Elizabeth Warren 2020

[Huckleberry 33003]

11 minutes ago, mdmost said:

I'd imagine Biden could've come out with a 20 tweet statement about Warren and bt would think Bernie's was better. We get it, bro. 

lulz

Sanders comes out with dramatically and basically inarguably better statement.

"Yeah but bt would have liked Sanders statement more even if it hadn't actually been better. WE GET IT ALREADY!"

This is what I'm talking about.

[Bateshorn 9928]

You guys do know that neither of these septuagenarians actually manages their own twitter accounts, right? 

[gmr548 16580]

 
Careful bro. I said that about Hillary a while back and my wife almost clawed my eyes out.
 

I said this about Elizabeth and it did not go over well in my house.

Because it's a ridiculous statement in context.

Biden and Sanders are both constantly yelling. The former barely makes any sense. The latter gets visibly angry when pressed. No one cares. Warren replaces Bernie's temper with composure and is orders of magnitude more coherent than Biden. But she's grating? GTFO with that nonsense.

[Bateshorn 9928]

I found both Sanders and Biden to be equally grating.  But that's true of most politicians.

I did find Warren to be much more compelling on the campaign trail and in interviews than any other candidate.  Behind the lectern, not as much.

[mdmost 43004]

11 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

lulz

Sanders comes out with dramatically and basically inarguably better statement.

"Yeah but bt would have liked Sanders statement more even if it hadn't actually been better. WE GET IT ALREADY!"

This is what I'm talking about.

Both statements were fine. I'm not the one playing one statement off the other to say my chosen person is so much better than the other. bt is beating us over the head with Bernie is better at everything. Bernie is and he isn't. And it's fucking Twitter. You think Biden hasn't called her yet. Or Bernie?

Edited March 5, 2020 by mdmost

[washparkhorn 9939]

 

[immortal13 4059]

She is grating. She always sounds like she is about to cry

[Lurch 5931]

When your wives object and immortal shares your stance, perhaps it’s time to reassess.

[DixonHur 11341]

Elizabeth would have made the best President out of any of the candidates, but she was an early causality of the center-left elites in the media.  Once she started rising in the polls, coverage of her virtually disappeared.

If the centrists in the Dem party blow this by trying to "play it safe" again,  then they deserve King Trump forever.  

Edited March 5, 2020 by DixonHur

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

2 hours ago, hpslugga said:

My one issue with this is that Warren had every bit as much ammo to go after Biden in the exact same way. She chose not to, and, if she really is the progressive she claims to be, I have no idea why.

Maybe she thought she could purify the Democratic Party, fine-tune an institution that has gone astray but is not in need of a drastic overhaul. That would gibe with her (I believe mistaken) view on American capitalism.

[bad_teammate 13218]

14 minutes ago, Bateshorn said:

You guys do know that neither of these septuagenarians actually manages their own twitter accounts, right? 

They don't literally type it out, no, but the content of the messaging comes from them. At an institutional level, the Sanders campaign deeply shares Warren's values.

Biden's campaign does not.

You're just reinforcing the point.

[tantric superman 4667]

22 minutes ago, High Plains Drifter said:

 

Careful bro. I said that about Hillary a while back and my wife almost clawed my eyes out.

 

The very weird thing is that I assumed my thoughts were based on my own sexism.  I still think they impulsively are, but I found that all the members of my family, including the females, and most of my friends (including my female friends) agreed with my assessment that she was off putting in demeanor and style.   My wife hates all politicians but sucks it up to vote and usually pushes the trigger for the most union oriented candidate (she voted Bernie).  She walked by the tv during a debate when Warren was speaking and just muttered "Jesus" and walked by. 

She thought UT law school was 99% bullshit so Warren as a professor their was actually a negative.

[Tom 2959]

She was mostly good, but damn she sounded too much like a woman.  I just can't get behind being led by a woman with some old woman voice.

[mdmost 43004]

1 minute ago, Tom said:

She was mostly good, but damn she sounded too much like a woman.  I just can't get behind being led by a woman with some old woman voice.

And she had vocal fry /tantric

[Tom 2959]

The great news for Warren is she is not done.  This country is hell-bent on electing 80-year-olds far past their prime and after they start mentally declining.  She just ran too early.  Her time will come in 2028.

Edited March 5, 2020 by Tom

[bad_teammate 13218]

damn tantric's wife sounds cool what's her #?

[tantric superman 4667]

17 minutes ago, gmr548 said:

Biden and Sanders are both constantly yelling.

Just because they suck doesn't mean her "you're stupid as fuck so I'll lower my voice to explain" delivery and her overall goofiness didn't make one roll one's eyes.

I've said I thought she was the smartest of the bunch but smarts kind of a negative with you Americans. 

To paraphrase my sister "I'd like Warren more if Kate McKinnon just played her all the time in real life."

[washparkhorn 9939]

 

[bad_teammate 13218]

God he sucks so fucking much.

And she used to rule so much.

[tantric superman 4667]

8 minutes ago, mdmost said:

And she had vocal fry /tantric

I never noticed.  Maybe all the other stuff hid it.

I like my vocal fry with a little spice, so my go to is AOC.

[Hank Kingsley 20967]

Warren's Senate term ends in 2025, correct? She turns 71 this year.

How is it even possible she doesn't endorse Bernie? What's the risk? 

 

[Brisketexan 105158]

She was my preferred candidate, she got my vote (early), she'd have gotten it on Tuesday as well, because I'm gonna vote my conscience.

One thing for the eventual winning candidate to have in mind when courting Warren supporters is that MAN....a lot of them are seriously wounded.  Again, this is my wife and her peer group, and they are very much taking this as a blow for misogyny (and no doubt, it's a proxy event for them to cover the misogyny they have faced in their lives over, and over, and over).  I'm not kidding -- there are tears, and real anger.

Women have always been wounded - advances be damned, gender equity ain't our social strong suit.  They have been particularly wounded the past three years by the 1-2 punch of the first female nominee losing (they will all acknowledge her flaws, but in the end, she was the first female nominee and she lost, and there was absolutely some misogyny baked into that), and a bragging misogynist winning.  They are PISSED, and they are motivated.  And a lot of them put their hope in Warren -- smarter than Hillary, without all the Hillary baggage.  Seeing her lose is a new wound.

And I think she lost because there's some misogyny baked in, but I also think she ran a weak campaign and made some mistakes, and what I think is most important: "smartest candidate in the room" is never going to win.  It's not about being smart, it's about packaging a message, and intellectual types usually aren't too good at that.  But I'm not going to tell my wife that.  I'm going to tell her "I'm sorry" and let her mourn.  But then, there will come a day when she needs to decide who she'll support next -- it's going to be interesting how (or even IF) the two remaining campaigns try to connect with that group.

Edited March 5, 2020 by Brisketexan

[tantric superman 4667]

1 minute ago, Hank Kingsley said:

How is it even possible she doesn't endorse Bernie? What's the risk? 

There was a time there where Warren defended the engine that the market economy could be.  I'm surprised she didn't make it more of a theme -- it's a great engine for progress in technology and building wealth but it leaves bodies in it's wake and we need to help those who are victimized by the victim and we need to make sure all have the opportunity to share the wealth.  I kind of saw her as someone who might sell themselves as a steward of the capitalist system 

I think that person could easily win the Presidency.  I do think there is a danger in tethering oneself to Bernie.

[Pancho 44858]

 

[Mo Horn 8850]

4 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

She was my preferred candidate, she got my vote (early), she'd have gotten it on Tuesday as well, because I'm gonna vote my conscience.

@Brisketexan, not sure this is the right place to admit you voted multiple times. 😉

[Brisketexan 105158]

3 minutes ago, tantric superman said:

There was a time there where Warren defended the engine that the market economy could be.  I'm surprised she didn't make it more of a theme -- it's a great engine for progress in technology and building wealth but it leaves bodies in it's wake and we need to help those who are victimized by the victim and we need to make sure all have the opportunity to share the wealth.  I kind of saw her as someone who might sell themselves as a steward of the capitalist system 

I'm out of rep today, but this.  Indeed, early on she sold a pretty tight message of "I'm not here to destroy capitalism, but to save it."  Without going all the way down that economic system road, that's something akin to the Scandinavian model etc.  Capitalism is great to the extent that it fosters innovation and greater production....it just has to be regulated and managed in a way that doesn't socialize the costs and creates broad opportunities for all classes to share in the wealth (again, see the skyrocketing disparity between worker pay and CEO pay -- that's not sustainable, and may well kill capitalism if not reformed).

But ultimately, I don't know if that message sells.  It's too complex.  We the people/voters are simple, and need simple sound bites.

[Brisketexan 105158]

Just now, Mo Horn said:

@Brisketexan, not sure this is the right place to admit you voted multiple times. 😉

Hey, man...my mom grew up in the RGV.  It's in my blood.

[Hank Kingsley 20967]

2 minutes ago, Pancho said:

 

But she hates "power players", right? Her whole campaign was "anti-corruption" and "big, structural change". 

If we're to assume her actual candidacy was conducted in good faith, then Bernie is the only candidate she can endorse. 

 

 

[Mo Horn 8850]

Hey, I did too and all my in-laws still do, so I get it.  Vote early, and vote often. Good on ya. 

[bad_teammate 13218]

My most charitable interpretation:

She feels like she could become the main policy driver in the Biden administration as his brain melts. She basically runs some policy aspect (fiscal/regulatory) and gets free reign to use all the power she can get from President Joe. Aligning with him now assures her position with him and she feels he is far more likely to win.

Bernie is not looking strong right now, so even thought Bernie would give her even more power than Joe and would only ever encourage her to push harder and harder, it's less likely that she would ever get anything like that.

Either way she's still a Senator who can use her seat to do whatever she can as a Senator and that doesn't change either way.

I have less charitable interpretations, but I try to suppress those and maintain my positive imagine of her because I like her and want to continue to like her.

My wife, however, is very free and open with those less charitable interpretations. She was a Warren fan for a long time, switched to Bernie when Warren waffled on M4A ("I still love her though!") and then repelled in horror when Warren wouldn't shake his hand after that debate (part of what prompted me to say, "this might be a campaign-ender for Liz" or something like that). She now hates Warren with a disturbing passion that I don't try to understand because women are unknowable things, but I think it's one of those love/hate things that could turn around. All I know is not to push back too hard with my "Calm down, I think Warren still believes..." because it just doesn't make for a harmonious home.

[tantric superman 4667]

I'm around too many smart white women.  Fuck them and their bitching.  For hundreds of years they rode the coattails of their robber baron husbands and now they are in every level of boardroom and C-suite and Senate office.  

Warren was probably done with her fracking ban, and blame whoever you want, the M4A approach. 

Hillary just sucked.

My wife's straightforward view -- she and her white women buddies voted for Obama, and "the minorities" didn't come out and pay them back when HRC ran.  It's that simple. 

She blames Trumpism on "stupid fucking white women who didn't vote for the white woman and just vote for who their prick husband tells them to vote for."  I'm paraphrasing. 

Hang on.  She's calling me.  I think I need to bring her a beer..

[DixonHur 11341]

32 minutes ago, Tom said:

The great news for Warren is she is not done.  This country is hell-bent on electing 80-year-olds far past their prime and after they start mentally declining.  She just ran too early.  Her time will come in 2028.

Right after President RBG

[washparkhorn 9939]

2 minutes ago, tantric superman said:

I'm around too many smart white women.  Fuck them and their bitching.  For hundreds of years they rode the coattails of their robber baron husbands and now they are in every level of boardroom and C-suite and Senate office.  

Warren was probably done with her fracking ban, and blame whoever you want, the M4A approach. 

Hillary just sucked.

My wife's straightforward view -- she and her white women buddies voted for Obama, and "the minorities" didn't come out and pay them back when HRC ran.  It's that simple. 

She blames Trumpism on "stupid fucking white women who didn't vote for the white woman and just vote for who their prick husband tells them to vote for."  I'm paraphrasing. 

Hang on.  She's calling me.  I think I need to bring her a beer..

The tantric house right now:

 

[Hank Kingsley 20967]

Everyone's gonna have their post-mortem explanations for why they think Warren's campaign failed, so here's mine.  It's pretty simple: Medicare For All. And she never recovered.

Check out the RCP national polling average here: https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2020/president/us/2020_democratic_presidential_nomination-6730.html

From April to October, Warren steadily rose in the polls, culminating with her taking the lead on October 8th. Her campaign was practically flawless until late September. This is when she ducked the "will you raise middle class taxes" question in 6-7 different interviews. Buttigieg called her "evasive". Everything fell apart after that. 

Healthcare was never really part of her pitch when she gained from April to September. Her campaign just completely botched the M4A answers and eventual roll out when finally confronted with it. After the high point RCP average on October 8th, she was in a steady decline for the next 4-5 months. Healthcare was the one big weakness that she and her staff couldn't figure out how to contain. 

Edited March 5, 2020 by Hank Kingsley

[bad_teammate 13218]

2 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

From April to October, Warren steadily rose in the polls, culminating with her taking the lead on October 8th. Her campaign was practically flawless until late September. This is when she ducked the "will you raise middle class taxes" question in 6-7 different interviews. Buttigieg called her "evasive". Everything fell apart after that.

She could've handled that with more courage, but fuck Pete. Little fucking prick.

[Dnaguy 12002]

1 hour ago, Bateshorn said:

I said this about Elizabeth and it did not go over well in my house.

 

1 hour ago, High Plains Drifter said:

 

Careful bro. I said that about Hillary a while back and my wife almost clawed my eyes out.

 

You mean that people didn’t want to vote for their mom who keeps telling them to clean their room and stop eating junk food?

Or Vote for their aloof aunt who always gave them shitty gender neutral educational gifts when they grew up?

I mean, it’s sexist as shit but that’s the vibe I always got from them as candidates.

[ducks]

Edited March 5, 2020 by Dnaguy

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

She was my preferred candidate, she got my vote (early), she'd have gotten it on Tuesday as well, because I'm gonna vote my conscience.

One thing for the eventual winning candidate to have in mind when courting Warren supporters is that MAN....a lot of them are seriously wounded.  Again, this is my wife and her peer group, and they are very much taking this as a blow for misogyny (and no doubt, it's a proxy event for them to cover the misogyny they have faced in their lives over, and over, and over).  I'm not kidding -- there are tears, and real anger.

Women have always been wounded - advances be damned, gender equity ain't our social strong suit.  They have been particularly wounded the past three years by the 1-2 punch of the first female nominee losing (they will all acknowledge her flaws, but in the end, she was the first female nominee and she lost, and there was absolutely some misogyny baked into that), and a bragging misogynist winning.  They are PISSED, and they are motivated.  And a lot of them put their hope in Warren -- smarter than Hillary, without all the Hillary baggage.  Seeing her lose is a new wound.

And I think she lost because there's some misogyny baked in, but I also think she ran a weak campaign and made some mistakes, and what I think is most important: "smartest candidate in the room" is never going to win.  It's not about being smart, it's about packaging a message, and intellectual types usually aren't too good at that.  But I'm not going to tell my wife that.  I'm going to tell her "I'm sorry" and let her mourn.  But then, there will come a day when she needs to decide who she'll support next -- it's going to be interesting how (or even IF) the two remaining campaigns try to connect with that group.

Facebook posting by a very political woman I know:

Quote

So, it's Bernie or Joe. I'll vote for whichever of them.

 

But if you think I'm lifting a single damn finger to do any of the work of getting either of them elected, think again.

 

Every single woman I know in politics is Elizabeth Warren.

 

We make the calls to turn people out, we set up the meetings, we make sure there's food for the attendees. We create and administer a complete federal agency dedicated to protecting consumers. We make sure there's water for the speakers, we ask people to help us set up the chairs, we staff the check-in tables. We edit your press releases. We proof-read your campaign lit. We go on stage knowing how the world treats "aggressive" and "shrill" women and we still reel back and knock the ever-loving daylight out of Michael Bloomberg so he can't fuck things up for everyone else. We host the fundraising events. We make the calls. We follow up. We do the data entry. We block walk. We have plans and we are thinking two, four, and six years out. We hustle. We phone bank and write post cards and make yard signs and deliver yard signs and hand out push cards.

 

The guys I know who do this stuff are nodding along with me and they know I'm talking about a system not about them. I love y'all and you are my people.

 

The guys I know who are sputtering and about to type BUT BUT BUT not all men are the men I'm talking about. And it's about damn time you learned that women talk about you behind your backs. The Joes and the Bernies who take the mic and take the credit and disappear when it's time to pick up trash off the floor at the meeting and take the paychecks for the things they've asked women to do for free. We talk. We know who you are.

 

I am tired. My sisters in this struggle are tired. We'll vote because we have to, because our literal bodies are on the line. We will vote because we know it is even worse for so many of the people we care about who are often fighting even harder and more complex battles. And I'll campaign for my local folks, men and women, because I know which ones of them do the work and I'm willing to do it alongside them.

 

But presidentially? Meh. Will picking a woman VP mollify me? Sort of? But it will also depress the hell out of me, frankly, because it feels like a punch in the gut.

 

We need you so WE can lead, but we don't trust you TO lead.

 

That's what's on my mind today, Facebook. Thanks for asking.

 

P.S. edited to add this photo that if you think a emoji has power over me, then you don’t know much about how I roll.

 

 

[Fudge Nuggets 19206]

37 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

She could've handled that with more courage, but fuck Pete. Little fucking prick.

She should have gone with the tried and true always winning political philosophy of flat out lying.

[High Plains Drifter 11050]

2 hours ago, gmr548 said:

Because it's a ridiculous statement in context.

Biden and Sanders are both constantly yelling. The former barely makes any sense. The latter gets visibly angry when pressed. No one cares. Warren replaces Bernie's temper with composure and is orders of magnitude more coherent than Biden. But she's grating? GTFO with that nonsense.

 

I agree, there is a double standard.

[RomaVicta 29931]

1 hour ago, Pancho said:

 

Such a petty, stupid world.

[williemackgarza 1826]

Hey, man...my mom grew up in the RGV.  It's in my blood.

Duval county says hi!

[Judge Roybeanbag 11819]

1 hour ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

Facebook posting by a very political woman I know:

 

Man, those are some badass handles she has on her dildos.

[Bateshorn 9928]

Given a couple of the fuck yeahs I’ve just seen, I clearly need to be a more thoughtful about how I evaluate things vis-a-vis ingrained gender roles and stereotypes. 
 

My bad. 

Edited March 6, 2020 by Bateshorn

[G650 14263]

4 hours ago, tantric superman said:

There was a time there where Warren defended the engine that the market economy could be.  I'm surprised she didn't make it more of a theme -- it's a great engine for progress in technology and building wealth but it leaves bodies in it's wake and we need to help those who are victimized by the victim and we need to make sure all have the opportunity to share the wealth.  I kind of saw her as someone who might sell themselves as a steward of the capitalist system 

I think that person could easily win the Presidency.  I do think there is a danger in tethering oneself to Bernie.

That idea is literally the bedrock of everything I believe, but I just dont feel Warren is the one to deliver it. I've always maintained, much to the disturbance of my wife, that she is not uplifting to a great swath if the electorate, as this campaign has shown to be true.

 

Personally, I don't think she ever got past that dumbfuck you didn't build it fiasco years ago, no matter what her late 2019 polling may have said.

[mdmost 43004]

My wife, who was very passionate about Warren, is very similar to how Brisket's wife and friends feel. She's pretty pissed off and dejected. She has plenty of hot sports opinions on the media's coverage or lack of coverage for Warren over the men in this race. She also holds a grudge for Bernie and his supporters. That said, she'll support whomever the nominee is and hopes Warren is a part of the coalition built around the winner. 

[G650 14263]

3 minutes ago, mdmost said:

My wife, who was very passionate about Warren, is very similar to how Brisket's wife and friends feel. She's pretty pissed off and dejected. She has plenty of hot sports opinions on the media's coverage or lack of coverage for Warren over the men in this race. She also holds a grudge for Bernie and his supporters. That said, she'll support whomever the nominee is and hopes Warren is a part of the coalition built around the winner. 

Ditto.

[Bateshorn 9928]

8 minutes ago, mdmost said:

My wife, who was very passionate about Warren, is very similar to how Brisket's wife and friends feel. She's pretty pissed off and dejected. She has plenty of hot sports opinions on the media's coverage or lack of coverage for Warren over the men in this race. She also holds a grudge for Bernie and his supporters. That said, she'll support whomever the nominee is and hopes Warren is a part of the coalition built around the winner. 

Adding my wife as well.

[Brisketexan 105158]

1 hour ago, Judge Roybeanbag said:

Man, those are some badass handles she has on her dildos.

[thrillhammer 684]

this is a sad day for all democrats.  when the campaign season started warren was my first choice, then I was leaning towards klobuchar until she dropped out, so I was back to warren.  now there's no one left but two guys older than trump and whiter than trump.  this is a bad message the party is sending out.  we had youth, vigor, energy, smarts, innovation - beto, castro, harris, gabbard, booker, pete.  and now this is what we're left with?  this is a terrible state the party is in, and trump just took a giant leap towards reelection.

 

[mdmost 43004]

The one upside you can take from Super Tuesday is African American vote was really high and mostly all went to Biden. So a group that stayed home in a decent number in 2016 and didn't come out for Hillary, came out for Biden. Biden wins you some Midwest states. Yeah, it sucks two old white guys are the only alternatives but in the end, it's all about beating the old white guy in the Oval Office. And Warren voters aren't going to stay home. They know what's at stake. 

Edited March 6, 2020 by mdmost