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the alabama abortion attack

hayden_horn

By hayden_horn
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WhatTheBuck
WhatTheBuck

A 20-year-old in Alabama in 1969 didn't need a tv to see that. 

Bama Chick
Bama Chick

Someone asked one of the bill authors why they didn’t include a punishment for the destruction of embryos in labs if this is about saving all “babies”. He said since it’s not in a woman it doesn’t co

Pancho
Pancho

Fuck Alabama and those inbred fucksticks

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Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, jimmyjazz said:

I agree, more men should "own their shit" . . .

. . . and women should have final say about what goes on in their own bodies.

Cool.. then you can explain how by some miracle the baby becomes mine again after birth  and I am required to pay child support. 

It is just her body, right? Only if it isn’t.  

Edited by slorch
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Cheeseweasel

Cheeseweasel 26437

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, slorch said:

Cool.. then you can explain how by some miracle the baby becomes mine again after birth  and I am required to pay child support. 

It is just her body, right? Only if it isn’t.  

 

Friendly advice: When you find yourself in a hole, stop digging.

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45538

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, slorch said:

Cool.. then you can explain how by some miracle the baby becomes mine again after birth  and I am required to pay child support. 

It is just her body, right? Only if it isn’t.  

You had total control over impregnation.  Are you actually refusing to "own your shit"?  Irony.

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M12BH

M12BH 544

Posted
Posted
11 hours ago, NowThis said:

Fruit is Murder

This makes about as much sense as "people don't automatically have abortions".  Anyway I think this thread has been about as Slorch'd up as any, so.....yeah.  Anyone who can seamlessly leap from "Children don't always hold the same values as their parents and don't always tell their parents about everything they do", to "Most any kid will have an abortion"....well, ain't nobody got time for that bullshit. Some people are constitutionally incapable of understanding nuance, I think.  It's as much of a waste of time to ask them to see gray areas as it is trying to make them see infrared.  And buddy you can whine in the mirror and stamp your feet all you like about how no one respects your opinions and that we all JUDGE you for your beliefs, waahhh.  So the fuck what?  No one wants to criminalize your convictions. Is anyone here who is pro-choice as sensitive to your beliefs about them as you are to theirs?  No, EXCEPT TO THE EXTENT THAT YOU WANT YOUR VALUES TO BECOME THE LAW OF THE LAND AND FORCE THE REST OF US TO LIVE ACCORDING TO THEM.  It's just not personal, no matter how much you get your fee-fees damaged.

Unless you really do oppose the Alabama and Georgia laws.  In that case, my apologies and never mind. 

Anyway....I think my least favorite word in the English language is "should".  Women "should" be more responsible. Yep.  Men "should" be accountable if they knock up a woman. Check. Everyone "should" have other options than abortion.  Righto.  Government officials "should" face consequences when they drag us into lethal wars over fictional RMDs. Wait what?  People died because of that.  But they weren't fetuses so never mind.  Everyone dying from want of an organ transplant "should" be able to arbitrarily take an organ from someone else.  Why not?  Umm, let me guess - they aren't fetuses.  Only fetuses can commandeer the body parts of others.  As soon as they are born they are not worthy of the same life-saving rules.

Until we live in a world where everything that should happen does, or in a world in which resources are not scarce, there will be situations in which the decision of one adversely affects another, up to and including the death of the latter.  No one has yet been able to explain why a pregnant woman should be held to a different standard than every other human being on the planet who makes decisions on a daily basis that cause harm to others.  Unless you think fetus lives are more important than born lives, or pregnant women's decisions are less valid that everyone else's it's not possible. 

 

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Posted
Posted
34 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

You had total control over impregnation.  Are you actually refusing to "own your shit"?  Irony.

I am not absolving the guy of anything.  

Can you explain the miracle of it only being her body and then the guy is on the hook financially 9 months later?

 

again political gymnastics.  Your position is illogical as hell.

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M12BH

M12BH 544

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Pescado_Rojo said:

It's the Republican position in a nutshell...They care about fetuses, but don't want to pay for babies. 

They don't want to pay for fetuses either.  I bet that if prenatal care was subsidized, the number of abortions would decrease.  If that's actually the goal, I mean.  

Really the notion of legal child support only after a child is born is completely consistent with the pro-choice position, it's just that those arguing otherwise are too dumb to see it. 

 

Here's a handy cheat sheet for the logic-impaired:

Before conception:  Male has rights to and and responsibility for his penis and semen, female has rights to and responsibility for her uterus and whatever is in it

During pregnancy: Male has rights to and responsibility for his penis and semen, female has rights to and responsibility for her uterus and whatever is in it

If a child is born:  Male has rights to and and responsibility for his penis and semen, female has rights to and responsibility for her uterus and whatever is in it.  AND both male and female have rights and responsibilities concerning the child which is now a separate being.

 

Anyone arguing that either parent should not have responsibility for the product of a pregnancy is certainly not going to be advocating a position that will reduce the number of abortions.  If that's actually the goal, I mean.

 

BTW it's my 14th wedding anniversary today.  Not bad for a chick who has no notion of responsibility of accountability, amirite?  

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M12BH

M12BH 544

Posted
Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, slorch said:

I am not absolving the guy of anything.  

Can you explain the miracle of it only being her body and then the guy is on the hook financially 9 months later?

 

again political gymnastics.  Your position is illogical as hell.

So are you saying he should not be on the hook at all, or that he should be on the hook from conception?  Because anything else is illogical as hell if you care for the life and wellbeing of the unborn.  Well, illogical or callous, take your pick.  Someone other than the pregnant woman having responsibilities to a child after birth, but not before, is completely consistent with the position that a woman controls what happens inside her body during pregnancy.  If she does indeed have this control, and the father does not, then it stands to reason he should have no responsibilities either.  During pregnancy.  

On edit - for someone who claims to abhor political gymnastics you sure play a lot of them.  With the lives of the fetuses you claim to care for so much.  Unless you really believe that child support for born children should not be mandatory.  Which I don't believe you do, because if you did, that would make you a dick.  And though you might be, it's probably not for that reason.

Edited by M12BH
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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45538

Posted
Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, slorch said:

I am not absolving the guy of anything.  

Can you explain the miracle of it only being her body and then the guy is on the hook financially 9 months later?

 

again political gymnastics.  Your position is illogical as hell.

My position is not illogical as hell.  You're ascribing something to me I haven't advocated.  That's poor form.

I think the guy should be on the hook financially from conception.  Maybe that would help him think a little more clearly about exactly who he wants to fuck.

EDIT:  just saw M12BH's post, which is more elaborate than mine, but she pretty much has my perspective.

Edited by jimmyjazz
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M12BH

M12BH 544

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

My position is not illogical as hell.  You're ascribing something to me I haven't advocated.  That's poor form.

I think the guy should be on the hook financially from conception.  Maybe that would help him think a little more clearly about exactly who he wants to fuck.

EDIT:  just saw M12BH's post, which is more elaborate than mine, but she pretty much has my perspective.

Yeah, I've never been into the whole brevity thing. 

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henrygandorf

henrygandorf 29174

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, slorch said:

It was a purposefully extreme answer to the suggestion that most any kid has or will have an abortion, regardless of relationship or values in their relationship with their parents.

so nobody said they hoped your kids turn gay?  that seems intentionally misleading.

also i didn't see anyone suggest that "most any kid" will or has had an abortion.  i thought he just said if one of your kids did have an abortion, there was a really good chance they wouldn't tell you about it.  

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wildcat09

wildcat09 29213

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Cheeseweasel said:

 

Friendly advice: When you find yourself in a hole, stop digging.

Slorch has probably been given that advice on at least a few hundred separate occasions in his life. He's not about to start listening to it now.

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GSU&UT

GSU&UT 1798

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Bama Chick said:

Buckle up, Georgia.
 

Alyssa got dragged hard for this kind of shit. I'm not saying come here and throw away your morals and convictions, but it has rightfully been pointed out to her and other people that a boycott isn't going to change minds, donate your time and money because the only people who are going to hurt are the poor and mostly non-white people we have here.

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Grade of D as in David

Grade of D as in David 13253

Posted
Posted
23 minutes ago, GSU&UT said:

Alyssa got dragged hard for this kind of shit. I'm not saying come here and throw away your morals and convictions, but it has rightfully been pointed out to her and other people that a boycott isn't going to change minds, donate your time and money because the only people who are going to hurt are the poor and mostly non-white people we have here.

Boycotts don't work? 

You should really read up on the Montgomery bus boycott of 1956.

It helped change minds and the law.

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GSU&UT

GSU&UT 1798

Posted
Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, Grade of D as in David said:

Boycotts don't work? 

You should really read up on the Montgomery bus boycott of 1956.

It helped change minds and the law.

The jim crow law boycotts are a tad bit different than film studios that already move to states where they can get tax breaks. I don't see this moving the needle because Brian Kemp campaigned on this issue, this isn't a surprise. 

What Jordan Peele and JJ Abrams are doing is going to help a lot more in fighting this, they're donating much of their profits from Lovecraft Country (which was filmed here in Georgia) to groups and candidates that are going to fight this.

 

Edit: This is also what a lot of black women and men who are activists here in Georgia are saying as well, this is something that a lot of privileged people can afford to do while black women and other women of color are going to suffer because they can't just easily get up and move to a better state.

 

Edited by GSU&UT
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Bama Chick

Bama Chick 28596

Posted
Posted

Stupid sex boycotts like the one Alyssa Milano was pushing are dumb and don’t work.

 

But Georgia makes big money off the film industry. And a boycott that hits the state revenue and local businesses in the wallet most certainly do work and have worked in the past.

 

That’s how the gross bill that works have banned gay couples from adopting was defeated.

 

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Grade of D as in David

Grade of D as in David 13253

Posted
Posted (edited)
47 minutes ago, GSU&UT said:

The jim crow law boycotts are a tad bit different than film studios that already move to states where they can get tax breaks. I don't see this moving the needle because Brian Kemp campaigned on this issue, this isn't a surprise. 

What Jordan Peele and JJ Abrams are doing is going to help a lot more in fighting this, they're donating much of their profits from Lovecraft Country (which was filmed here in Georgia) to groups and candidates that are going to fight this.

 

Edit: This is also what a lot of black women and men who are activists here in Georgia are saying as well, this is something that a lot of privileged people can afford to do while black women and other women of color are going to suffer because they can't just easily get up and move to a better state.

 

Agreed that the boycotts are different, I was just responding to the boycotts don't work sentiment. They have been and continue to be effective in some cases. The sex boycott notwithstanding.

I also agree that there are other separate and complimentary actions that can be taken, some of which you have mentioned. I also understand that ordinary people who may very well be against the legislation will be hurt by a boycott in the form of lost wages and opportunities.

 

That said, if a nationwide boycott of Coca-Cola were to happen as someone mentioned up thread, I guarantee the Georgia legislature would take some action.

Edited by Grade of D as in David
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RDCanecutter

RDCanecutter 26246

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, Grade of D as in David said:

That said, if a nationwide boycott of Coca-Cola were to happen as someone mentioned up thread, I guarantee the Georgia legislature would take some action.

Be kinda cool if it happened at the same time as the retro reissue of New Coke.

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Asithappens

Asithappens 974

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, slorch said:

I am not absolving the guy of anything.  

Can you explain the miracle of it only being her body and then the guy is on the hook financially 9 months later?

 

again political gymnastics.  Your position is illogical as hell.

Grow up.

It's no "miracle", nor is it illogical.

Do you really not know why the guy is (often) on the financial hook later? Is this like you not knowing the definition of murder?

 

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workswithseed

workswithseed 2033

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, slorch said:

Cool.. then you can explain how by some miracle the baby becomes mine again after birth  and I am required to pay child support. 

It is just her body, right? Only if it isn’t.  

I think it should be the opposite. If the dude pays for child support while it's in the womb, that legally she can't kill it. Then men would have a say instead of the mother just killing it off. 

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workswithseed

workswithseed 2033

Posted
Posted (edited)
25 minutes ago, ChuckNorrisActionJeans said:

Won't someone please think of the poor, victimized men with no choices and no ability to run off into the sunset.

Men can't be victimized too? A buddy of mine cried to me after his then girlfriend had an abortion. Why are his feelings disregarded?

Edited by workswithseed
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henrygandorf

henrygandorf 29174

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

Men can't be victimized too? A buddy of mine cried to me after his then girlfriend had an abortion. Why are his feelings disregarded?

sounds like it was the girl who disregarded his feelings, and maybe this is between them.

a nice microcosm metaphor for who should be involved in the decision (hint, it isn't state legislators).

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M12BH

M12BH 544

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

Men can't be victimized too? A buddy of mine cried to me after his then girlfriend had an abortion. Why are his feelings disregarded?

They aren't. I feel really sad for him, honestly.  But that which is contained within his girlfriend's body at her discretion is not legislated by his fee-fees. 

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Bama Chick

Bama Chick 28596

Posted
Posted
Won't someone please think of the poor, victimized men with no choices and no ability to run off into the sunset.


I think all men should be required to get a vasectomy at age 13.

It can be reversed once they submit proof of marriage or long term committed relationship status to the legislature.

No sperm = no unplanned pregnancies = no abortions!!
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Biff Tannen

Biff Tannen 45491

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Bama Chick said:

 


I think all men should be required to get a vasectomy at age 13.

It can be reversed once they submit proof of marriage or long term committed relationship status to the legislature.

No sperm = no unplanned pregnancies = no abortions!!

 

This is actually a fucking fantastic idea.

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Pescado_Rojo

Pescado_Rojo 19330

Posted
Posted
27 minutes ago, M12BH said:

Who's going to pay for it?  Not the men undergoing the procedure, of course.  Undue burden.  

This article is about IUDs for women, but this article from Colorado shows that investing in birth control can both reduce teen pregnancy and actually save money in the long run. I'd assume a vasectomy is more expensive than an IUD, but I bet it would still be a money saver. 

https://www.denverpost.com/2017/11/30/colorado-teen-pregnancy-abortion-rates-drop-free-low-cost-iud/ 

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Posted
Posted
6 hours ago, Bama Chick said:

 


Yikes.

Sorry your wife finds accessories more satisfying than your dick.

 

I get mine.

 

That's the theme of this entire fucking thread.

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