Rick Barnes thread

[shadow_operative 15932]

Vols up to no.2 in AdjD after their 20 point win at Mizzou. The schedule gets tougher going forward, but you have to say that the Vols have looked great thus far. They have the look of a Rick Barnes team, and i really enjoy watching them play that physical, hard nosed style, with athleticism, tenacity, and rebounding as huge priorities/strengths. Time will tell, but this looks like it could be the best defense that Barnes has ever had. if Yves Pons isn't the best defender in America then i'd like to see the guy that's better. 

Edited December 31, 2020 by shadow_operative

[shadow_operative 15932]

[shadow_operative 15932]

Yves Pons in foul trouble, Santi Vescovi hurt, and the team shooting 9-31 (3-12) in the period. Rough first half for the Vols, down 38-27 at the break. 

[Js1 85564]

And Gata was missing 2 top players

 

[shadow_operative 15932]

Vols got that ass whooped. I don't think they could have played or shot any worse. They better hope not. That shit was baaaad. 

[Clintonaldo 2576]

Absolute fuck beating. We need Springer to get healthy as I don’t think Vescovi is going to get us to the next level. 

[LTtxfan 49348]

Ugly loss especially with gators missing some key players... 

 

 

[shadow_operative 15932]

the loss dropped Tennessee from no.6 in Kenpom all the way down to no.13. that's a big drop from a single loss, and it's reflective of how big of an ass kicking that was. the Vols still are no.2 in the country in AdjD, and may very well have the best defense in the country, along with the best single defender in the country in Yves Pons. it's their offense that did them in last night, and it's their inconsistent offense that will eventually see them KO'd from the tourney.

listen, anyone who knows me must surely know that i've spent plenty of time thinking about what would happen if Texas and Tennessee were to meet in the tourney, and every time i've thought about it i've come to the same conclusion- with the gulf in class between Barnes and Shaka, i feel inclined to have Tennessee as a slight favorite in that matchup. however, with Texas being so much more balanced than Tennessee (we are ranked 14th in AdjO, 7th in AdjD while Tennessee is ranked 51/2), it kind of tips the scales back in our favor. as great as Tennessee is defensively- and they have been outstanding- we have more balance and would likely win the game barring the Vols just having an outstanding day shooting jumpers.

point being, while Tennessee does have a very good team that should be looking at the Sweet 16 as a baseline goal, they still have a lot of work to do offensively before they seriously challenge for anything beyond that. they have a ton of balance offensively- 6 or 7 guys who can really play- but no true floor leader or alpha player. that can help you win a lot of regular season games, but it is hard to advance in the tourney without knowing exactly who you will lean on in a tight tourney game. they need to have somebody step up, or they could be in some trouble against the really good teams and/or in the tourney. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

home loss to Mizzou makes back to back losses. if this team had any one of Jordan Bone, Admiral Schofield, or Grant Williams (or their equivalent) then they'd be for real. as it stands, they kind of remind me of the 2004 Longhorns who had Mouton, Ivey, Boddicker, Buckman, and a freshman PJ Tucker- they have a lot of talent and some real experience, but they don't have "the guy".  now that Texas team did go 25-8 and made a trip to the Sweet 16, but if nobody on this Tennessee team emerges as a nightly offensive threat then they are going to struggle with good teams when they aren't shooting well as a whole.

also, with Pons and Fulkerson gone after this year, Barnes is going to need a few of his 5* recruits to stick around for 2-3 years, otherwise the Vols will continue to be good-but-not-great. which honestly they should be happy with, but no doubt Barnes and co. are striving for more. 

Edited January 24, 2021 by shadow_operative

[shadow_operative 15932]

 

721-719 and 15-8 now. Good performance by the Vols last night. Held KU to 20-53FG (6-24 3P) and outrebounded them 38-23, but the team effort on offense is what's important. Once again there was no alpha player for the Vols, but the offense was humming and guys were getting good looks and knocking down shots. Nice bounce back for Tennessee.

Edited January 31, 2021 by shadow_operative

[shadow_operative 15932]

oof. uncalled travel against Ole Miss with 3.5 seconds left and Tennessee loses by one. Vols are in a free fall, save whooping Kansas. 

[Js1 85564]

Never would have predicted a midseason swoon for a Barnes team! 

[shadow_operative 15932]

right on schedule. 

[Js1 85564]

I kid but that was not a good loss to Ole Miss of all teams. Mizzou and UF weren’t bad losses. This was 

[LTtxfan 49348]

8 minutes ago, Js1 said:

Never would have predicted a midseason swoon for a Barnes team! 

Rebounds, poor shooting, and not converting offensively down the stretch doomed Vols.  

Losing 52-50  is an ugly score for Barnes crew though...

 

[Clintonaldo 2576]

Springer needs to take over at point and sit Vescovi. Also, score with 8 minutes remaining. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

Rick Barnes is now 7-5 vs Kentucky since taking over at Tennessee, with three wins coming at Rupp Arena. Barnes has always been great against elite coaches/programs. from being KU's toughest foe under both Roy and Self, to owning Roy at UNC, and now to being a consistent thorn in the side of Coach Cal at Kentucky. Barnes is never the best coach in his league, but he's usually the guy who the league's best coach least wants to face. 

Edited February 7, 2021 by shadow_operative

[shadow_operative 15932]

sorry, Barnes is now 8-5 vs Kentucky, and doing all sorts of things vs the Wildcats that have never been done before at Tennessee.

 

https://247sports.com/college/tennessee/Article/Tennessee-basketball-Vols-Rick-Barnes-Kentucky-record-Rupp-Arena-160587775/Amp/

 

No. 11 Tennessee’s rally from down 10 points in the second half to win 82-71 at Rupp Arena in Lexington Saturday night gave Barnes his eighth win over the Wildcats in 13 meetings dating back to February 2016. Before Barnes, Tennessee needed 32 games against Kentucky to win eight, dating back to February 1999.

Before Barnes, the Vols had won only four times at Rupp Arena — 1977, 1979, 1999 and 2006. Tennessee has now won three times in its last four trips to Lexington. The only loss: When the team had been ranked No. 1 for a month and had won a school-record 19 straight games in 2019.

“It means that we have come up here with good basketball teams,” Barnes said of the success on the road against Kentucky.

Barnes is the only Tennessee coach in program history with multiple wins at Rupp Arena. He’s the only active head coach in college basketball with three wins at Rupp. The Vols are the only team during the John Calipari era to win three times in Lexington, too.

 

 

 

[shadow_operative 15932]

unreal dunk.

side note: he hangs on the rim *and* stares the guy down- no technical foul call. 

 

[shadow_operative 15932]

this team is all over the place. way too up and down to be depended upon. they not only will probably go home early in March, but i could see them losing in ugly fashion in a 5/12 type matchup. Pons and Fulkerson have been somewhat disappointing this season (particularly Fulky), which means Tennessee's best players are a bunch of up-and-down teenagers. there's at least three NBA players on this team, but the cohesion just is not there. you never know what you're going to get with this group. 

[Js1 85564]

39 minutes ago, shadow_operative said:

this team is all over the place. way too up and down to be depended upon. they not only will probably go home early in March, but i could see them losing in ugly fashion in a 5/12 type matchup. Pons and Fulkerson have been somewhat disappointing this season (particularly Fulky), which means Tennessee's best players are a bunch of up-and-down teenagers. there's at least three NBA players on this team, but the cohesion just is not there. you never know what you're going to get with this group. 

Someone from ESPN predicted a first weekend exit bc they can’t score 

[LTtxfan 49348]

Heard Kentucky shot lights out. 

This Vol team struggles on offense so needs lower scoring games to win most of the time...

[shadow_operative 15932]

2 hours ago, Js1 said:

Someone from ESPN predicted a first weekend exit bc they can’t score 

oh they can score. problem is they can just easily be held in the 50's, and you never know which it will be. easily one of the most bipolar teams i've ever followed.

 

[Underdog 28771]

First half was probably UK's best performance all season.  

[Machinator 32099]

Wouldn't have been surprised if a similar result had happened in the UK-Texas matchup that never happened.

[cashman 20]

Yeah so the Rick Barnes February collapse is still a thing

[Knoxtnhorn 6066]

Yep.  The Vol basketball board sounds exactly like ours does.  Barnes has somehow underachieved even more than Shaka this year.

[shadow_operative 15932]

16 minutes ago, Knoxtnhorn said:

Yep.  The Vol basketball board sounds exactly like ours does.  Barnes has somehow underachieved even more than Shaka this year.

lol hell no. that's insanely wrong. this is Rick's third best team at Tennessee, and their expectations coming into this year we're not on par with ours. first off, their best player (Yves Pons) can't even shoot. second,  Fulkerson has been a huge disappointment this year, and the stud HS recruits have been hot and cold. now that's not to say that Tennessee isn't underachieving, because they clearly are. but never had the potential that Texas has this year. Tennessee is lacking the talent they had in previous years, while Texas has its best/most talented team ever under Shaka and yet we're going to finish 7th in the league. Rick isn't having a good season by any stretch, but Shaka is ha ain't a terrible season. 

 

Tennessee opened the year ranked #21 by Kenpom; they are currently #23.

Texas opened the year ranked #9 by Kenpom; we are currently #25. 

 

like i said- not close. 

Edited February 27, 2021 by shadow_operative

[LTtxfan 49348]

2 hours ago, cashman said:

Yeah so the Rick Barnes February collapse is still a thing

Yeah -- and Shaka is pretty bad in B12 too

[Knoxtnhorn 6066]

3 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

lol hell no. that's insanely wrong. this is Rick's third best team at Tennessee, and their expectations coming into this year we're not on par with ours. first off, their best player (Yves Pons) can't even shoot. second,  Fulkerson has been a huge disappointment this year, and the stud HS recruits have been hot and cold. now that's not to say that Tennessee isn't underachieving, because they clearly are. but never had the potential that Texas has this year. Tennessee is lacking the talent they had in previous years, while Texas has its best/most talented team ever under Shaka and yet we're going to finish 7th in the league. Rick isn't having a good season by any stretch, but Shaka is ha ain't a terrible season. 

 

Tennessee opened the year ranked #21 by Kenpom; they are currently #23.

Texas opened the year ranked #9 by Kenpom; we are currently #25. 

 

like i said- not close. 

Um.  According to your own post, TN got up to #2.  Plus, every human poll had TN in the preseason Top 10 or close to it.  I could be wrong, but I don't think TX was near the Top 10 in any poll.  

And, I hate to do this because it'll appear as if I'm defending Shaka ... I'm not, but TN has some really ugly losses (double digits, non-25 teams), whereas TX has one double-digit loss (to #2) and a bunch of other close losses to good teams.  

I'd take underachieving but competetive over underachieving and getting run out of the gym.

Edited February 28, 2021 by Knoxtnhorn

[shadow_operative 15932]

7 minutes ago, Knoxtnhorn said:

Um.  According to your own post, TN got up to #2.  Plus, every human poll had TN in the preseason Top 10 or close to it.  I could be wrong, but I don't think TX was near the Top 10 in any poll.  

And, I hate to do this because it'll appear as if I'm defending Shaka ... I'm not, but TN has some really ugly losses (double digits, non-25 teams), whereas TX has one double-digit loss (to #2) and a bunch of other close losses to good teams.  

I'd take underachieving but competetive over underachieving and getting run out of the gym.

i have no idea what you're trying to say when you that Tennessee "got up to #2". no idea what you're talking about.

re: I'd take underachieving but competetive over underachieving and getting run out of the gym.

that's great, but it has nothing to with your original premise- that Barnes has been underachieving even more than Shaka. it's just not true. 

[cashman 20]

Texas would have 2 losses max if they played in the SEC

[shadow_operative 15932]

5 minutes ago, cashman said:

Texas would have 2 losses max if they played in the SEC

sure. Texas' roster coached by Rick Barnes would probably have two losses max in the SEC. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

Tennessee, with lower preseason expectations, lower preseason computer rankings, and an inferior roster, is still ranked ahead of Texas in both Kenpom and Sagarin. and that equates to Barnes failing more than Shaka has? I don't think so.

there's plenty of reason to be disappointed with this Tennessee team, from the up and down play of the young guards, to John Fulkerson shrinking in a leading role, to the job that Rick Barnes has done with their offense. Have at it. But don't go saying some stupid shit like he's doing worse than Shaka is. It's not even close.

Edited February 28, 2021 by shadow_operative

[Knoxtnhorn 6066]

1 hour ago, shadow_operative said:

Tennessee, with lower preseason expectations, lower preseason computer rankings, and an inferior roster, is still ranked ahead of Texas in both Kenpom and Sagarin. and that equates to Barnes failing more than Shaka has? I don't think so.

there's plenty of reason to be disappointed with this Tennessee team, from the up and down play of the young guards, to John Fulkerson shrinking in a leading role, to the job that Rick Barnes has done with their offense. Have at it. But don't go saying some stupid shit like he's doing worse than Shaka is. It's not even close.

But you claim Barnes is God's guft to coaching, and Shaka is terrible.  The fact that there's even a debate f's your premise.  Most (if not all) of us think Shaka sucks.  You're so emotionally attached, you don't see he's f'd up as much as Shaka this year.  And don't give me semantics.  There were plenty that saw TN as a better preseason team than TX.  

[shadow_operative 15932]

28 minutes ago, Knoxtnhorn said:

But you claim Barnes is God's guft to coaching

ha. i don't think so. you and many other self deluded posters can continue to say this all you want, but it will never make it true. also, lmao at me being the one who is "emotionally attached". i'm not the one who keeps getting upset here; i'm not the one taking or making any of this personal. that would be you.

 i very recently posted that Rick was in danger of never having a great program at Tennessee if he can't get his shit together, yet you claim that i deify him. i post sagarin and kenpom ratings for reference and you call that "semantics". i cite stats, facts, and empirical evidence while you angrily make up shit that ive never said and get all upset about this stuff and yet you believe that *I'm* too emotionally attached to be reasonable. lol, whatever dude. believe what you want. you're clearly the guy who is too emotionally attached here to be objective or reasonable. 

Edited February 28, 2021 by shadow_operative

[Brothahorn 10087]

But you claim Barnes is God's guft to coaching, and Shaka is terrible.  The fact that there's even a debate f's your premise.  Most (if not all) of us think Shaka sucks.  You're so emotionally attached, you don't see he's f'd up as much as Shaka this year.  And don't give me semantics.  There were plenty that saw TN as a better preseason team than TX.  

[shadow_operative 15932]

computers >>>>>>>> the fucking preseason AP poll. christ. the head coach and prior results affect the AP voters. the computers look at our roster and say that we are clearly better than Tennessee. the voters look at a clearly superior Texas roster being coached by Shaka Smart and predict that Tennessee, coached by Rock Barnes, will be better. shocker. if you put more stock into a preseason writers poll than the computers then that's your prerogative. doesn't make it any less dumb. 

Edited February 28, 2021 by shadow_operative

[Underdog 28771]

I’m amazed that of all the talent and teams both the Vols and Bama have had over many, many years that neither one of them has snuck into a FF. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

3 hours ago, Underdog said:

I’m amazed that of all the talent and teams both the Vols and Bama have had over many, many years that neither one of them has snuck into a FF. 

Bama could do it this year. Hell, if there was ever a year for them to do it, a year when Duke, UNC, Kentucky, Sparty, and Kansas are all down would be the one. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

if Tennessee had any one of Williams, Schofield, or Bone they would be a completely different team. this alludes to what i said previously about Barnes stacking his talent correctly if he ever wants to get over the hump. his two senior leaders this year (Pons and Fulky) are offensively stunted (Pons, an athletic freak, defensive savant, and their supposed best player is a projected late se one round pick, and Fulky will be going pro in something other than sports), while their most talented players (their young guards) are totally up-and-down and can't be relied upon. they're missing that veteran stud who can take over a game. with no go-to player to rely on, you're gonna get mixed results like this. 

[Fletch 5800]

2 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

Bama could do it this year. Hell, if there was ever a year for them to do it, a year when Duke, UNC, Kentucky, Sparty, and Kansas are all down would be the one. 

Hmmmm basketball payback in the elite 8 against them? It’d be fun to beat the shit out of em to exercise that 09 Colt national title game. 
 

And fuck bama making the final 4. Their shitass fanbase is annoying enough with football. Can’t imagine how obnoxious they’d be if they went to the final 4  

[Underdog 28771]

Basketball falls behind Football, spring football, NSD, Baseball, Women's Gymnastics, Women's softball @ Bama. 

[Fletch 5800]

But you know they’ll have an ocean of bandwagon fans who can’t name a single bama basketball player in the last 20 years and be all obnoxious about it 

[maninblack 7974]

 

[MotownHorn 1793]

Looks like Rick is doing his usual March choke job. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

6 hours ago, maninblack said:

 

"we don't belong in the NCAA tourney." LOL. sports fans are such miserable babies. 

[Revolution512 1495]

On 2/28/2021 at 11:20 AM, shadow_operative said:

if Tennessee had any one of Williams, Schofield, or Bone they would be a completely different team. this alludes to what i said previously about Barnes stacking his talent correctly if he ever wants to get over the hump. his two senior leaders this year (Pons and Fulky) are offensively stunted (Pons, an athletic freak, defensive savant, and their supposed best player is a projected late se one round pick, and Fulky will be going pro in something other than sports), while their most talented players (their young guards) are totally up-and-down and can't be relied upon. they're missing that veteran stud who can take over a game. with no go-to player to rely on, you're gonna get mixed results like this. 

You’re bullshit excuses are hilarious. You’ll explain away shitty coaching by this guy anyway you can

Edited March 8, 2021 by Revolution512

[shadow_operative 15932]

3 hours ago, MotownHorn said:

Looks like Rick is doing his usual March choke job. 

he was one of the best tourney coaches in the country for an entire decade, and he's spent his entire career at football schools, schools where basketball is an afterthought. but of course none of that, nor any other facts will dissuade you from obsessively posting about Barnes, inanely claiming that Shaka is a better coach than Barnes. bringing him up out of nowhere, etc, etc.

of course, attempting to talk facts with someone like you is an exercise in futility. you can't even grasp the basic reality of college basketball, much less actually watch the sport and then come up with your own original ideas and opinions on what you've observed. i mean, Bill Self has had nothing but great teams for 17 straight years and he has only one title to show for it, plus many, many more notable struggles/losses as a 1 or 2 seed in March. that's college hoops. but that's the thing about people like you, aka 85% of college hoops fans: you obsess over the tourney and ignore the much larger body of work. you don't even really keep up with the sport, but you always have an opinion. it's lame.

you aren't in here saying anything specific or germane to this actual Tennessee team, its talent, its record, its expectations, etc. because you don't actually know anything about Barnes, his program, his team. their expectations, etc. newsflash: 80-90% of good teams have a great record heading into conference play and then suddenly start playing .600-.700 ball. that's just the way it goes, every year for most teams, for obvious reasons. there's a couple of truly great teams (this year it's BU and Gonzaga), and then the next 30 teams are all flawed and inconsistent to one degree or another, and all of their fans are unhappy and pissed. if you think that the whiny, entitled complaints of Tennessee fans are unique to Rick Barnes teams, as opposed to just being the norm among most top 30-40 schools (of not the next 100 schools), then well, i guess that wouldn't surprise me at all coming from you. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

9 minutes ago, Revolution512 said:

You’re bullshit excuses are hilarious. You’ll explain away shitty coaching by this guy anyway you can

lol. you do not want to actually have this conversation with me. that's not a threat- that's a  statement of fact. you legitimately have zero desire to have any sort of adult conversation here. first off, you have no idea what you're talking about. you know it, i know it, it's not a secret- you are clueless on this topic. you don't know a thing about Tennessee, nor do you know anything about my posts/thoughts on Barnes.

second, and more importantly, your only goal here is to start some gay-ass, aol chatroom, youtube comment section, WORLDSTAR internet fight. that's a fact. it's lazy, childish, and stupid. the post of mine that you quoted was totally critical of Barnes and his ability to manage his roster and develop his senior players, and yet you quote it and refer to it as "bullshit excuses", because you're so fucking caught up in this middle schoolish attempt to start some shit with me that you can't even comprehend the criticism that you're quoting. you don't read this thread; you don't have a fucking clue as to whether or not i'm critical of Barnes, yet your stupid ass comes in here talking shit like you do. i sincerely hope that the year you were born starts with the number 2, because if you're a grown adult man who acts like this then you should be embarrassed and ashamed of yourself.