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MLS 2018 Thread

ATLLonghorn

By ATLLonghorn
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alincoln

alincoln 2371

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There is one South American in the MLS currently getting paid more than $2.5 million (Piatti at MTL).

MLS salary rules simply don't allow for a significant influx of high level South American talent, particularly if the number of DPs is permanently reduced to 2 this offseason as expected.

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ztejas

ztejas 43411

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15 minutes ago, alincoln said:

There is one South American in the MLS currently getting paid more than $2.5 million (Piatti at MTL).

MLS salary rules simply don't allow for a significant influx of high level South American talent, particularly if the number of DPs is permanently reduced to 2 this offseason as expected.

Okay - so it isn't yet a "trend" - but I stand by my point. 

DP or not almost 50 players are banking $1MM a season.

 

On top of that - the league is expanding. So yes, 3 DPs to 2 might lead some non-Americans to look elsewhere in the short term, but as salary and revenue increase across the board overall there will definitely be more elite Mexican, Central and South American talent. 

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Napoleon

Napoleon 8661

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15 hours ago, ztejas said:

I think "Soccer in America" would be a better phrasing considering he's, you know, Argentinian. 

But, this trend will continue. South Americans that like being closer to family and in the same time zones are going to seriously start considering MLS clubs that can offer them $5MM plus. 

Ironically, this is at a time when the US is sending more players overseas than ever. There must be over a dozen Americans in the Bundesliga right now. SEVEN Americans have scored a goal in BL play this season just 14 games in. 

The storm is coming. Europe got to point and laugh for decades, it won't be as funny once the US is a national powerhouse and running teams off the field. 


He's not "Choosing the MLS over Europe."

He's said that Europe didn't want him, so he's going to the MLS.

He's hoping that after a year or two in the MLS, he can get more attention from a European league worth going to. Atlanta will sell Miguel Almiron for $12M-$15M and will be buying Pity Martinez for $15M. If Almiron does well in Europe, Martinez might be sold for a profit. (Also didn't realize that Almiron came from Lanús as well, mí club de Argentina está ganando mucha plata de los clubes del MLS.)

The MLS is becoming a weigh station for South Americans to prove that they can handle the physicality that they'll find in Europe as well as handle being so far from home before the Euros make the investment to bring this kids over. That's a nice position for MLS teams to be in while the league continues to grow.This will also help with international TV contracts, because the MLS will be seen as a league that "produces" future stars.

Atlanta's financial commitment could see them become a dominant team in the MLS for the coming decade.

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alincoln

alincoln 2371

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6 hours ago, Napoleon said:

Atlanta's financial commitment could see them become a dominant team in the MLS for the coming decade.

Atlanta has certainly made full use of Designated Players but its total payroll for 2018 was a relatively modest $11.3 million (9th in the league).  Toronto blew the rest of the league away with a total payroll of $26.2 million, almost $9 million more than LA Galaxy in second place at $17.5 million.  Meanwhile, 13 teams in the league (including Dallas at $9.3 and Houston at $5.7) had total payrolls of less than $10 million.

The league wants more payroll compression among its teams.  Simply eliminating one DP slot will drop Toronto's payroll from 4.7x Houston to 3.5x Houston.

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ztejas

ztejas 43411

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6 hours ago, Napoleon said:


He's not "Choosing the MLS over Europe."

He's said that Europe didn't want him, so he's going to the MLS.

He's hoping that after a year or two in the MLS, he can get more attention from a European league worth going to. Atlanta will sell Miguel Almiron for $12M-$15M and will be buying Pity Martinez for $15M. If Almiron does well in Europe, Martinez might be sold for a profit. (Also didn't realize that Almiron came from Lanús as well, mí club de Argentina está ganando mucha plata de los clubes del MLS.)

The MLS is becoming a weigh station for South Americans to prove that they can handle the physicality that they'll find in Europe as well as handle being so far from home before the Euros make the investment to bring this kids over. That's a nice position for MLS teams to be in while the league continues to grow.This will also help with international TV contracts, because the MLS will be seen as a league that "produces" future stars.

Atlanta's financial commitment could see them become a dominant team in the MLS for the coming decade.

Nice correction.

MLS has already capitalized on the washed-up Euro star, now comes the Central/South American prospects, what would be the next phase? Keeping homegrown talent in the US or poaching tweeners from the rest of the world? Or a bit of both?

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ATLLonghorn

ATLLonghorn 848

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26 minutes ago, alincoln said:

Atlanta has certainly made full use of Designated Players but its total payroll for 2018 was a relatively modest $11.3 million (9th in the league).  Toronto blew the rest of the league away with a total payroll of $26.2 million, almost $9 million more than LA Galaxy in second place at $17.5 million.  Meanwhile, 13 teams in the league (including Dallas at $9.3 and Houston at $5.7) had total payrolls of less than $10 million.

The league wants more payroll compression among its teams.  Simply eliminating one DP slot will drop Toronto's payroll from 4.7x Houston to 3.5x Houston.

It is underrated how Atlanta built the roster around the high profile DP signings. Certainly having arguably the best player in the league (Almiron) and the single season scoring leader on the roster gives you wiggle room, but Eales and Bocanegra did a great job filling the roster in. 

It's nice to have Almiron's replacement already in the mix and that's where the commitment to spending is a massive benefit. I'm more concerned about the eventual replacement for Parkhurst (35 next year) and Larentowicz (36 next August). Tata found ways to reinvigorate those guys in the tail ends of their careers. Those guys were unbelievably valuable this year.

 

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Napoleon

Napoleon 8661

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4 hours ago, ztejas said:

Fuck. Must have caught a cold.

Still, being "aggy" about 'Murica is better than being aggy about aggy.

/noCR

Considering that the stars of both teams (as well as the head coaches) are from South America, I don't know how quickly the Euros are going to run & hide due to the fact that the USMNT is running roughshod over everyone else.

Arguably the best US player at the moment is currently riding the bench behind an 18 year-old English kid in Germany for their team's biggest matches. The US has a long-long way to go, but at least the domestic league is getting more and more fun to watch, is (somewhat) financially viable, and kids are being exposed to quality play at an impressionable age.

...I still can't believe that Brad Guzan won a trophy.

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ztejas

ztejas 43411

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4 minutes ago, Napoleon said:

Considering that the stars of both teams (as well as the head coaches) are from South America, I don't know how quickly the Euros are going to run & hide due to the fact that the USMNT is running roughshod over everyone else.

Arguably the best US player at the moment is currently riding the bench behind an 18 year-old English kid in Germany for their team's biggest matches. The US has a long-long way to go, but at least the domestic league is getting more and more fun to watch, is (somewhat) financially viable, and kids are being exposed to quality play at an impressionable age.

...I still can't believe that Brad Guzan won a trophy.

I'm probably higher on our national team than you. The US has competed fairly well in world cups before our players were flocking to Germany and England. Our 2010 squad was pretty damn good and should have made the QF - winning our group over England. That team had maybe 3 guys on it that were good enough to play overseas in Donovan, Howard, and Dempsey (maybe Altidore if he could have stayed healthy).

We hung tight in the "group of death" in 2014 and made it out. 

I think once this crop of young guns gets some experience behind them we won't be that far away from pulling some upsets and righting the ship. 

Obviously missing the WC was a freaking disaster but it's probably the shock our program needed to take that penultimate step of maybe sneaking into a semifinal or finally beating a top Euro side in meaningful competition. 

We shall see. I like what I'm seeing from our teenagers overseas and believe that they can figure it out together to become a pretty damn good international side. 

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Napoleon

Napoleon 8661

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4 hours ago, ztejas said:

MLS has already capitalized on the washed-up Euro star, now comes the Central/South American prospects, what would be the next phase? Keeping homegrown talent in the US or poaching tweeners from the rest of the world? Or a bit of both?

Although I wasn't a fan of buying washed up Euros when that was all the rage in ~2006-2015, I was living in Buenos Aires when David Beckham signed with the Galaxy and the following season, you could watch MLS matches on TV. That would not have happened without big names, but during the dead period for the European summer and South American breaks in the schedule (from late June until ~mid August), there was now an alternative to watching various matches from decades gone by that had been edited down into 30 minute packages.

So here we are, 10 years on from me sitting in my room in Buenos Aires watching MLS to having a 3 Argies playing in the final for Portland and an Argie coach leading Atlanta to a title (with one of his two best players having played professionally in Argentina).


NEXT PHASE:

More inter-league play between the MLS & Mexico, almost a Superliga on the side of the CONCACAF Champions League, but it will have to have $$$$ payouts and maybe even include a team or three from Colombia (which is almost completely in the Northern Hemisphere) and maybe Venezuela as well, if they ever have a regime change that stabilizes that country. More young American kids going abroad to train in academies as well as foreigners coming to the US to train in academies... that is when you know that you have something. When a foreign kid wants to train in the U.S. 

More and more youth coaches who know what they are doing and who coach to improve skills & tactics, not to simply beat another team no matter how boring game plan.

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ztejas

ztejas 43411

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6 minutes ago, Napoleon said:

Although I wasn't a fan of buying washed up Euros when that was all the rage in ~2006-2015, I was living in Buenos Aires when David Beckham signed with the Galaxy and the following season, you could watch MLS matches on TV. That would not have happened without big names, but during the dead period for the European summer and South American breaks in the schedule (from late June until ~mid August), there was now an alternative to watching various matches from decades gone by that had been edited down into 30 minute packages.

So here we are, 10 years on from me sitting in my room in Buenos Aires watching MLS to having a 3 Argies playing in the final for Portland and an Argie coach leading Atlanta to a title (with one of his two best players having played professionally in Argentina).


NEXT PHASE:

More inter-league play between the MLS & Mexico, almost a Superliga on the side of the CONCACAF Champions League, but it will have to have $$$$ payouts and maybe even include a team or three from Colombia (which is almost completely in the Northern Hemisphere) and maybe Venezuela as well, if they ever have a regime change that stabilizes that country. More young American kids going abroad to train in academies as well as foreigners coming to the US to train in academies... that is when you know that you have something. When a foreign kid wants to train in the U.S. 

More and more youth coaches who know what they are doing and who coach to improve skills & tactics, not to simply beat another team no matter how boring game plan.

Fun, somewhat related story. Family was doing a cruise in Alaska sometime around 2012 I think. We spent a few days in Seattle and while there found out that the Sounders had a home game on an afternoon we hadn't really blocked out. 

So, we went. They were playing the Galaxy. On that Galaxy team (who I both got to watch play in person that day) were Landon Donovan and David Beckham.

It was a pretty awesome experience that we just kind of stumbled into. Think the Sounders won 4-2 or 5-2 or something. 

Gorgeous stadium. Great fans. 

This game!

https://www.soundersfc.com/matchday/2012/2012-08-05-sea-v-galaxy

Edited by ztejas
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Napoleon

Napoleon 8661

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6 minutes ago, ztejas said:

We hung tight in the "group of death" in 2014 and made it out. 

The US always calls their group "The Group of Death". The rest of the world rarely sees it that way.

But yes, the US advanced out of their group in 2014 and hung with Belgium in a hard-fought game.

That said, when your best player sits because an 18 year-old is better, your country is hardly on the edge of taking over anything.

I'm a fan of playing the kids from now until 2026. Keep playing them for the experience and the chemistry. I think that there is more potential than ever, but that doesn't mean that we're anywhere close to a top soccer country. But, given the right chemistry, coach, luck, and matchups, we will soon be able to ground out a win vs most countries and even have a number of good matches in a World Cup. We came kind of close to winning the Confederations Cup in 2009. (We lost 3-2, but with VAR it would have been 4-2.) We were better than Germany in 2002, but got screwed by a non-call. We overcame getting screwed by the refs in 2010.

We just keep plugging away and see where things go.

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ztejas

ztejas 43411

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6 minutes ago, Napoleon said:

That said, when your best player sits because an 18 year-old is better, your country is hardly on the edge of taking over anything.

This is a strange way you keep phrasing this concept. 

Pulisic has been fighting nagging injuries and is playing on the best team in the Bundesliga. It's not like he hasn't found any success at BvB. He might just need a change of scenery. 

And the 18 year old you are comparing him to is an absolute beast that just recently won BL player of the month and has an estimated transfer tag of 40 million Euro. I'm not staying up at night because Pulisic can't edge that kid out of the rotation. 

To add to that - success at the national level is rarely about who your best player is. It is such a team game, and I think that is why the US has had success at times disproportionate to its talent. 

Edited by ztejas
Off thread topic - apologies
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Buzzrock

Buzzrock 14902

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It is underrated how Atlanta built the roster around the high profile DP signings. Certainly having arguably the best player in the league (Almiron) and the single season scoring leader on the roster gives you wiggle room, but Eales and Bocanegra did a great job filling the roster in. 
It's nice to have Almiron's replacement already in the mix and that's where the commitment to spending is a massive benefit. I'm more concerned about the eventual replacement for Parkhurst (35 next year) and Larentowicz (36 next August). Tata found ways to reinvigorate those guys in the tail ends of their careers. Those guys were unbelievably valuable this year.
 


It’s all about Lucy:

https://inews.co.uk/sport/football/lucy-rushton-interview-atlanta-united-mls-analytics/

I met her at an event. Sharp as a tack.
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shnsajax

shnsajax 3591

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Yeah I haven’t read much about him but haven’t heard much negativity. Big shoes to fill.


Very successful at Ajax, not so much in other leagues. Not sure he has many options in Europe, but style shouldn’t change to much from this past season.


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