original gangster that hasn’t been seen since. 

[Bookman 4610]

I guess he didn’t want to waste the rings on a dead guy.

[alincoln 2364]

The critics keep piling on.  Per RT, 8.5 is currently the worst-reviewed in the show's history.  

[CooterBrown 17907]

Who rang the bells?  That wasn't a normal sign of surrender. Tyrion came up with it and Jaime never got the chance to execute it.

The episode spoilers on reddit/freefolk have been very accurate. According to the spoilers, there were two endings filmed. One takes D&D's tone-deaf stupidity to new heights and other one you can tell was GRRM's original bare bones framework ending he provided them years ago. It'll be interesting to see which one we get.

 

 

Edited May 13, 2019 by CooterBrown

[Lidig8r 1856]

1 hour ago, Mojo Hand said:

I agree that must be the writer's rationale, but it doesn't actually make sense.   She instilled a fuckton of fear by the time they surrendered, which is why they surrendered.   She just took back everything that had been taken from her family, and then destroys it all, including the castle her ancestors built?    It doesn't make sense and isn't in keeping with a character who has always cared about women and children.   And just saying "well she went mad and took it too far" seems like a cop out to me.   She never seemed all that crazy before now to me.  Ruthless to enemies, sure.  But that isn't the same as what she did street by street.   Hell, she roasted plenty of her own troops and almost killed Arya. 

Insanity has no logic. You could see parts of the insanity in Dany as early as Season One. Watching passively as her douchebag brother is given a golden crown. Having the young dragons fry the Wizard. Allowing the Dothraki to sack Qarth. Roasting the leadership of the Dothraki so she could take it over. Crucifying the masters in Mereen. Roasting Lord Tarly and Dickhead.. err. Dickon. Her madness grows as her power grows.

Cold blooded killing, no remorse. Using fire just as the Mad King did to kill.

Now... Jorah Mormont who betrayed her, then salvaged himself and dying for her. Jon Snow snubbing her vagina. Varys betraying her and getting roasted. Missendei being whacked. Except for the balless wonder, Grey Worm, she has no one. And she knows her family line ends with her since Jon is a wimpdick and she believes she can't have kids. The last Targaryen. 

Great, she will rule with only one dragon to keep her company, not loved by any, no discernible line of succession ... So it's "Fuck it... burn 'em all."  She is sitting on the dragon, looking out over what she had fought for her adult life... achieved it, then realized she has nothing. They could have had her love, snubbed that so now they will fear her. And the manifestation into Aerys the Mad King becomes complete. But she succeeds where he failed. And King's Landing is torched.

[Barry_McCokiner 160]

28 minutes ago, Viper said:

so what was the deal with Varys' rings? Why'd he take them off? Some sort of sign to his accomplice that he's dead and to activate a contingency plan? do the letters get sent now or were they already sent? Who is there left to send letters to anyway? Maybe to all the lords of the other realms, Edmure Tully, Robert Arryn, Prince of Dorne guy, etc? Sort of like a redo of Stannis sending all those letters about Joffrey not being the rightful heir?

No, I think that's normal.  Ever watch Donny Brasco?  When Al Pacino got the call, he took his jewelery off.

[Mojo Hand 4580]

7 minutes ago, Lidig8r said:

Insanity has no logic. You could see parts of the insanity in Dany as early as Season One. Watching passively as her douchebag brother is given a golden crown. Having the young dragons fry the Wizard. Allowing the Dothraki to sack Qarth. Roasting the leadership of the Dothraki so she could take it over. Crucifying the masters in Mereen. Roasting Lord Tarly and Dickhead.. err. Dickon. Her madness grows as her power grows.

Cold blooded killing, no remorse. Using fire just as the Mad King did to kill.

Now... Jorah Mormont who betrayed her, then salvaged himself and dying for her. Jon Snow snubbing her vagina. Varys betraying her and getting roasted. Missendei being whacked. Except for the balless wonder, Grey Worm, she has no one. And she knows her family line ends with her since Jon is a wimpdick and she believes she can't have kids. The last Targaryen. 

Great, she will rule with only one dragon to keep her company, not loved by any, no discernible line of succession ... So it's "Fuck it... burn 'em all."  She is sitting on the dragon, looking out over what she had fought for her adult life... achieved it, then realized she has nothing. They could have had her love, snubbed that so now they will fear her. And the manifestation into Aerys the Mad King becomes complete. But she succeeds where he failed. And King's Landing is torched.

None of that previous stuff was insanity or madness. They were ruthless, coldly rational responses to real threats.  She hasn't really acted irrationally before now.   Torching the civilian population after they surrender is a completely illogical psychotic break.   Sure, that can happen.   But if that's what the writers wanted to happen, they should have shown more signs of real crazy before this point.

[Dark Horse 2263]

None of that previous stuff was insanity or madness. They were ruthless, coldly rational responses to real threats.  She hasn't really acted irrationally before now.   Torching the civilian population after they surrender is a completely illogical psychotic break.   Sure, that can happen.   But if that's what the writers wanted to happen, they should have shown more signs of real crazy before this point.

The show runners are only interested in surprise and shock.

The most shocking scenes from the books (Ned, Robb, Jon, etc) are all set up and make sense when you evaluate the lead up to these events. The show runners just want things to happen out of nowhere for shock value.

[alincoln 2364]

11 minutes ago, Mojo Hand said:

None of that previous stuff was insanity or madness. They were ruthless, coldly rational responses to real threats.  She hasn't really acted irrationally before now.   Torching the civilian population after they surrender is a completely illogical psychotic break.   Sure, that can happen.   But if that's what the writers wanted to happen, they should have shown more signs of real crazy before this point.

Odd that so many are struggling to distinguish between killing political and military enemies and mowing down thousands of women and children

[sidis 9750]

she started breaking throughout...they had her outright resenting everyone the minute she showed up in the north where she wasn't embraced as a liberator.  then jon told her what was up with him being a targ.  she watched her number 1 chick get beheaded right in front of her for no reason right after her baby dragon was murdered.  varys betrayed her and plotted to assassinate her.  they visually morphed her into a crazy, flowers in the attic character and then, in one last hail mary to make sense of it all, she put the penis on the pedestal and tries to embrace love and when jon rejects her...

"it's fear, then."

massacre.  the crazy was murmuring under the surface the whole time.  think about how it all went down with the dothraki chicks in seasons 1 and 2.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

All the signs of Dany snapping were there.  Characters were literally concerned and talking about it.  Only people blind to the signs couldn't see it.  People never expect someone with power to go on a genocidal rampage until they do. 

Edited May 13, 2019 by Hugo Stiglitz

[LCHorn 2585]

3 hours ago, Bookman said:

It seems like after six seasons the writers were forced to finish everything up in two seasons. And then budget concerns made those two seasons become thirteen episodes.

 

Which is stupid because HBO would have happily paid for additional hours so the many plot inconsistencies and wildly out of characters decisions didn’t come come as a complete surprise.  

I’ve gone from appreciating how the show runners streamlined an unwieldy text that Martin looked to have little interest or ability to complete to hate watching the show just to see how it finishes.  My sole hope remains that Martin has a good cardiologist.  

[alincoln 2364]

3 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

All the signs of Dany snapping were there.  Characters were literally concerned and talking about it.  Only people blind to the signs couldn't see it.  People never expect someone with power to go on a genocidal rampage until they do. 

D&D decided that Dany would become the Mad Queen and included some throwaway dialogue in Season 8 episodes to justify that the turn was always coming despite the massacre representing a massive departure from her attitude toward the powerless established in excruciating detail in the first 7 seasons.  But Varys expressed concern in 8.4!!!

[Pimphand 5597]

13 hours ago, Mojo Hand said:

The only two good parts of the episode, IMO, were Varys going out like a man and the Hound taking his bro with him into the flames.   Pretty much everything else was absurd, even by the standards of these writers. 

I mean, visually there was plenty of cool stuff.  In terms of the story, though. 

This is where I was with regard to last night....

[Chewbacca 7730]

4 hours ago, DigglerontheHoof said:

I read that they were forced to speed things up b/c one or more of the actors said they would absolutely not agree to another year or two. 

Show runners are the ones that absolutely would not agree to another year or two.  Maybe some of the actors as well, but I haven't heard them come out and say it like D&D did.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

1 hour ago, alincoln said:

D&D decided that Dany would become the Mad Queen and included some throwaway dialogue in Season 8 episodes to justify that the turn was always coming despite the massacre representing a massive departure from her attitude toward the powerless established in excruciating detail in the first 7 seasons.  But Varys expressed concern in 8.4!!!

I think it was intentional.  Dany gaining power and using her power righteously throughout the story was incredibly seductive to anyone following.  Her beauty, her dragons, the armies, the heritage, all of it.  But what was her real purpose?  At points, not even she was sure.  Her charm and powers worked on everyone except the most perceptive around her and when they realized her true motivations were destructive, they turned on her.  Varys was the first to see it and he died trying to rescue the realm from her.  

Now that she’s shown the world who she is, the good characters will revolt and the compromised will remain compromised.

Edited May 13, 2019 by Hugo Stiglitz

[Bateshorn 9899]

I do wonder, at some level, how much the AT&T purchase effected things.  The HBO Execs May have been told by the Warner people that the unlimited budgets was coming to an end once the sale was final, so if you want creative control, I’d get done for Ma Bell rolls up. 

[elguapo 4583]

I can buy Dany becoming the Mad Queen, I just don't think they did a great job of setting it up. I think there should have been a traumatic trigger event to set her off in the heat of the battle.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

6 minutes ago, elguapo said:

I can buy Dany becoming the Mad Queen, I just don't think they did a great job of setting it up. I think there should have been a traumatic trigger event to set her off in the heat of the battle.

I think they set it up okay.  You don’t find out who someone really is until they face losing everything they have or want to have.  She already lost dragons, she lost her Missandei, and she lost the love of her Jon Snow.  All she wanted was her throne and she was on the verge of losing that too.  She would burn all of Westeros to prevent that from happening and I think that’s the takeaway. 

[seven 1366]

I hated the surprise death of rheagal, and it seems everyone complaining points out missendei's death but not the dragon's (a bigger event imo). rheagal dying in this episode and battle would have smoothed a lot of the complaints and also deleted (imo) the worst moment in the series. 

Edited May 13, 2019 by seven

[Texas Flood 1356]

I do wonder, at some level, how much the AT&T purchase effected things.  The HBO Execs May have been told by the Warner people that the unlimited budgets was coming to an end once the sale was final, so if you want creative control, I’d get done for Ma Bell rolls up. 

That didn’t happen.

[CurlyDumps 4439]

Me and r/freefolk are on the same page.