For all the young'ns here who didn't get to see Roy during his time at Texas

[joeycovers 381]

1 hour ago, formermav43 said:

Yeah, talking about Roy losing targets to other receivers and ignoring Quan’s 92 catches in 2008 - more than Shipley, and almost as many as any 2 combined seasons of Johnson/Thomas - is curious.

I don’t know the answer but maybe look at Simms vs Colt pass attempts for a better comparison. 

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

I love Shipley, but if we put Roy on those 2008-2009 teams instead of Shipley, and Roy got to play in the same offense Shipley played in, we wouldn’t be having this discussion. 

Shipley is the most accomplished wr ever at Texas. He had the better college career. Roy was a better player and was more of a nightmare for DCs around the country to gameplan for. Two completely different arguments.

Edited May 11, 2019 by youdunnf'dup

[TwiceHorn 31272]

On 5/9/2019 at 3:27 PM, closetojumping said:

The problem there is that RW's speed was next level compared to CJ. 

Roy Williams is the single greatest WR I've seen at Texas, and that's taking nothing away from any other greats. He was fucking electric and terrified defenses. Saban's LSU beats us in the Cotton Bowl if RW doesn't come totally unhinged in the 2nd half. That's how I remember it, at least.

He was a one-man mudhole machine in that game.  Fan-fucking-tastic.  We haven't had a YAC monster like him in forever.

[Sgt Hulk 13647]

9 hours ago, SpiralOut said:

What you want is a guy with the attitude, leadership, and hustle of Ship in Roy's body. 

Roy legitimately could have been one of the greatest WRs in NFL history.  Like Jerry Rice levels of greatness.  He was that naturally gifted.  He just never got the whole humble, work ethic, lead by example part down to go with it.

I came to post this. What ship lacked in measurables compared to Roy he made up 19 fold in hustle desire and want to.  You couldn’t deny either but ship wanted it more. Roy did it because of genetics. Both have epic memories burned in my brain. You say Shipley and I instantly see ship up the middle on the kick off return against BlowU.  You say Roy and LSU hits my brain. Good times 

[formermav43 4599]

2 hours ago, joeycovers said:

I don’t know the answer but maybe look at Simms vs Colt pass attempts for a better comparison. 

That has nothing to do with the specific point about other receivers taking targets from Roy/Shipley.

[gmr548 16509]

Generally I am too young to remember Roy; in fact, I was corrected in another thread when I thought he was on the 2004 team. But I remember that 2003 Cotton Bowl - my first college game. God damn, did he go off. Big reason I became a Texas fan. He wasn't total trash in the NFL either.

[Murfdogg21 4412]

I still yell “Throw it to Roy!” when a WR is on a roll or just generally dominant (see: Collin Johnson @USC 2017).

[Jkwellborn 6653]

That has nothing to do with the specific point about other receivers taking targets from Roy/Shipley.

If you throw it 25 times a game as opposed to 50 times, it matters.

[Eskimohorn 5615]

2003 saw 2 of the greatest physical specimens ever to wear UT football gear with Roy's last year VY's first. There was some tension as to who the leader of team was  - but I challenge anyone to name a more athletic QB-WR pairing in college football history. 

Chance Mock was a better passer than VY in 2003. Had we had a functioning offense, we could have leveraged our best player Roy Williams with Mock playing a Chris Leak-type role splitting time w/ VY. A good OC would have been able to use all our weapons and brought VY along with special packages*. Cedric Benson was the fucking running back and OU beat the shit out of us (We scored 13 points against OU in two years with Ced and VY in the backfield).

Our offense was basically a conservative base of random conservative pass plays and run plays that relied upon out-athleting teams. Back in 2003, it was very effective most of the time. We were good at avoiding negative plays (except against good teams).

When Washington State blitzed the shit out of us in the Holiday Bowl, we had no answers. Complete shit show.


*Regarding going back in time and giving Mock more snaps, keep in mind this is predicated on having a functional offensive coordinator who would have had VY and Mock in the same functioning offense from 2002-2005.

[formermav43 4599]

9 hours ago, Jkwellborn said:

If you throw it 25 times a game as opposed to 50 times, it matters.

No, it really doesn’t. We’re talking about a percentage of attempts when there’s talk of other receivers stealing targets. Quan had more catches than Shipley-the raw numbers are academic. How many receivers do you have to count up before the aggregate is more catches than Roy?

[WBT 20420]

Mock needed fewer snaps not more

[Johnny Sack 8397]

4 hours ago, WBT said:

Mock needed fewer snaps not more

Yep.  He was great passing against crap teams.  Any team that could get any kind of pass rush against him we were toast.

[Eskimohorn 5615]

I stand by my asterisk

“*Regarding going back in time and giving Mock more snaps, keep in mind this is predicated on having a functional offensive coordinator who would have had VY and Mock in the same functioning offense from 2002-2005.”

Good teams pillaged Davis’ offense because he could not consistently punish teams throughout the game. It’s why a decent college QB Mock looked horrific against decent teams. And, why most of our big plays in the passing game were off-schedule for VY and (especially) Colt McCoy.

[Goo Punch 4275]

On 5/12/2019 at 12:36 PM, Eskimohorn said:

When Washington State blitzed the shit out of us in the Holiday Bowl, we had no answers. Complete shit show.

 

yeah but who knew you could blitz in a postseason bowl game?

[Hank Scorpio 17723]

2 minutes ago, Goo Punch said:

yeah but who knew you could blitz in a postseason bowl game?

I tell you what, I’ve got some experience coaching in the East West Shrine game and we don’t allow blitzing in those games. 

[Murfdogg21 4412]

21 minutes ago, Goo Punch said:

yeah but who knew you could blitz in a postseason bowl game?

LZ peaked during that call. 

[Goo Punch 4275]

edit: re- Hank's post

 

^^^ i'm all out of rep for today, so here's a 🤘🏼. 

also i agree with murfdogg 

Edited May 14, 2019 by Goo Punch

[SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861]

On 5/10/2019 at 3:08 PM, TexArcher said:

Since Ship basically only played two full seasons as the #1 target:

Roy (Junior) :  64 rec, 1142 yds, 12 TD

Roy (Senior) :  70 rec, 1079 yds, 9 TD

Ship (Junior) : 89 rec, 1060 yds, 11 TD

Ship (Senior) : 116 rec, 1485 yds, 13 TD

Ship had more catches, more yards, and more receiving touchdowns (plus 4 on PR and KR).

You could argue that Roy lost targets to other receivers while Ship was basically THE guy.  But there's no question that Ship was more productive at Texas across those final two years.

None of this is to knock Roy.  He was a man among boys in college and I loved watching him play.  But Shipley didn't have a lot of Roy's physical gifts and put up bigger numbers because he worked his ass off in spite of a lot of early injuries.  Shipley has some Major to him.  If Ship had Roy's body, he'd he in the NFL Hall of Fame.

Ship was the number two receiver on his own team his junior year.  His raw numbers are bigger than Roy's because we passed way more those two years -- we passed 300-400 times per season when Roy was playing, and were up to 500 by the time Shipley was done.  And even still, Roy ended up with more career catches, yards, and TDs.

 

Shipley had some all time great seasons.  Roy had the better career in a less pass friendly environment.  We are comparing a 'great' with an 'all time great.'

[sidis 9748]

On 5/10/2019 at 12:09 AM, TheMailBox357 said:

I honestly don't know how can y'all still say that when the 2000 recruiting class was pre-internet recruiting. The 2002 recruiting class was the 1st recruiting class covered on the net, so as far as back as I'm willing to go.

in this entire thread of nostalgia-fueled inanity and argument, this post really stood out to me as genuinely hilarious.

lulz.

roy was awesome.  he was also frustrating...god, he never did a damned thing in dallas and drove me fucking nuts.  but outside of the ou games, he was greatness...what he lacked against ou, it was absolutely the inverse against the agros. 

[Wild Bill 324]

On 5/9/2019 at 8:24 PM, BigHorn'13 said:

Video for those who don't remember or like these now outlawed type of hits

 

 

He dead.

 

[Wild Bill 324]

2 hours ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

Ship was the number two receiver on his own team his junior year.  His raw numbers are bigger than Roy's because we passed way more those two years -- we passed 300-400 times per season when Roy was playing, and were up to 500 by the time Shipley was done.  And even still, Roy ended up with more career catches, yards, and TDs.

 

Shipley had some all time great seasons.  Roy had the better career in a less pass friendly environment.  We are comparing a 'great' with an 'all time great.'

Not only did Roy lose targets to the other talented receivers he had Cedric running the ball.

[Wild Bill 324]

Roy was the best receiver I ever saw in college.  Back off tight coverage and he would go over the middle. Cover tight and he ran right by the db.