impeachment inquiry hearings thread

[Biff Tannen 45,695]

2 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

That's not going to happen. 

See you on the lanai.

[TheRealRonWeaver? 1,258]

Any resident cultists gonna stop by and offer up their surely insightful opinions/fact-based arguments in Trump’s defense?  Nope?  Didn’t think so. Fucking cowards and pussies.

They’re all on the cartoons thread.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23,367]

 

[shnsajax 3,591]

 

Noice!

[Bama Chick 28,596]

~rubs hands together~

Bring the heat, Bolton.

[atomheartbevo 89,758]

No way Bolton skips a chance to shit all over the guy that stabbed him in the back.   Trump was dumb enough to bring an ideologue on board.  

[henrygandorf 29,194]

once bolton came out and said he’d talk with a subpoena, i figured it was a done deal. let’s go!

[Tuco 5,076]

I really hope this is as devastating as it sounds.

I’m not holding my breath. Anyone who has holdings and family in Ukraine or Russia is not likely to burn Trump unless he is told to. Having Trump distance himself from a criminal investigation seems like an unlikely complaint from a criminal. What’s the max sentence for an illegal campaign contribution? I doubt it is enough to burn bridges in Ukraine. But, maybe the guy is just a complete moron. That seems to be the leading characteristic for these plots.

[Tuco 5,076]

...maybe Firtash is sending a message. He’s out at least 300k to the GOP, whatever he spent on his “translators”, and whatever bribes he spent in Ukraine, and is still fighting extradition.

[DigglerontheHoof 21,207]

41 minutes ago, Tuco said:

 

I’m not holding my breath. Anyone who has holdings and family in Ukraine or Russia is not likely to burn Trump unless he is told to. Having Trump distance himself from a criminal investigation seems like an unlikely complaint from a criminal. What’s the max sentence for an illegal campaign contribution? I doubt it is enough to burn bridges in Ukraine. But, maybe the guy is just a complete moron. That seems to be the leading characteristic for these plots.

 

Yeah, hope in one hand, shit in the other...

[HenryJames 66,135]

 

[bolverk 29,695]

7 minutes ago, HenryJames said:

 

So now they don't want shit public?

[Doc Sam Beckett 5,797]

Lulz. Maybe they're not so confident in Nunes? I'd tell these scumbags to pound sand, but the Dems seem to be bending over backwards to give the GOP what they want here... 

 

House Republicans are considering installing Rep. Jim Jordan (R-Ohio), a fierce Trump ally, on the Intelligence Committee at a key juncture in the impeachment proceedings, according to two GOP aides familiar with the dynamics.

The move would have to be approved by the full House when it comes back into session next week.

 

The GOP aides requested anonymity to share private deliberations about the panel, whose top Republican is Rep. Devin Nunes (R-Calif.).

Jordan, the ranking member of the Oversight and Reform Committee, would provide a powerful voice for Republicans as the Intelligence Committee starts to hold public hearings, the aides said.

It remained unclear which Republican currently on the committee would be bumped if Jordan is added.

[WhatTheBuck 28,794]

11 minutes ago, bolverk said:

So now they don't want shit public?

That was predictable. 

[Js1 85,449]

15 hours ago, Pig Bellmont said:

I just heard Giuliani shit his pants. 

[Pig Bellmont 8,719]

13 minutes ago, Doc Sam Beckett said:

Lulz. Maybe they're not so confident in Nunes? I'd tell these scumbags to pound sand, but the Dems seem to be bending over backwards to give the GOP what they want here... 

 

House Republicans are considering installing Rep. Jim Jordan (R-Ohio), a fierce Trump ally, on the Intelligence Committee at a key juncture in the impeachment proceedings, according to two GOP aides familiar with the dynamics.

The move would have to be approved by the full House when it comes back into session next week.

 

The GOP aides requested anonymity to share private deliberations about the panel, whose top Republican is Rep. Devin Nunes (R-Calif.).

Jordan, the ranking member of the Oversight and Reform Committee, would provide a powerful voice for Republicans as the Intelligence Committee starts to hold public hearings, the aides said.

It remained unclear which Republican currently on the committee would be bumped if Jordan is added.

That’s dumb. On the one hand, why allow it? On the other, Jordan isn’t exactly a mental heavyweight so who cares. 

[Mrs Whiggins 13,050]

56 minutes ago, Tuco said:

...maybe Firtash is sending a message. He’s out at least 300k to the GOP, whatever he spent on his “translators”, and whatever bribes he spent in Ukraine, and is still fighting extradition.

I would argue that it may not be Firtash sending the message as he is probably a proxy for the real money that is behind him. He has a number of ties to Russia (he supported the ousted Yushchenko) and Forbes looked into his assets back in 2014 and couldn't find hard evidence that he was in front of Putin, et al, but they seemed to believe unnamed partners were backing him, so all that kompromat, NRA, dirty money stuff is saying, "Hello! We're still here! We see you!" That'll keep some folks up at night.

 

[Pig Bellmont 8,719]

12 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

 

Bolton since said he won’t appear

[Nice Guy Eddie 13,515]

Bolton seems to be the type who will wait for more clarification on whether he has to honor the subpoena or not. Regardless I don’t think he’s personally said whether he will appear at the hearing or not. All reports references sources not him.

[Mrs Whiggins 13,050]

4 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:

That’s dumb. On the one hand, why allow it? On the other, Jordan isn’t exactly a mental heavyweight so who cares. 

Nunes is (more) compromised, especially if sh*t is exposed. The Nunes memo, all of his deflection regarding Russia during his time of the transition team for Trump. He has some manure on his shoes that isn't from his "farm," so they may want him to take a back seat for awhile. The public will have forgotten most of that because...distractions...but if it gets dragged out of the closet again into the sunlight, people will begin to connect the dots. The Democrats are trying to lay it all out with the answer key next to the puzzle, and the GOP is trying to hide the newspaper.

[zork 629]

12 hours ago, TheRealRonWeaver? said:

 

They’re all on the cartoons thread.

 

https://www.worldatlas.com/sa/bo/where-is-bolivia.html

[Tuco 5,076]

7 minutes ago, Mrs Whiggins said:

I would argue that it may not be Firtash sending the message as he is probably a proxy for the real money that is behind him. He has a number of ties to Russia (he supported the ousted Yushchenko) and Forbes looked into his assets back in 2014 and couldn't find hard evidence that he was in front of Putin, et al, but they seemed to believe unnamed partners were backing him, so all that kompromat, NRA, dirty money stuff is saying, "Hello! We're still here! We see you!" That'll keep some folks up at night.

 

Maybe.  But I don't necessarily think it's as complicated as all that.  Firtash is fighting extradition to the US.  Yes, he had a sweetheart deal with the Russians - buying natural gas from them and selling them at a mark-up to Ukraine. And that sweetheart deal likely had some strings attached where he worked with/for Putin.  But I think he has plenty of incentive to be working this particular deal for his own self interest.  He hired Toensing/diGenova because they had access Trump.  He hired Fruman and Parnas as "interpreters", and they hired Rudy, because of Rudy's access to Trump.  Not only did Fruman and Parnas funnel Firtash's money to the GOP campaign coffers in 2018 and to Rudy on a continuous basis, they also worked with Giuliani doing the footwork to get an investigation opened into the Bidens. Maybe Firtash has a personal reason for wanting that investigation, but more likely it was part of the bribe to Trump.  You have Toensing, diGenova, Fruman, and Parnas all working with Rudy to dig up dirt on Biden, and all of them paid by Firtash.  The motives seem pretty obvious.  The flow of cash seems pretty obvious.  There may be less obvious stuff going on as well, but my focus on what is easily supported. 

[CowboyFred 1,151]

36 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:

Bolton since said he won’t appear

I thought Bolton would only testify if he was subpoenaed?  In any event, I feel like he'll end up testifying against Trump.

 

The Lev Parnas news could be big in that he could be the link between Russia/Trump/Giuliani and have the docs to prove it.  

[Dnaguy 12,015]

12 hours ago, Bama Chick said:

~rubs hands together~

Bring the heat, Bolton.

A Bolton of lightning?

[horn4life 3,775]

19 hours ago, Dbeasy said:

 

While the Trump believers are idiots, it’s also stupid to compare job growth between Trump and Obama. Obama was building from the financial collapse of 2007.

 

Gee-Obama inherits a giant fucking job growth hole, and in the final years of his second term it is "stupid" to compare job growth figures?  WTF!   You don't need to understand economics, but when you make evaluations of economic comparison, and declare it "stupid" you should at least have some degree of understanding of basic economics when making an assessment. Job growth after a period of negative job growth is likely. You hope for it, but the reality is there is no guarantee.  I simply use the most reasonable comparison. Using the numbers from the 1st month of Trump's to the last month of Obama's. The second month of Trump's to the second to last of Obama's and so on. Which at this point happen to be Obama's 6th, 7th, and 8th year after inheriting the disaster the GOP handed off to him.  Obama was 1.5 million jobs ahead in July.  Trump may narrow the gap on increase it before years end. Right now the most reasonable math to predict is that Obama's last three years created somewhere between 40K and 50K more jobs per month than the Trump economy has.

I simply clearly represent the fallacy that this is the greatest economy ever!  It was most certainly the greatest economy ever inherited by a sitting President in our lifetimes.  Trump has managed to keep the momentum alive, but his job production has waned.  This FACT is simply that, a FACT.   I guess now I need to do some math and figure out how many millions of extra debt Trump heaped on, for every job less than Obama.

The "good" news Dbeasy...  is that if Trump is reelected eventually the job growth numbers will move into the super shitty economy and job production that Obama inherited and which the GOP refused to stimulate properly over concerns over (try not to laugh your ass off here) too much deficit spending. So it Trump gets another term, the years will cascade back and eventually hit the horrific employment monthly figures Obama's inherited.  OF course then it would be really, really stupid to compare the job growth figures, wouldn't it? '-)

[HenryJames 66,135]

 

[triplehorn 2,664]

Firtash is more than a Putin-linked natura gas billionaire.  wiki on Firtash:

Firtash owns seven television channels as well as an influential Kiev-based Ukrainian News Agency.[21] Firtash is also cited as having part ownership of SCL Group and thus Cambridge Analytica through various shell companies, by the U.S. documentary Active Measures, in its breakdown of the Russian–U.S. relationship before and after the 2016 election.

Recall a couple weeks ago Zuckerberg testified to Congress that he first learned about Cambridge Analytica in March 2018.

 

Russian hackers/troll farms - Firtash/Bannon/Cambridge Analytica - Facebook/Parscale/Project Alamo

Firtash has been an integral cog in this dating to well before 2016 election attack.

[Tuco 5,076]

And for the lulz, and article on the attempt to revoke house confinement for Fruman.  I thought some of the lawyers on board might like the last two paragraphs.  

 

Quote

On the way out of the federal courthouse in downtown New York, Blanche shook his head, seeming defeated. When BuzzFeed News asked him for his card in order to get the spelling of his name correct, he responded, “I wish you wouldn’t spell my name right. I wish I had one of my colleague's cards to give you instead. Lord.”

Ultimately, he gave BuzzFeed News his business card.

Buzzfeed

 

[bolverk 29,695]

3 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

Recall a couple weeks ago Zuckerberg testified to Congress that he first learned about Cambridge Analytica in March 2018.

I know the real answer is "he's lying," but how can the owner of a major social media outlet that was targeted by Cambridge claim such a thing? We mere peons began posting about that operation on the old site in February 2017 shortly after the inauguration. I should know, because I distinctly recall posting that article about the Mercers and their ties to them at that time.

[sachick 1,189]

1 hour ago, Doc Sam Beckett said:

Lulz. Maybe they're not so confident in Nunes? I'd tell these scumbags to pound sand, but the Dems seem to be bending over backwards to give the GOP what they want here... 

 

House Republicans are considering installing Rep. Jim Jordan (R-Ohio), a fierce Trump ally, on the Intelligence Committee at a key juncture in the impeachment proceedings, according to two GOP aides familiar with the dynamics.

The move would have to be approved by the full House when it comes back into session next week.

 

The GOP aides requested anonymity to share private deliberations about the panel, whose top Republican is Rep. Devin Nunes (R-Calif.).

Jordan, the ranking member of the Oversight and Reform Committee, would provide a powerful voice for Republicans as the Intelligence Committee starts to hold public hearings, the aides said.

It remained unclear which Republican currently on the committee would be bumped if Jordan is added.

Fuck that. He's not on the committee. Period. What reasoning would there be to add him other than Trump likes him because he's loud and obnoxious.

[Chad Fuck 17,698]

7 minutes ago, sachick said:

Fuck that. He's not on the committee. Period. What reasoning would there be to add him other than Trump likes him because he's loud and obnoxious.

I think you've pretty much nailed the standard of the Republican party these days.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13,515]

I'm sure the GOP has run focus groups and the results are that everyone hates Nunes. jordan is a horrible person but there's no denying that he's better at speaking than Nunes, not that the the Nunes bar is very high.

In many ways, the upcoming impeachment hearings are going to have a huge impact on the 2020 elections. Potentially more than the future conventions and debates. Both parties have a lot at stake that is not solely about removing Trump from office.

[Pig Bellmont 8,719]

47 minutes ago, sachick said:

Fuck that. He's not on the committee. Period. What reasoning would there be to add him other than Trump likes him because he's loud and obnoxious.

This is true. What would GOP do? Vote no and say to the press they can’t cherry pick sycophants for the camera. Time for picking committees was earlier and their leadership must live with their own choices 

[Biff Tannen 45,695]

1 hour ago, HenryJames said:

 

While this might be the most effective method to achieve the desired end result, it pisses me off that he is going to get to skate on 99% of the treasonous and/or un-American activity he has engaged in, simply because the general public is too stupid to understand it.

[hookemATL 11,803]

6 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

While this might be the most effective method to achieve the desired end result, it pisses me off that he is going to get to skate on 99% of the treasonous and/or un-American activity he has engaged in, simply because the general public is too stupid to understand it.

It’s infuriating, but it is probably the only way forward. Either way, it is an extreme indictment on the electorate and proves how far we have to go as a country to fulfill our responsibilities of being citizens. Idiocracy indeed. 

[Red Five 40,877]

It also gives Trump the opportunity to go even more simple. “Read the transcript”. In addition to the defense of “you can’t impeach a president over just a phone call.”

[hayden_horn 11,364]

2 minutes ago, Red Five said:

It also gives Trump the opportunity to go even more simple. “Read the transcript”. In addition to the defense of “you can’t impeach a president over just a phone call.”

trump's kentucky rally last night featured t-shirts on supporters that said "read the transcript."

nevermind there is no released transcript.

it works, this blatant dishonesty.

so fucking disheartening.

[jimmyjazz 46,000]

6 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

trump's kentucky rally last night featured t-shirts on supporters that said "read the transcript."

nevermind there is no released transcript.

Never mind the fact that the overwhelming majority of those people didn't read "the transcript" (memo).

[Player 4,575]

Yeah, do me a favor, Donny. Release the "...transcript." 

[Biff Tannen 45,695]

15 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

trump's kentucky rally last night featured t-shirts on supporters that said "read the transcript."

nevermind there is no released transcript.

it works, this blatant dishonesty.

so fucking disheartening.

I count three people of color there.  How have they been conned into this?

[Chad Fuck 17,698]

2 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

I count three people of color there.  How have they been conned into this?

[horncyclist 1,391]

24 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

trump's kentucky rally last night featured t-shirts on supporters that said "read the transcript."

nevermind there is no released transcript.

it works, this blatant dishonesty.

so fucking disheartening.

And what was release has omissions flagged by someone with first hand knowledge who was then told to keep quiet about it.

[horncyclist 1,391]

30 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

trump's kentucky rally last night featured t-shirts on supporters that said "read the transcript."

nevermind there is no released transcript.

it works, this blatant dishonesty.

so fucking disheartening.

And what was released has omissions flagged by someone with first hand knowledge who was then told to keep quiet about it.

Edited November 5, 2019 by horncyclist

[Irwin F Fletcher 3,550]

5 minutes ago, horncyclist said:

And what was release has omissions flagged by someone with first hand knowledge who was then told to keep quiet about it.

I'm assuming that's printed on the back of those $2 t-shirts.

[Horn Dog 9,884]

Don’t understand why the dems haven’t been pounding that point harder.  “Release the REAL Transcript”.  They should be shouting this repeatedly.

[Pig Bellmont 8,719]

3 minutes ago, Horn Dog said:

Don’t understand why the dems haven’t been pounding that point harder.  “Release the REAL Transcript”.  They should be shouting this repeatedly.

Because we don’t need it, the crimes and corruption are already corroborated by multiple witnesses and not contradicted by anyone willing to go under oath. 

[David Dennison 18,940]

4 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:

Because we don’t need it, the crimes and corruption are already corroborated by multiple witnesses and not contradicted by anyone willing to go under oath. 

Yep.

But it isn't going to matter. The politics of impeachment are set in stone. He's not going to be removed from office because Republicans are terrified of his voters.

I just hope he loses. I can't imagine how emboldened he and the Republicans will be if he survives impeachment and gets re-elected.

[Foggy Notion 1,202]

48 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

I count three people of color there.  How have they been conned into this?

Here’s the video of last night’s rally. 

Clayton Bigsby shows up around the 4:00 mark to pronounce that Kentucky is Trump Country. 

[Horn Dog 9,884]

9 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:

Because we don’t need it, the crimes and corruption are already corroborated by multiple witnesses and not contradicted by anyone willing to go under oath. 

Of course you are right.  But I think there is political value in highlighting the hypocrisy.  If you can get them released it is much more powerful for the general public to see Trump’s words directly then to hear 100 others say what they heard.  There is also political value in highlighting Trumps inevitable refusal to release the true transcript.  We live in a word of soundbites.  When they yell “ Read the transcript” the retort of “Then Release the Real Transcript” is stronger then  “Several 1st hand witnesses have testified that they heard something different then the highly edited and incomplete summary that was released” 

[Dbeasy 15,075]

Gee-Obama inherits a giant fucking job growth hole, and in the final years of his second term it is "stupid" to compare job growth figures?  WTF!   You don't need to understand economics, but when you make evaluations of economic comparison, and declare it "stupid" you should at least have some degree of understanding of basic economics when making an assessment. Job growth after a period of negative job growth is likely. You hope for it, but the reality is there is no guarantee.  I simply use the most reasonable comparison. Using the numbers from the 1st month of Trump's to the last month of Obama's. The second month of Trump's to the second to last of Obama's and so on. Which at this point happen to be Obama's 6th, 7th, and 8th year after inheriting the disaster the GOP handed off to him.  Obama was 1.5 million jobs ahead in July.  Trump may narrow the gap on increase it before years end. Right now the most reasonable math to predict is that Obama's last three years created somewhere between 40K and 50K more jobs per month than the Trump economy has.
I simply clearly represent the fallacy that this is the greatest economy ever!  It was most certainly the greatest economy ever inherited by a sitting President in our lifetimes.  Trump has managed to keep the momentum alive, but his job production has waned.  This FACT is simply that, a FACT.   I guess now I need to do some math and figure out how many millions of extra debt Trump heaped on, for every job less than Obama.
The "good" news Dbeasy...  is that if Trump is reelected eventually the job growth numbers will move into the super shitty economy and job production that Obama inherited and which the GOP refused to stimulate properly over concerns over (try not to laugh your ass off here) too much deficit spending. So it Trump gets another term, the years will cascade back and eventually hit the horrific employment monthly figures Obama's inherited.  OF course then it would be really, really stupid to compare the job growth figures, wouldn't it? '-)

I have a masters degree with a minor in economics. I’m not going to waste any more time in this thread helping you understand growth curves and rates. No one disagrees with the assertion that Trump hasn’t done anything special with the economy. In fact he’s just using deficit spending to fuel what growth there is. He sucks. You just are using a flawed job growth analysis to support your position.