2019 NBA FInals - Warriors vs. Raptors

[Machinator 32099]

 

[Jhawk 1075]

If he isn’t even sniffing on court activities then his season is done unless this series goes to six or seven. If GSW wins without him then his legacy is taking a hit. Even though it’s still a great legacy. 

[PittsburghTiger 6181]

I'm rooting for the Warriors. I can't root for Canada.

[Sweetnsourpoke 169]

Ok...I have to ask.....why on earth would someone hate Canada? I can see hating Oklahoma or California or Iran or Syria or someplace awful.

But Canada? Seriously? What happened? They were too friendly to you and your family?

[Slacks 6819]

Ok...I have to ask.....why on earth would someone hate Canada? I can see hating Oklahoma or California or Iran or Syria or someplace awful.
But Canada? Seriously? What happened? They were too friendly to you and your family?

MCGA

[MNLonghornFUKM 8817]

4 hours ago, Sweetnsourpoke said:

Ok...I have to ask.....why on earth would someone hate Canada? I can see hating Oklahoma or California or Iran or Syria or someplace awful.

But Canada? Seriously? What happened? They were too friendly to you and your family?

when I was 18 or 19, i was up in Winnipeg because of booze. They have disgusting ketchup in Canada....and their mcdonalds have a maple leaf in the middle of the golden M which has always pissed me off when I infrequently go up there

Edited May 28, 2019 by MNLonghornFUKM

[aggie08 21501]

Boogie Cousins is becoming a pretty intriguing side-plot.  Kerr's comments make it pretty damn clear that he's really not looking forward to trying to fit him back into the rotation in the middle of an NBA Finals.  But he came to Golden State to play in the playoffs/Finals, and he's done everything asked of him to come back from a(nother) devastating injury, so what do you tell you guy?  "We like starting 50 year old Andrew Bogut against Gasol, Kevon Looney should be getting most of the center minutes [factual], and we like bringing in Jordan Bell to speed up the pace.  Oh, and we still want to try some modified Death Unit lineups with Dray at center.  Sorry Boogie, maybe we'll get you in in a blowout!"

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

It's not that hard.  "Hey we are on a six game winning streak, all against top teams.  we aren't going to be making any significant roation changes now."

Also, I hate to say it, but if KD isn't ready until a hypothetical game 6 or 7, I'm not sure that's the time to see how the leg feels or to test his conditioning.  I wouldnt be surprised if KD comes off the bench when he's "healthy"

Edited May 28, 2019 by dingleberryswitzer

[aggie08 21501]

22 minutes ago, dingleberryswitzer said:

Also, I hate to say it, but if KD isn't ready until a hypothetical game 6 or 7, I'm not sure that's the time to see how the leg feels or to test his conditioning.  I wouldnt be surprised if KD comes off the bench when he's "healthy"

I would. If it gets to a Game 6 or 7, it'll be because Kawhi is carving them up and eliminating one of the original Big 3 with his defense. If nothing else, KD would be a magnet for Kawhi.

Steph did come off the bench in the 2nd round in 2016 against Portland after missing 3 weeks with a knee sprain, so I suppose it's possible. But he still played 36 minutes that game, so not sure how much not starting helped to ease back into things.

The Warriors are pretty good about taking their time with injuries. Once KD is cleared for on-court activities, it'll still be about 3 days of individual and team practices and 3-on-3 scrimmaging before they let him suit up. Obviously not the same as NBA Finals game speed, but they'll test his leg as much as they can. Because of this, I'm beginning to think it's very possible that KD doesn't play at all in this series. I don't think he's even taking shots yet.

Edited May 28, 2019 by aggie08

[ztejas 43420]

8 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

I would. If it gets to a Game 6 or 7, it'll be because Kawhi is carving them up and eliminating one of the original Big 3 with his defense. If nothing else, KD would be a magnet for Kawhi.

Steph did come off the bench in the 2nd round in 2016 against Portland after missing 3 weeks with a knee sprain, so I suppose it's possible. But he still played 36 minutes that game, so not sure how much not starting helped to ease back into things.

The Warriors are pretty good about taking their time with injuries. Once KD is cleared for on-court activities, it'll still be about 3 days of individual and team practices and 3-on-3 scrimmaging before they let him suit up. Obviously not the same as NBA Finals game speed, but they'll test his leg as much as they can. Because of this, I'm beginning to think it's very possible that KD doesn't play at all in this series. I don't think he's even taking shots yet.

I think people need to be more cognizant of how absurdly long they are dragging out the Finals. Game 3 isn't for another 8 days. 

And Durant does not come off the bench. He's either good to go or he isn't - they aren't playing him at 70% or for 15 minutes a game. It will be close to zero sum, caveat being he will play as long as he's at 90% and can give 30 minutes. 

[Machinator 32099]

 

[ztejas 43420]

33 minutes ago, dingleberryswitzer said:

It's not that hard.  "Hey we are on a six game winning streak, all against top teams.  we aren't going to be making any significant roation changes now."

None of that matters as soon as game 1 tips off. Toronto is riding a 4 game winning streak against probably the 3rd best team in the NBA. If GS goes down 1-0 no one is going to give a shit that they swept Portland. Which is why so many of these "lol are they better without KD?" takes are hilarious to me. Lads, it's the Blazers. 

[PittsburghTiger 6181]

9 hours ago, Sweetnsourpoke said:

Ok...I have to ask.....why on earth would someone hate Canada? I can see hating Oklahoma or California or Iran or Syria or someplace awful.

But Canada? Seriously? What happened? They were too friendly to you and your family?

I'm just not going to root for a foreign team to win the NBA title. I don't root for any Canadien teams to win the Stanley Cup. If the CFL and NFL merged I would not root for the Edmonton Eskimos either.

In eighth grade I was kicked out of a bar in the old town part of Quebec City. 

[hookem48 4687]

10 hours ago, Sweetnsourpoke said:

Ok...I have to ask.....why on earth would someone hate Canada? I can see hating Oklahoma or California or Iran or Syria or someplace awful.

But Canada? Seriously? What happened? They were too friendly to you and your family?

because they can't play football right, fuck them.

[MoJames 8244]

On 5/25/2019 at 10:07 PM, Brian Fantana said:

Fuck a Kevin Durant give me Kawhi Leonard any day

Yeah, what this guy said but the opposite.

Hook'em

[MoJames 8244]

On 5/26/2019 at 2:45 AM, 52-80 said:

Team kawhi.  Everybody wrote off the raptors after g2.  That dude is incredible

Incredible at sitting out with a fake injury. And I'm not a Spurs fan, I'm a fan of adults not throwing temper tantrums.

[Vic Mackey 47029]

6 hours ago, ztejas said:

None of that matters as soon as game 1 tips off. Toronto is riding a 4 game winning streak against probably the 3rd best team in the NBA. If GS goes down 1-0 no one is going to give a shit that they swept Portland. Which is why so many of these "lol are they better without KD?" takes are hilarious to me. Lads, it's the Blazers. 

Who gives a shit about the Blazers right now. This is about the Warriors and Raptors. And the Warriors are the better team, with or without KD. What is also hilarious is so many people can't grasp that losing KD is not a huge deal to the Warriors. How long do they have to continue to prove this before people realize? They don't miss a beat when he's not there. They just revert back to their style that won them 73 games. Has nothing to do with the Blazers. They also took care of the Rockets at the end of the 2nd round series without him and they are much better than the Blazers.

Why are we comparing levels of competition when discussing the Warriors? They are at the top of the NBA. And above any other team right now. Of course their opponents are going to be lesser competition no matter who it is.

[MNLonghornFUKM 8817]

So how are we ranking the top teams


1 GS with KD

2 GS without him

3 Toronto

4 milwaukee

5 houston

[Thatguy 8692]

Who gives a shit about the Blazers right now. This is about the Warriors and Raptors. And the Warriors are the better team, with or without KD. What is also hilarious is so many people can't grasp that losing KD is not a huge deal to the Warriors. How long do they have to continue to prove this before people realize? They don't miss a beat when he's not there. They just revert back to their style that won them 73 games. Has nothing to do with the Blazers. They also took care of the Rockets at the end of the 2nd round series without him and they are much better than the Blazers.
Why are we comparing levels of competition when discussing the Warriors? They are at the top of the NBA. And above any other team right now. Of course their opponents are going to be lesser competition no matter who it is.

Um....how did that 73 game winner finish? People keep saying but if Draymond.....

Well, he played in game 6 and 7. Still didnt matter. That team you said didnt matter if KD played or not never beat a full strength team for a title. They got taken to 6 by Lebron and 4 middle schoolers the year prior. Then they lost to them when they were at full strength.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

[Mitch Cumsteen 18549]

55 minutes ago, Thatguy said:

Um....how did that 73 game winner finish? People keep saying but if Draymond.....

Well, he played in game 6 and 7. Still didnt matter. That team you said didnt matter if KD played or not never beat a full strength team for a title. They got taken to 6 by Lebron and 4 middle schoolers the year prior. Then they lost to them when they were at full strength.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
 

You can't look at the individual Warriors teams in a vacuum. That 73 win team is a lot different than this year's team aside from Durant. The one thing that they have going for them now that they didn't back then is experience. They've had a ton of reps in crucial moments since then.

With regard to the finals matchup, I could delve into the matchups and breakdown how I think it plays out, but my overall prediction is fuck Kawhi Leonard. 

[NowThis 931]

4 hours ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

So how are we ranking the top teams


1 GS with KD

2 GS without him

3 Toronto

4 milwaukee

5 houston

1. GS without KD but has Cousins

2. GS without KD and no Cousins

3. GS with KD and Cousins

4. Houston 

5. GS with KD and no Cousins

6. TOR 

Edited May 29, 2019 by NowThis

[aggie08 21501]

You know, there's a 20 page KD thread where we've held the "what happens if KD doesn't go to Golden State" hypothetical conversation no less than 37 times in recent weeks. It's also a great place to get butt hurt over "people" saying that the Warriors are as good or better without KD, despite Vic and NowThis being the only two idiots (possibly on the entire planet) actually making that argument.

Can we have a Finals thread about the actual Finals? I think it's going to be a good one.

[Machinator 32099]

Good read.

 

[Beau Vine 54219]

Is this thing still happening?  Or did they already play it and I missed it?

[BradInATX 9208]

13 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

You know, there's a 20 page KD thread where we've held the "what happens if KD doesn't go to Golden State" hypothetical conversation no less than 37 times in recent weeks. It's also a great place to get butt hurt over "people" saying that the Warriors are as good or better without KD, despite Vic and NowThis being the only two idiots (possibly on the entire planet) actually making that argument.

Can we have a Finals thread about the actual Finals? I think it's going to be a good one.

I'd make the argument myself but it's not a battle I want to fight on here as it's going to be a super unpopular opinion. However I do agree with the point that KD being around for the grind of the regular season takes a lot of pressure and injury risk away from the other guys on the team, which helps them in the playoffs. But I would take the Warriors without KD over the Warriors with KD in a seven game playoff series all day long.

Raptors gonna get that ass beat. Warriors in 6, only because of the schedule and I don't see them winning 2 of the first 3 in Toronto. But they'll win 1 and that's all they'll need to close it out in 6.

Edited May 29, 2019 by BradInATX

[Vic Mackey 47029]

...

[ztejas 43420]

16 hours ago, Vic Mackey said:

How long do they have to continue to prove this before people realize?

I don't know. Let's start with tomorrow night. 

[Dutchrudder 11139]

So if I'm KD, I'm hoping Toronto goes up 3-0, and then come back and help the Warriors win 4-3.

Then peace out for 200m+ and living in New York CIty, and let the chips fall where they may. 

[Machinator 32099]

 

[Thatguy 8692]

6 hours ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

You can't look at the individual Warriors teams in a vacuum. That 73 win team is a lot different than this year's team aside from Durant. The one thing that they have going for them now that they didn't back then is experience. They've had a ton of reps in crucial moments since then.

With regard to the finals matchup, I could delve into the matchups and breakdown how I think it plays out, but my overall prediction is fuck Kawhi Leonard. 

   That may be true. However, they were a better collective back then. The bench was far superior to what they have now. I just think that they are extremely beatable without KD.

[Machinator 32099]

 

[Vic Mackey 47029]

...

[goatsaag 279]

If Durant was 100%, I would take Golden State in 5. If Durant doesn't play at all, I think it's a toss up 7 game series. Assuming Durant plays some and is healthy enough to not be a negative, I'm thinking the Warriors in 6 or 7.

[MNLonghornFUKM 8817]

...

Saw that... crazy haha

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

8 hours ago, goatsaag said:

If Durant was 100%, I would take Golden State in 5. If Durant doesn't play at all, I think it's a toss up 7 game series. Assuming Durant plays some and is healthy enough to not be a negative, I'm thinking the Warriors in 6 or 7.

It’s all about tonight for me. If GS just comes out and blows the doors off Toronto, this is going to be a short series. Toronto has to win tonight. Going into game two with the pressure of ”this series is over if we don’t win” is a tough task.

Obviously a slight over reaction, but Toronto is in trouble if they don't win tonight. I don't see them winning more than once at GS (if at all)

Edited May 30, 2019 by youdunnf'dup

[ztejas 43420]

https://dailycaller.com/2019/05/30/kevin-durant-calf-injury-game-three-2019-nba-finals/

https://www.goldenstateofmind.com/2019/5/29/18644796/2019-nba-finals-raptors-warriors-game-1-kevin-durant-injury

Looking like KD is probable for game 3

[aggie08 21501]

Toronto HAS to punish Golden State in the 8-10 minutes every game that Steph is on the bench. The Warriors have been pretty bad without Steph on the court for almost a decade, but KD's arrival helped to weather those minutes a little better (the numbers below should end once and for all any notion that Golden State is as good without KD...not even close, even though Steph is obviously the most important cog). Klay has never been able to carry the 2nd units effectively. If Boogie gets real minutes in this series, I think the non-Steph minutes are where he starts. See if he can punk Ibaka and Toronto's bench.

How the Warriors have fared with and without KD and Curry

Since 2016-17, playoffs and regular season

LINEUP	CURRY	DURANT	OFF. RATING	DEF. RATING	NET RATING
Curry + KD	✓	✓	115.0	99.8	+15.2
Curry	✓		108.2	96.4	+11.8
KD		✓	102.3	100.6	+1.7
Neither			95.6	99.6	-4.0

Lineups are weighted by minutes played

SOURCE: NBA

How KD, Curry and Klay play together

Since 2016-17, playoffs and regular season

LINEUP	CURRY	DURANT	THOMPSON	OFF RATING	DEF RATING	NET RATING
Curry + KD + Klay	✓	✓	✓	115.9	100.9	+15.0
Curry + KD	✓	✓		111.7	96.1	+15.6
Curry + Klay	✓		✓	109.0	97.0	+12.0
KD + Klay		✓	✓	101.2	100.6	+0.6
Curry only	✓			107.1	95.7	+11.4
KD only		✓		104.9	100.6	+4.3
Klay only			✓	98.4	98.9	-0.5
None of them				91.6	100.5	-8.9

Lineups are weighted by minutes played

SOURCE: NBA

[Mitch Cumsteen 18549]

31 minutes ago, youdunnf'dup said:

It’s all about tonight for me. If GS just comes out and blows the doors off Toronto, this is going to be a short series. Toronto has to win tonight. Going into game two with the pressure of ”this series is over if we don’t win” is a tough task.

Obviously a slight over reaction, but Toronto is in trouble if they don't win tonight. I don't see them winning more than once at GS (if at all)

Terrible take. They were down 0-2 to Milwaukee and never lost faith. If they get a split at home, they just need a split in the next two games in Oakland to tie it up. I think they got over all their yips when Kawhi hit that shot against Philly. Not to mention that they are playing with house money. I'd be less concerned about them about dealing with the pressure and more concerned about them being satisfied just being there.

That said, I think that Toronto is a tough matchup for the Warriors. They have a lot of long perimeter guys, especially if Anunoby can go, who can switch without giving up bad mismatches. Those are the types of teams that typically give the Warriors the most trouble. If the W's get sloppy and turn the ball over, which they are definitely prone to do, then this is going to be a long series. I honestly wouldn't be surprised to see Toronto win.

[Machinator 32099]

[aggie08 21501]

4 minutes ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

Terrible take. They were down 0-2 to Milwaukee and never lost faith. If they get a split at home, they just need a split in the next two games in Oakland to tie it up. I think they got over all their yips when Kawhi hit that shot against Philly. Not to mention that they are playing with house money. I'd be less concerned about them about dealing with the pressure and more concerned about them being satisfied just being there.

That said, I think that Toronto is a tough matchup for the Warriors. They have a lot of long perimeter guys, especially if Anunoby can go, who can switch without giving up bad mismatches. Those are the types of teams that typically give the Warriors the most trouble. If the W's get sloppy and turn the ball over, which they are definitely prone to do, then this is going to be a long series. I honestly wouldn't be surprised to see Toronto win.

All of this.

I'm guilty of underrating Toronto last series (at least through the first 3 games). I assumed that everyone on that team not named Kawhi would wilt after falling down 0-2 like we've seen from Toronto so many times in the past. But they're playing with confidence and proving that they're not just a nice regular season team. I still don't fully trust Lowry and Green and even Gasol at his age offensively against a swarming Warriors' defense. But they'll play smart and in control and not give the series away.

The run 4-deep with All-Defensive team members--including 3 DPOY awards--Siakam will make one in the future, and Kyle Lowry will make you feel him. Gasol, Kawhi, Ibaka, and Green know how to guard the Warriors and have been pretty damn good at it in the past.

[Vic Mackey 47029]

[Mitch Cumsteen 18549]

And one more bit of analysis (aside from fuck Kawhi Leonard)... I really believe this series will hinge on whether Toronto can get either Danny Green or Fred VanVleet to hit consistently from three.

Danny Green was beyond atrocious (4/23) against Milwaukee. I've been watching that bucket of dick cheese forever in San Antonio and you never know what you're going to get from his shooting night to night. He could make his next 10 in a row. He could miss his next 15. He's going to continue to be a plus defender, but you can definitely take your chances leaving him.

And whatever the fuck happened to VanVleet is completely inexplicable. He's got to be the first person in recorded history to become not just slightly, but exponentially more productive at his job immediately after having a kid. I don't understand how you go from hitting 1/14 from three against Philly, follow it up by shooting 2/11 from three in the first three games of the ECF and then make 14 out of the next 17. The motherfucker was 3 of his last 25 (12%) and then made 14 of his next 17 (82%) three point attempts. How is that even possible? And a lot of those makes were bombs, several feet behind the line. I cannot wrap my head around this, at all.

[Rockethorn1978 6077]

On 5/28/2019 at 5:55 AM, MNLonghornFUKM said:

when I was 18 or 19, i was up in Winnipeg because of booze. They have disgusting ketchup in Canada....and their mcdonalds have a maple leaf in the middle of the golden M which has always pissed me off when I infrequently go up there

Isn't Minnesota basically "Canada"? 

[NowThis 931]

41 minutes ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

And one more bit of analysis (aside from fuck Kawhi Leonard)... I really believe this series will hinge on whether Toronto can get either Danny Green or Fred VanVleet to hit consistently from three.

Danny Green was beyond atrocious (4/23) against Milwaukee. I've been watching that bucket of dick cheese forever in San Antonio and you never know what you're going to get from his shooting night to night. He could make his next 10 in a row. He could miss his next 15. He's going to continue to be a plus defender, but you can definitely take your chances leaving him.

And whatever the fuck happened to VanVleet is completely inexplicable. He's got to be the first person in recorded history to become not just slightly, but exponentially more productive at his job immediately after having a kid. I don't understand how you go from hitting 1/14 from three against Philly, follow it up by shooting 2/11 from three in the first three games of the ECF and then make 14 out of the next 17. The motherfucker was 3 of his last 25 (12%) and then made 14 of his next 17 (82%) three point attempts. How is that even possible? And a lot of those makes were bombs, several feet behind the line. I cannot wrap my head around this, at all.

that newborn, not Kawhi,  is the reason Toronto is in the Finals. 

[Dutchrudder 11139]

1 hour ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

And whatever the fuck happened to VanVleet is completely inexplicable. He's got to be the first person in recorded history to become not just slightly, but exponentially more productive at his job immediately after having a kid. I don't understand how you go from hitting 1/14 from three against Philly, follow it up by shooting 2/11 from three in the first three games of the ECF and then make 14 out of the next 17. The motherfucker was 3 of his last 25 (12%) and then made 14 of his next 17 (82%) three point attempts. How is that even possible? And a lot of those makes were bombs, several feet behind the line. I cannot wrap my head around this, at all.

He changed his shot a little bit. He got better at releasing the ball at the top of his jump, and he's arcing the ball higher in the air. This should be common knowledge in the NBA, but it's not. The higher the ball goes in the air, the higher your accuracy will be. The arc and backspin on the ball greatly improve your chances of it going in the basket.  Curry figured this out a few years ago and has been dominant from the perimeter because of it. 

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

3 hours ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

Terrible take. They were down 0-2 to Milwaukee and never lost faith. If they get a split at home, they just need a split in the next two games in Oakland to tie it up. I think they got over all their yips when Kawhi hit that shot against Philly. Not to mention that they are playing with house money. I'd be less concerned about them about dealing with the pressure and more concerned about them being satisfied just being there.

That said, I think that Toronto is a tough matchup for the Warriors. They have a lot of long perimeter guys, especially if Anunoby can go, who can switch without giving up bad mismatches. Those are the types of teams that typically give the Warriors the most trouble. If the W's get sloppy and turn the ball over, which they are definitely prone to do, then this is going to be a long series. I honestly wouldn't be surprised to see Toronto win.

It might be a terrible take, but they went down 0-2 against Milwaukee when they didn’t have home court advantage. That’s really more of my point. I think that’s one of the big things they have going for them in these finals. If they lose home court right out of the gate, and it isn’t a particularly close game, I think they’re in trouble. I personally don’t see them winning more than one game at GS this series. They need to protect homecourt if they’re going to win this series. 

Plus, I know I keep harping on this, but for a team that’s never been to the finals, I just have a hard time believing they’ll be able to bounce back from a game one loss against a team with this much championship experience. I could be wrong. Maybe I’m putting way too much stock into that. But we’ll see how things play out tonight. Both teams have had a lot of time to think about how they want to attack this series so it’ll be interesting. 

Edited May 30, 2019 by youdunnf'dup

[NowThis 931]

11 minutes ago, Dutchrudder said:

He changed his shot a little bit. He got better at releasing the ball at the top of his jump, and he's arcing the ball higher in the air. This should be common knowledge in the NBA, but it's not. The higher the ball goes in the air, the higher your accuracy will be. The arc and backspin on the ball greatly improve your chances of it going in the basket.  Curry figured this out a few years ago and has been dominant from the perimeter because of it. 

again, the newborn gave FVV impetus to change his arc. It's all subconscious, comes from primal love of the child. 

[Brothahorn 10087]

17 hours ago, Vic Mackey said:

...

Man I forgot all about that failed Bron-Shaq era.

[XYZ 2154]

Shaq played for the cavs?

[MNLonghornFUKM 8817]

Isn't Minnesota basically "Canada"? 

Isnt texas basically mexico?