Breaking news - Notre Dame Cathedral in Paris on fire

[HornsOverIthaca 2,333]

5 minutes ago, MirrOlure said:

Pic from my trip in 2014:

I guess they don’t sell bolt cutters over there.

[Hate 20,106]

For those whom have never been, here is what is gone.

[midtown 3,345]

9 minutes ago, Laxtonto said:

I assume the church will do it all on their own, but a huge price tag.

Well they've clung onto billions if not trillions of dollars in art work that could help billions of suffering people what makes you think they'll fund a building?

[Wally Pryor 5,261]

A spokesman for the Paris firefighters says the two towers and the main structure of the cathedral have been saved from complete destruction as the flames begin to wane. Three or four more hours needed to contain the fire, he adds.

https://www.france24.com/en/20190415-liveblog-fire-paris-france-notre-dame-cathedral

[Chad Fuck 17,659]

What is that damn scaffolding made of?  They need to rebuild with that, because it seems like it will last through anything.

[wood 11,225]

15 minutes ago, hornimal said:

I'm genuinely curious, please explain.

The water doesn't all break up into small drops as it falls. The drops are usually made from low altitude, so the water isn't falling a very long way, and it's moving fast. The force of the water can injure or kill people in the way, or it can break trees, etc, which can fall on people below. 

[DaysOff 7,947]

Pic from my trip in 2014:

Glad those stupid fucking locks were removed before the bridge collapsed.

[UTCzech III 2,907]

 

[wood 11,225]

17 minutes ago, Laxtonto said:

So who pays to rebuild Notre Dame?

The Vatican or does the French government get stuck with the bill?

I assume the church will do it all on their own, but a huge price tag.

Why the gubment?

[Vito Andolini 9,124]

9 minutes ago, Wally Pryor said:

 

 

https://www.france24.com/en/20190415-liveblog-fire-paris-france-notre-dame-cathedral

The headline and lede of that article... as I post this... seem vastly different than the positive blurb quoted. Certainly hoping they can preserve much, if not most of the exterior. I’ll take hope where I can get it, though. Thanks.

Edited April 15, 2019 by Vito Andolini

[Royalfan5 2,353]

2 minutes ago, wood said:

Why the gubment?

There’s been some historical unpleasantness vis a vis the Church, the State, and the People of France regarding clerical ownership of properties 

[deadshank 24,652]

7 minutes ago, Chad Fuck said:

What is that damn scaffolding made of?  They need to rebuild with that, because it seems like it will last through anything.

The same stuff that was used to build that arch at Hiroshima?

[Chad Fuck 17,659]

1 minute ago, deadshank said:

The same stuff that was used to build that arch at Hiroshima?

[Pato del Muerto 52,485]

1 hour ago, Laxtonto said:

This gets me thinking...

What iconic structures are out there globally that would generate this level of shock and sadness worldwide?  I’m curious what people would compare the loss of Notre Dame to.

Just off the top of my head

The Eiffel Tower

Buckingham Palace

Saint Peters Basilica

Taj Mahal

The Sphinx 

 

Can the sagrada familia burn, or is it all concrete and stone?

It doesn’t have the centuries behind it though. 

Edited April 15, 2019 by Pato del Muerto

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

51 minutes ago, Lhorn said:

Open concept, laminate flooring, the works!

Shiplap everywhere 

[Pato del Muerto 52,485]

Just now, Onboard 2.0 said:

Shiplap everywhere 

Uh, maybe automated fire suppression this time around?

[deadshank 24,652]

4 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Shiplap everywhere 

Sea grass area rugs and LOTS of pillows. 

[Fuck Tim Beck 3,815]

7 minutes ago, deadshank said:

Sea grass area rugs and LOTS of pillows. 

I'm thinking mid century sea ranch 

[hornimal 80]

29 minutes ago, wood said:

The water doesn't all break up into small drops as it falls. The drops are usually made from low altitude, so the water isn't falling a very long way, and it's moving fast. The force of the water can injure or kill people in the way, or it can break trees, etc, which can fall on people below. 

I still don't follow.  if the force of a rain drop that forms high up in the clouds is not able to punch a hole in my head during a rain shower, how is a water drop originating from a leaf/tree branch/arching off a fire hose able to be accelerated so much that it would cause injury?

[Brisketexan 105,059]

Just now, hornimal said:

I still don't follow.  if the force of a rain drop that forms high up in the clouds is not able to punch a hole in my head during a rain shower, how is a water drop originating from a leaf/tree branch/arching off a fire hose able to be accelerated so much that it would cause injury?

He doesn't mean "drops" like "raindrops."  He means "drops" as in "hey, have that tanker do his drop of 25,000 gallons over there."  Giant slug of water, all in one "piece" hits your head.  Doesn't kill you for the same reason that dropping a piece of gravel onto your head from 20 feet won't hurt you, but dropping a boulder will kill you.

[hornimal 80]

46 minutes ago, Foosters said:

What happens if you drop a few hundred feet into a body of water? Now imagine instead, that large body of water being dropped on you.

I get that part.  I understood it was if water drops reacted differently during a blaze that would turn them into bullets or something that would pierce clothing and skin.

[Vito Andolini 9,124]

Maybe he should have used the word water dump instead of “drop.”

[bolverk 29,653]

1 minute ago, hornimal said:

I get that part.  I understood it was if water drops reacted differently during a blaze that would turn them into bullets or something that would pierce clothing and skin.

Quoi?

[wood 11,225]

2 minutes ago, hornimal said:

I get that part.  I understood it was if water drops reacted differently during a blaze that would turn them into bullets or something that would pierce clothing and skin.

LOL.

[retread 2,951]

1 minute ago, bolverk said:

Quoi?

Pour quoi?

[wood 11,225]

1 minute ago, Vito Andolini said:

Maybe he should have used the word water dump instead of “drop.”

Yeah I used the word 'drop' two different ways in that post. My bad. I thought he'd get it. You guys get it. Oh well.

[wood 11,225]

10 minutes ago, hornimal said:

I still don't follow.  if the force of a rain drop that forms high up in the clouds is not able to punch a hole in my head during a rain shower, how is a water drop originating from a leaf/tree branch/arching off a fire hose able to be accelerated so much that it would cause injury?

Like Brisket said, ain't nobody getting hurt or killed by some drops of water falling out of the sky. It's when they drop a swimming pool or ten on your head all at once that it becomes a problem. A couple of FF have been killed just in the last year or so like this. In one of the incidents a 90 foot fir tree was uprooted and fell on a FF.

Edited April 15, 2019 by wood

[Bama Chick 28,596]

Good thread from former fire chief and state emergency management official from Missouri on why fighting fires in churches - especially very old ones - is so difficult.

[Anastasis 23,458]

46 minutes ago, UTCzech III said:

 

powerful. 

[mdmost 42,999]

Thank God they were able to save the main structure. I can't find the tweet but someone noted that Notre Dame was shelled in WWI and rebuilt. So there's hope. Still a terrible day. 

[hornimal 80]

6 minutes ago, wood said:

Yeah I used the word 'drop' two different ways in that post. My bad. I thought he'd get it. You guys get it. Oh well.

yeah, bit of dumbassery on my part.  totally ignored that you had started talking about tanker dumps.  I misunderstood water drop as in droplets.  

apologies for the derail.  this is fucking tragic.

Edited April 15, 2019 by hornimal

[wood 11,225]

2 minutes ago, Bama Chick said:

Good thread from former fire chief and state emergency management official from Missouri on why fighting fires in churches - especially very old ones - is so difficult.
 

Yep. Hell, some churches used to get the FD to come change their light bulbs for them up high on those cathedral ceilings because there was no way for them to get to them. Some probably still do. Now imagine fighting a big fire in that room.

[wood 11,225]

Just now, hornimal said:

yeah, bit of dumbassery on my part.  totally ignored that you had started talking about tanker dumps.  I misunderstood water drop as in droplets.  

Meh ... we're all dumbasses from time to time ... esp 'round these parts. ; )

[wood 11,225]

5 minutes ago, Bama Chick said:

Good thread from former fire chief and state emergency management official from Missouri on why fighting fires in churches - especially very old ones - is so difficult.
 

What the hell is Gregg Favre doing here?

[TwiceHorn 31,438]

1 hour ago, Vito Andolini said:

Someone up thread posted an article from Newsweek claiming there’s been a recent spate of crime directed at French Catholic churches, so that could be a cause, but when I saw the initial flames emanating from the scaffolding area, my first thought was renovation related. Also, don’t discount European Smoking Asshole (they are everywhere), so one of the workers could have been careless with his Lucky Strike.

Gaulois, imo.

I was of the impression that the medieval cathedrals were almost entirely structurally stone.  I know stone can "burn" or degrade under extreme heat, especially mortar joinery, but I was also of the impression that mortar joinery was not extensively used.

[InkaUtexas 25,859]

19 minutes ago, hornimal said:

I still don't follow.  if the force of a rain drop that forms high up in the clouds is not able to punch a hole in my head during a rain shower, how is a water drop originating from a leaf/tree branch/arching off a fire hose able to be accelerated so much that it would cause injury?

This dude survived right? 

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19,100]

13 minutes ago, mdmost said:

Thank God they were able to save the main structure. I can't find the tweet but someone noted that Notre Dame was shelled in WWI and rebuilt. So there's hope. Still a terrible day. 

Yeah.  Last i saw of the live feed, looks like the fire is under control. Looks like the stone structure is ok for now (so is that scaffolding, so wow).  If they can shore up the stone once the fire is totally out, then they can restore and rebuild.  It will just take years.

[NowThis 931]

1 hour ago, Chad Fuck said:

What is that damn scaffolding made of?  They need to rebuild with that, because it seems like it will last through anything.

or whatever the fuck comprises the airplane black boxes (actually orange) 

[BlueGreySky 1,003]

“This Cathedral will be rebuilt”

 

 

 

[Chooky 13,307]

1 hour ago, HenryJames said:

NBC

Boom, imo.

[Ghost of LL 15,531]

So by next week the French government will be setting up a national subscription soliciting contributions.  I would expect that they'll get a fair amount that way, both domestically and from overseas.

[bolverk 29,653]

46 minutes ago, retread said:

Pour quoi?

N'importe quoi.

[Nivek 16,917]

There’s been some historical unpleasantness vis a vis the Church, the State, and the People of France regarding clerical ownership of properties 

Probably don’t want to let the French be in debt to the Church either.

[retread 2,951]

 

Image  https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D4OlykgXsAYEBcH.jpg

Edited April 15, 2019 by retread

[bolverk 29,653]

46 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

powerful. 

I'm sure the folks sitting across from me on the bus were wondering what I was watching on my phone to suddenly tear up. Thanks for publicly humiliating me, surly assholes.

[phdhorn 6,224]

I bet they get it done within 10 years.  1) high-profile campaign will easily get them $1-$2 billion.  Worldwide.  2) "We have the technology".   If you're a stonecutter/carpenter/etc., you're there and will get paid handsomely.

Because it's Easter Week, and because this is one of the most unearthly beautiful things I've heard on YouTube, Victimae Paschale Laudes, the Easter Sequence, sung from... Notre Dame by the Choire of Notre Dame de Paris, arranged by former cathedral organist Pierre Cochereau (d. 1984), played by current titular (er, "chief") organist Pierre Grandmaison ... in 2009.  Sound isn't terrific but it's good enough.  If nothing else, the last "Amen. Alleluia." at 3:00-3:15 is drop-dead gorgeous.

Imagine how much more unbelievably incredible this would sound in person - Notre Dame has a more resonant, lasting echo to it than most other cathedrals.  You are immediately surrounded by a swell of sound, there's almost nothing like it (and I've been to a buncha cathedrals).  Imagine this live.  Well, you can't.  Neither can I (wasn't there for this).  Unbelievably, no-words-beautiful what sounds can come from that organ in that church.

 

[ulukinatme 1,763]

2 hours ago, Laxtonto said:

This gets me thinking...

What iconic structures are out there globally that would generate this level of shock and sadness worldwide?  I’m curious what people would compare the loss of Notre Dame to.

Just off the top of my head

The Eiffel Tower

Buckingham Palace

Saint Peters Basilica

Taj Mahal

The Sphinx 

 

Interesting that you include the Eiffel Tower, which is also in Paris of course.  Apparently Notre Dame Cathedral receives twice as many visitors a year compared to the Eiffel Tower.  Of course you have to pay to get into the tower, and supposedly lines are rather long, but it's interesting given the sentiments and the mixed feelings Parisians have when it comes to the Eiffel Tower.  Guy de Maupassant once said "She offers the best view on Paris, since it’s the only place where I can’t see her."  Certainly not all Parisians feel that way, but you get the impression they don't show as much pride in it as we do the Statue of Liberty which was made by the same man.  

[bolverk 29,653]

Thanks for posting, PhD. I've had the incredible pleasure to listen to that organ blow my mind in person. You can feel in it resonate in your bones - it's the greatest ASMR experience I've ever had. There's nothing else like it.

[Whiskyteer 51]

Wifey and I were at the Cathedral around noon today.   We heard first responders speeding by our hotel around 7:15 this afternoon.  By 7:30, we could see the flames through the thick smoke.  So sad for the people of Paris and for the Church.  There were hundred thousand folks lining both banks shocked and distraught.  So sad

[bolverk 29,653]

2 minutes ago, ulukinatme said:

Interesting that you include the Eiffel Tower, which is also in Paris of course.  Apparently Notre Dame Cathedral receives twice as many visitors a year compared to the Eiffel Tower.  Of course you have to pay to get into the tower, and supposedly lines are rather long, but it's interesting given the sentiments and the mixed feelings Parisians have when it comes to the Eiffel Tower.  Guy de Maupassant once said "She offers the best view on Paris, since it’s the only place where I can’t see her."  Certainly not all Parisians feel that way, but you get the impression they don't show as much pride in it as we do the Statue of Liberty which was made by the same man.  

Notre Dame is located in the absolute heart of the city on the literal Île de la Cité and is much more a part of the lives of most residents and can make up a bigger part of your experience as a visitor if you're out on foot. The Eiffel Tower is actually a little bit out of the way.