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2019 San Antonio Spurs Offseason Thread -- Rebuild or Run it Back?

Patrick Bateman

By Patrick Bateman
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Patrick Bateman

Patrick Bateman 3932

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There's no way to really spin this.  Yea, Morris went back on his word and looks like a weasel, but this is another failure on PATFO's part in regards to free agency.  A lot of egg on their faces.  The losses are starting to mount up when it comes to how we approach free agency/trades.

Trey Lyles is very young but not that good, FWIW.  Significant drop off especially on defense.

Edited by Patrick Bateman
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Kermit

Kermit 3158

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Third year of Carroll is team friendly, and the second year of Lyles is supposedly also team friendly. And I don’t know how this falls into a failure of the front office. They had an agreement and one party backed out. What are you supposed to do when you’re left holding your dick?

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Chad

Chad 1728

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You can't blame the Spurs for what transpired with Marcus Morris. The Spurs reached an agreement, a shady agency continued negotiating once a deal was struck and landed a more lucrative offer from a toilet bowl of a team backing out from an offer that was already agreed upon. Bertans was gone after this season, he had a player option for the final year of his contract and would've exercised his option for a bigger payday on the open market the Spurs never could've matched just like what transpired with Kyle Anderson. Bertans was a tremendous 3 point shooter, but he's a one trick pony and was absolutely bullied at the 4 on defense.

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Patrick Bateman

Patrick Bateman 3932

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16 hours ago, Kermit said:

Third year of Carroll is team friendly, and the second year of Lyles is supposedly also team friendly. And I don’t know how this falls into a failure of the front office. They had an agreement and one party backed out. What are you supposed to do when you’re left holding your dick?

That doesn't matter.  We were supposed to only get 2 years of Carroll and then be done.  Lyles isn't the player that Morris is and they were both essentially 1 year deals and he isn't the shooter Davis is nor is he a great defender, but his rep is he does give effort defensively.  So basically, we downgraded from Davis to pay more money to Carroll or an extra year.  That's fucking terrible GM'ing and I don't give two shits if Morris weaseled his way into a bigger contract.  Don't get caught with your pants down, that's on RC, Pop and the entire front office.  There are things they could have done to, at a minimum, decrease the risk that something like this could happen.  

Lyles is very young and as stated earlier, shown flashes of being productive.  Two years ago, he showed he could play some pick and pop and shoot well from the outside.  He gives effort on defense (although as discussed isn't known as a good defender) and has a huge wingspan so there is potential.  Perhaps he flourishes in the Spurs system and has some experience having played in Quin Snyder's system (very similar to Pop's) in Utah for a couple of years.  For whatever reason, Lyles really struggled to play with Jokic, who pretty much makes other competent or good players better.  All his metrics were down across the board when paired with the Joker and Jokic's were too, so this may give some concern of him playing next to LMA. 

Morris' game was mature.  You knew what you were going to get -- tough, hard nosed defense, a floor spacer with functional outside shooting, a little bit of a post up game, and tough vet presence.  Lyles is none of that, he's another developmental player, who has some potential and certainly the body and athleticism to perhaps contribute in a real way.  But if he plays like last year, he may end up 12th man or perhaps cut if there's another player that comes around in buy-out season as we have a little bit of the MLE saved.  Either way, yea fuck Morris (and Klutch) for being a weasel, but I can't get behind throwing up our hands and saying the front office had no culpability in the situation.  You rarely see this happening anywhere else.

Also..... hmmm.... we have no roster spot for him currently though.

 

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Chad

Chad 1728

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Pounding the rock created an article titled "As far as backup plans go, Trey Lyles is not a terrible one for the Spurs". Good fucking grief. A malcontent that two respectable, competitive teams gave up on is indeed a terrible backup plan, regardless of the minuscule amount of cash involved. The Spurs could've had Boogie or even Marcus Morris, they did push for a reunion with Green, but were rejected in favor of the Clippers for less $$$ even. Now the Spurs are stuck with Lyles who quickly fell out of favor for a poor work ethic and bad attitude......sounds like just the type of player Pop wants on his team.......

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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

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1 hour ago, Chad said:

The Spurs could've had Boogie or even Marcus Morris, they did push for a reunion with Green, but were rejected in favor of the Clippers for less $$$ even. 

Well uh, they tried to get Marcus Morris. And the Spurs were never, ever going to have Cousins on the team. Ever. If you're lamenting the fact that we don't sign malcontents and always focus on character, the last 20 years must have really sucked for you.

They did the best they could given the market, their available money, and the culture they demand. It's a bummer that we lost out on Morris, but shit happens. Fuck him and his brother Marqueef

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ztejas

ztejas 43537

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2 hours ago, housious said:

Cousins can barely walk. Why would you want the spurs to sign him? 

Idk man. Cousins is tearing it up right now on my 2k fantasy team. He's 2nd in the league in rebounds behind Wilt Chamberlain. 

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Kermit

Kermit 3158

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Cousins didn’t want us. Morris did want us until the last second when he didn’t. The inevitable slide to lottery is slowly happening, unless we hit big on Lonnie, Murray, and possibly Luka. This is why many of us just wanted to rip off the scab, get it over with.

Now watch them win 55 games and fuck shit up.

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Patrick Bateman

Patrick Bateman 3932

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Once Kawhi demanded out, it was most likely going to set us back 4-7 years.  We needed to play it almost perfect to get back to contender status within 2-3 years and frankly we’ve haven’t done so but a wide margin.  As an organization, we still do a ton right specifically drafting and developing our own talent but imo, we didn’t play the Kawhi trade right and haven’t done a ton in free agency or trades right.  Doesn’t mean we’ve been awful, but while I think Pop and staff keeps us competitive, we haven’t been willing to makes the sacrifices to rebuild or reload this team optimally.  

Maybe they’ll be proven right if lonnie or Murray become stars but at this point we’re a dying star.  Doesn’t mean we can’t have high points but it’ll be hard to really challenge for a title until DD and LMA get off our books and out of our future.  Shrugs.  Still can have some fun though.

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dingleberryswitzer

dingleberryswitzer 2724

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6 hours ago, Patrick Bateman said:

Maybe they’ll be proven right if lonnie or Murray become stars but at this point we’re a dying star.  Doesn’t mean we can’t have high points but it’ll be hard to really challenge for a title until DD and LMA get off our books and out of our future.  Shrugs.  Still can have some fun though

I guess we're gonna see how the other 80% of the NBA fan base lives.  Fact is, according to history you can't win a championship without a once in a generation type player.  Currently we don't have that.  And I doubt a guy like giannis is going to demand a trade to San Antonio.  Just have to wait for the next duncan I guess.  

 

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BurdineBandit

BurdineBandit 815

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14 hours ago, Braff Zacklin said:

It was the Spurs last year, too.

When was the last time we won an off-season? Why are we comparing the way that PATFO works to the rest of the league? 

We're not ever going to win an off-season through free agency because nobody wants to live in San Antonio. Morriss left bc he had an easy decision to make to live somewhere better than San Antonio. Why is that PATFOs fault?

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Patrick Bateman

Patrick Bateman 3932

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1 hour ago, BurdineBandit said:

When was the last time we won an off-season? Why are we comparing the way that PATFO works to the rest of the league? 

We're not ever going to win an off-season through free agency because nobody wants to live in San Antonio. Morriss left bc he had an easy decision to make to live somewhere better than San Antonio. Why is that PATFOs fault?

When we signed LMA?  Probably the closest if anything.

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XYZ

XYZ 2154

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6 hours ago, dingleberryswitzer said:

Fact is, according to history you can't win a championship without a once in a generation type player.

In 2004 the pistons did it and I don’t recall them having a once-in-a-generation player, but for the most part I think you are right.

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Chad

Chad 1728

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Did Rich Paul lead him on to believe he could do better than the Clippers deal? Could've played for the Clippers or Spurs now he'll be suiting up for a prospective 15-25 win ass wipe of a team with a crowded front court......good luck with that. The funny thing is Rich Paul also represents Lyles, he steered Morris away and steered a real steaming turd towards the Spurs.

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Mitch Cumsteen

Mitch Cumsteen 18575

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Ok, this is finally starting to make some sense. Klutch screwed up his free agency. Morris wasn't supposed to be available when the music stopped and it looked like the Spurs caught a lucky break for once. I don't blame Morris for being pissed and backing out for a bigger deal in NY and being able to hit the market again next year. He was a victim here of Klutch misunderstanding the market.

I don't mind Trey Lyles so much. He's young and if they can get his shot tweaked and get him to at least play competent defense, he could be a real asset as a stretch four. For about half the money that Davis Bertans makes (or is going to make in free agency), this is a low risk / high reward signing. Morris would have been an immediate upgrade defensively and added much needed toughness, but he wasn't supposed to even be on their radar to begin with. But let's face it.... Marcus fucking Morris wasn't ever going to be the difference between winning a championship or not. You could argue that Lyles is the type of guy they should be targeting anyway and they still have about half of the mid level to do something with during buyout season.

So... we get a younger guy with some upside who has eaten some humble pie over the last couple of years and hopefully sees the writing on the wall for his career. And Lyles is another Klutch player, so hopefully this bodes well with their relationship with the front office as it pertains to re-signing Murray.

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Mitch Cumsteen

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I can somewhat understand the Spurs number given all the improvements in the rest of the West, but are the Mavs really 3 games better? Is Porzingis and a second year Doncic supposed to move them up 10 wins from last season in a theoretically tougher conference? What else did they do this off season? Overpay for Steph Curry's little brother and add Delon Wright? Boban? Don't get me wrong, they have a very enviable young core but there's a lot of meh on the rest of that roster.

And the Pels seem like a stretch at 46 wins too. 

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ztejas

ztejas 43537

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5 minutes ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

And after further review, those numbers are bullshit:

https://www.actionnetwork.com/nba/nba-win-totals-betting-odds-2019-2020

Spurs 45.5

Mavs 40.4

Pels 39.5

Rockets 52.5

Because those are actual vegas numbers and what Paul Garcia posted is just some analytics model that doesn't seem to have a ton of traction. 

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