Israel

[NowThis 931]

7 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

I think you're wrong. Post all the faces of death you want. Let me know the first time the picture is the difference that changes anyone's mind. 

people form opinions in a variety of ways, reading, pics, videos, friends etc. Out of a large population, pic and videos will affect someone. After all, most Americans became pro Israel somehow, the data came in a variety of forms - most likely Holocaust images and the legacy of WW2, along with the bible and other cultural factors. To say that NO ONE will EVER be affected by this form of data is a very limited viewpoint. After all, the world was moved by ISIS slitting the throat of James Foley in full video, a boring newspaper article doesn't have the same effect of this..  Images matter my friend, A LOT. 

[WhatTheBuck 28705]

20 minutes ago, NowThis said:

people form opinions in a variety of ways, reading, pics, videos, friends etc. Out of a large population, pic and videos will affect someone. After all, most Americans became pro Israel somehow, the data came in a variety of forms - most likely Holocaust images and the legacy of WW2, along with the bible and other cultural factors. To say that NO ONE will EVER be affected by this form of data is a very limited viewpoint. After all, the world was moved by ISIS slitting the throat of James Foley in full video, a boring newspaper article doesn't have the same effect of this..  Images matter my friend, A LOT. 

I'm satisfied in my understanding of human psychology. Like I said, let me know if you change anyone's mind. I think your approach might come across as overzealous (literally), and actually turn people off. 

[NowThis 931]

41 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

I'm satisfied in my understanding of human psychology. Like I said, let me know if you change anyone's mind. I think your approach might come across as overzealous (literally), and actually turn people off. 

well your understanding needs some improvement.  If pics/videos have no effect, then how will ordinary online articles? Why post anything on any topic? How can you prove changing anyone's mind on anything you personally post? You are presuming everything is perpetually rigid or that someone will capitulate and say they are wrong.

how do we determine who is overzealous? on the Trump thread, we have dozens of rabid trump haters, is that turning people off? Have they ever changed anyone's mind over the last 2 years? I think your questions are a bizarre criteria, impossible to prove.  So posting pics of REALITY turns people off? good grief, what a weak minded group of people we have here. 

[WhatTheBuck 28705]

1 hour ago, NowThis said:

well your understanding needs some improvement.  If pics/videos have no effect, then how will ordinary online articles? Why post anything on any topic? How can you prove changing anyone's mind on anything you personally post? You are presuming everything is perpetually rigid or that someone will capitulate and say they are wrong.

how do we determine who is overzealous? on the Trump thread, we have dozens of rabid trump haters, is that turning people off? Have they ever changed anyone's mind over the last 2 years? I think your questions are a bizarre criteria, impossible to prove.  So posting pics of REALITY turns people off? good grief, what a weak minded group of people we have here. 

Like I said, just let me know when your approach achieves your goal. I've had my say. I don't think I'll ever see a "told you so" post from you. 

[NowThis 931]

2 hours ago, WhatTheBuck said:

Like I said, just let me know when your approach achieves your goal. I've had my say. I don't think I'll ever see a "told you so" post from you. 

my goal is to educate people, so your idea is a false premise. I'm not looking for a 'told you so' moment. I'm not expecting a right winger to say "yeah, Israel is a racist fascist dictatorship, i was wrong all along, F Israel!". If that 'gotcha' moment happens, great, but that's not the goal.  Also, you never answered my numerous questions to you. 

No one ever changes their mind on the Arab Israel conflict on the internet, i've been on this for about 20+ years, people are firmly entrenched on one side with pro Arabs being less than 5% due to cultural and demographic factors.  In fact, few people ever change their mind publicly on the internet on ANY topic (sports, music, politics etc). So your project of "goal" isn't what I had in mind to begin with. Not sure how you came up with that. 

I'm still perplexed why you or anyone would be against pictures of reality. Even more bizarre is the idea that REALITY of Israeli evil would actually make people more pro-Israel. So I take it that we shouldn't be so strongly anti Israel as that may frighten the softies around here?

[Fozzz 152]

Never believe reactionaries when they whine about threats to free speech.  It's all bullshit, and always has been.

 

 

[HenryJames 65887]

 

[Anastasis 23393]

1 hour ago, Fozzz said:

Never believe reactionaries when they whine about threats to free speech.  It's all bullshit, and always has been.

 

 

mmm, za'atar bread. 

[NowThis 931]

2 hours ago, Fozzz said:

Never believe reactionaries when they whine about threats to free speech.  It's all bullshit, and always has been.

 

 

it's incredible that Americans have to swear allegiance to a foreign power.  Ownage is complete

[NowThis 931]

1 hour ago, HenryJames said:

 

yes, i posted a video upthread of him being shot in the back of the head while simply walking away.

[NowThis 931]

Israel army arrests 3 year old.  Has a happy ending though, invest 55 seconds to watch it. 

 

Edited December 17, 2018 by NowThis

[bad_teammate 13132]

24 minutes ago, NowThis said:

Israel army arrests 3 year old.  Has a happy ending though, invest 55 seconds to watch it. 

 

Pathetic.

[Chrispy 132]

My in-laws are going to Israel next summer and are looking for restaurant recommendations, etc. If anyone on this thread has been there, I’m all ears. 

[NowThis 931]

Haaretz , a liberal progressive Israeli paper, posted this opinion piece.  Kobi Niv, an Israeli Jewish journalist, says it's ok to shoot IDF soldiers.  This is excellent progress in Israeli thinking. 

https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/shooting-at-soldiers-of-occupation-is-legitimate-1.6766115?fbclid=IwAR3yDO99A28AYia0szwNtpZmF6U7YSXxzAr3RREP2x95biZG78gIg8GviG8

 

And unfortunately, in Ofra, Hebron and all the territories occupied in the 1967 war, Israel is a nation and army of occupation

The heart aches and is torn following the death and injury of young men in last week’s attack near the settlement of Ofra. The soul is roused and angered, but even at such a time we must admit the truth to ourselves: Shooting at an occupying army is a legitimate action according to any law. And unfortunately, in Ofra and its sister settlements, in Hebron and its environs and in all the territories occupied in the 1967 war, we are an occupying nation and army.

Yes, in Judea, Samaria and Gaza we’re an occupying and oppressing nation, by means of the Israel Defense Forces, the Shin Bet security service and the settlers, who are the civilian arm of the occupation, oppressing the people living there, the Palestinians. These areas do not belong to us and not one person in the entire world (not even our savior Trump) recognizes our rights or ownership over these lands. We are a nation, an army, a security service and settlers who are occupiers there.

 

[NowThis 931]

East Jerusalem Arab families are forced to demolish their own homes, or pay a demolition fee to the military dictatorship of Israel.  This practice is common to make life miserable for the East Jerusalem Arabs so that eventually the Jews can take over bit by bit. 

https://mondoweiss.net/2018/12/demolition-palestinian-jerusalem-demolish/?fbclid=IwAR2kbcbVAyn0m0dF7woxLJ0h8tc0uILh0SIXsxp8vxav52Mq8vqgUlwp5XM

 

 

Murad is the latest addition to the growing list of Palestinians in East Jerusalem who have made the unbearable decision to destroy their own home.

With Israeli building permits too expensive for most Palestinians in Jerusalem, many are forced to build their homes without a license, and thus face the Israeli demolition order that inevitably follows.

When officials from Israel’s Jerusalem Municipality served Hashimi with a demolition order for the home he built 20 years ago, he was given two options: demolish the house himself, or wait for Israeli forces to destroy his home, and then pay them a demolition fee.

[Anastasis 23393]

Fuck Murad. We got to implement God's will via American foreign policy.

 

 

[Zavala 1384]

On 12/23/2018 at 11:04 AM, Anastasis said:

Fuck Murad. We got to implement God's will via American foreign policy.

 

Count the dual citizens in the house and Senate. 

[NowThis 931]

facebook has video clips which are not always on youtube or MSM (lol). So here a youth on crutches (white shirt) standing and is shot by the IDF , i think this is on the Gaza border.  You see, the Israelis will lie to you every day about "threats" when in reality they shoot people for entertainment or to make a statement about who is really in control , or to terrorize the civilian population. 

 

edit - just realized the youth on crutches only had one leg, most likely the other shot off the IDF which is standard practice. NOW FOR FUN THEY SHOOT OFF THE OTHER LEG. 

 

Edited January 19, 2019 by NowThis

[NowThis 931]

here's the Youtube of the one legged man being shot by an Israeli sniper . That was January . 

 

last week, the IDF snipers murdered 2 teenagers and a 44 year old woman. Not one of the 300+ murdered civilians were armed. 

This 14yo shot in the neck in broad daylight by a sniper. Your tax dollars at work. 

 

Edited February 10, 2019 by NowThis

[Asithappens 974]

Ok, let's play your game and stipulate that this was a "murder".

How many murders are the Palestinians guilty of?

The Palestinians are their own worst enemy, imo. Not that this condones what the Israelis do. 

But I don't remember Israelis dancing in the street after 9/11. 

I don't remember Israel attacking other Arab states way back when and getting their shit kicked. Do you?

Bibi is a fuckstick, imo. And Israel is barely a "democracy". But the Palestinians? Give me a break.

[bad_teammate 13132]

1 minute ago, Asithappens said:

Ok, let's play your game and stipulate that this was a "murder".

How many murders are the Palestinians guilty of?

The Palestinians are their own worst enemy, imo. Not that this condones what the Israelis do. 

But I don't remember Israelis dancing in the street after 9/11. 

I don't remember Israel attacking other Arab states way back when and getting their shit kicked. Do you?

Bibi is a fuckstick, imo. And Israel is barely a "democracy". But the Palestinians? Give me a break.

That bolded statement is like Ricky Bobby saying, "with all due respect"

What did that one-legged man do? What did the children and women do? 

"the Palestinians", you know, that homogeneous group of animals who share group responsibility for whatever crimes you imagine in your head?

fuck off

[Asithappens 974]

I don't know, and don't care, what Ricky Bobby would say or do. I guess that is one of the things that differentiates us?

My point, which you seemed to have missed, is that Israel is not perfect; Israel has dirty hands themselves. But when compared to the Palestinians? 

How many Arab entities have, as a foundational element of their ethos, to eliminate the state of Israel from the face of the earth? 

Imo, Israel today is fucking things up with Bibi et al. 

Like I said, I don't recall Israelis dancing in the streets after 9/11.

 

You fuck off.

[Brisketexan 104557]

I don't know, and don't care, what Ricky Bobby would say or do. I guess that is one of the things that differentiates us? My point, which you seemed to have missed, is that Israel is not perfect; Israel has dirty hands themselves. But when compared to the Palestinians? 

How many Arab entities have, as a foundational element of their ethos, to eliminate the state of Israel from the face of the earth? 

Imo, Israel today is fucking things up with Bibi et al. 

Like I said, I don't recall Israelis dancing in the streets after 9/11.

 

You fuck off.

 

You realize that what you typed is exactly how people rationalize genocide, right?

What does the Palestinian “nation” having said and done asshole things have to do with whether Israeli sniper X was justified in killing unarmed, one-legged Palestinian civilian Y?

And to go even further, presuming we reach a conclusion that Israel and its army has murdered numerous Palestinian civilians...then maybe we reach the same conclusion you reached about Palestinians: their nation has done some shitty things, so fuck em all. Indeed, that’s how you get to a conclusion of “fuck Israel, it shouldn’t exist.” Perfect. You are what you hate.

 

[WhatTheBuck 28705]

34 minutes ago, Asithappens said:

Ok, let's play your game and stipulate that this was a "murder".

How many murders are the Palestinians guilty of?

The Palestinians are their own worst enemy, imo. Not that this condones what the Israelis do. 

But I don't remember Israelis dancing in the street after 9/11. 

I don't remember Israel attacking other Arab states way back when and getting their shit kicked. Do you?

Bibi is a fuckstick, imo. And Israel is barely a "democracy". But the Palestinians? Give me a break.

Replace "Palestinians" with "Texans" and tell me how they'd act if a bunch of outsiders came and stole their land, their voice, and deprived them of the political power to do anything about it. It's not how you see it, it's how they see it, and people who've lived on the land for a thousand years and see outsiders taking it from them are only going to react in one way. It's as predictable as the sunrise. 

[Asithappens 974]

Not really. 

Do you realize that what I typed is exactly how Israel justifies defending its existence?

It's a shit storm over there. Maybe you've got it figured out. If so, good for you. 

And yeah, fuck 'em all. But at the end of the day, it won't be the Israelis dancing in the streets when the next 9/11 comes....

I'll hold my nose and be with the Israelis. 

[hpslugga 4043]

15 minutes ago, Asithappens said:

Not really. 

Do you realize that what I typed is exactly how Israel justifies defending its existence?

It's a shit storm over there. Maybe you've got it figured out. If so, good for you. 

And yeah, fuck 'em all. But at the end of the day, it won't be the Israelis dancing in the streets when the next 9/11 comes....

I'll hold my nose and be with the Israelis. 

Posts like these are why I always cringe when I see this thread has new posts in it.

[Bama Chick 28596]

So, as long as a country displays fealty to America, they’re all good and can shoot the disabled, children, old people, and unarmed people?

Seriously? That’s your barometer? They didn’t have some assholes cheer after 9/11?

That’s some ridiculous jingoistic logic.

[Fozzz 152]

15 hours ago, Asithappens said:

Ok, let's play your game and stipulate that this was a "murder".

How many murders are the Palestinians guilty of?

The Palestinians are their own worst enemy, imo. Not that this condones what the Israelis do. 

But I don't remember Israelis dancing in the street after 9/11. 

I don't remember Israel attacking other Arab states way back when and getting their shit kicked. Do you?

Bibi is a fuckstick, imo. And Israel is barely a "democracy". But the Palestinians? Give me a break.

Yes, let's both sides ethnic cleansing.  Freak.  

[Johnny Sack 8397]

They were on the side of the Nazis in WWII.  They started a war with Israel in 1948 and lost.   Losing territory is the consequence.  

Move the fuck on.  Israel isn’t giving it back.  Just like the US isn’t giving back the Southwest.  

[David Dennison 18652]

3 minutes ago, Johnny Sack said:

They were on the side of the Nazis in WWII.  They started a war with Israel in 1948 and lost.   Losing territory is the consequence.  

Move the fuck on.  Israel isn’t giving it back.  Just like the US isn’t giving back the Southwest.  

Then annex it and make it part of Israel.

Oh, that's right. They don't want new voters.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

Just now, David Dennison said:

Then annex it and make it part of Israel.

Oh, that's right. They don't want new voters.

Yeah the other Arab states didn't want 'em either when given the chance.

[David Dennison 18652]

1 minute ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Yeah the other Arab states didn't want 'em either when given the chance.

That's completely irrelevant when talking about the occupation.

[SimonBolivar 10911]

6 minutes ago, Johnny Sack said:

 Just like the US isn’t giving back the Southwest.  

Just give it time amigo. Spanish Habsburg long game.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

Just now, David Dennison said:

That's completely irrelevant when talking about the occupation.

No, its not  When this all went down back in 48 the Arabs states wouldn't take the Palestinians. It's only irrelevant because it doesn't fit in your weird little boxed in view of the world.

[NowThis 931]

31 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Yeah the other Arab states didn't want 'em either when given the chance.

except Palestinian refugees are in all the neighboring states. So your point is incorrect as a basic fact. 

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

Just now, NowThis said:

except Palestinian refugees are in all the neighboring states. So your point is incorrect as a basic fact. 

At the time of the creation of the Israeli state they didn't want to take the Palestinians.

[Asithappens 974]

2 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

At the time of the creation of the Israeli state they didn't want to take the Palestinians.

Correct.

So much for "Arab Brotherhood".

 

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

Just now, Asithappens said:

Correct.

So much for "Arab Brotherhood".

 

Got to be the right kind of Arab.

[NowThis 931]

20 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

At the time of the creation of the Israeli state they didn't want to take the Palestinians.

but they did in 1948.

I believe the argument is -- well if the Arabs mistreat the Pals, then how can anyone complain about the Jews mistreating the Pals? ie, Jewish mistreatment of the Pals is ok then and not really a big deal because their own Arab brothers do the same! 

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

Just now, NowThis said:

but they did in 1948.

I believe the argument is -- well if the Arabs mistreat the Pals, then how can anyone complain about the Jews mistreating the Pals? ie, Jewish mistreatment of the Pals is ok then and not really a big deal because their own Arab brothers do the same! 

No, that's not my argument at all.  There's no excuse for some of the shit the Israelis do.  I was simply responding to a comment that they should annex the West Bank.

[David Dennison 18652]

1 hour ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

No, its not  When this all went down back in 48 the Arabs states wouldn't take the Palestinians. It's only irrelevant because it doesn't fit in your weird little boxed in view of the world.

Why should they take the Palestinians? Why are the Israelis so hesitant to make the Palestinians Israelis?

[Lagunamadre 1975]

2 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Why should they take the Palestinians? Why are the Israelis so hesitant to make the Palestinians Israelis?

Because Bibi needs people for his base to fear and hate to distract them from his corruption. Sound familiar? 

[Asithappens 974]

3 minutes ago, Lagunamadre said:

Because Bibi needs people for his base to fear and hate to distract them from his corruption. Sound familiar? 

That's not the reason, imo.

Look at birth rates.

[Fozzz 152]

1 hour ago, Johnny Sack said:

They were on the side of the Nazis in WWII.  They started a war with Israel in 1948 and lost.   Losing territory is the consequence.  

Move the fuck on.  Israel isn’t giving it back.  Just like the US isn’t giving back the Southwest.  

Proud Apartheid supporter here.  

[NowThis 931]

23 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

No, that's not my argument at all.  There's no excuse for some of the shit the Israelis do.  I was simply responding to a comment that they should annex the West Bank.

well, ok then.  Since the Israeli army and settlers are never leaving, the 2 state solution is only proposed by idiots now, either the brutal occupation is eternal or they annex it.

[Johnny Sack 8397]

9 minutes ago, Fozzz said:

Proud Apartheid supporter here.  

Backing Hitler and invading another country has consequences.  Don't do both and then bitch about the result when you lose after you failed to finish Hitler's goals.

[Fozzz 152]

Just now, Johnny Sack said:

Backing Hitler and invading another country has consequences.  Don't do both and then bitch about the result when you lose after you failed to finish Hitler's goals.

You and Dylann Roof appear to have a few things in common.

[bad_teammate 13132]

JohnnySack doing the "if I scream loudly and incoherently enough I'll win" thing.

[David Dennison 18652]

4 minutes ago, Johnny Sack said:

Backing Hitler and invading another country has consequences.  Don't do both and then bitch about the result when you lose after you failed to finish Hitler's goals.

How long do generations of Palestinians who had nothing to do with either of those things have to suffer at the hands of Israeli oppression? When does the statute run?

Edited February 11, 2019 by David Dennison

[Foosters 17727]

5 minutes ago, Johnny Sack said:

Backing Hitler and invading another country has consequences.  Don't do both and then bitch about the result when you lose after you failed to finish Hitler's goals.

Backing Hitler?  Do we apply the same standard to, you know, Germany?