2019 San Antonio Spurs Offseason Thread -- Rebuild or Run it Back?

[BradInATX 9208]

I think Houston is the only team "clearly better" than the Spurs right now. They won't win the title because they're comprised of Harden, CP3, and D'Antoni, but they're the chalk choice for "gun to your head, name one team that finishes above the Spurs next year". Lots of question marks all around. Lakers (without Kawhi) will have major depth issues. Jazz look strong but have never existed in their current form. Denver - I'm a wait and see on them. GSW obvious huge question marks. Portland is the same Portland team they always are, they benefited from other teams' injuries and a weird bracket last year. They were not a WCF quality team. Thunder are the same as always.  But of those 8 teams I see a few that have potential to differentiate themselves (LAL, Denver, Hou, maybe Utah). The Spurs I don't think will get into that "first tier" of teams (whoever that ends up being), but after that (says seeds 3-7), it's really anyone's ballgame. 

I'd probably set the over/under at 5 seed. We still have some of serious issues (lack of scoring, lack of ball movement at times) that gave us some of the ugliest Spurs playoff games in history last season. DJ Murray ain't gonna change that, as much as I like him.

Edited July 1, 2019 by BradInATX

[LTtxfan 49289]

 

[Radical Larry 28649]

We have Summer League action on NBA TV in 10 minutes.

[ztejas 43497]

1 minute ago, Radical Larry said:

We have Summer League action on NBA TV in 10 minutes.

Well since the Rangers got cancelled guess I might tune in. 

[LTtxfan 49289]

19 minutes ago, Radical Larry said:

We have Summer League action on NBA TV in 10 minutes.

Played 6 minutes.. Spurs haven't shown up yet. 😕 

Cavs lead 11-2

Edited July 1, 2019 by LTtxfan

[Radical Larry 28649]

Osetkowski sighting

[LTtxfan 49289]

4 minutes ago, Radical Larry said:

Osetkowski sighting

Yeah.... playing for Cavs.  Since DO came into the game, the Spurs have played better.  😆

Cavs lead 15-11

Edited July 1, 2019 by LTtxfan

[Mitch Cumsteen 18550]

I know it's the got dam summer league and only one game and I missed most of the first half, but I was impressed with what I saw from Lonnie Walker last night. He was definitely a cut above everyone else on the court.

Samanic is a project. You can see why the Spurs like him - good length, athleticism, and a smooth looking j. He obviously needs to get stronger. Johnson is an even bigger project. It's a good thing that his work ethic is allegedly his biggest strength because he's got a million miles to go before being an NBA rotation player. Completely understandable that both of those guys are going to look lost out there in their first games and they definitely did (a lot). Drew Eubanks showed some skill for a big guy. I think he eventually finds an NBA home, but maybe not this season. The second round pick Weatherspoon showed some moxy and toughness and playmaking, but also some pretty terrible decision making, including a horribad chest tattoo accentuated by low cut summer league jersey.

 

[LTtxfan 49289]

26 minutes ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

I know it's the got dam summer league and only one game and I missed most of the first half, but I was impressed with what I saw from Lonnie Walker last night. He was definitely a cut above everyone else on the court.

Samanic is a project. You can see why the Spurs like him - good length, athleticism, and a smooth looking j. He obviously needs to get stronger. Johnson is an even bigger project. It's a good thing that his work ethic is allegedly his biggest strength because he's got a million miles to go before being an NBA rotation player. Completely understandable that both of those guys are going to look lost out there in their first games and they definitely did (a lot). Drew Eubanks showed some skill for a big guy. I think he eventually finds an NBA home, but maybe not this season. The second round pick Weatherspoon showed some moxy and toughness and playmaking, but also some pretty terrible decision making, including a horribad chest tattoo accentuated by low cut summer league jersey.

 

Yeah Walker has improved his shooting and can generate his own offense.  He mentioned working with Chip has really helped his shot. 

Felt like several times Lonnie was extremely careless with the ball causing too many turnovers vs Cavs.  Spurs coaches need to work with Lonnie on this or Pop will sit him on the end of bench and slow his development...

Might be better for Lonnie to play first part of season in G-League as long as his Spurs rights are protected??

Edited July 2, 2019 by LTtxfan

[angelfacedmongoloid 80]

 

[Patrick Bateman 3918]

So..... for shits and giggles, there doesn't appear to be much of a market for Boogie Cousins, who is having to wait for the Kawhi dominos to fall.  Anybody want to send out some money (Marco, Bertans, or Patty) and sign him to a 1+1 for 8/9 million?

 

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

Hell yes.  Any combination of the three.  

[angelfacedmongoloid 80]

Yeah lets do that

[Radical Larry 28649]

I’d do that.

[SilasCoade 2622]

I wouldn't give up bertans to get cousins.

[BradInATX 9208]

Fuck no. I wouldn't want Cousins on this team for vet minimum. That guy sucks both as a player and a person.

[Patrick Bateman 3918]

I don't think we could actually do it unless someone wanted to S&T him to us but just thought it was fun to think about.  It's why I would have kept my powder drive rather than rush to sign a guy like Carroll, who will have no impact on a team's record regardless.

[Patrick Bateman 3918]

Keldon Johnson had a big night in SL.  He struggled in his first game so good to see him blow up.  29/7/3 steals.  Had a really quick release although it's a little low.  Lonnie rested.

 

[Hate 20121]

As it is right now, I see a kind of Celtics of 3 years ago vibe to the Spurs. They are getting younger and more athletic. I’d love to see them move DD and LMA this year to fully commit to a rebuild. It’s going to be fun to watch this group grow together. I might get the league pass again this year for the first time in a couple of years.

[LTtxfan 49289]

7 minutes ago, Hate said:

As it is right now, I see a kind of Celtics of 3 years ago vibe to the Spurs. They are getting younger and more athletic. I’d love to see them move DD and LMA this year to fully commit to a rebuild. It’s going to be fun to watch this group grow together. I might get the league pass again this year for the first time in a couple of years.

Not familiar with Spurs returning roster.  Who did the Spurs lose off last year's team??

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

So far Poindexter and Cunningham.  And Pau I guess. 

[LTtxfan 49289]

10 hours ago, Patrick Bateman said:

So..... for shits and giggles, there doesn't appear to be much of a market for Boogie Cousins, who is having to wait for the Kawhi dominos to fall.  Anybody want to send out some money (Marco, Bertans, or Patty) and sign him to a 1+1 for 8/9 million?

 

Old June 29th Tweet:

SI quote today: " There is "not a market" for DeMarcus Cousins during free agency this year. He has a slim chance of receiving a one-year deal with double-digit millions with a big market team." (Adrian Wojnarowski, ESPN)

 

Edited July 3, 2019 by LTtxfan

[LTtxfan 49289]

On 6/21/2019 at 10:30 AM, Mitch Cumsteen said:

This is what the roster looks like post draft:

G (7) - Murray, White, Walker, Derozen, Mills, Forbes, Belineli   F (4) - Gay, Bertans, Samanic, Johnson.   Post (3) - Aldridge, Poetl, Metu

So crowded in the backcourt, so thin up front, so young overall really for the first time since the Larry Brown era. They are almost certainly going to have to move somebody out of that backcourt. Belineli seems like the most obvious to go, but he's got $6 million guaranteed. They will have 14 players under contract and the only real bigs they can rely on are Aldridge and Poetl. I can't imagine them not adding a veteran front court player in some capacity using the MLE. The guys who are out there would seem out of their budget considering that there are quite a few teams with cap to work with: Mirotic, Morris twin du jour, Thaddeus Young, Al-Farouq Aminu, Julius Randle. I don't see any of them coming.

With regard to the draft.... 

I think they jumped a little too early on Samanic, but they have such a good track record with these late first round picks and such a strong developmental program that it's difficult to criticize them. After a little more review, Samanic is a much better athlete than I originally thought. 6' 11" with a 38" vertical along with really good agility and speed testing numbers is nothing to sneeze at. At only 19 years old, he's going to get bigger and stronger. They will work to get the kinks out of his jumper. He competes on defense and is long enough and athletic enough to not get completely abused by smaller players on switches. He's going to get bullied in the paint but that should get better as he ages and adds strength. And really, nobody in this league plays on the block anymore anyway. My biggest question is his work ethic. I just don't get the "first guy in the gym and last one to leave" vibe from him. I get more of a Beno Udrih "how many tacos can I eat and how many Mexican girls can I plow" vibe. Hopefully he buys into the culture - Spurs culture, that is.

Keldon Johnson seems like a really good value pick. With regard to his being the top player on their board at his position, I would love to know what other players they had at the same position. Assuming Johnson is a 3, is Cam Reddish a 4? Is DeAndre Hunter a 4? Is Romeo Langford a 2? Nassir Little? I can't believe they had him rated higher than all of those guys but he seems like a solid defender who can eventually shoot a good clip from 3.

As much as I'd like them to trade Derozen, I don't see them making any big moves between now and the beginning of the season. Break up the backcourt logjam, find another big, maybe sign some under the radar guy who has been toiling in Europe or the G-league, don't screw up the cap, develop the young guys, win 45-50 games, and get bounced in the first or second round.

Bump since post has roster breakdown....

Thx to @Mitch Cumsteen  

 

Edited July 3, 2019 by LTtxfan

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

So, slurs couldn't sign cousins for more than the min (or whatever is left of the mle) but could do a sign and trade with golden st?  They might be interested in belineli to have another shooter until Klay cones back .  Probably won't happen.  

I kind of wished they had traded one of their first round picks for a future first round just so they have something to throw in a trade either this summer or before the deadline.  

[Chad 1728]

I'd be okay with Marco for Boogie. To say there is a logjam at SG is an understatement. You have DeRozan, Marco, Forbes, Patty and Lonnie at SG. Marco's expiring contract is appealing trade bait as well, he'll be off the books completely next season. The Spurs have a strong locker room and a hard nosed coach, Boogie would be kept in check.

Edited July 3, 2019 by Chad

[LTtxfan 49289]

10 minutes ago, Chad said:

I'd be okay with Marco for Boogie. To say there is a logjam at SG is an understatement. You have DeRozan, Marco, Forbes, Patty and Lonnie at SG. Marco's expiring contract is appealing trade bait as well, he'll be off the books completely next season. The Spurs have a strong locker room and a hard nosed coach, Boogie would be kept in check.

Great Daffy avatar Chad....

 

Edited July 3, 2019 by LTtxfan

[Kermit 3157]

Boogie Cousins can fuck the fuck off. That dude sucks. Hell to the no. Nope. Hell no. Nooooooooooooooo. Michael Scott no.

[BradInATX 9208]

There is literally a zero percent chance Pop would have Cousins on his team. At any time for any price in any alternate universe, will never happen

 

 

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

47 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

There is literally a zero percent chance Pop would have Cousins on his team. At any time for any price in any alternate universe, will never happen

 

 

I mean, all he has to do is call his buddy Steve Kerr and ask about him.  Who knows, maybe you're right.  But there wasn't any indication that he was an asshole in Oakland.  

[C-Man 27235]

FWIW, Raul Dominguez -- former long-time SAEN staffer who now freelances and covers the Spurs a lot for AP and others:

Quote

Spurs fans, don't get too excited but there is a chance, slim one, that DeMarcus Cousins could join San Antonio. 
The market for Cousins is non-existent and he is frustrated. He even changed agents recently and is now represented by Jeff Schwartz, who just so happens to be LaMarcus Aldridge's agent. The fact that he switched agents to someone who happens to represent one of San Antonio's biggest stars doesn't mean anything, BUT Cousins also reached out to DeMar DeRozan. 
Cousins would have to take a lot less money than he wants to join the Spurs since they only have about $3 million left on their mid-level exception. The Spurs may also need to trade or release someone from their contract to add some more cap space and add room since they already have 15 guaranteed contracts. but it can be done.
Cousins may not seem like a good fit, but Pop would make it work. Cousins likes playing in the paint, Aldridge likes playing on the wing. Cousins could defend and rebound, allowing Aldridge and others to concentrate on offense.
It could work, but again, the chances are slim the Spurs would add Cousins. Still, there is a chance.

 

[Mitch Cumsteen 18550]

If the deal is small enough, then there's not much downside. You just waive his ass if he becomes a distraction or cancer and use him as a cautionary tale for the rest of the young players. Granted, he is the anti-Spur in almost every way possible and I just can't imagine him dealing with Pop but for the love of God he's only 28 years old and averaged 27 and 11 with 4.5 apg just two seasons ago. He's always been an incredible talent and there is the remote possibility that he's been humbled by all of this and grown up a bit.

[ztejas 43497]

I'm on the Cousins train. I really question his ability to make this team any worse and he played some pretty good minutes in the Finals. He played some bad minutes, too, but definitely showed flashes. I think he could be an efficient, 16/10 type of player if we gave him 25ish minutes a game.  

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

Soyouresayingtheresachance.gif

[Kermit 3157]

There’s no upside, even if he paid the Spurs to play. Fuck him. 

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

I think he’s fine when he’s on a competitive team. IIRC, didn’t Pop have a pretty good relationship with him when they were together with team USA? I think he respects Popovich, like a lot of other guys around the league, and I think you would get the best version of him from a “teammate” standpoint. 

As for how he plays, who knows. That’s a wildcard. He’ll never be the player he was before the injury. But if he can get back into shape, he’d definitely help this team. Is that even an argument?

Edited July 3, 2019 by youdunnf'dup

[Dbeasy 15073]

Aldridge does not like to play the 5.

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

32 minutes ago, Kermit said:

There’s no upside, even if he paid the Spurs to play. Fuck him. 

Is there any evidence that he was a bad teammate or anything negative from his time in New Orleans or golden State?  Or is this hate all based on how he acted as a guy in his early 20s on a shitty Sacramento team?  

He has the talent and size the spurs need, if he turns into an asshole again either waive, trade at the deadline, or just tell him to GTFO like pop did to Stephen Jackson .  I think the league pays at least half of minimum contracts too.

[miguelito 11266]

Didn't Sean Elliott get into a scuffle with Cousins a few years back?

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

2 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

Aldridge does not like to play the 5.

Yea but it's 2019, he has to know by now that on most teams he'd play the 5 like 90% of the time.  

[hornfan785 557]

 

[C-Man 27235]

1 hour ago, Kermit said:

There’s no upside, even if he paid the Spurs to play. Fuck him. 

Yeah, this is bullshit. We're no better than a 4-5 seed in the West as things stand today. If his head is screwed on straight, Cousins could help and as stated above, if he fucks around you cut his ass because he ain't gonna cost anything. Remember he's playing for a contract and he knows what Pop is like. If he signs up for that, I assume he's OK with that.

BTW, Mavs have signed Boban.

[XYZ 2154]

Damn it, why couldn’t the spurs hold on to Boban?

[Patrick Bateman 3918]

So I've been on record previously as a big no on Boogie in the past.  But that was Boogie at 20-25 million.  Boogie at 5-10 million or less (not convinced he'll take less), I'm a huge yes on.  Why?  Because this Spurs squad is nowhere near a real contender.  They're so bereft of top tier talent that despite our advantages in organization and coaching, it doesn't matter.  Boogie would be a dart throw and he was actually rumored to be a good guy in the locker room last year.  He also fills a huge need.  We need talent, anywhere we can get it and even if we hated it and cut him at midseason a la Melo, at 7/8 million.... who gives a shit.  It'd be funny.  It's a one year deal, if he sucks, you move on.  But, if somehow you got lightning in a bottle, it allows you to do some things in the future with a legit post threat.

[C-Man 27235]

20 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

So I've been on record previously as a big no on Boogie in the past.  But that was Boogie at 20-25 million.  Boogie at 5-10 million or less (not convinced he'll take less), I'm a huge yes on.  Why?  Because this Spurs squad is nowhere near a real contender.  They're so bereft of top tier talent that despite our advantages in organization and coaching, it doesn't matter.  Boogie would be a dart throw and he was actually rumored to be a good guy in the locker room last year.  He also fills a huge need.  We need talent, anywhere we can get it and even if we hated it and cut him at midseason a la Melo, at 7/8 million.... who gives a shit.  It'd be funny.  It's a one year deal, if he sucks, you move on.  But, if somehow you got lightning in a bottle, it allows you to do some things in the future with a legit post threat.

 

[Patrick Bateman 3918]

For a rundown as to what has come to light in the last day and since I posted the hypothetical question here...

The prevailing rumor is we would cut Metu if we acquired another player (Boogie included), but how about we get some money off the books from the 126 guards/small wings we have?  Marco's expiring contract for under 6 million would seem to be of use to someone rather than give up on Metu before we can see what his development curve may look like.  The other dude is Forbes, who's 2.875m, is basically a vet's minimum.  Doesn't give as much room and again to be used, you would have to arrange a S&T but our guard rotation is deep and someone probably needs to go.

 

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

54 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

So I've been on record previously as a big no on Boogie in the past.  But that was Boogie at 20-25 million.  Boogie at 5-10 million or less (not convinced he'll take less), I'm a huge yes on.  Why?  Because this Spurs squad is nowhere near a real contender.  They're so bereft of top tier talent that despite our advantages in organization and coaching, it doesn't matter.  Boogie would be a dart throw and he was actually rumored to be a good guy in the locker room last year.  He also fills a huge need.  We need talent, anywhere we can get it and even if we hated it and cut him at midseason a la Melo, at 7/8 million.... who gives a shit.  It'd be funny.  It's a one year deal, if he sucks, you move on.  But, if somehow you got lightning in a bottle, it allows you to do some things in the future with a legit post threat.

All of this. We are the type of organization that can make something like this work. We aren’t close right now. We need to add talent. Especially when it’s a position of need, and it’s at a discount. That’s the exact type of move this organization should he making, IMO. 

[EvilCaseMcCoy 691]

Off topic but Keldon kinda reminds me of Rudy. 

[LTtxfan 49289]

2 hours ago, EvilCaseMcCoy said:

Off topic but Keldon kinda reminds me of Rudy. 

Good stuff....

Looked up draft notes for both:

Rudy was 6'8" & 222lb  7'3" wingspan (SmFwd)

NBA Comparison: Scottie Pippen

Strengths: Elite run/jump athlete who finishes well above the rim ... High flyer ... Very versatile... Does everything well ... Complete offensive arsenal... Can hit the mid range jumper... Excellent at slashing to the hoop... Accurate passer who is very unselfish... Does the majority of his damage in the post ... Very tough to defend... Doesnt get pushed around down low ... Runs the floor well ... Tough on the boards... Works harder than everyone else on the court ... Will most likely play on the wing at the next level ... Extremely long (7-3 wingspan) and freakishly athletic ... Has shows tremendous potential. Late to the game, so his lack of a great feel could improve over time, he wasn't seriously coached until he was a junior in high school ...

Weaknesses: Though he's just 19 years of age, his sophomore year was supposed to be his to take over college basketball. When that didn't happen, people began to question his desire and intensity and whether he has it in him to become great ... He floats in and out of games, and tended to defer to teammates in clutch situations ... Is it a lack of fire, or just a lack of maturity and confidence? Time will tell ... Unselfish to a fault, like Vince Carter, he almost takes being the perfect teammate too far. He's a star and should act like one ... He still struggles to create offense for himself off the dribble, getting the majority of his baskets off of rebounds, or passes from tammates ...

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Keldon is 6'6" & 210lb  6'8.5" wingspan (Guard/SmFwd)

NBA Comparison: Corey Maggette

Strengths: Athletic wing who plays with a lot of heart and determination ... Has an explosive first step that he uses to get by defenders to the rim ... He’s great at finishing around the basket ... He’s a good three-point shooter ... He shot 38% from behind the arc this season on just over three attempts per game ... He’s a great athlete with strong arms which will make a coveted player at the next level ... He has great leaping ability which will make him fun to watch in transition ... He has a solid floater that he uses to score over bigger defenders ... His body is NBA ready for a shooting guard… At 6’6 211, he will come into the NBA ready to defend either guard position ... He has a lot of potential on the defensive side of the ball ... He has good balance and length that can give any opponents problems trying to score on him ... He has the strength and the will to fight through screens ... He’s a solid scorer off the dribble ... When a smaller player is on him, he can post them up ... He’s a good rebounder at his position, averaging nearly six rebounds per game ... He has a good motor ... He’s a well-rounded player who’s adept at a lot of things…. Willing to do the dirty work on both ends of the floor ... He knows how to find the open spots on the floor off the ball…. He is also good at finding open shooters on the perimeter ... He doesn’t need the ball in his hands to be a threat on the offensive end of the floor…… Has shown the desire to guard his man the full length of the court ... His defensive impact doesn’t show up on the stat sheet ... A winner. A natural leader with very good intangibles ...

Weaknesses: He will need to improve on his free throw shooting at the next level ... He shot 70%, which is low for a guard ... He is reluctant to shoot three pointers at times and takes the offense out of its rhythm ... He is an inconsistent 3-point shooter ... At times his athleticism can cause him to get out of control going to the rim and miss layups ... Deflections are nice and takes opposing offenses out of rhythm, but he needs to use his athleticism to generate more turnovers for his team…. He averaged less than one steal and block per game ... He needs to improve his catch and shoot game, as well as his shooting coming off the pick and roll ... He can be over-aggressive at times and pick up unnecessary fouls at times … He is good at a lot of things, but not great at any one skill ... Needs to improve his playmaking ability… He averaged as many assists as he did turnovers ... He is great at straight line drives, but when going east to west he lacks creativity when getting past opponents and finishing at the rim…. He needs to work on his footwork when sizing up his opponents ... His shooting motion is slow in catch and shoot situations, which leads to defenders being able to contest his shots on closeouts ... He over-penetrates at times instead of shooting the open shots that present themselves ...

Outlook: Keldon Johnson right now is projected to be a lottery pick in this year’s NBA draft ... He projects to be the ideal 3&D player, which a lot of teams need in today’s league ... He has the size and athleticism to guard 1-3s and even some small ball 4s. He needs to work on his confidence taking 3 pointers because that will open more opportunities for him to use his explosiveness at the rim. A team in need of perimeter defenders and athleticism will be a perfect fit for him. With right coaching staff around him in the NBA, he could eventually develop into a potential all-star ...

Notes: Measured 6'6" in shoes, 6'5" barefoot, 210 lbs, 6'8.5" wingspan, 8'8" standing reach at USA Basketball October Minicamp veraged 13.5 points and 5.9 rebounds this past season 

Edited July 4, 2019 by LTtxfan

[Patrick Bateman 3918]

3 hours ago, EvilCaseMcCoy said:

Off topic but Keldon kinda reminds me of Rudy. 

Reminds me of a mini Shawn Marion, from body type (the high shoulders and long arms and legs) to the way he flicks the ball when he shoots from distance to his overall sort of uber garbage man brand of ball.  Not saying he'll be that good, but that's who he reminds me of when I look at him.

 

Edited July 4, 2019 by Patrick Bateman

[Patrick Bateman 3918]

Again, I think the odds we sign him are remote but it's funny to see the ground swell.

Apparently in San Marcos somewhere.

Happy 4th of July, you animals.