2019 Women's World Cup - Do It Back to Back

[Hagbard Celine 11395]

5 hours ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

Just in: Michael Bradley has been demoted to USNWT to give other teams a chance

This.  Crafts. Man. Ship.

[Captain Ron 13160]

A pretty good take on the problem with US 13 Thailand 0

 

 

[Hagbard Celine 11395]

except, the USSF did fuckall to create the womenats.  title 9 created the culture and critical mass that used the inverted pyramid for 30 years while there was an international professional vacuum.  now that all of the european clubs are "coming correct" you will see an entirely different set of results when the US comes up against Norway in the round of 16, and if they win, France in the quarters, where i predict we lose.

[Hagbard Celine 11395]

5 hours ago, Rimbo said:

"Thank you, Master control."

Greetings, programs.

[Hagbard Celine 11395]

4 hours ago, Napoleon said:

2) The excessive celebrations by the squad from 6 goals on was the most classless display in soccer that I've ever seen at any level (male or female). This team is dripping with skill, but is absolute trash. They were every bit the ugly Americans that the majority of the world thinks we are. It would be like knocking down a one-armed boxer and then peeing on them while the ref is giving the person a 10 count.

The womenats culture created itself from title 9 in a professional vacuum.  They don't carry themselves like professionals, because they are in essence a grown-up high school team.  But this is FIFA's fault.  I don't support the immature display, but they have no choice but to put the sword to the opponent in front of them.

The BBC poll settled in at this hour at much less than 2:1 but still a solid majority in favor of the sword, 3643 to 2098.

[Hagbard Celine 11395]

1 hour ago, freyguy said:

I hate mercy rules.  Beatdowns have their purpose.  They remind you that our women athletes have their shit together, however our men are uncoordinated pieces of trash.

We are good.  I hope we win it all.  But I don't think we will, and today's result will be quickly forgotten against Sweden, Norway, and France.  And if we get past France, the English and Germans await.  Women's pro ball in Europe is now a thing.  You will see the difference in this tournament.

[Pig Bellmont 8894]

It’s the World Cup. You play to the whistle, and if you don’t like it, find a way to stop it. We should be trying to score 13 every game. 

[Tex Long 4743]

Looked like men against boys, although given the context I'd be inclined to cliche it to (wo)men against (lady)boys. 

Other than the fact that the Thais clearly had zero business being there, the thing that was most painful was the fucking idiot ref running three minutes of extra time. 

[Knoxtnhorn 6316]

1 hour ago, Captain Ron said:

A pretty good take on the problem with US 13 Thailand 0

 

 

So the world doesn't have Title 9?  Guess what.  A bunch of these countries - including Thailand - don't consider women to be even remotely equal to men.  There are about 500 other things that need to be worked through before you can start worrying about equal soccer pay between men and women in Thailand.  And this is precisely why today's display is so disappointing.  Equal pay or not in the US, in order to work your way through the system to become an elite player, you generally need to come from lots and lots and lots of money.  I know.  I worked the club scene.  I can pretty much guarantee you that the vast majority of women that play for the US National Team spent tens of thousands of dollars in club fees, travel, extra coaching, etc.. throughout their youth to get where they are today.  There aren't too many underprivileged women soccer players in this country.  The few that can claim this status were, perhaps, lucky enough to be in an area that identified talent and worked to offset the cost to play.  So, let's not pretend that the game today was on anywhere near equal footing when the US was scoring  and prancing around after goals 9, 10, 11, etc..  

Now if the US does the same thing to France or Sweden, by all means, celebrate.  But we should really tone it down when it comes to countries with a similar makeup to Thailand.

[utee94 16093]

When you play the Game of Women's World Cup you win, or you die.  There is no middle ground.

[TrashMaster G 18280]

10 minutes ago, Knoxtnhorn said:

So the world doesn't have Title 9?  Guess what.  A bunch of these countries - including Thailand - don't consider women to be even remotely equal to men.  There are about 500 other things that need to be worked through before you can start worrying about equal soccer pay between men and women in Thailand.  And this is precisely why today's display is so disappointing.  Equal pay or not in the US, in order to work your way through the system to become an elite player, you generally need to come from lots and lots and lots of money.  I know.  I worked the club scene.  I can pretty much guarantee you that the vast majority of women that play for the US National Team spent tens of thousands of dollars in club fees, travel, extra coaching, etc.. throughout their youth to get where they are today.  There aren't too many underprivileged women soccer players in this country.  The few that can claim this status were, perhaps, lucky enough to be in an area that identified talent and worked to offset the cost to play.  So, let's not pretend that the game today was on anywhere near equal footing when the US was scoring  and prancing around after goals 9, 10, 11, etc..  

Now if the US does the same thing to France or Sweden, by all means, celebrate.  But we should really tone it down when it comes to countries with a similar makeup to Thailand.

I must be missing who you are aiming you post at.  

[kingkoopa6 8776]

Boom! Get it ladies !

[Napoleon 8874]

4 hours ago, Captain Ron said:

A pretty good take on the problem with US 13 Thailand 0

Go to Uruguay, round up their handful of athletic females in the younger years in that mostly rural country of 3 million people and slap a national team training program together. Colombia with their semi-pro female players from 2015 would kick Uruguay's women's team's ass for the next 30 years, if not longer. In fact, the K(unt)im called out HALF of CONMEBOL. Why were Bolivia, Paraguay, Peru, Venezuela, and Ecuador spared? All of their federations are crooked and none of them put a dime into women's soccer, save Brazil... and athletic country with a rich futebol history and roughly 200 million people, that had a top female player for a while and hosted the 2016 Olympics.

And in addition to pissing about CONMEBOL feds, I wouldn't exactly say that Portugal is dripping with money, no? If Portugal siphoned off money from their men's team, they would have two mediocre programs rather than one program that has won two trophies in the last 3 years.

Mexico gets their players from the USA (they are to the USA in Women's Soccer what Algeria & Morocco are to France in Men's Soccer), Croatia has a population of just over 4 million people and hasn't even been a country for 30 years, Belgium probably loses its best female athletes to Net Ball... there is no reason that a country is required to make soccer the #1 female sport in that country. I continually point to Women's Field Hockey in Argentina. Sorry North American/Western European whiners, but Field Hockey is the #1 women's sport in Argentina and no amount of whining is going to change that in the near future.

 

2 hours ago, Tex Long said:

...the thing that was most painful was the fucking idiot ref running three minutes of extra time. 

I was explaining to a friend that there would be ZERO minutes of stoppage time. I mentioned in the 2014 semifinal matchup between Brazil & Germany, when the clock struck 90:00 (as far as I can remember), the ref mercifully blew his whistle. I said that the same would be the case today...

And then 3 fucking Minutes were added on?

That ref shouldn't ref again. That was despicable. 

 

[ATLLonghorn 1118]

Yeah the only thing even remotely offensive about yesterday was the referee adding second half stoppage time. The rest is just meaningless noise.

[Knoxtnhorn 6316]

9 hours ago, TrashMaster G said:

I must be missing who you are aiming you post at.  

The tweet(s); not any Surly members.  I guess my point is that it's a little disingenuous to point out monetary discrepancies as to Thailand's performance given how wealth is such a key factor in the ability of an American female to reach elite levels of soccer.  

[alincoln 2391]

8 hours ago, Knoxtnhorn said:

Equal pay or not in the US, in order to work your way through the system to become an elite player, you generally need to come from lots and lots and lots of money.  I know.  I worked the club scene.  I can pretty much guarantee you that the vast majority of women that play for the US National Team spent tens of thousands of dollars in club fees, travel, extra coaching, etc.. throughout their youth to get where they are today.  There aren't too many underprivileged women soccer players in this country.  The few that can claim this status were, perhaps, lucky enough to be in an area that identified talent and worked to offset the cost to play.  So, let's not pretend that the game today was on anywhere near equal footing when the US was scoring  and prancing around after goals 9, 10, 11, etc..  

The advent of the ECNL following our drubbings in the 2003 and 2007 world cups dramatically changed girls club soccer in the U.S. and has created unprecedented depth in terms of the quality of the player pool.  Any college coach will tell you that the talent and skill level in elite girls soccer in the US is night and day from 10 years ago.  ECNL club fees and travel expenses are certainly pricey, but many girls from average middle class backgrounds play for ECNL clubs.  That's just a fact.  In addition, if your daughter is a superstar but you need financial assistance, the ECNL clubs will provide that assistance.  There isn't enough money in soccer in the U.S. to invert the pyramid, particularly in the women's game, and many lower income communities place less emphasis on girls sports than boys sports.  It's so easy to complain about the pyramid, but the only real solutions are economic and those resources simply aren't available at this time.  

Unsurprisingly, the USSF is in the process of trying to fuck up elite girls soccer in the US by implementing a new Girls Development Academy system that is intended to replace the ECNL (which is run by US Club Soccer) as the top level of girls club soccer in the US.  Interestingly, many of the elite clubs that moved to DA from ECNL identified the incompetence of the USSF and have moved back to ECNL.  Make no mistake, the USSF is the biggest impediment to the continued development of soccer in the US.

[Knoxtnhorn 6316]

4 minutes ago, alincoln said:

The advent of the ECNL following our drubbings in the 2003 and 2007 world cups dramatically changed girls club soccer in the U.S. and has created unprecedented depth in terms of the quality of the player pool.  Any college coach will tell you that the talent and skill level in elite girls soccer in the US is night and day from 10 years ago.  ECNL club fees and travel expenses are certainly pricey, but many girls from average middle class backgrounds play for ECNL clubs.  That's just a fact.  In addition, if your daughter is a superstar but you need financial assistance, the ECNL clubs will provide that assistance.  There isn't enough money in soccer in the U.S. to invert the pyramid, particularly in the women's game, and many lower income communities place less emphasis on girls sports than boys sports.  It's so easy to complain about the pyramid, but the only real solutions are economic and those resources simply aren't available at this time.  

Unsurprisingly, the USSF is in the process of trying to fuck up elite girls soccer in the US by implementing a new Girls Development Academy system that is intended to replace the ECNL (which is run by US Club Soccer) as the top level of girls club soccer in the US.  Interestingly, many of the elite clubs that moved to DA from ECNL identified the incompetence of the USSF and have moved back to ECNL.  Make no mistake, the USSF is the biggest impediment to the continued development of soccer in the US.

Isn't USSF great?  Every time I see Gulati, I want to punch him in the face.

[alincoln 2391]

1 minute ago, Knoxtnhorn said:

Isn't USSF great?  Every time I see Gulati, I want to punch him in the face.

Their arrogance, stupidity, greed and dictatorial impulses are shocking to behold.  Rather than try to help US Club Soccer (which operates under the web of the USSF) continue to improve and expand the reach of and access to the ECNL, their immediate instinct is to instead replace it with a less accessible alternative that is completely under the control of the out of touch USSF.  As evidence of the USSF's pettiness, the U-15 national team from 2018 only included one girl from ECNL teams despite MANY of the top clubs and players in the country not playing in DA.   

[Pam Cummings 9923]

That was really weird, watching them celebrate the 8th, 9th, 10th, goals as if they were Cup clinchers......never seen that.

[Captain Ron 13160]

Wait, former Canadian players were pissed about our goal celebrations?

https://www.tsn.ca/fifa-women-s-world-cup/video/tsn-women-s-world-cup-panel-it-s-not-about-goals-it-s-about-sportsmanship~1705454

Like the twitter post that led me to that video, I didn't have a feeling one way or the other. But after watching Canada being ticked about our celebrations, I LOVE IT.

 

 

Edited June 12, 2019 by Captain Ron
Added twitter post, in case the TSN video gets region locked

[ztejas 44345]

16 hours ago, Napoleon said:

4) I will watch all of the USA matches, but will be pulling for Germany or France to lift the trophy. (If a Scandinavian squad does instead, I'll be okay with that.) I like the underdogs and I like a bit of humility. I'm old school American, not bully trash American.

Lost me there, bud. 

I agree the celebrating was tasteless. The goal scoring was not. This is the highest level of women's competition. If you don't want 13-0 results then make the field smaller or do more for non-contending programs. For all the hoopla about the US women not getting paid what they should what do we think the budget or pay is for Thailand's squad? 

I also think the celebrating was less of a slight to their competition and more of a "fuck you" to the USSF. Not that that condones it, but you have to consider everything in context. If the argument is "we should be paid more" then going out and absolutely embarrassing another team on the highest stage is not bad ammo for the argument. 

[ztejas 44345]

11 hours ago, Hagbard Celine said:

Women's pro ball in Europe is now a thing.  You will see the difference in this tournament.

Maybe. The US is pulling from a much, much deeper player pool than any other team, though. 

I don't think we are a sure thing to win but we are by far the favorites. 

[hayden_horn 11409]

26 minutes ago, Captain Ron said:

Wait, former Canadian players were pissed about our goal celebrations?

https://www.tsn.ca/fifa-women-s-world-cup/video/tsn-women-s-world-cup-panel-it-s-not-about-goals-it-s-about-sportsmanship~1705454

Like the twitter post that led me to that video, I didn't have a feeling one way or the other. But after watching Canada being ticked about our celebrations, I LOVE IT.

 

 

canada would apologize after each goal.

but seriously. i think the goal scoring was fine. if the goal is there, you take it. but the celebrations were a bit out of line after maybe the 4th or 5th goal. at that point, you just jog back to the midline, because you are vastly outclassing your opponent. at some point it becomes a bit like kramer dominating the dojo:

 

[alincoln 2391]

Holland is really the only Euro team to enter the elite category since the last WC that wasn't already there.  

[ztejas 44345]

8 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

canada would apologize after each goal.

but seriously. i think the goal scoring was fine. if the goal is there, you take it. but the celebrations were a bit out of line after maybe the 4th or 5th goal. at that point, you just jog back to the midline, because you are vastly outclassing your opponent. at some point it becomes a bit like kramer dominating the dojo:

 

Racist

[Cheeseweasel 26443]

In light of the "outrage" across the planet, I hope we mop the floor with every team we face. 

Fuck them.

Merica. 

[JNip 132]

12 hours ago, Captain Ron said:

A pretty good take on the problem with US 13 Thailand 0

 

 

Bitch called Mexico a problem? Mexico started a women's league just a couple of years ago. Trying to develop women's soccer and fight disparity. Bitch should do her research before throwing out countries. Then again, I don't know who the fuck that is so who cares. 

[alincoln 2391]

4 minutes ago, JNip said:

Bitch called Mexico a problem? Mexico started a women's league just a couple of years ago. Trying to develop women's soccer and fight disparity. Bitch should do her research before throwing out countries. Then again, I don't know who the fuck that is so who cares. 

It is a bit shocking that people continue to view Mexican as misogynists 

[phdhorn 6225]

If they beat Thailand 13-0, they'd beat the U.S. Men's team by about 24-0.

[ATLLonghorn 1118]

If Spain beats Germany in the next game up the US' path to the Final is probably Germany (2nd in FIFA rankings), France (4th) and England (3rd)

[staboner 5099]

1 hour ago, Pam Cummings said:

That was really weird, watching them celebrate the 8th, 9th, 10th, goals as if they were Cup clinchers......never seen that.

I didn't watch the game. Don't care that much. But that is weird part. Not the score, but the celebrating of the late scores. Sounds cringe worthy. 

Next time Thailand should field lady boys. 

[crash_davis 23470]

win with class.  absolute disgraceful display by the women.  

[Jerry Callo 9032]

I had no problem with scoring goals if they were there.  Rapinoe looked like an absolute clown celebrating the 6th or 7th goal, though.

[ztejas 44345]

2 minutes ago, Jerry Callo said:

I had no problem with scoring goals if they were there.  Rapinoe looked like an absolute clown celebrating the 6th or 7th goal, though.

That was the one that irked me. She looked like a complete fucking idiot. I didn't think any of the others were that excessive, just smiling and hugging. 

[JNip 132]

1 hour ago, alincoln said:

It is a bit shocking that people continue to view Mexican as misogynists 

I see what you did there.

[ATLLonghorn 1118]

Fox: We take soccer seriously

Fox play by play announcer: pronounces Barça as "bark-uh"

[Cheeseweasel 26443]

55 minutes ago, ATLLonghorn said:

Fox: We take soccer seriously

Fox play by play announcer: pronounces Barça as "bark-uh"

Please tell me it was that cunt Lalas. 

[drt 647]

I just tried to turn on the game via the Fox app again.  Doesn't work, again.  This is pathetic.

[Hagbard Celine 11395]

SA's Women's World Cup Power Rankings: Matchday 1       1. (1) USA. A record seven different players scored against Thailand. 2. (2) France. After Korea win, remaining 6,000 tickets for Norway game sold in a day. 3. (3) Germany. Injury bug (broken toe) hits Dzsenifer Marozsan for third straight WWC. 4. (5) England. Phil Neville labeled Nikita Parris as "world class" after Scotland win. 5. (4) Netherlands. Five-thousand orange-clad fans invaded Le Havre on Tuesday. 6. (-) Italy. Goal-scoring hero Barbara Bonansea dubbed "the Barbie bomber." 7. (7) Canada. Only one goal allowed in nine games since start of the year. 8. (9) Sweden. Chile match was scoreless after 72 minutes when rains forced stoppage. 9. (10) Spain. La Roja rallied to beat South Africa, 3-1, for first WWC victory. 10. (-) Norway. Big win over Nigeria takes pressure off ahead of France match. Note: In parentheses is pre-tournament ranking.

[ztejas 44345]

1 hour ago, ATLLonghorn said:

Fox: We take soccer seriously

Fox play by play announcer: pronounces Barça as "bark-uh"

Also: We take soccer seriously 

(60% of pregame coverage is shots of stupid tourist shit in Paris and "LOL THE EIFFEL TOWER IS RIGHT THERE OMG PARIS")

[ATLLonghorn 1118]

19 minutes ago, Cheeseweasel said:

Please tell me it was that cunt Lalas. 

it was the woman doing play by play for the Spain-Germany game.

[Cheeseweasel 26443]

3 minutes ago, ATLLonghorn said:

it was the woman doing play by play for the Spain-Germany game.

So, it could have been Lalas.

[Cheeseweasel 26443]

19 minutes ago, drt said:

I just tried to turn on the game via the Fox app again.  Doesn't work, again.  This is pathetic.

[ATLLonghorn 1118]

Spain has controlled possession in this game, but their finishing is shit. I haven't seen much to think they're going to be a huge problem for the US unless they can play keep away. Germany doesn't look overly impressive without Marozsan so if she's out long term that could make that half of the KO bracket fun.

[Hagbard Celine 11395]

4 hours ago, alincoln said:

The advent of the ECNL following our drubbings in the 2003 and 2007 world cups dramatically changed girls club soccer in the U.S. and has created unprecedented depth in terms of the quality of the player pool.  Any college coach will tell you that the talent and skill level in elite girls soccer in the US is night and day from 10 years ago.  ECNL club fees and travel expenses are certainly pricey, but many girls from average middle class backgrounds play for ECNL clubs.  That's just a fact.  In addition, if your daughter is a superstar but you need financial assistance, the ECNL clubs will provide that assistance.  There isn't enough money in soccer in the U.S. to invert the pyramid, particularly in the women's game, and many lower income communities place less emphasis on girls sports than boys sports.  It's so easy to complain about the pyramid, but the only real solutions are economic and those resources simply aren't available at this time.  

Unsurprisingly, the USSF is in the process of trying to fuck up elite girls soccer in the US by implementing a new Girls Development Academy system that is intended to replace the ECNL (which is run by US Club Soccer) as the top level of girls club soccer in the US.  Interestingly, many of the elite clubs that moved to DA from ECNL identified the incompetence of the USSF and have moved back to ECNL.  Make no mistake, the USSF is the biggest impediment to the continued development of soccer in the US.

I've never heard of the USCS leagues offering financial assistance.  I searched the ECNL site and all of their assistance is for referees and coaches.

re: pyramid complaints...

1. As you cite, the USSF since the mashup with SUM (i.e., "The Cabal"), can no longer distinguish between monetization, commercialization, and operation.  Combined with a policy of dipshittery required to get hired, which insures the star chamber is protected, we have in essence reached a Captured situation which will continue to indefinitely delay the establishment of the global International Soccer Economy within the US.

2. The real solutions are more than just economic.  They are just as much political.  In the US, the pyramid for NFL, NBA, MLB and the NHL is funded by the taxpayers as part of the $800B+ US education system.  These were 2011 dollars but illustrate the problem:

https://rossieronline.usc.edu/blog/u-s-education-versus-the-world-infographic/

The US taxpayer gets no return on their investment in US Public Education sports programs which get no part of the action when their athletes are granted College Scholarships.  The Colleges get no part of the action when their athletes are drafted in to a professional league.  And US spending per student in 2011 was $2000/year more than #2 United Kingdom.  That money is what subsidizes the player development and eventual profitability of the non-soccer professional leagues as well as the for-profit / free-labor college sports economies.  The US Pyramid is right-side-up for the entire US sporting landscape.  With the exception of Soccer.  Because we insist on going it alone with an economic and political structure funded by rich white suburban parents that is completely disconnected from and at odds with the International Soccer Economy.

 

[C-Man 27943]

3 hours ago, phdhorn said:

If they beat Thailand 13-0, they'd beat the U.S. Men's team by about 24-0.

The USMNT has scored 12 World Cup goals in the last 6,202 days.

[alincoln 2391]

 

44 minutes ago, Hagbard Celine said:

I've never heard of the USCS leagues offering financial assistance.  I searched the ECNL site and all of their assistance is for referees and coaches.

Financial assistance is provided by the individual clubs not US Club Soccer which is just an administrative body with limited operating funds.  Some clubs just provide financial assistance to low income players.  Some pay for all travel expenses for ECNL team members.  Some cover all fees and expenses for all ECNL team members.  Depends on how big and successful the club is.  The wealthiest clubs have many teams below the top team that fund the top teams through their fees and/or possess benefactors that support the club financially.

44 minutes ago, Hagbard Celine said:

 

2. The US Pyramid is right-side-up for the entire US sporting landscape.  With the exception of Soccer.  Because we insist on going it alone with an economic and political structure funded by rich white suburban parents that is completely disconnected from and at odds with the International Soccer Economy.

 

This is simply wrong outside of American football which is funded by US public education and super elite AAU basketball which is primarily funded by shoe companies.  Pay to play and/or train (at least at an elite level) is now ubiquitous across the rest of the US youth sports landscape.  

[Schulz2.0 29326]

On 6/11/2019 at 1:15 PM, Bottlecap said:

i've had a multi-world cup thing for kelley o'hara.

Same here.

[Hagbard Celine 11395]

13 minutes ago, alincoln said:

This is simply wrong outside of American football which is funded by US public education and super elite AAU basketball which is primarily funded by shoe companies.  Pay to play and/or train (at least at an elite level) is now ubiquitous across the rest of the US youth sports landscape.  

We need to continue this discussion, but right now i'm trying to get some work done while being distracted by one of the norge brunettes.

[Cheeseweasel 26443]

22 minutes ago, C-Man said:

The USMNT has scored 12 World Cup goals in the last 6,202 days.