Israel

[Boss Hogg 808]

This dude seems pretty reasonable. 
 

 

 

 

[InkaUtexas 25875]

Yes he is. Started following him about internal Lebanon issues. 

[Hermanator 7032]

20 hours ago, mchookem said:

personal rant, feel free to skip...so i feel like the gen z person in my life is close to off-the-rails on this topic and i'm really worried she's going to end up arrested and/or expelled in the middle of her senior year of college for crossing a line in her efforts to protest. she is beyond passionate at this point 😒

her enthusiasm is right in line with her Type A/ocd/eating disorder mental issues... she grabs hold of something and gives it 1000% and just won't let go. she's also a leader so she's actually organizing some shit this weekend...i don't even want to really know details but ngl... i'm worried how it might turn out. i actually admire her passion and commitment, and i don't think she's even wrong (i share many of her sentiments)... but not if she ends up sabotaging her future. 

a sample - 'i can't sit back and lavish in my cushy american privilege and future while innocent men women and children are bombed and their history erased! that's horrifying and i can and will sacrifice so that they can have a chance. those kids deserve to grow up as much as i do!'

she and her mother haven't been speaking for a while (nothing to do with this, mostly her moms alcohol/histrionics) and her dad is a wet-brained moronic maga-type (i mean thank god she doesn't actually drink, amirite)... i'm literally the only one she talks to. luckily we are super close, and she does listen to me, i spent the morning counseling her on how her skills and resources could be put to good use in this effort in productive ways versus... whatever she's got planned. but this is a topic she's honestly probably more informed on than i am so i'm not sure what to say or how. i have to freakin google half the shit she talks about so i can at least try to discuss it... but of course some of it is just horrible and i don't know what to say. i read this and the other thread to try and stay informed of developments. but i stg if i have to fly to Texas to bail her out i'm gonna lose my shit 😳 any words of advice??

tl/dr my niece is damn near radicalized and may blow something up this weekend, what should i tell her to get her to not? lol (kidding. sort of. 😐)

I know this is a bit long but watch it and see if having her watch it might help. It's a pretty good (IMO) synopsis on the conflict and the political aspects to it not only for Israel and Hamas but also other countries in the region and the US. 

 

Bremmer does a pretty good job of looking at it from different vantage points. I'd talk to her about how everyone in this world has bias and it's up to her to analyze what bias is inherent in the information she's receiving. Also how there's absolutely nothing wrong with her enjoying her life here right now, and ruining her life or ruining the lives of others isn't going to help Palestinian and Israeli civilians one bit. 

She sounds like the type of person that needs to self impose cool down periods from emotional reactions. It's important she realizes it's vital not to let yourself become a puppet strung along by disinformation aimed at attacking people's emotional vulnerabilities. Good luck. 

 

[mchookem 16324]

thank you. that's the sort of thing i was looking for.

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19100]

Got caught up in yet another protest tonight (just trying to get home from work!).

 

[mchookem 16324]

well my niece wasn't in NYC, i swear!

 

😄

[GoPokes83 2240]

One of however many of you guys that understands this more than I do dumb it down for me. Israel is going to call a humanitarian time out for 4 hours a day, with a 3 hour notice of when these 4 hours will start basically giving Hamas somewhere between 16 and 29% of the day to prepare or regroup. Is this basically the start of Israel signaling that there’s no real way to win this war? When you’re fighting against a non uniformed enemy that’s easily blended with the civilian population it’s hard enough without allowing them unhindered movement.

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19100]

22 minutes ago, mchookem said:

well my niece wasn't in NYC, i swear!

 

😄

LOL.  It just took forever.  They have been doing this for two weeks.  I support their right.  I just want them to support my right to not get caught up in their protest.  I am also not a fan of them chanting, "From the River to the Sea," as I am not sure they understand the complicated back story behind that chant.  But as long as they stay peaceful, I support their right to say it.  

[MC Fresh Breath 4074]

On 11/8/2023 at 2:04 PM, mchookem said:

personal rant, feel free to skip...so i feel like the gen z person in my life is close to off-the-rails on this topic and i'm really worried she's going to end up arrested and/or expelled in the middle of her senior year of college for crossing a line in her efforts to protest. she is beyond passionate at this point 😒

her enthusiasm is right in line with her Type A/ocd/eating disorder mental issues... she grabs hold of something and gives it 1000% and just won't let go. she's also a leader so she's actually organizing some shit this weekend...i don't even want to really know details but ngl... i'm worried how it might turn out. i actually admire her passion and commitment, and i don't think she's even wrong (i share many of her sentiments)... but not if she ends up sabotaging her future. 

a sample - 'i can't sit back and lavish in my cushy american privilege and future while innocent men women and children are bombed and their history erased! that's horrifying and i can and will sacrifice so that they can have a chance. those kids deserve to grow up as much as i do!'

she and her mother haven't been speaking for a while (nothing to do with this, mostly her moms alcohol/histrionics) and her dad is a wet-brained moronic maga-type (i mean thank god she doesn't actually drink, amirite)... i'm literally the only one she talks to. luckily we are super close, and she does listen to me, i spent the morning counseling her on how her skills and resources could be put to good use in this effort in productive ways versus... whatever she's got planned. but this is a topic she's honestly probably more informed on than i am so i'm not sure what to say or how. i have to freakin google half the shit she talks about so i can at least try to discuss it... but of course some of it is just horrible and i don't know what to say. i read this and the other thread to try and stay informed of developments. but i stg if i have to fly to Texas to bail her out i'm gonna lose my shit 😳 any words of advice??

tl/dr my niece is damn near radicalized and may blow something up this weekend, what should i tell her to get her to not? lol (kidding. sort of. 😐)

Learning about US aided genocide can be troubling.

 

But like all of us here actually, we can't make much impact.  As there is complete bi-partisan agreement (re: the masters want it). edit: last few minutes of this one are a bit to polly-ana-ish for me.  Money and might rule all.

 

The lack of true power and impact we all have in this duopoly can be frustrating for sure.  

Perhaps contributing to humanitarian causes is the way to go.  I give to this one:

https://www.anera.org/

 

Edited November 10, 2023 by MC Fresh Breath

[956 Worldwide 34705]

28 minutes ago, MC Fresh Breath said:

Learning about US aided genocide can be troubling.

 

But like all of us here actually, we can't make much impact.  As there is complete bi-partisan agreement (re: the masters want it). edit: last few minutes of this one are a bit to polly-ana-ish for me.  Money and might rule all.

 

The lack of true power and impact we all have in this duopoly can be frustrating for sure.  

Perhaps contributing to humanitarian causes is the way to go.  I give to this one:

https://www.anera.org/

 

Serious question, do you realize you’re sharing pure, uncut agitprop and disinformation? It doesn’t make it better when it’s delivered by a smarmy guy in glasses using the buzzwords that get you going.  Fucking up the map of U.S. military installations this badly in the CENTCOM AOR alone is reason enough to tune out:

Here’s a hint: all those alleged installations northeast of India and up from the Persian Gulf? They don’t fucking exist except in leftist fever dreams and Russian disinformation maps.  Neither does the capability to “invade any corner of the globe in a matter of hours” although I’m sure there are people at the Pentagon who’d like to hear this guy’s pitch on how to do it. 

 

Speaking of Russian disinformation, what was “Breakthrough News” concerned about before October 6?

Oh, carrying Russia’s water and advocating for the end of aid to Ukraine. That actually….tracks perfectly.  Totally on-brand and easy to spot within the first fucking two minutes of watching your video.   

It is not better or smarter to fall for this shit from an “anti-imperialist” perspective.

[956 Worldwide 34705]

But maybe “Breathrough News” are just peaceniks.  Maybe they just really believe all war is bad.  That’s a good take, right? What else are they caring about besides…….

Celebrating Wagner Group organized coups in Africa.

Calling Zelenskyy a welfare queen (note Russian spelling of his name in the screengrab)

Hyping the Putin-Kim Jong Un alliance. 
 

Europe needs to undo sanctions against Russia! 
 

“The Eritrean government is good, actually….” Is a take. It is a take. 
 

 

[956 Worldwide 34705]

Although, this has been an instructive insight into how information manipulation works, it’s as easy as sending out something that’s well produced and that vibes with your biases and all of a sudden you’re sharing content from an outlet stocked with Kremlin and PRC shills. 
 

https://www.thedailybeast.com/neville-singham-funded-breakthrough-news-is-pushing-moscow-beijing-propaganda

 

Quote

Since it started posting to Instagram and Youtube in early 2020, nearly all BreakThrough News’ camera-facing personalities have been veterans of Kremlin-backed outfits: former Radio Sputnik host Eugene Puryear; pundit Rania Khalek of video generator ‘In the Now;’ Kei Pritsker, Abby Martin, and Brian Becker of defunct propaganda organ RT America. BreakThrough’s earliest productions lambasted America’s presidential system and persistent racial inequality, and attacked the American and Brazilian responses to the COVID-19 outbreak while praising policies in China.

 

But beginning in January 2022, amid the build-up to Russia’s unprovoked assault on Ukraine, the channel began sharing videos with titles like “Risking World War III with Russia: Why?” and “If NATO Goes to War, U.S. & European Soldiers Will Be Called On to Kill & Die.” More recent clips have carried such headlines as “Leaked Pentagon Docs Show US Elites Want Never-Ending Ukraine War” and “G7 Sends F-16 Jets to Ukraine: Flirting with Disaster, Direct War on Russia.”

These themes are familiar to observers of a particular fringe of the Western political spectrum, where the U.S.’s domestic and international abuses have kindled sympathy for hostile autocracies—and have even tempted a few to accept paychecks and platforms from their state media.

 

[Anastasis 23464]

40 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Fucking up the map of U.S. military installations this badly in the CENTCOM AOR alone is reason enough to tune out:

Here’s a hint: all those alleged installations northeast of India and up from the Persian Gulf? They don’t fucking exist except in leftist fever dreams and Russian disinformation maps.  Neither does the capability to “invade any corner of the globe in a matter of hours” although I’m sure there are people at the Pentagon who’d like to hear this guy’s pitch on how to do it. 

 

nORtHeAsT Of inDiA aNd uP FRoM tHe GUlF! dEy dON't ExiST. 

Jesus Christ, speaking of disinformation. Or maybe just poor geography skills. 

 

 

[956 Worldwide 34705]

Northwest* and up from the Persian Gulf. And you’re a Kremlin troll. Fuck uou. 

[Anastasis 23464]

Just now, 956 Worldwide said:

And you’re a Kremlin troll.

Well that is of course false, but totally unexpected type of rhetoric from a state department talking head. You got a drum you beat it, even and esp when it is nonsensical. Regurgitate some more talking points for us Ned Jr. 

[956 Worldwide 34705]

3 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Well that is of course false, but totally unexpected type of rhetoric from a state department talking head. You got a drum you beat it, even and esp when it is nonsensical. Regurgitate some more talking points for us Ned Jr. 

You have nothing to add to any discussion except pure edgelord bullshit and defense of Kremlin shit, every time. You’re a troll who carries their water. 

[Anastasis 23464]

1 minute ago, 956 Worldwide said:

You have nothing to add to any discussion except pure edgelord bullshit and defense of Kremlin shit, every time. You’re a troll who carries their water. 

You've been part of the political discussion on these boards since what, late 2020? I am unsurprised that you feel secure in making an assessment of anything given that window. Matches up well with the short attention span expectation. 

[Hermanator 7032]

3 hours ago, GoPokes83 said:

One of however many of you guys that understands this more than I do dumb it down for me. Israel is going to call a humanitarian time out for 4 hours a day, with a 3 hour notice of when these 4 hours will start basically giving Hamas somewhere between 16 and 29% of the day to prepare or regroup. Is this basically the start of Israel signaling that there’s no real way to win this war? When you’re fighting against a non uniformed enemy that’s easily blended with the civilian population it’s hard enough without allowing them unhindered movement.

Israel's in a catch 22. Don't allow humanitarian aid to the millions of Palestinians who had no part in attacking them and they'll be seen as sadistic ghouls the world over. They also risk waning US support as Biden can't be seen as the president siding with genocide in an election year. 

I feel they may be on the cusp of making similar mistakes as the US after 9/11. Initial support at being the victim of attack flips when you spend years invading lands and killing women and children. There really isn't any good course of action, ol' Benji fucked up by falling asleep at the wheel and allowing their defenses to be defeated that easily and severely. 

[texas08 1599]

Gunfire and bombs dropping left and right

[Willfully Horn 8002]

4 hours ago, 956 Worldwide said:

You have nothing to add to any discussion except pure edgelord bullshit and defense of Kremlin shit, every time. You’re a troll who carries their water. 

 

4 hours ago, Anastasis said:

You've been part of the political discussion on these boards since what, late 2020? I am unsurprised that you feel secure in making an assessment of anything given that window. Matches up well with the short attention span expectation. 

Narcissists attack.

[BrazilHorn 6586]

It’s funny how folks in Congress are asking for a ceasefire.
 

After our “9/11” the US went to war for 20 years across two countries with estimates of over 400k civilians killed. 
 

It took the US ~10 years to find the ring leader of our attacks and we went so far as to sneak into a “neutral” third country to kill him. 
 

The fact that the US wants to lecture is just so classic an American thing to do it’s just amazing  

 

 

 

 

[BrickHorn 18217]

6 hours ago, Willfully Horn said:

Narcissists attack.

[TreatyOak 16311]

14 hours ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

Got caught up in yet another protest tonight (just trying to get home from work!).

 

NYC Public Library at 42nd Street. Highly underrated. 

[Anastasis 23464]

15 minutes ago, BrickHorn said:

You seem like the type to use a rUsSiaN SpELlInG oF zeLeNsKiY so you are on the list buddy. 

[MC Fresh Breath 4074]

956 is on my ignore list.  It would not matter what source I shared with that douchebag warmongering shitheel who loves zionist takes.  

 

['stache 21800]

14 hours ago, Hermanator said:

Israel's in a catch 22. Don't allow humanitarian aid to the millions of Palestinians who had no part in attacking them and they'll be seen as sadistic ghouls the world over. They also risk waning US support as Biden can't be seen as the president siding with genocide in an election year. 

I feel they may be on the cusp of making similar mistakes as the US after 9/11. Initial support at being the victim of attack flips when you spend years invading lands and killing women and children. There really isn't any good course of action, ol' Benji fucked up by falling asleep at the wheel and allowing their defenses to be defeated that easily and severely. 

Americans were overwhelmingly in support of efforts to root out terrorism in the middle east after 9/11. Public support faded when it became full scale wars against Iraq and Afghanistan. It's obviously difficult to root out individuals and terrorist cells as opposed to flighting state armies, but that's the reality of the situation in that region and should be waged as such, in my opinion.

Edited November 10, 2023 by 'stache

[chainsaw 9860]

4 hours ago, TreatyOak said:

NYC Public Library at 42nd Street. Highly underrated. 

 

[Da Fino 2776]

30 minutes ago, MC Fresh Breath said:

956 is on my ignore list.  It would not matter what source I shared with that douchebag warmongering shitheel who loves zionist takes.  

 

Fascinating. How many on your ignore lists would you label as zionists? 

[mdmost 43001]

35 minutes ago, MC Fresh Breath said:

956 is on my ignore list.  It would not matter what source I shared with that douchebag warmongering shitheel who loves zionist takes.  

 

Nice echo chamber you built for yourself. 

[chainsaw 9860]

17 hours ago, MC Fresh Breath said:

Learning about US aided genocide can be troubling.

 

But like all of us here actually, we can't make much impact.  As there is complete bi-partisan agreement (re: the masters want it). edit: last few minutes of this one are a bit to polly-ana-ish for me.  Money and might rule all.

 

The lack of true power and impact we all have in this duopoly can be frustrating for sure.  

Perhaps contributing to humanitarian causes is the way to go.  I give to this one:

https://www.anera.org/

 

Hard to swallow pills but necessary.

[statsman 5456]

56 minutes ago, chainsaw said:

Hard to swallow pills but necessary.

Genocide? Please. 
 
The Holocaust was attempted genocide against the Jewish people. 
 
What Turkey tried to do to the Armenians was attempted genocide. 
 
What the Hutus tried to do to the Tutsis was attempted genocide. 
 
Israel is not attempting anything like genocide. Calling it genocide is a form of anti-semitism, implying these accusers learned more from the Holocaust than the Jews did. 

[Serak The Preparer 3431]

23 minutes ago, statsman said:

Genocide? Please. 
 
The Holocaust was attempted genocide against the Jewish people. 
 
What Turkey tried to do to the Armenians was attempted genocide. 
 
What the Hutus tried to do to the Tutsis was attempted genocide. 
 
Israel is not attempting anything like genocide. Calling it genocide is a form of anti-semitism, implying these accusers learned more from the Holocaust than the Jews did. 

Oh for fuck's sake, these takes are getting more and more ridiculous. I frankly am not interested in arguing over what level of killing innocent people rises to the definition of "genocide" but it is not a goddanm form of anti-semitism to call it that as used in common discussion. I am not even saying Israel should or should not be doing what they are doing but you continuously conflate criticism of Israel with anti-semitic views. They can overlap of course, but are not one and the same.

[Anastasis 23464]

26 minutes ago, statsman said:

Genocide? Please. 
 
The Holocaust was attempted genocide against the Jewish people. 
 
What Turkey tried to do to the Armenians was attempted genocide. 
 
What the Hutus tried to do to the Tutsis was attempted genocide. 
 
Israel is not attempting anything like genocide. Calling it genocide is a form of anti-semitism, implying these accusers learned more from the Holocaust than the Jews did. 

A piece put out this week by a sociologist and genocide scholar. You might find it interesting. Just the closing paragraph below, but the article is worth a quick read in whole. 

https://newlinesmag.com/spotlight/the-uses-and-abuses-of-the-term-genocide-in-gaza/

“Genocide” is generally under-deployed because states wish to avoid the responsibilities to “prevent and punish” that the convention imposes on signatories, but there is a special aversion to investigating its implications for Israel’s conduct. Western states continue to protect it out of a misplaced belief that Jews, having been prime historical victims of genocide, cannot also be its perpetrators. Israel’s current policies are rapidly destroying that conceit, however, and bringing closer the day when its leaders — as well as those of Hamas — will be brought to account for their crimes.

[Anastasis 23464]

1 minute ago, Serak The Preparer said:

Oh for fuck's sake, these takes are getting more and more ridiculous.

You are talking to a poster that kept clamoring about the "Rule of Law" in the context of illegal Israeli settlements and occupation. I'd say it started with ridiculous straight off the bat. 

[956 Worldwide 34705]

1 hour ago, mdmost said:

Nice echo chamber you built for yourself. 

Doubling down on stuff that’s both demonstrably full of untruths and also clearly foreign-origin autocratic agitprop is brainwormy behavior.

LOL at Zionist being a slur, I do indeed openly support a Jewish-character independent nation in the Levant. 

[Nivek 16923]

Funny how many useful idiots love to sign themselves up for russian propaganda or even when it is exposed as such, refuse to acknowledge it and double down.    

Had they been born in Oklahoma they would be telling themselves and us that Texas is just as dirty as OU, LSU and UGA.  

[chainsaw 9860]

1 hour ago, statsman said:

Calling it genocide is a form of anti-semitism

Denying it's genocide is a form of delusion.

[statsman 5456]

57 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

A piece put out this week by a sociologist and genocide scholar. You might find it interesting. Just the closing paragraph below, but the article is worth a quick read in whole. 

https://newlinesmag.com/spotlight/the-uses-and-abuses-of-the-term-genocide-in-gaza/

“Genocide” is generally under-deployed because states wish to avoid the responsibilities to “prevent and punish” that the convention imposes on signatories, but there is a special aversion to investigating its implications for Israel’s conduct. Western states continue to protect it out of a misplaced belief that Jews, having been prime historical victims of genocide, cannot also be its perpetrators. Israel’s current policies are rapidly destroying that conceit, however, and bringing closer the day when its leaders — as well as those of Hamas — will be brought to account for their crimes.

But that’s not true. There is no special aversion to using it wrt Israel. It happens all the time! In this thread! Anti-Israelis and anti-Semites like to use it to refer to Israeli policies, because they believe its application reduces the ability of Jews to be victims of anti-semitism. 

[wildcat09 29348]

1 hour ago, statsman said:

Genocide? Please. 
 
The Holocaust was attempted genocide against the Jewish people. 
 
What Turkey tried to do to the Armenians was attempted genocide. 
 
What the Hutus tried to do to the Tutsis was attempted genocide. 
 
Israel is not attempting anything like genocide. Calling it genocide is a form of anti-semitism, implying these accusers learned more from the Holocaust than the Jews did. 

I think the parallels between the Armenian genocide and the current situation in Gaza are pretty obvious.  The Young Turks thought that the land known as "Turkey" belonged to ethnic Turks and used violence and the threat of violence to force millions of Armenians to relocate to Syria. As they were carrying it out, they denied that they were attempting to kill Armenians and claimed that they were simply resettling them for the safety of the empire and those who deny the Armenian genocide today claim that they only intended to resettle Armenians as a defensive measure, not kill them.

I think there's room for reasonable debate whether what Israel is currently doing qualifies as a genocide as defined by the Geneva convention.  But the only reason I think there's room for debate is that I think there's tensions among Israel's current leadership about the goals of their current actions, and the perpetrator's intent is a central component of genocide as defined by the Geneva convention. I think there's also a pretty good argument to be made that the Geneva convention's definition is insufficient and doesn't cover certain acts of ethnic cleansing that most people would reasonably view as genocide (e.g. the Trail of Tears). But to say it's anti-Semitic to see what Israel is currently carrying out as a genocide is absurd.

[Brian Fantana 6682]

1 hour ago, statsman said:

Genocide? Please. 
 
The Holocaust was attempted genocide against the Jewish people. 
 
What Turkey tried to do to the Armenians was attempted genocide. 
 
What the Hutus tried to do to the Tutsis was attempted genocide. 
 
Israel is not attempting anything like genocide. Calling it genocide is a form of anti-semitism, implying these accusers learned more from the Holocaust than the Jews did. 

This is an absolutely trash take, but I guess I should expect this from the motherfucker that is claiming Israel's ongoing actions in the West Bank are because of Hamas.

[DixonHur 11296]

7 minutes ago, statsman said:

But that’s not true. There is no special aversion to using it wrt Israel. It happens all the time! In this thread! Anti-Israelis and anti-Semites like to use it to refer to Israeli policies, because they believe its application reduces the ability of Jews to be victims of anti-semitism. 

Serious question, do you consider people who are anti-Israel to be Anti-Semites?

[Brian Fantana 6682]

1 minute ago, DixonHur said:

Serious question, do you consider people who are anti-Israel to be Anti-Semites?

Of course he does. He and 956 have openly stated that criticizing the actions of Israel's government is antisemitism multiple times in this thread. The irony that their position is, in fact, actual antisemitism is lost of them of course.

Edited November 10, 2023 by Brian Fantana

[Huckleberry 32850]

9 minutes ago, statsman said:

But that’s not true. There is no special aversion to using it wrt Israel. It happens all the time! In this thread!

Uh yeah, then you call it antisemitic. That's the point. Try to keep up. 

[DDD Dad 14331]

15 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

I think the parallels between the Armenian genocide and the current situation in Gaza are pretty obvious.  The Young Turks thought that the land known as "Turkey" belonged to ethnic Turks and used violence and the threat of violence to force millions of Armenians to relocate to Syria. As they were carrying it out, they denied that they were attempting to kill Armenians and claimed that they were simply resettling them for the safety of the empire and those who deny the Armenian genocide today claim that they only intended to resettle Armenians as a defensive measure, not kill them.

I think there's room for reasonable debate whether what Israel is currently doing qualifies as a genocide as defined by the Geneva convention.  But the only reason I think there's room for debate is that I think there's tensions among Israel's current leadership about the goals of their current actions, and the perpetrator's intent is a central component of genocide as defined by the Geneva convention. I think there's also a pretty good argument to be made that the Geneva convention's definition is insufficient and doesn't cover certain acts of ethnic cleansing that most people would reasonably view as genocide (e.g. the Trail of Tears). But to say it's anti-Semitic to see what Israel is currently carrying out as a genocide is absurd.

I thought it was the Palestinians that chant, "from the river to the sea," not the Israelis.  I guess I was wrong.

[Smax 3800]

Serious question, do you consider people who are anti-Israel to be Anti-Semites?

Are people who are anti black racists?

[DixonHur 11296]

Just now, Smax said:

Are people who are anti black racists?

Is black a country now?

[Anastasis 23464]

3 minutes ago, DDD Dad said:

I thought it was the Palestinians that chant, "from the river to the sea," not the Israelis.  I guess I was wrong.

It's also a phrase straight out of the early Likud party platform. 

 

[Brian Fantana 6682]

10 minutes ago, DDD Dad said:

I thought it was the Palestinians that chant, "from the river to the sea," not the Israelis.  I guess I was wrong.

"Between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty"

Edited November 10, 2023 by Brian Fantana

[956 Worldwide 34705]

17 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

Of course he does. He and 956 have openly stated that criticizing the actions of Israel's government is antisemitism multiple times in this thread. The irony that their position is, in fact, actual antisemitism is lost of them of course.

I’ve criticized Bibi’s government on this thread myself. I did say that the (completely unhinged) theory that the Israeli government “let October 7 happen” is super fucking anti-Semitic, and it is, even if you hide behind that “anti-Israel, not Jewish” fig leaf. 

[DDD Dad 14331]

1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

It's also a phrase straight out of the early Likud party platform. 

1 hour ago, Brian Fantana said:

"Between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty"

I'm aware of that language in the original Likud platform.  That party has always been opposed to a two state solution and claims an eternal right to both sides of the Jordan.  So what?

I'm not aware of Israelis generally using that phrase as a rallying cry currently.  Some others are, though.

 

Edited November 10, 2023 by DDD Dad