the alabama abortion attack

[jimmyjazz 45513]

15 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

Maybe he should have worded it better, but how he said this quote looks bad.

No, it doesn't, not to a person who isn't bringing a loaded agenda to the discussion.  You're reaching.  The entire quote is more than enough to convince a sane, reasonable person that he is not advocating for the execution of live babies. 

But hey, that doesn't matter you.

[workswithseed 2033]

13 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

No, it doesn't, not to a person who isn't bringing a loaded agenda to the discussion.  You're reaching.  The entire quote is more than enough to convince a sane, reasonable person that he is not advocating for the execution of live babies. 

But hey, that doesn't matter you.

I am not some unreasonable person, if you tell me how I am reaching then I'll understand how I'm wrong.

Edited May 16, 2019 by workswithseed

[jimmyjazz 45513]

23 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

I am not some unreasonable person, if you tell me how I am reaching then I'll understand how I'm wrong.

Well, for starters, there is nothing in that quote that indicates he is advocating infanticide.  Nothing whatsoever.  For fuck's sake, Jack Kevorkian went to prison for physician-assisted suicide.  

Is it possible that a terminal infant would be allowed to die without resorting to extraordinary measures?  I suppose so.  Isn't that essentially the role of the parent -- to decide when enough is enough?  I guarantee you no sane physician would withhold sustenance from a healthy infant so that it would eventually die, and they damn sure wouldn't execute it.

I just don't think there is a shred of evidence that the VA Governor is a proponent of anything untoward here.  I don't know what you think you're seeing.

Edited May 16, 2019 by jimmyjazz

[Longhorn_Fan68 33825]

40 minutes ago, Junior Miller said:

What's worse? Never living at all or being born to a horrifically stupid single mother who can't afford and doesn't want you? Being born to a mother in prison and immediately becoming a ward of the state? Being born to a woman who was raped and will resent every time she looks at you for your entire life and will probably neglect you? 

Yeah, the act of abortion is horrible and I dislike it, but I also know I don't live in a candyland Utopia and the alternatives of children suffering because they were born to unfit idiot parents is far worse. 

Republicans want more idiots they can manipulate to vote for them because their platform is one of ignorance and stupidity. We should be striving for a better educated and smarter society with fewer children in extreme suffering. 

FIFY

[Longhorn_Fan68 33825]

[elfenix 34168]

36 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

I am not some unreasonable person, if you tell me how I am reaching then I'll understand how I'm wrong.

the current law is that measures for life support must be given if there's clearly visible evidence of viability.  the amendment they were discussing doesn't substantively change that provision.

Quote

(c) 3. Measures for life support for the product of such abortion or miscarriage must shall be available and utilized if there is any clearly visible evidence of viability.

http://lis.virginia.gov/cgi-bin/legp604.exe?191+ful+HB2491

 

Edited May 16, 2019 by elfenix

[Longhorn_Fan68 33825]

[Chuckie Finster 22583]

41 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

I am not some unreasonable person, if you tell me how I am reaching then I'll understand how I'm wrong.

You may not be unreasonable, but you are 1) easily manipulated by sensational, partisan media reports or 2) intentionally misrepresenting something to further your argument.

 

[Aqua Buddha 14488]

The Duggar wing of the Republican party wants to force a 15 year old girl to have a baby if her brother impregnates her and the parents do nothing.

[Brisketexan 104465]

Also, I kinda wonder why folks aren't taking actions against states like Alabama that force the state to take either inconsistent legal positions or at least absurd positions.  Alabama has taken the clear legal position that a fetus is a human life from the moment of conception.

For example, a pregnant woman is arrested and detained (she can't afford bail, etc., so she stays in custody).  File a writ of habeas corpus on behalf of Fetus Jones.  The state of Alabama can have no legal basis to detain Fetus Jones.  As Fetus Jones is a human being, the detention of Fetus Jones is unquestionably unlawful.

To go even further, sue the Alabama Department of Prisons for providing an insufficient diet to help Fetus Jones grow (fetal growth requires significant nutrition that is likely not available in prison food).

Need a friendly local DA to charge a man who had unprotected sex with a woman he knows to be a drug user, or alcoholic, for child endangerment.

Surely there are plenty of equal protection claims, or due process claims, that could likewise arise from other state actions.

Alabama chose to enter the Stupidity Decathlon.  Make them compete, and fall on their ass, in every event.

[wildcat09 29187]

1 hour ago, jimmyjazz said:

Well, for starters, there is nothing in that quote that indicates he is advocating infanticide.  Nothing whatsoever.  For fuck's sake, Jack Kevorkian went to prison for physician-assisted suicide.  

Is it possible that a terminal infant would be allowed to die without resorting to extraordinary measures?  I suppose so.  Isn't that essentially the role of the parent -- to decide when enough is enough?  I guarantee you no sane physician would withhold sustenance from a healthy infant so that it would eventually die, and they damn sure wouldn't execute it.

I just don't think there is a shred of evidence that the VA Governor is a proponent of anything untoward here.  I don't know what you think you're seeing.

These lunatics actually think liberals are literally baby murderers.

[SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861]

1 hour ago, workswithseed said:

I am not some unreasonable person, if you tell me how I am reaching then I'll understand how I'm wrong.

[TexArcher 37455]

21 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

These lunatics actually think liberals are literally baby murderers.

Of course they do.  That's what they hear on Fox News, their only source of "information".  And if you show them something from a legitimate news source that contradicts what Fox told them, they'll dismiss it as fake news.

It's amazing how Fox has gotten a bunch of rural working class folks to support a bunch of rich men who are actively working to destroy rural working class folks in pursuit of lowering their own tax bills and making their 401k's go up.  They'll even get the rural working class folks to cheer when their healthcare is taken away.

[Gil Bang 25865]

7 hours ago, wildcat09 said:

I dunno, historian twitter is pretty great.

watching D'Souza get pantsed is a joy.

[lemonlime 5503]

44 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

These lunatics actually think liberals are literally baby murderers.

We're going to lie about facts in heinous and blatantly untrue ways.  Try to pass laws that ignore all of medical science (eg. Ohio bill to re-implant ectopic pregnancies).   And ridicule and demonize people who disagree with us, and essentially everyone who's not a white, straight, "Christian" man.  But why won't you have a reasonable conversation about abortion?  

[Bama Chick 28596]

War Eagle, Kay you disgusting collaborating sex traitor.

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

2 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

Fetus Jones 

Very, very racist

[TexasMan 10785]

 

[hookemATL 11596]

Fetus Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Coathanger

[Jive Turkey 12562]

Fetus Jones of House Saban, First of Her Name, the Unborn, Queen of the Illiterate, Khaleesi of the great Gulf Shores, the Breaker of Tackles and Mother of Auburn.

[TwiceHorn 31184]

6 hours ago, Bama Chick said:

Every time I read that “legitimate rape” mess my blood boils.

How exactly does he think a vagina works? Does he think we have steel shutters in our snatch? A pussy pistol? Teeth?

A pussy troll? Pillow pants?

 

Dammit.

Edited May 17, 2019 by TwiceHorn
Dammit

[Anastasis 23375]

Abortion is not a political problem, but of course our dysfunctional political system is happy to roll it right up under its wings.  Abortion is a public health issue, and should be approach as such. The statistics are simply not acceptable from a public health perspective. About 20% of all abortions are performed for women who have had 2+ previous abortions.  This is not acceptable in any way in a modern, humane society. Put aside your politics for a second.  The psychological implications of abortion on the individual are profound and should not be diminished. The medical implications of repeated abortions as well are profound. If anybody was serious about addressing a problem related to abortion, they would start at a tail of the distribution that is substantial and where some common ground across all (most) political stripes can be found.  If we could bend the trend for women who are at a place in their life that they are considering their third abortion, through whatever compassionate means possible, we should try that.  It would have a substantial impact if you care about life from the point of conception, as well as the life and well being of the women involved. But we don't, as a society politic.  We care about advantage and posture and nothing else.  And it is part of the reason why we are a fundamentally broken society. 

Edited May 17, 2019 by Anastasis

[David Dennison 18605]

4 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Abortion is not a political problem, but of course our dysfunctional political system is happy to roll it right up under its wings.  Abortion is a public health issue, and should be approach as such. The statistics are simply not acceptable from a public health perspective. About 20% of all abortions are performed for women who have had 2+ previous abortions.  This is not acceptable in any way in a modern, humane society. Put aside your politics for a second.  The psychological implications of abortion on the individual are profound and should not be diminished. The medical implications of repeated abortions as well are profound. If anybody was serious about addressing a problem related to abortion, they would start at a tail of the distribution that is substantial and where some common ground across all (most) political stripes can be found.  If we could bend the trend for women who are at a place in their life that they are considering their third abortion, through whatever compassionate means possible, we should try that.  It would have a substantial impact if you care about life from the point of conception. But we don't, as a society politic.  We care about advantage and posture and nothing else.  And it is part of the reason why we are a fundamentally broken society. 

And that's why contraception should be free.

[jimmyjazz 45513]

3 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Abortion is not a political problem, but of course our dysfunctional political system is happy to roll it right up under its wings.  Abortion is a public health issue, and should be approach as such. The statistics are simply not acceptable from a public health perspective. About 20% of all abortions are performed for women who have had 2+ previous abortions.  This is not acceptable in any way in a modern, humane society. Put aside your politics for a second.  The psychological implications of abortion on the individual are profound and should not be diminished. The medical implications of repeated abortions as well are profound. If anybody was serious about addressing a problem related to abortion, they would start at a tail of the distribution that is substantial and where some common ground across all (most) political stripes can be found.  If we could bend the trend for women who are at a place in their life that they are considering their third abortion, through whatever compassionate means possible, we should try that.  It would have a substantial impact if you care about life from the point of conception. But we don't, as a society politic.  We care about advantage and posture and nothing else.  And it is part of the reason why we are a fundamentally broken society. 

"We" don't care about the woman.  "We" don't care about the fetus.  "We" care about control.

Part of me hopes science will come up with a way to quite literally harvest fertilized eggs from women who don't want to carry to term, for whatever reason, and place them in other hosts or incubators or whatever.  It's science fiction.  The main reason I want to see it happen is because I don't think this war will go away and it might be an acceptable end around.  Hopefully, it won't be forced by law.

[Anastasis 23375]

7 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

And that's why contraception should be free.

$4/month is pretty much free. If you are suggesting that they should also be available OTC without an Rx but with pharmacist counseling, I could go there. 

 

[Anastasis 23375]

8 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

 Part of me hopes science will come up with a way to quite literally harvest fertilized eggs from women who don't want to carry to term, for whatever reason, and place them in other hosts or incubators or whatever.  It's science fiction.  The main reason I want to see it happen is because I don't think this war will go away and it might be an acceptable end around.  Hopefully, it won't be forced by law.

What the fuck.  How about we just take some common sense measures to help women before they have to make their third trip to the abortion clinic. 

[jimmyjazz 45513]

1 minute ago, Anastasis said:

What the fuck.  How about we just take some common sense measures to help women before they have to make their third trip to the abortion clinic. 

Way to miss the point.  "Part of me", "science fiction", "end around".

I am not hopeful for the direction this country is headed.  But yes, I am anti-woman.  What.  The.  Fuck.  Indeed.  Neg rep.

[Anastasis 23375]

2 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Way to miss the point.  "Part of me", "science fiction", "end around".

I am not hopeful for the direction this country is headed.  But yes, I am anti-woman.  What.  The.  Fuck.  Indeed.  Neg rep.

No one said you were anti women. But thanks for the neg rep shit head.  What the fuck about this conversation makes your brain go to egg harvesting and incubators.  Jesus.  Take a breath Jimmy. 

[Anastasis 23375]

17 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Part of me hopes science will come up with a way to quite literally harvest fertilized eggs from women who don't want to carry to term, for whatever reason, and place them in other hosts or incubators or whatever.

[/totallynormalbrain]

[jimmyjazz 45513]

1 minute ago, Anastasis said:

No one said you were anti women. But thanks for the neg rep shit head.  What the fuck about this conversation makes your brain go to egg harvesting and incubators.  Jesus.  Take a breath Jimmy. 

Fuck you.  Suck my breath.

Try to keep up:  our country is currently moving backwards to a time when all abortion, for any reason, is illegal.  My post was an exaggeration of what might be necessary in such a dystopia to give women a tiny bright light.  It wasn't an actual policy proposal, but I'm not shocked you failed to interpret it correctly even though the intent was clear.

You have exactly zero room to lecture.

[jimmyjazz 45513]

Neg bomb, bitch.  

[Anastasis 23375]

totally hinged. 

[LonghornJudas 1090]

20 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Part of me hopes science will come up with a way to quite literally harvest fertilized eggs from women who don't want to carry to term, for whatever reason, and place them in other hosts or incubators or whatever.  It's science fiction.

It'll happen. https://jme.bmj.com/content/44/11/751

[jimmyjazz 45513]

Just now, Anastasis said:

totally hinged. 

Totally transparent.

[Anastasis 23375]

1 minute ago, jimmyjazz said:

Totally transparent.

Would be much more indicative of non-lunacy if I talked about harvesting the eggs of fertile women and storing them in incubators as a solution to the abortion debate. 

[jimmyjazz 45513]

1 minute ago, Anastasis said:

Would be much more indicative of non-lunacy if I talked about harvesting the eggs of fertile women and storing them in incubators as a solution to the abortion debate. 

As usual, you can't even get the concept straight, either literally or figuratively.  Don't let that big brane trip you up too much, Ace.

[Anastasis 23375]

2 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Don't let that big brane trip you up too much, Ace.

Big branes indeed. 

[Anastasis 23375]

Good talk, good thread CRver.surly.  Abortion discussions always bring out the best.  

[Post Oak 20182]

It's not the mountains and rivers fault.  Alabama is a beautiful place.  It's just that there are Alabamans that live there.

-Jason Isbell

[NowThis 931]

so this is good for Saban and Auburn too right? 

Edited May 17, 2019 by NowThis

[Pancho 44358]

I guess republicans have received their talking points from Fox. Most all of my conservative “friends” have posted how this law will benefit Blacks and how abortion is a racist idea thought up by Democrats to keep blacks oppressed.

 

It’s like a crazy email chain

[Pancho 44358]

I guess republicans have received their talking points from Fox. Most all of my conservative “friends” have posted how this law will benefit Blacks and how abortion is a racist idea thought up by Democrats to keep blacks oppressed.

 

It’s like a crazy email chain

[Fondren & Main 6658]

I mean the history of Planned Parenthood is pretty well documented...

[Homercles 10205]

"We" don't care about the woman.  "We" don't care about the fetus.  "We" care about control.

Part of me hopes science will come up with a way to quite literally harvest fertilized eggs from women who don't want to carry to term, for whatever reason, and place them in other hosts or incubators or whatever.  It's science fiction.  The main reason I want to see it happen is because I don't think this war will go away and it might be an acceptable end around.  Hopefully, it won't be forced by law.

 

Seems I use this every few months lately

 

[Cheeseweasel 26437]

14 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

Also, I kinda wonder why folks aren't taking actions against states like Alabama that force the state to take either inconsistent legal positions or at least absurd positions.  Alabama has taken the clear legal position that a fetus is a human life from the moment of conception.

For example, a pregnant woman is arrested and detained (she can't afford bail, etc., so she stays in custody).  File a writ of habeas corpus on behalf of Fetus Jones.  The state of Alabama can have no legal basis to detain Fetus Jones.  As Fetus Jones is a human being, the detention of Fetus Jones is unquestionably unlawful.

To go even further, sue the Alabama Department of Prisons for providing an insufficient diet to help Fetus Jones grow (fetal growth requires significant nutrition that is likely not available in prison food).

Need a friendly local DA to charge a man who had unprotected sex with a woman he knows to be a drug user, or alcoholic, for child endangerment.

Surely there are plenty of equal protection claims, or due process claims, that could likewise arise from other state actions.

Alabama chose to enter the Stupidity Decathlon.  Make them compete, and fall on their ass, in every event.

[jimmyjazz 45513]

1 hour ago, Pancho Negro said:

I guess republicans have received their talking points from Fox. Most all of my conservative “friends” have posted how this law will benefit Blacks and how abortion is a racist idea thought up by Democrats to keep blacks oppressed.

Yep, I'm seeing it too.  I am routinely amazed at the bullshit otherwise intelligent people will accept with no critical review whatsoever.

[Goredho 17302]

I don’t understand the fuss, the Bible is pretty clear on the matter.

”And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

This dominion is absolute and does not excludeth a Woman nor any part of her fleshly vessel, including but not limited to her uterus, which may spark the life of a soul the moment said woman, if being of such an age, parts her legs like the Red Sea.  For woman is to serve man, trust in his wisdom and keep to the kitchen to fixeth him turkey pot pie when bade to do so.  

So does God entrust and command man to rule the earth and it’s denizens forevermore.*

* this offer not valid in Asia or the as yet undiscovered New World or Australia”

[Cheeseweasel 26437]

[alincoln 2364]

11 hours ago, Anastasis said:

What the fuck.  How about we just take some common sense measures to help women before they have to make their third trip to the abortion clinic. 

Exactly.  First trimester abortions should be free and encouraged.  That said, sterilization should be required after two or possible three abortions.  

[Biff Tannen 45477]

2 minutes ago, alincoln said:

Exactly.  First trimester abortions should be free and encouraged.  That said, sterilization should be required after two or possible three abortions.  

fixed