“for all mankind” - streaming this fall on apple+

[SizzleChest 8284]

1 hour ago, MrBig said:

I would not be surprised if this show gets cancelled. I noticed ads for Apple TV+ during MNF with clips from other original shows and there wasn’t a single clip from this one. 

This is the last season anyway.

[Js1 85443]

20 minutes ago, SizzleChest said:

This is the last season anyway.

Wut? Isn’t it planned for 7? Did I miss the news?

[Js1 85443]

They could not have telegraphed that death harder. 

But finale should be a bloodbath - I don’t think Ed and Danielle and Dev all make it out alive. 

Supposed to be 1 hr 16 min too

[Js1 85443]

That felt like one of the better season finales to me 

[wild_turkey 3168]

That felt like hot garbage to me. Seasons 1-2 were so good and season 4 was a complete mess.

[MrBig 5421]

On 1/11/2024 at 10:09 PM, wild_turkey said:

That felt like hot garbage to me. Seasons 1-2 were so good and season 4 was a complete mess.

I thought it sucked too. The writing was a mess and it seemed like they just threw it together. They didn’t tie up any loose ends and nobody faced any consequences on Mars. The show died back in Season 2 with the characters who saved Jamestown. 

[Nivek 16946]

That was underwhelming.   I guess that is how these things end though.  I can't even recall how The Expanse ended.

[wild_turkey 3168]

They didn’t tie up any loose ends and nobody faced any consequences on Mars.

What exactly was the end game for Ed, Dev, and their crew? They will be criminals that sabotaged plans for the major countries of the world to gain unprecedented prosperity. They “saved Mars” but to what end? It’s a colony full of angry people who can’t cooperate to achieve anything of substance.

How could Margo possibly take the fall for Aleida? Margo wasn’t even touching a computer, whereas Aleida was directly involved in sending the code. That made no sense to me and seemed incredibly sloppy unless I missed something there.

How was there a riot with weapons and firearms and the only consequence was a non-lethal gunshot to Poole and some bruises? They could’ve at least killed some minor characters.

The CIA and KGB agent torture sessions and power trip rampage were pure cheese.

I guess I already thought Sergei was dead, so they brought him back just to kill him again. His poor wife, waiting at home and he never came back from work.

[Nivek 16946]

4 minutes ago, wild_turkey said:

 

What exactly was the end game for Ed, Dev, and their crew? They will be criminals that sabotaged plans for the major countries of the world to gain unprecedented prosperity. They “saved Mars” but to what end? It’s a colony full of angry people who can’t cooperate to achieve anything of substance.

How could Margo possibly take the fall for Aleida? Margo wasn’t even touching a computer, whereas Aleida was directly involved in sending the code. That made no sense to me and seemed incredibly sloppy unless I missed something there.

How was there a riot with weapons and firearms and the only consequence was a non-lethal gunshot to Poole and some bruises? They could’ve at least killed some minor characters.

The CIA and KGB agent torture sessions and power trip rampage were pure cheese.

I guess I already thought Sergei was dead, so they brought him back just to kill him again. His poor wife, waiting at home and he never came back from work.

 

You are putting in way too much thought into it.  Yes, the abandoned wife, how did the Russians find Sergei?  Why would the cancel the DI for Margot?  The torture stuff and Poole not knowing her goon squad was going goon was a complete failure of leadership.  She seemed fine with roughing up the people who already protested and shutdown their operations, why wouldn't they strike again?  What laws cover their actions on the Mars?  Dev walking away scott free is the most realistic component, he was rich.  

 

[Js1 85443]

It was all Helios employees who participated so I guess Dev protects them? I doubt any of them went back to Earth, especially Ed. Maybe Miles, but I’m guessing the whole “tortured on Mars by the CIA” thing gave him a pass.  Who is going to drag them back to Earth to be prosecuted?

I wonder if by 2012, they claim Mars as a refuge for persecution from the U.S. government and just refuse to ever go home. Dev can keep them stocked, fed, etc. just via Helios. I mean, they smuggled more people than just the Nork’s wife, so there’s going to be something from that.

Guessing Danielle will be the NASA director in season 5. 

Remember that Dani recognized immediately the grunts were getting shafted and Ed didn’t care. She tried to make things better (fixing the comms array so they could get their messages from home). I don’t think they had anything against her and then she got shot, so they calmed down a bit. 

Of course the KGB found Sergei. I’m sure Aleida’s house was bugged and I’m sure she was also being followed due to her relationship with Margo. They were having dinner with Margo and Sergei with the back door and windows wide open. They were reckless and careless with it. 

Im sure a lot will get “caught up” with the season 5 opening montage of news headlines 

Edited January 13 by Js1

[MrBig 5421]

It pisses me off that Helios workers are blaming Nasa and M7 for being treated like shit when it’s Helios and their CEO Dev making their workers eat shitty food and have shitty living conditions and are lowering their bonuses. NASA should have just cancelled their contract with Helios and told Dev to fuck off.

[wild_turkey 3168]

Dev is basically the tamer version of Elon Musk in this fictional world. No, I don’t think Elon would be immune if he conspired to sabotage a plan that cost the U.S., Russia, India, North Korea, and other countries unprecedented wealth to the tune of trillions of dollars.

In this hypothetical scenario where CIA and KGB agents are present on Mars and torturing people for intel, I think the best case scenario for them would be extradition to Earth and a trial in the U.S. with life in prison. The more likely scenario is a quick space accident.

[Guest]

Just started the series yesterday.  Thought the EP1 was fine, maybe a 5 out of 10.  Got a kick out of Senator Kennedy avoiding the Chappaquiddick Incident.

Ep2 went to 11.  Damn.

This is some great TV.

[Js1 85443]

1 minute ago, slorch said:

Just started the series yesterday.  Thought the EP1 was fine, maybe a 5 out of 10.  Got a kick out of Senator Kennedy avoiding the Chappaquiddick Incident.

Ep2 went to 11.  Damn.

This is some great TV.

It’s hard to beat season 1. It was so fucking good 

[MrBig 5421]

16 hours ago, slorch said:

Just started the series yesterday.  Thought the EP1 was fine, maybe a 5 out of 10.  Got a kick out of Senator Kennedy avoiding the Chappaquiddick Incident.

Ep2 went to 11.  Damn.

This is some great TV.

Seasons 1 & 2 were the best. Everything after Season 2 just isn’t as good as the early episodes of the show.
 

 

[WelfareBuysMyWeed 5488]

On 1/16/2024 at 8:46 AM, MrBig said:

Seasons 1 & 2 were the best. Everything after Season 2 just isn’t as good as the early episodes of the show.
 

 

I find seasons 3 and 4 have higher highs but overall season 1 was front to back the best. Season 3 in particular is so, soooo fucking stupid for the vast majority of it. But that said, holy shit, when this show is hitting the highs, it's incredible. That bit with Sam on the engine in the finale made my palms sweat.

[WelfareBuysMyWeed 5488]

On 1/2/2024 at 1:37 PM, SizzleChest said:

This is the last season anyway.

The actress who plays Danni just a few days ago talked about season 5 coming up and how they are changing things because originally

Spoiler

danni was supposed to die at the finale of season 4

so this deffo isn't the last season.

[Pato del Muerto 52531]

On 1/13/2024 at 8:13 PM, wild_turkey said:

Dev is basically the tamer version of Elon Musk in this fictional world. No, I don’t think Elon would be immune if he conspired to sabotage a plan that cost the U.S., Russia, India, North Korea, and other countries unprecedented wealth to the tune of trillions of dollars

I don’t think their plan cost those countries trillions.  They will still be mining the thing, they will just be doing it from mars instead of earth.  That added cost isn’t much compared to what they made the asteroid mining worth overall. 

[WelfareBuysMyWeed 5488]

Just now, Pato del Muerto said:

I don’t think their plan cost those countries trillions.  They will still be mining the thing, they will just be doing it from mars instead of earth.  That added cost isn’t much compared to what they made the asteroid mining worth overall. 

I'm surprised so many missed that Helios was funding basically everything on mars. That was a running thread in the first half of the season, how the M7 *aren't* picking up their share of the bill and how much Helios, prior to Dev taking it back, is paying for it all. This is the heart of the entire conflict with Danni as Captain -- she always had to curtail to Helios because they owned everything. To the degree where Ed can just walk wherever the hell he wants on the base despite being "confined" to his quarters. Whether on Earth or mars, Helios was going to be footing the majority of the bill to mine the Asteroid. Which is why he decided to say fuck it and go after it in the first place.

[MrBig 5421]

3 hours ago, WelfareBuysMyWeed said:

I'm surprised so many missed that Helios was funding basically everything on mars. That was a running thread in the first half of the season, how the M7 *aren't* picking up their share of the bill and how much Helios, prior to Dev taking it back, is paying for it all.

Helios is the sole contractor for expanding, operating, and maintaining Happy Valley for M7. When did they say Helios was using their own money to fund operations? Helios gets paid through their contract with M7. 
 

3 hours ago, WelfareBuysMyWeed said:

Whether on Earth or mars, Helios was going to be footing the majority of the bill to mine the Asteroid. Which is why he decided to say fuck it and go after it in the first place.

At the M7 meeting in Russia, Helios told the M7 it would need $2 trillion to mine the asteroid from Mars. Irina said that Helios stands to gain the most because Helios gets paid right away while everyone else has to wait 40 years to see the benefits. How does this mean Helios is footing the bill for everything?

[WelfareBuysMyWeed 5488]

24 minutes ago, MrBig said:

Helios is the sole contractor for expanding, operating, and maintaining Happy Valley for M7. When did they say Helios was using their own money to fund operations? Helios gets paid through their contract with M7. 

At the M7 meeting in Russia, Helios told the M7 it would need $2 trillion to mine the asteroid from Mars. Irina said that Helios stands to gain the most because Helios gets paid right away while everyone else has to wait 40 years to see the benefits. How does this mean Helios is footing the bill for everything?

Helios outright owns the technology which enables the drilling of the asteroid, colony on mars, etc. This was from season 3. Dev invented the fusion engine that literally the entire mars colony uses, and helios is the sole provider of it. The base, the ships, the drilling crew, they are all helios owned. They own the energy, they own the base, they own the equipment, and they own the crew. Just because Helios would see an immediate return on investment, doesn't mean they also aren't footing the largest portion of the bill. In fact, the very reason they asked for $2 trillion in the first place, is because only they will be the ones supplying the equipment and man power at their own cost. Helios is a P3 entity. The reasons the US balks is because they only have a 2-term window for any president to take advantage of the asteroid, and Russia has no need since they already are cut in on the supply side of Iridium on mars.

This is made more clear by the role Dev has on the base. Officially, he's only below Danni as Captain, but Dev is officially simply a Helios employee. He's not actually any government official or anything. The only thing that gives him power up there is that he owns everything on mars.

[WelfareBuysMyWeed 5488]

Speaking of small details in the show: Anybody notice that Pam, Ellen's girlfriend, is a Texas Longhorn?

[WelfareBuysMyWeed 5488]

Oh wow, someone pointed out to me an easter egg in the Season 4 closing shot that hints at what season 5 will be about:

 

Spoiler

In the shot of Kuznetsov Station, across the roof of one of the rigs, the words "FREE MARS" are written in giant letters, indicating that Mars is still not independent by 2012

 

[Js1 85443]

11 hours ago, WelfareBuysMyWeed said:

The actress who plays Danni just a few days ago talked about season 5 coming up and how they are changing things because originally

  Reveal hidden contents

danni was supposed to die at the finale of season 4

so this deffo isn't the last season.

They have a 7 season plan so I knew season 4 was not last. They may not get 7 but the story isn’t over 

[MrBig 5421]

8 hours ago, WelfareBuysMyWeed said:

Helios outright owns the technology which enables the drilling of the asteroid, colony on mars, etc. This was from season 3. Dev invented the fusion engine that literally the entire mars colony uses, and helios is the sole provider of it. The base, the ships, the drilling crew, they are all helios owned. They own the energy, they own the base, they own the equipment, and they own the crew. Just because Helios would see an immediate return on investment, doesn't mean they also aren't footing the largest portion of the bill. In fact, the very reason they asked for $2 trillion in the first place, is because only they will be the ones supplying the equipment and man power at their own cost. Helios is a P3 entity. The reasons the US balks is because they only have a 2-term window for any president to take advantage of the asteroid, and Russia has no need since they already are cut in on the supply side of Iridium on mars.

This is made more clear by the role Dev has on the base. Officially, he's only below Danni as Captain, but Dev is officially simply a Helios employee. He's not actually any government official or anything. The only thing that gives him power up there is that he owns everything on mars.

I still don’t think Helios owns the Happy Valley base. In one of the bonus videos it says Helios was chosen by the M7 to be the sole contractor to expand and maintain Happy Valley.

When Helios first got this contract in 1997, they were in financial trouble after an antitrust ruling broke up their monopoly on exclusive government contracts to mine helium-3 on the moon. The M7 contract to expand Happy Valley on Mars was described as a “shot in the arm” for Helios because the M7 was pouring billions of dollars into the project. How could Helios own the base if it’s being paid for by the M7 countries? 

Helios owns all the technology like the ships, the plasma engine, and the drilling stuff, but Helios is being paid by M7 to use their technology to to do all these things related to the expansion and maintenance of the base. NASA and the M7 countries use Helios to transport and install their base habs at Happy Valley as part of their contract. If Helios “owned” the base outright then they wouldn’t need to ask the North Koreans permission to go into their wing of the base.

[Js1 85443]

https://www.thewrap.com/for-all-mankind-renewed-season-5-spinoff-show/

Quote

“For All Mankind,” Apple TV+’s critically acclaimed series that follows an alternate history version of the space race, has been renewed for a fifth season. And, along with it, creators Ronald D. Moore, Matt Wolpert and Ben Nedivi are set to expand the “For All Mankind” universe with a brand-new spinoff series “Star City.” Wolpert and Nedivi will showrun the new series, set within the Russian space program. Both series are produced for Apple TV+ by Sony Pictures Television.

Quote

Described as “a propulsive paranoid thriller that takes us back to the key moment in the alt-history retelling of the space race,” “Star City” explores how the Soviet Union became the first nation to put a man on the moon. This was covered early in the “For All Mankind” run, but this time “we explore the story from behind the Iron Curtain, showing the lives of the cosmonauts, the engineers, and the intelligence officers embedded among them in the Soviet space program, and the risks they all took to propel humanity forward.”

 

[WelfareBuysMyWeed 5488]

I hope Star City puts on display just how fucking abysmal life in the soviet union, how unqualified most of their leaders were. I think they'll dig into that, because they got into a little bit in Season 4 with Margo's Handler, how she really was not the technical peer of those at NASA or Helios and how that made dealing with the USSR so much more difficult. I'm hoping for something like Chernobyl, a deep dive into the nepotism that drove the soviet union and how it made for a miserable, terrible life for the actual citizens.

[Js1 85443]

I have pretty high hopes for Star City. Sounds absolutely fascinating 

[WelfareBuysMyWeed 5488]

1 minute ago, Js1 said:

I have pretty high hopes for Star City. Sounds absolutely fascinating 

I gotta admit, soviet deep dives grip me. Chernobyl was goddamn awesome. Along similar lines, the movie "The Death of Stalin," which is a comedy, is also awesome, for the same reason I liked Chernobyl and the soviet parts of For All Mankind. I love seeing what life was like for average people behind the iron curtain. I was too little to really remember the soviet era, I was in kindergarten when the Berlin wall fell. So it's like this period of history that aesthetically looks familiar to me, but is still alien. Like an alternate timeline society or something.

[atomheartbevo 89738]

26 minutes ago, WelfareBuysMyWeed said:

I gotta admit, soviet deep dives grip me. Chernobyl was goddamn awesome. Along similar lines, the movie "The Death of Stalin," which is a comedy, is also awesome, for the same reason I liked Chernobyl and the soviet parts of For All Mankind. I love seeing what life was like for average people behind the iron curtain. I was too little to really remember the soviet era, I was in kindergarten when the Berlin wall fell. So it's like this period of history that aesthetically looks familiar to me, but is still alien. Like an alternate timeline society or something.

You missed the joys of “duck and cover” in elementary school as well as everybody watching and talking about The Day After (which is on YouTube I believe). 

We have friends whose families emigrated from the Soviet Union at the end when they were allowed to, and they’ve talked about Chernobyl being extremely accurate about how things were and how they worked.

[WelfareBuysMyWeed 5488]

2 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

You missed the joys of “duck and cover” in elementary school as well as everybody watching and talking about The Day After (which is on YouTube I believe). 

We have friends whose families emigrated from the Soviet Union at the end when they were allowed to, and they’ve talked about Chernobyl being extremely accurate about how things were and how they worked.

I actually saw The Day After when the Berlin Wall fell. It's fall made my parents go back and watch a lot of cold war movies, and they were never shy about showing me stuff that was intense (I saw Robocop in theaters when I was like 4 lol). That movie is probably what made the soviets stay in my mind as this awesome (in a literal sense), terrifying force. They always fascinated me, in the same way a caged shark does.

[Js1 85443]

They also can get creative since it’s alt history.