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Trade #1 Pick?? or Zion Removes Name from NBA Draft??

LTtxfan

By LTtxfan
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d2o

d2o 1603

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6 minutes ago, phdhorn said:

You seem to be talking simply about his contract within NOLA.  But "how the system works" includes "buyout option."  This of course is used all the time to break contracts.  Yes the team has the power and not the player, but often these are mutually agreeable.  Let's say Zion does okay but in 2 years NOLA thinks they can get a better fit with some players or draft choices.  Would they trade Williamson in some mega deal if he does well?  It's possible.  If he ends up not meeting expectations/gets injured too much?  It's more than possible.

Any contract is voidable.  Including this one.  Not saying it'll happen, but yeah, it could, and it does.  A lot.  No matter what the long terms are.

Yes the team could chose to do any of that.   Your original point was about Zion making those choices.   He cannot.  If he doesn't meet expectations, the team would just not pick up the last two option yrs or possibly pick them up and trade him.   Neither entity would be "breaking" the contract in either of those scenarios.

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Murfdogg21

Murfdogg21 4553

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As a 20 year old (as opposed to a 40 year old shaggy poster), I’d think NO would be a lot more appealing place to live than markets like Milwaukee, Salt Lake, Phoenix, OKC, Indiana, etc. 

If he really thinks he’s above the construct of the draft process, maybe NYK send #3 plus future #1’s to NO in a Chris Webber for Penny type trade. 

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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

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This is dumb. There's no reason to even speculate that he has any intention not to go to NOLA. Nothing from Zion at all, except that he's going to NOLA. Just media nonsense. This thread is a microcosm of why we have trash sports TV. 109 posts about literally nothing except an article trying to start shit.

 

He will be a Pelican. Why is this even a discussion?

 

 

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LTtxfan

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29 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

He will be a Pelican. Why is this even a discussion?

Because Nola is not considered a good organization and place to play in the NBA.  Nola could be a huge albatross around his neck.... Just look at AD -- the Dude can't get out of Nola fast enough.

Also the Benson family ownership is a mess after the death of Tom Benson in March 2018. Family owns both Saints and Pelicans -- but treats the Pelicans more like a step-child.

https://clutchpoints.com/pelicans-news-new-orleans-ownership-fighting-back-notion-that-saints-are-more-important/

Until the new GM was just recently added for the Pelicans, their NBA players often had to get rehab medical treatment from the Saints medical staff because the ownership wouldn't pay for a separate medical staff for the Pelicans.

Zion may still be considering his options...

USA Today quote this morning:

 "For now, Williamson is laying low. He left Chicago on Wednesday after meeting with teams, according to the Associated Press, meaning he's not expected to partake in drills and measurements at Thursday’s NBA draft combine or speak to the media."

 

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BradInATX

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4 minutes ago, LTtxfan said:

Because Nola is not considered a good organization and place to play in the NBA.  Nola could be a huge albatross around his neck.... Just look at AD -- the Dude can't get out of Nola fast enough.

Also the Benson family ownership is a mess after the death of Tom Benson in March 2018. Family owns both Saints and Pelicans -- but treats the Pelicans more like a step-child.

https://clutchpoints.com/pelicans-news-new-orleans-ownership-fighting-back-notion-that-saints-are-more-important/

Until the new GM was just recently added for the Pelicans, their NBA players often had to get rehab medical treatment from the Saints medical staff because the ownership wouldn't pay for a separate medical staff for the Pelicans.

Zion may still be considering his options...

USA Today quote this morning:

 "For now, Williamson is laying low. He left Chicago on Wednesday after meeting with teams, according to the Associated Press, meaning he's not expected to partake in drills and measurements at Thursday’s NBA draft combine or speak to the media."

 

Why would he do any of that combine stuff? He's going #1 and nothing is going to change that. Several other players left Chicago too.

He met with the Pelicans today. His family is saying he is preparing to go to New Orleans. He made a comment on draft night about "helping them get over Katrina" which, while sort of a dumb comment, shows that he seems to plan to go to NOLA.

There is literally zero evidence that he is considering doing anything like that. Zero. This is speculative trash sports media and you are its target audience. 

Edited by BradInATX
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ztejas

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49 minutes ago, longhornmatt said:

It’s extremely unlikely any overseas team would pay him near the amount of money necessary to make playing a year outside the NBA anything other than a huge financial loss.  

First of all, they won’t even match base salary in all likelihood (there was some crazy owner in the Greek league that paid big bucks like 10 years ago, but otherwise I don’t think anyone pays NBA type money overseas -  good money, yes, but not like $6,000,000 for a one year American player).

Second, and more importantly, he’s going to be the hottest endorsement commodity since Lebron.  I would expect Zion to make the most endorsement money ever for a rookie, but that won’t happen until he’s in the NBA.   Nike, Adidas, and everyone else that puts basketball players in commercials will want him in the NBA, not playing in Spain or Turkey.

China would pay him more than an NBA team, but it would be an utter waste of his time and talent. And like you said, companies wouldn't endorse him for near as much if at all. 

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LTtxfan

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6 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

Why would he do any of that combine stuff? He's going #1 and nothing is going to change that. Several other players left Chicago too.

He met with the Pelicans today. His family is saying he is preparing to go to New Orleans. He made a comment on draft night about "helping them get over Katrina" which, while sort of a dumb comment, shows that he seems to plan to go to NOLA.

There is literally zero evidence that he is considering doing anything like that. Zero. This is speculative trash sports media and you are its target audience. 

Fair enough.... maybe Zion does go to Nola.

But for me, I hope Zion requests that the Pelicans trade their 1st pick because playing in Nola could hurt his career.  And it's fun to discuss possible trades and destinations for Zion.

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BradInATX

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Just now, LTtxfan said:

Fair enough.... maybe Zion does go to Nola.

But for me, I hope Zion requests that the Pelicans trade their 1st pick because playing in Nola could hurt his career.  And it's fun to discuss possible trades and destinations for Zion.

Right on. My understanding is that Gayle Benson has sort of taken the Pelicans on as "her baby" and is trying to turn things around, thus the medical staff changes and hiring of Griffin. So hopefully we'll see that franchise turn around a bit. I'm with you, Zion is so much fun to watch I'd hate to see his career wasted. I just hate sports media that thrives on creating controversy that's not there. I can't even watch cable sports TV unless it's an actual game anymore.

Then again I'm a Spurs and they're in the division so hopefully they trade him for Rajon Rondo or something like that.

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Beau Vine

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3 hours ago, phdhorn said:

You seem to be talking simply about his contract within NOLA.  But "how the system works" includes "buyout option."  This of course is used all the time to break contracts.  Yes the team has the power and not the player, but often these are mutually agreeable.  Let's say Zion does okay but in 2 years NOLA thinks they can get a better fit with some players or draft choices.  Would they trade Williamson in some mega deal if he does well?  It's possible.  If he ends up not meeting expectations/gets injured too much?  It's more than possible.

Any contract is voidable.  Including this one.  Not saying it'll happen, but yeah, it could, and it does.  A lot.  No matter what the long terms are.

1.  A buyout option does not break a contract.  It's part of the contract.  As is a player option.

2.  If the buyout option is "mutually agreeable," it's not a buyout option.  It's a mutual option. 

3.   Athlete contracts are not voidable.  Contracts are voidable only because of stuff like fraud, coercion, etc.  Seriously, when have you ever seen an NBA contract being voided?

Shit, you sound like Vic trying to play lawyer.  

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VinyVango

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He will go to NO... After year 2 he can bitch to be traded... and if he's there through 4 years, he will certainly bolt for a larger market rather than resign.

It'll be interesting to see who/what they get for Davis.  Perhaps they'll get enough in return to surround Zion with enough talent to keep him distracted and he waits through year 3 or 4 before pitching a fit for brighter lights.

 

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d2o

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17 minutes ago, Junior Miller said:

New Orleans hired a legit GM, they'll be pretty good and they should be able to convince AD to stay with Zion. 

Why would the NBA not have a withdrawal deadline for the draft before the day of the lottery? This league is becoming more and more WWE by the year. 

So guys can go to the combine and get info to find out if they will be drafted or not and how high or low they are projected to be picked.   That way they can make the most informed decision on whether they should stay in the draft or not.    If they stay in and dont get drafted they cannot go back to school so the more info they get from actual NBA evaluators, the better

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BradInATX

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New Orleans hired a legit GM, they'll be pretty good and they should be able to convince AD to stay with Zion. 

Why would the NBA not have a withdrawal deadline for the draft before the day of the lottery? This league is becoming more and more WWE by the year. 

There's no way AD will stay. Bridge is burned. They might posture to get a better deal but he gone

 

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Patrick Bateman

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9 minutes ago, d2o said:

So guys can go to the combine and get info to find out if they will be drafted or not and how high or low they are projected to be picked.   That way they can make the most informed decision on whether they should stay in the draft or not.    If they stay in and dont get drafted they cannot go back to school so the more info they get from actual NBA evaluators, the better

Probably the idea that the combine should be before the lottery so no teams don't get leveraged, that's all.  They're awfully close together.  I guess it depends on who's interests you're trying to protect -- teams, fans, possible draftees, schools, everybody?

 

 

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d2o

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3 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

Probably the idea that the combine should be before the lottery so no teams don't get leveraged, that's all.  They're awfully close together.  I guess it depends on who's interests you're trying to protect -- teams, fans, possible draftees, schools, everybody?

 

 

Cant please everyone but in this situation its probably best to do your best to protect the kids who may be getting bad advice or have a higher view of themselves than they should.   Keep them from making a mistake that they cant undo.   The NCAA is super restrictive.   The NBA looks like the good guys in the situation

 

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goatsaag

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Wasn't the entire idea at the start of the lottery that whoever won was going to try to send the pick to New Orleans anyway to get Davis? Who had the stupid idea that suddenly when New Orleans wins the pick, Zion won't want to play there? He's going to be ok with LA or New York trading him to New Orleans but not being picked by them?

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youdunnf'dup

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8 hours ago, BradInATX said:

This is dumb. There's no reason to even speculate that he has any intention not to go to NOLA. Nothing from Zion at all, except that he's going to NOLA. Just media nonsense. This thread is a microcosm of why we have trash sports TV. 109 posts about literally nothing except an article trying to start shit.

 

He will be a Pelican. Why is this even a discussion?

 

 

 

10 hours ago, d2o said:

Maybe that will put an end to this stupid shit.

My take was more in reference to his immediate response when finding out he would end up in NO. He didn’t look happy. But even if it was his last choice, obviously he’s still going to go. If for no other reason, because he seems like a really good kid who doesn’t want to ruffle any feathers.  He understands how this works, and you don’t just get to choose where you want to go.

Although that would be pretty fucking interesting. Just have a free for all, players go to the highest bidder, or whatever situation is going to give them the best chance to succeed. You know, like every other profession outside of sports. 

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Junior Miller

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3 hours ago, d2o said:

Cant please everyone but in t its probably best to do your best to protect the kids who may be getting bad advice or have a higher view of themselves than they should.   Keep them from making a mistake that they cant undo.

....

Edited by Junior Miller
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d2o

d2o 1603

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12 minutes ago, Murfdogg21 said:

Would NYK send #3 pick for AD? Duke reunion in Big Easy!

It should take a whole lot more than #3.   I don't know that they have enough.    Knox, DSJ, #3 and a couple more picks MIGHT be enough.

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Patrick Bateman

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23 minutes ago, HookEm said:

No love for my LeBron for Zion trade? Reunite Bron with Gilbert. Give AD a real reason to stay and win now.

1.  Lebron may retire.

2.  What are you trading with Zion to get the money to work?  

3.  I don't think New Orleans would be that interested unless Davis demanded it and would sign an extension.

 

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LTtxfan

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31 minutes ago, d2o said:

It should take a whole lot more than #3.   I don't know that they have enough.    Knox, DSJ, #3 and a couple more picks MIGHT be enough.

AD can leave as an UFA after next season.  Nola has to trade AD to a team he will sign an extension with or else it will end up like the crap trade that Spurs were forced to do with Raptors.

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Patrick Bateman

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41 minutes ago, LTtxfan said:

AD can leave as an UFA after next season.  Nola has to trade AD to a team he will sign an extension with or else it will end up like the crap trade that Spurs were forced to do with Raptors.

Uhm...... no.  They don't have to do anything but take the best deal possible.

 

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d2o

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6 hours ago, Patrick Bateman said:

1.  Lebron may retire.

2.  What are you trading with Zion to get the money to work?  

3.  I don't think New Orleans would be that interested unless Davis demanded it and would sign an extension.

 

retire?  when?

 

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d2o

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8 hours ago, Patrick Bateman said:

1.  Lebron may retire.

2.  What are you trading with Zion to get the money to work?  

3.  I don't think New Orleans would be that interested unless Davis demanded it and would sign an extension.

 

Solomon Hill and/or Etuan Moore would clear out more than enough room

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UTDD

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To me the Pelicans have two main options: 1) Trade AD for as much youth/assets as possible and rebuild with Zion or 2) convince AD to stay and maybe hope Randle doesn't pick up his option and try and get another good player to round out the roster going forward.  I think the first choice is better as I think Zion's prime will not quite hit until AD is a little older, and I'm also pretty sure AD still wants out even with Zion.  I'd probably try to leverage the Knicks with the # 3 pick, Knox, and Mitchell Robinson (maybe DSJ if they feel he is going to be good) and involve a third team perhaps to try and get a good young player or two and/or more draft assets.  They can and should make sure they get multiple first round picks if possible. 

You have to match up a 27 million dollar salary within roughly 125%, so you need to include enough players to make it work.  I'd also try and force Solomon Hill out in a trade (difficult because now you are talking about 40 million going out) if possible and also a third team because I'm not sure the Knicks young players are all that enticing.  I personally would at least try for Barrett, more picks, Knox, Robinson, and Ntilikina, and hope the Knicks can garner more assets for DSJ with a third team.  The Knicks might not mind that if they can sign 1 or 2 max stars to come along with AD.  That would be a formidable enough team perhaps to sacrifice most of their youth.  

I'd probably avoid the Lakers unless as a last resort as the 4th pick is good but not as good as # 3 obviously, and Ingram I avoid because 1) his health and 2) his contract is up the following year and you'd have to pay him a lot more or lose him so maybe leverage Lonzo (if you don't like him involve maybe Chicago for their pick and/or another young player you like better as a third team) and Kuzma as two potential pieces of a larger trade.  You probably need Lonzo's salary - or an equivalent - to realistically make it work overall as part of a package.  I personally like Lonzo as a decent PG down the road, but likely the hassle of just his father alone is not worth the headache for a franchise like New Orleans.  I like Kuzma a lot as a 6th man/scorer type but not a great player, but still pretty decent.  But say Gardner at 4, and Kuzma, and Lonzo plus more for AD?  That doesn't sound that great. 

I think Boston is out given that Kyrie is most likely gone, and Ainge is more unlikely to leverage so many assets for a very likely one year rental.

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dingleberryswitzer

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11 hours ago, youdunnf'dup said:

Just have a free for all, players go to the highest bidder, or whatever situation is going to give them the best chance to succeed. You know, like every other profession outside of sports

I think it's the owners/GM's protecting themselves.  They would be presssured to giving huge deals to un proven rookies who might end up a bust.  Imagine how shitty the Anthony Bennet pick was, then imagine he was making 15-20 million as a rookie.  

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d2o

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21 minutes ago, dingleberryswitzer said:

I think it's the owners/GM's protecting themselves.  They would be presssured to giving huge deals to un proven rookies who might end up a bust.  Imagine how shitty the Anthony Bennet pick was, then imagine he was making 15-20 million as a rookie.  

Its funny cause people complained when rookies got 60-70M guaranteed before they played a single before the rookie scale was in place

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Patrick Bateman

Patrick Bateman 3966

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4 hours ago, d2o said:

retire?  when?

 

It was a joke, just like this hypothetical.

2 hours ago, d2o said:

Solomon Hill and/or Etuan Moore would clear out more than enough room

They'd have to renounce everyone and have Randle decline his option in that case, but yes they could hypothetically afford everyone. 

 

Edited by Patrick Bateman
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Rockethorn1978

Rockethorn1978 6203

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49 minutes ago, LTtxfan said:

Still think Zion should ask Pelicans to trade their #1 pick.....

 

Do you think NBA players like Zion live in a apartment in Baton Rouge? He's going to be a millionaire living in a mansion or some high level apartment high rise, traveling playing basketball by private jet, and in the off season will be traveling to anywhere he wants. Do you really think Zion gives a fuck about who won the best states poll on some newspaper website? 

Zion understands that it's a privilege to play on any nba team in any nba city and will play in N.O.

I also hope N.O. front office sends AD packing to some shithole Eastern Conference team and don't give into his baby entitled demands. Or they just say grow the fuck up and get ready to play with Zion.  

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LTtxfan

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32 minutes ago, Rockethorn1978 said:

Zion understands that it's a privilege to play on any nba team in any nba city and will play in N.O.

I also hope N.O. front office sends AD packing to some shithole Eastern Conference team and don't give into his baby entitled demands. Or they just say grow the fuck up and get ready to play with Zion.  

 

giphy.gif

 

 

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