John Walker Lindh is a free man

[Parliament 14262]

 

Bearded and bedraggled, John Walker Lindh became a focal point of American anger when the then-20-year-old from Northern California was found among the ranks of Taliban soldiers captured in Afghanistan less than three months after the Sept. 11 attacks.

He's still known as the "American Taliban," and some called him a traitor who deserved the death penalty. But Lindh, now 38, is scheduled to be released from a federal prison in Terre Haute, Ind., on Thursday after serving 17 years of a 20-year sentence.

He's getting three years off for good behavior, though his probation terms include a host of restrictions: He needs permission to go on the Internet; he'll be closely monitored; he's required to receive counseling; and he's not allowed to travel.

He remains a lightning rod for critics who say his sentence was too lenient and he shouldn't be allowed out early. At his sentencing in 2002, Lindh said, "I have never understood jihad to mean anti-Americanism or terrorism. I condemn terrorism on every level, unequivocally."

 

https://www.npr.org/2019/05/23/725865999/john-walker-lindh-the-american-taliban-set-to-be-released

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

Damn, 17 years.  I’d say he’s served his time. 

[HenryJames 66133]

 

[Nice Guy Eddie 13515]

If anyone has a problem with it, take it up with the bush admin who gave him an offer.   

I go back and forth on whether I like him being out, but I strongly believe that when you serve your time, you deserve to go free.  A deal is a deal.

hopefully he does something good with the rest of his life.

 

[TornACL 7721]

1 hour ago, Parliament said:

 

He remains a lightning rod for critics who say his sentence was too lenient and he shouldn't be allowed out early. At his sentencing in 2002, Lindh said, "I have never understood jihad to mean anti-Americanism or terrorism. I condemn terrorism on every level, unequivocally."

 

https://www.npr.org/2019/05/23/725865999/john-walker-lindh-the-american-taliban-set-to-be-released

It's easy to say that once you're facing prison time.

I wonder if he told Osama Bin Laden that he condemned terrorism when they had a brief meeting?

[SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861]

6 minutes ago, HenryJames said:

 

Quite a way to look at it. 

[Asithappens 974]

1 hour ago, Parliament said:

At his sentencing in 2002, Lindh said, "I have never understood jihad to mean anti-Americanism or terrorism. I condemn terrorism on every level, unequivocally."

 

Screw him.

He's a traitor. In a time of war. 

[pepper brooks 580]

He served his time, and is free to get on with his life whatever that means.  I have no problem with him being let our 3 years early on a 20 year sentence.  That said, I would have been much more satisfied if they had found some deep dark hole to put him in never to be seen nor heard from again.  

[NowThis 931]

he was a naive young guy who joined the Taliban for idealistic reasons.  His crime was being caught in Afghanistan with some weapons, hardly a major figure.  He should have been released just like other Taliban foot soldiers, that's all he was. His sentence was symbolic, to look tough in the war on terrah, completely disproportionate with reality. 

[tantric superman 4667]

(Lind-eh)?

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

13 minutes ago, NowThis said:

he was a naive young guy who joined the Taliban for idealistic reasons.  His crime was being caught in Afghanistan with some weapons, hardly a major figure.  He should have been released just like other Taliban foot soldiers, that's all he was. His sentence was symbolic, to look tough in the war on terrah, completely disproportionate with reality. 

There was also the death of the CIA officer he might have had something to do with.  When he first got captured he was interviewed by a CIA officer but shortly after the interview there was a riot among the prisoners and the officer was killed.  It is unknown if Lindh had anything to do with it.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/john-walker-lindh-american-taliban-growing-concerns-over-early-release-from-prison/

Edited May 23, 2019 by Hugo Stiglitz

[Chrispy 132]

He deserved nothing less than a bullet to the head. Although, having to ask permission to watch internet porn is a steep price to pay. 

[NowThis 931]

19 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

There was also the death of the CIA officer he might have had something to do with.  When he first got captured he was interviewed by a CIA officer but shortly after the interview there was a riot among the prisoners and the officer was killed.  It is unknown if Lindh had anything to do with it.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/john-walker-lindh-american-taliban-growing-concerns-over-early-release-from-prison/

meh, like nothing. It's all symbolic tough guy from the Bush administration.

There' s really good PBS documentary on him, showing video of the fort battle, escape, capture, interogation. He was nothing but a low level Taliban foot soldier, but hyped up by the US government as a publicity stunt. 

Edited May 23, 2019 by NowThis

[phdhorn 6224]

This from Foxy News:

Quote

John Walker Lindh, the captured Islamic militant who at age 20 journeyed to Afghanistan to join the Taliban and fought alongside the terrorists in the days after 9/11,  was released from a U.S. federal prison in Indiana on Thursday, his lawyer confirmed to the Washington Post -- despite lawmakers' concerns about the “security and safety implications” of freeing an unrepentant terrorist who officials say continues to “openly call for extremist violence."

... and this from Cee Enn Enn:

Quote

Lindh will live in Virginia subject to the direction of his probation officer, his lawyer, Bill Cummings, tells CNN. But some are already calling for an investigation into his time in prison -- where he is said in two US government reports to have made pro-ISIS and other extremist statements -- that could send him back into detention.

Yeah, "poor misguided guy who paid his price a long time ago and now should be let out..."

Well, all I can say is I won't be saying many salats for him if he turns up dead somewhere.  Go fuck yourself, unrepentant traitor.

[Asithappens 974]

I, for one, won't lose too much sleep when he eventually winds up in the Muslim version of hell.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13515]

29 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

There was also the death of the CIA officer he might have had something to do with.  When he first got captured he was interviewed by a CIA officer but shortly after the interview there was a riot among the prisoners and the officer was killed.  It is unknown if Lindh had anything to do with it.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/john-walker-lindh-american-taliban-growing-concerns-over-early-release-from-prison/

Someone needs to be jailed because its unknown if they had something to do with something 17 years ago?  The CIA was good about getting information they wanted (whether accurate or not) so they had plenty of time to produce information that Lindh had some responsibility in that murder.  

And to be honest, I don't know if killing your torturer is actually murder or self defense.  We see movies where we cheer on the hero performing that exact step and then escaping. But it all depends on your perspective on who is good and who is bad. I put the CIA in the good guy role but torturing someone comes with risk if they get loose. 

[Cheeseweasel 26438]

1 minute ago, Asithappens said:

I, for one, won't lose too much sleep when he eventually winds up in the Muslim version of hell.

72 virgins like this?

 

 

Muslim hell = Vic heaven. 

[SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861]

53 minutes ago, NowThis said:

he was a naive young guy who joined the Taliban for idealistic reasons.  His crime was being caught in Afghanistan with some weapons, hardly a major figure.  He should have been released just like other Taliban foot soldiers, that's all he was. His sentence was symbolic, to look tough in the war on terrah, completely disproportionate with reality. 

Taking up arms against your own country and taking up arms against a foreign country are treated differently by our laws, and every other set of laws I can think of.  He committed a pretty nuclear grade crime that is the complete opposite of the recognized hostilities permissible under all the international treaties and conventions like Geneva.  He deserved real prison time.

 

 

 

Also, re: Jihadist statements he's made in prison.  I spent an hour looking into those this morning.  It sounds pretty made up.  One dude reported something in 2017.  His cellmate says he'd never heard anything similar.  He's done a number of writings saying he thinks terrorism is bad, didn't really understand what he was joining as a 20 year old, etc.  I think people are just promoting propaganda that he is still a bad guy by taking the most flimsy of evidence and disregarding 99% of the rest.

Edited May 23, 2019 by SuingToGetAMessageBoard?

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

3 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Someone needs to be jailed because its unknown if they had something to do with something 17 years ago?  The CIA was good about getting information they wanted (whether accurate or not) so they had plenty of time to produce information that Lindh had some responsibility in that murder.  

And to be honest, I don't know if killing your torturer is actually murder or self defense.  We see movies where we cheer on the hero performing that exact step and then escaping. But it all depends on your perspective on who is good and who is bad. I put the CIA in the good guy role but torturing someone comes with risk if they get loose. 

He took a plea bargain to avoid the murder charges.  Regardless, I don’t GAF about this douchebag.  Hope he does something good with the life he has left, like everyone else. 

[NowThis 931]

1 minute ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

He took a plea bargain to avoid the murder charges.  Regardless, I don’t GAF about this douchebag.  Hope he does something good with the life he has left, like everyone else. 

he had no choice because it was all stacked against him, especially considering the political mood at the time. 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

Who knew joining the Taliban could end so poorly? 

[NowThis 931]

3 minutes ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

Taking up arms against your own country and taking up arms against a foreign country are treated differently by our laws, and every other set of laws I can think of.  He committed a pretty nuclear grade crime that is the complete opposite of the recognized hostilities permissible under all the international treaties and conventions like Geneva.  He deserved real prison time.

 

 

 

Also, re: Jihadist statements he's made in prison.  I spent an hour looking into those this morning.  It sounds pretty made up.  One dude reported something in 2017.  His cellmate says he'd never heard anything similar.  He's done a number of writings saying he thinks terrorism is bad, didn't really understand what he was joining as a 20 year old, etc.  I think people are just promoting propaganda that he is still a bad guy by taking the most flimsy of evidence and disregarding 99% of the rest.

he joined the Taliban at the time who were only fighting the Uzbeks and Tajik tribes of Afghanistan.  He's not a bad guy by any means, nothing "nuclear" about it.  It's so much hype to feed the FOX nutters. 

[formermav43 4606]

I’m sure he’s just as naive and idealistic in supporting the Islamic State as he was the Taliban. https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theatlantic.com/amp/article/590071/

Quote

Considering the attention that the Islamic State has attracted from the media, academics, researchers, and others over the past couple of years, it is striking to me how few appear to have actually visited the Islamic State to see how things really are there and to meet and interview its leaders … I would like to suggest that you visit the Islamic State yourself so that you can pose your questions directly to its officials and leaders. I am sure there are ways that that can be arranged.

I told him that sounded like a splendid idea, except for the possibility that I might be beheaded or enslaved.

I understand your concerns about being killed or enslaved, however I believe that your apprehensions are misplaced. The journalists who have been taken into custody by the authorities of the Islamic State travelled there illegally. Had they gone with the proper documentation, I am confident that the authorities of the Islamic State would have honoured their covenants, as required by Islamic law.

And then our correspondence ended with a note of self-effacement. Lindh said he was a mere “layman,” my sources were adequate to answer my questions, and his own opinions were “of no consequence.” He guided me to his “colleague” and former fellow Terre Haute inmate Ahmad Musa Jibril, a notorious ideologue now free and living in Michigan, and said that Jibril could answer further questions. Jibril was the most popular cleric among ISIS jihadis, before his accounts went dormant for legal reasons.

Edited May 23, 2019 by formermav43

[Parliament 14262]

If Lindh tells you there's little risk in traveling there and asking questions, I'm still not sure you should go.

[Fudge Nuggets 19208]

Deja vu moment, I was just wondering about this goofy bastard about three days ago.

[TwiceHorn 31509]

I am deeply suspicious of the criminal system, full stop.  I am even more deeply suspicious when the defendant can be made a political football or a whipping boy.  This goes double/triple for the feds. 

Traitorous behavior, if true, is a serious crime that deserves serious punishment.  Twenty years is serious punishment, even for this.

That said, there is a sufficient psychological element (maturity, delusion, etc. etc.) to his crime that, pending further information that may never come, I'm willing to say he's done his piece, leave him be.

[Asithappens 974]

5 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

I am deeply suspicious of the criminal system, full stop.  I am even more deeply suspicious when the defendant can be made a political football or a whipping boy.  This goes double/triple for the feds. 

Traitorous behavior, if true, is a serious crime that deserves serious punishment.  Twenty years is serious punishment, even for this.

That said, there is a sufficient psychological element (maturity, delusion, etc. etc.) to his crime that, pending further information that may never come, I'm willing to say he's done his piece, leave him be.

Please.

Lindh was a 20-year old man at the time. (or thereabouts)

 

[Aqua Buddha 14598]

Had Hillary been president, Fox would be in complete meltdown about why and how President Hillary Clinton released him.

[Foosters 17858]

8 minutes ago, Asithappens said:

Please.

Lindh was a 20-year old man at the time. (or thereabouts)

 

And?

[Asithappens 974]

24 minutes ago, Foosters said:

And?

So all the hand wringing about him being a kid/naive/psychologically unready are invalid excuses, imo.

He was a man. He made a very bad decision. Maybe his mamma didn't breast feed him. 

[Foosters 17858]

1 minute ago, Asithappens said:

So all the hand wringing about him being a kid/naive/psychologically unready are invalid excuses, imo.

He was a man. He made a very bad decision. Maybe his mamma didn't breast feed him. 

Who's making excuses. Both statements can be true. No one here is saying the kid should've been exonerated because of his age/maturity.

[Chooky 13317]

Growing up Lindh was a huge Globetrotters fan, so as soon as he's released he'll be joining the Washington Generals.

[Hank Scorpio 17729]

My prediction is that he goes back to Afghanistan, rejoins the Taliban, gets captured again, is sentenced to another 20 years, and then in 2036 he is released again and we are still at war in Afghanistan. 

[gmr548 16581]

Had Hillary been president, Fox would be in complete meltdown about why and how President Hillary Clinton released him.

As if they still won't be asking that

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

[Chooky 13317]

44 minutes ago, Hank Scorpio said:

My prediction is that he goes back to Afghanistan, rejoins the Taliban, gets captured again, is sentenced to another 20 years, and then in 2036 he is released again and we are still at war in Afghanistan. 

Then he'll be too old to fight in Afghanistan and we'll have them right where we want them. Long game scoreboard! USA! USA! USA!

Edited May 23, 2019 by Chooky
Phone blows

[Fudge Nuggets 19208]

His ankle monitor is going to lead us to the Taliban’s secret locations.  

[Lat22 4015]

I hope one of Johnny Spann's buddies visits him in the middle of the night.

[relapse98 634]

4 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Someone needs to be jailed because its unknown if they had something to do with something 17 years ago? 

Isn't that like the motto of the gitmo detention camp? Where we have 40 guys who will just end up living out the rest of their days there because once we captured them, we didn't have a plan (and still don't) about what to do with them other than let them live at Gitmo forever.

[Homesickhorn 2202]

There was also the death of the CIA officer he might have had something to do with.  When he first got captured he was interviewed by a CIA officer but shortly after the interview there was a riot among the prisoners and the officer was killed.  It is unknown if Lindh had anything to do with it.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/john-walker-lindh-american-taliban-growing-concerns-over-early-release-from-prison/

^^^^This.

 

And I’m fairly certain that there are a handful 5th SFG and Delta operators that would like to have a word with him.

[NowThis 931]

3 hours ago, Chooky said:

Growing up Lindh was a huge Globetrotters fan, so as soon as he's released he'll be joining the Washington Generals.

he should go into porn 

[F250 28788]

6 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Who knew joining the Taliban could end so poorly? 

Prior to 9/11?

The guy went in thinking he was going to be fighting the Northern Alliance. Then 9/11 happens and the U.S. invaded Afghanistan and aided with the Northern Alliance. Bad place and bad timing.

If you recall, up until that point in time, Islamic fighters were portrayed as freedom fighters in the 80's and 90's. There was that one American kid that volunteered to fight for Islamic Chechen forces against Russians in Chechnya. I don't even need to mention all the 80's propaganda about Afghanistan.

 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

He chose...poorly.

[Brisketexan 105161]

Yeah, I tried to muster up some sympathy for the guy.

Didn't really take.

He did his time, fair is fair, now he gets out.  But fuck him.  The Taliban weren't anything groovy BEFORE 9/11 -- there was plenty of well-publicized discussion about what they were doing to women etc. after they took power.  Who remembers the fact that they assassinated Massoud, leader of the Northern Alliance, a couple of days before 9/11?  I remember that event at the time, and thinking "well, that isn't good news."  Because the Taliban were not good news.

Choosing to join the Taliban was a dick move.  Sticking with them after they assisted with an attack on the US....dick move AND dumb move.

[Bama Chick 28596]

It really speaks to the futility of the American effort in Afghanistan that this guy has served 17 years and American troops are STILL THERE.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

6 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Yeah, I tried to muster up some sympathy for the guy.

Didn't really take.

He did his time, fair is fair, now he gets out.  But fuck him.  The Taliban weren't anything groovy BEFORE 9/11 -- there was plenty of well-publicized discussion about what they were doing to women etc. after they took power.  Who remembers the fact that they assassinated Massoud, leader of the Northern Alliance, a couple of days before 9/11?  I remember that event at the time, and thinking "well, that isn't good news."  Because the Taliban were not good news.

Choosing to join the Taliban was a dick move.  Sticking with them after they assisted with an attack on the US....dick move AND dumb move.

He was probably triple goat dared by his Taliban pledge class brothers.

[Brisketexan 105161]

7 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

He was probably triple goat dared by his Taliban pledge class brothers.

72 virgins will make a man do stupid things.

I mean, not THIS man.  Who would want to spend eternity with 72 gals who have no idea what they're doing?

[zork 629]

Didn't he predict all kinds of doom for the continental US citizen population from all of the damage they were going to inflict within our midst?  Was he talking about Opiate abuse? Poisoning from angry fast food workers?

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

11 minutes ago, zork said:

Didn't he predict all kinds of doom for the continental US citizen population from all of the damage they were going to inflict within our midst?  Was he talking about Opiate abuse? Poisoning from angry fast food workers?

He was pretty much  a Taliban Nostradumbass 

[NowThis 931]

3 hours ago, F250 said:

Prior to 9/11?

The guy went in thinking he was going to be fighting the Northern Alliance. Then 9/11 happens and the U.S. invaded Afghanistan and aided with the Northern Alliance. Bad place and bad timing.

If you recall, up until that point in time, Islamic fighters were portrayed as freedom fighters in the 80's and 90's. There was that one American kid that volunteered to fight for Islamic Chechen forces against Russians in Chechnya. I don't even need to mention all the 80's propaganda about Afghanistan.

 

pre-9/11, during the first few months of the Bush regime,  the US actually invited a Taliban delegation to Washington DC, just about the same time JWL went over there. 

 

Supposedly the Bush Administration had been meeting since January 2001 with the Taliban, and was also reluctant to offend Saudi Arabians who O’Neill had linked to bin Laden

in the late 90s, the Taliban even stayed at Houston hotels 

https://www.counterpunch.org/2002/01/10/bush-enron-unocal-and-the-taliban/

Back in Houston, the Taliban was learning how the “other half lives,” and according to The Telegraph, “stayed in a five-star hotel and were chauffeured in a company minibus.” The Taliban representatives “…were amazed by the luxurious homes of Texan oil barons. Invited to dinner at the palatial home of Martin Miller, a vice-president of Unocal, they marveled at his swimming pool, views of the golf course and six bathrooms.” Mr. Miller, said he hoped that UNOCAL had clinched the deal.

Edited May 24, 2019 by NowThis