Elizabeth Warren 2020

[Js1 87182]

2 minutes ago, tantric superman said:

Is that it?  Anyone else with a comment about what she actually did?  Got some more facts about the "some minority law teacher list"?

https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/nation/2018/09/01/did-claiming-native-american-heritage-actually-help-elizabeth-warren-get-ahead-but-complicated/wUZZcrKKEOUv5Spnb7IO0K/story.html

Quote

At Rutgers University, where she attended the law school, Warren said “no” when asked whether she wanted to apply to a program for minority students.

Quote

Warren changed her listed ethnicity to Native American in December 1989, nearly three years after she was hired as a white woman by the University of Pennsylvania Law School.

 

Hell she was more hired by Harvard for having a vagina.  They wanted a tenured female professor.

[RomaVicta 30584]

11 minutes ago, OatmealRaisinCookie said:

She listed herself as a minority. She self-identified as a minority. This despite being just like everyone else who chooses to not identify as a minority because recognize it is either dishonest, foolish, shameful or absurd to claim to be a minority because of something 9 or 10 or 11 generations back. I guess by her definition, everyone can claim being a minority and have it not be dishonest, as long as they do it outside of applications and just for their own aggrandizement and delusions.

At the end of the day, it doesn't matter and it shouldn't stop her from running. I think it's too far to do the whooping and war chant stuff that her opponent's staff did, whether you think it funny or not to mock her in that way, but I think calling her out of on her ridiculousness in this instance is fair game.

Negged for obfuscation and likely willful lying. You clearly want to keep this nothing story going to belittle the woman and make Trump's lying not such a big deal. You're a bad American.

 

[Longhorn_Fan68 34104]

2 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

Negged for obfuscation and likely willful lying. You clearly want to keep this nothing story going to belittle the woman and make Trump's lying not such a big deal. You're a bad American.

 

or a good Russian

[Longhornfan1024 1707]

23 minutes ago, OatmealRaisinCookie said:

She listed herself as a minority. She self-identified as a minority. This despite being just like everyone else who chooses to not identify as a minority because recognize it is either dishonest, foolish, shameful or absurd to claim to be a minority because of something 9 or 10 or 11 generations back. I guess by her definition, everyone can claim being a minority and have it not be dishonest, as long as they do it outside of applications and just for their own aggrandizement and delusions.

At the end of the day, it doesn't matter and it shouldn't stop her from running. I think it's too far to do the whooping and war chant stuff that her opponent's staff did, whether you think it funny or not to mock her in that way, but I think calling her out of on her ridiculousness in this instance is fair game.

I went ahead and negged you for the same reason Roma did.  You're either lying or willfully obfuscating.  Either way, you're doing exactly what I said you were in twisting her actions in order to create an alternative history in order to attack her credibility.  

[Mojo Hand 4580]

It's incredible how invested the right is in the phony narrative that she pretended to be a Native American to get a job.   The reality is clearly to the contrary:  she never lied on a form or falsely claimed official status, and her unofficial representation in a few cases was based on an honest belief from family history, which has now been proven by DNA results showing that she's as much as 1/64, the exact generation of the claimed part-Native ancestor.   Could be further back or not; doesn't really matter, because she's not trying to get some sort of Indian bloodline benefit.   Her story checks out.  As has long been obvious to anyone who saw Harvard's announcement for her hire, which touted the hiring of a female professor as a big deal for diversity while saying zilch about supposed Native status — something that would have been an even bigger deal for diversity. 

The only ones lying for personal and political gain are the "Pocahontas!" crowd.   

[RDCanecutter 26885]

4 hours ago, Celery Man said:

should've had them track those Northeastern Native American genes

They're never going to release those. You could compare them to Basque and Orkney genes, yell "Computer-- ENHANCE!", and up pops a map showing you the drowned but unlooted temples of Atlantis.

[maninblack 7975]

This whole thing is fucking hilarious.

[MaybeACoordinator 8350]

3 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

If Trump falsely claimed he was a minority to get preferential treatment and got away with it he would say that makes him smart.  

Trump wrote in his autobiography that he was of Swedish descent because that was more palatable to Jewish tenants and potential tenants than the truth of his grandaddy being a Kraut. A draft dodging Kraut, but a Kraut nonetheless. 

[MaybeACoordinator 8350]

1 minute ago, maninblack said:

This whole thing is fucking hilarious.

When did Warren apply for Cherokee tribal membership?

[Guest]

You people can't read and/or understand things outside of your preconceived conceptions. But okay, I'm the dishonest one, let's just settle there so that we can move on and you people can unwrap from the axle.

[Fozzz 152]

It was idiotic of her to bring this up.  She thought she could try to out logic and facts the right-wing fever swamp on this silly shit?  lol

[Pescado_Rojo 19587]

45 minutes ago, OatmealRaisinCookie said:

You people can't read and/or understand things outside of your preconceived conceptions. But okay, I'm the dishonest one, let's just settle there so that we can move on and you people can unwrap from the axle.

• Conway: "You're saying it's a falsehood and Sean Spicer, our press secretary, gave alternative facts to that."
• Todd: "Alternative facts are not facts. They are falsehoods."
• Conway: "If we're going to keep referring to the press secretary in those types of terms I think we're going to have to rethink our relationship here."

[Johnny Sack 8397]

Good job, good effort Pocahontas.  

[EuroHorn 3295]

Edited October 15, 2018 by EuroHorn

[Johnny Sack 8397]

She claimed to "be an Indian".

She didn't claim to have a minuscule trace of native American blood based on comparison to Mexicans and South Americans   I’m Northern European and have more Indian blood than Liawatha   

This whole Pocahontas thing was just funny.  But the fact she would release this test as her big proof shows she’s not all that bright on publicity.  

Edited October 15, 2018 by Johnny Sack

[Johnny Sack 8397]

[TexasMan 11456]

If you're taking Ls from The Onion, you know it's a really bad day..

 

 

 

 

[MaybeACoordinator 8350]

So first it was Warren lied about being an Indian to gain career advantages.

When it was proven that she gained no career advantages from her claims of Indian blood, it was that she simply lied about her Indian heritage, the same way pretty much every Okie ever born does.

Then it was proven that she is in fact part Indian, and no more than she said she was from the get-go.

And now we are right back to the false claim that she got a leg up through racial quotas.  

Which she did not. 

 

 

 

[tantric superman 4668]

1 hour ago, Fozzz said:

It was idiotic of her to bring this up.  She thought she could try to out logic and facts the right-wing fever swamp on this silly shit?  lol

Hmm.   I think the whole issue is dumb, and is a net negative for her.  While I guess I feel some sympathy for someone's attempts to figure out what kind of national origin they may have, the early 1980s were a period where universities were trying to establish there bona fides by referring to the ethnic makeup of their students and professors.  I think it's very important that she didn't use this to gain admission anywhere. 

But she was playing with fire, and she's getting burned, because even though my sister has taken a DNA and I have some tiny bit of , I think she said Senegalese,.  If I had used it in any way back in the early 1980s it would have been bullshit, because such a small percentage coupled with the fact that I wasn't living my life with any connection to Senegalese ethnicity makes one believe she was doing it for some self-serving reason.  Not a remotely big self-serving reason, but perhaps some way to increase her bona fides. 

Anyway, fuck the Republican for making this a bigger issue than it is, but I've got no problem with Warren taking some medicine for this.  To me it's as relevant as Beto's arrests.  Not a big deal to me. 

 

Edited October 15, 2018 by tantric superman

[Js1 87182]

 

[tantric superman 4668]

13 minutes ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

So first it was Warren lied about being an Indian to gain career advantages.

When it was proven that she gained no career advantages from her claims of Indian blood, it was that she simply lied about her Indian heritage, the same way pretty much every Okie ever born does.

Then it was proven that she is in fact part Indian, and no more than she said she was from the get-go.

And now we are right back to the false claim that she got a leg up through racial quotas.  

Which she did not.  

 

 

 

Why do you think she claimed Indian heritage?  And why do you think she changed the form to indicate such? 

And do you think that there was remotely anything to gain?  And do you think it's appropriate for one to claim heritage no matter the amount of blood one has or the cultural connection one has to the claimed heritage?

And I'm not assuming Warren is lying about anything. 

Edited October 15, 2018 by tantric superman

[bad_teammate 13523]

1 hour ago, Fozzz said:

It was idiotic of her to bring this up.  She thought she could try to out logic and facts the right-wing fever swamp on this silly shit?  lol

Is she the one who brought this up?

The President of the United States calls her out in rallies in front of tens of thousands of people. Kind of shitty to blame her for defending herself.

[maninblack 7975]

Imagine taking this seriously enough to defend an Okie that became Yankee Senator who thought it'd be a smart move to actually take a DNA test that shows she might have some Indian heritage from 1400 or some shit. Keep bringing the lulz Surly

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

Y’all are missing the big picture here.  Warren is the topic of the day today.  She got the President of the United States to have to deal with her today.  She is dominating the posting on this forum today.  

While this whole thing will be an afterthought by the weekend, she made a lot of noise today.  

That gives her some seperation from other contenders that are waiting until after the midterms to make their moves.

This was a strategic play.

No serious person gives a shit about her Native American heritage. 

This was a straight up troll on the Trumpkins and the responses in this thread prove it.

She rang the dinner bell and the usual suspects came running.  

That was the point. 

[maninblack 7975]

^^^^^^^^Bwahahahahahahahah^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

[Mojo Hand 4580]

1 minute ago, tantric superman said:

Why do you think she claimed Indian heritage?  And why do you think she changed the form to indicate such? 

And do you think that there was remotely anything to gain?  And do you think it's appropriate for one to claim heritage no matter the amount of blood one has or the cultural connection one has to the claimed heritage?

And I'm not assuming Warren is lying about anything. 

The same reason personal DNA testing is now an industry.  People like feeling a cultural connection through ancestry.  Hence all the commercials about the guy who used to go to German beer events but found out he's really part Scottish and may get a kilt.   Or how everyone else from Oklahoma talks about some Indian ancestor.   It's extremely common.   But on every form we've seen asking Warren for her official status, from college on, she checked the box for white.  

[MaybeACoordinator 8350]

Maybe it was on this board, maybe the other one, but it was Harvard's PR department that ran with the story of her being an Indian, not Warren, and they did so long after she was hired. It was to enhance their reputation, not hers. 

[tantric superman 4668]

1 minute ago, Mojo Hand said:

The same reason personal DNA testing is now an industry.  People like feeling a cultural connection through ancestry.  Hence all the commercials about the guy who used to go to German beer events but found out he's really part Scottish and may get a kilt.   Or how everyone else from Oklahoma talks about some Indian ancestor.   It's extremely common.   But on every form we've seen asking Warren for her official status, from college on, she checked the box for white.  

There was a box up a number of posts where she checked it for Native American.   So she didn't just talk about it.  She checked one box.

[tantric superman 4668]

2 minutes ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

Maybe it was on this board, maybe the other one, but it was Harvard's PR department that ran with the story of her being an Indian, not Warren, and they did so long after she was hired. It was to enhance their reputation, not hers. 

Harvard's enhanced reputation does not inure to her?

 

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

28 minutes ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

So first it was Warren lied about being an Indian to gain career advantages.

When it was proven that she gained no career advantages from her claims of Indian blood, it was that she simply lied about her Indian heritage, the same way pretty much every Okie ever born does.

Then it was proven that she is in fact part Indian, and no more than she said she was from the get-go.

And now we are right back to the false claim that she got a leg up through racial quotas.  

Which she did not. 

 

 

 

Dude she has less Native American blood than the guy sitting next to me, and he's Irish.  Did you read the report ?  They're using related ethnic types to arrive at a Native American answer. I have more than she does, my wife definitlely does.

She used it as a carer enhancer (for some reason). It's a joke and she's made it worse with this lame report.

She's a smart lady and should have just shut the hell up, but she has eyes for the White House, and this was her first foray into that arena, FAIL.

[Buzzrock 15136]

If you're taking Ls from The Onion, you know it's a really bad day..
 
 
 
 

See now that’s a good joke.

[tantric superman 4668]

Onboard hits on the problem.  A very large number of Americans have more native American blood than Warren.  People know that using ethnicity was often a game in the days when Warren entered academia.  Whether or not she used it to her advantage, she is seen as part of a crowd that did.  To those American who have more Native American blood than she has, she is going to be seen as an opportunists in one way or another. 

 

Edited October 15, 2018 by tantric superman

[Buzzrock 15136]

Y’all are missing the big picture here.  Warren is the topic of the day today.  She got the President of the United States to have to deal with her today.  She is dominating the posting on this forum today.  
While this whole thing will be an afterthought by the weekend, she made a lot of noise today.  
That gives her some seperation from other contenders that are waiting until after the midterms to make their moves.
This was a strategic play.
No serious person gives a shit about her Native American heritage. 
This was a straight up troll on the Trumpkins and the responses in this thread prove it.
She rang the dinner bell and the usual suspects came running.  
That was the point. 

I think she did it to get it out of the way. Have he keefuffle now and it won’t be as much of a distraction during the primaries.

[Mojo Hand 4580]

16 minutes ago, tantric superman said:

There was a box up a number of posts where she checked it for Native American.   So she didn't just talk about it.  She checked one box.

No, schools she worked at overstated her status after she was hired.   Warren didn't check any box at Rutgers or UT.  At both Penn and Harvard, internal forms show that she applied as a white female (https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/nation/2018/09/01/did-claiming-native-american-heritage-actually-help-elizabeth-warren-get-ahead-but-complicated/wUZZcrKKEOUv5Spnb7IO0K/story.html).   She did self-identify as Native American in unofficial circumstances based on her family history, which DNA testing has just confirmed as accurate.   

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

Just now, tantric superman said:

Onboard hits on the problem.  A very large number of Americans have more native American blood than Warren.  People know that using ethnicity was often a game in the days when Warren entered academia.  Whether or not she used it to her advantage, she is seen as part of a crowd that did.  To those American who have more Native American blood than she has, she is going to be seen as an opportunists in one way or another. 

The Dems need to start thinking hard about how they look to the opposition.  And stop making stupid mistakes.

Yeah, would it keep me from voting for her ?  If she keeps beating the drum on this issue it would.  If she just let's it go, makes a statement that her family oral history is what she was relying on, and it turns out it wasn't correct.  I can look past it, and applaud her for being honest.

Every politician lies some just haven't been caught.  Hers seems harmless unless she did in fact get over on somebody with actual Native American blood in the %'s that would make  her claims harmful to them.

[WhatTheBuck 28929]

3 minutes ago, tantric superman said:

Onboard hits on the problem.  A very large number of Americans have more native American blood than Warren.  People know that using ethnicity was often a game in the days when Warren entered academia.  Whether or not she used it to her advantage, she is seen as part of a crowd that did.  To those American who have more Native American blood than she has, she is going to be seen as an opportunists in one way or another. 

 

Who fucking cares? That this is even a subject for discussion just shows that the Republicans have nothing else to attack her for. She's a Democrat. She's the enemy. They need to attack her. This is all they have. 

Onboard is an idiot. You will be made dumber by paying attention to anything he has to say. 

[tantric superman 4668]

3 minutes ago, Mojo Hand said:

She did self-identify as Native American in unofficial circumstances based on her family history, which DNA testing has just confirmed as accurate.    

Great.  She's obviously chock-full of Indian blood.  Whole issue should be forgotten by tomorrow. 

So just so that I understand, what would be your stance if she had indeed gotten preferential treatment for self identifying as Native American and just now got it verified to the extent it was?  Given that she "proved" her Native American stance, it doesn't change your argument, does it?

 

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

4 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

Who fucking cares? That this is even a subject for discussion just shows that the Republicans have nothing else to attack her for. She's a Democrat. She's the enemy. They need to attack her. This is all they have. 

Onboard is an idiot. You will be made dumber by paying attention to anything he has to say. 

Heeeeey fuck you very much too.

[GSU&UT 1799]

LOL at thinking she is worse off for doing this. If she never had this whole crap about her ancestry come up there would be only a thousand other talking points FNC and y'all would buy into, probably that's she's some sort of evil Socialist like Bernie because of wanting to hold Wall Street bankers more accountable for the financial crisis.

[tantric superman 4668]

3 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

Who fucking cares?

Any person who thinks that academia was infected with unfair race agendas for the past few decades.  Anyone who feels wounded by people who unfairly, or underhandedly, use race or disability (see, service animals), or feels that the learned gentry take unfair advantages.

The Harvard Asian quota case is going to make people care about this shit even more.

As someone who hates the Republicans, I fucking care because I hate it when the Dems needlessly fuck themselves. 

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

3 minutes ago, GSU&UT said:

LOL at thinking she is worse off for doing this. If she never had this whole crap about her ancestry come up there would be only a thousand other talking points FNC and y'all would buy into, probably that's she's some sort of evil Socialist like Bernie because of wanting to hold Wall Street bankers more accountable for the financial crisis.

They're trying to pass off a test based on south of the border DNA to make the claim she's got Native American blood, and the test shows she's got less than many other Americans  (who aren't yelling about their Cherokee nation blood BTW).. Now that just seems kind of like .... how to say this ? ...... bullshit comes to mind.  The test did nothing to help her claim unless she starts sporting a sombrero.

Edited October 16, 2018 by Onboard 2.0

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

6 minutes ago, GSU&UT said:

LOL at thinking she is worse off for doing this. If she never had this whole crap about her ancestry come up there would be only a thousand other talking points FNC and y'all would buy into, probably that's she's some sort of evil Socialist like Bernie because of wanting to hold Wall Street bankers more accountable for the financial crisis.

The winner of the Democratic nomination will be the candidate that successfully makes the most noise in the media, bonus points if you can do it with issues that resonate with voters. 

This was Trump’s playbook. 

Edited October 16, 2018 by Hugo Stiglitz

[Mojo Hand 4580]

2 minutes ago, tantric superman said:

Great.  She's obviously chock-full of Indian blood.  Whole issue should be forgotten by tomorrow. 

So just so that I understand, what would be your stance if she had indeed gotten preferential treatment for self identifying as Native American and just now got it verified to the extent it was?  Given that she "proved" her Native American stance, it doesn't change your argument, does it?

 

Her DNA test merely serves to bolster her claim to an honest belief in her family story of an NA ancestor, which is already backed up by other family members as well.   That she has that DNA wouldn't validate claims to formal NA status because it is insufficient for those purposes.   But she never claimed formal NA status, so that doesn't matter.  Again, she applied for all of her schooling and jobs as a white woman.  Numerous forms prove it.   Given that, it wouldn't even matter if her DNA were all-white.   There's nothing wrong with seeking cultural connection based on a mistaken, but honest, belief in NA ancestry, as long as you don't overstate that belief to be something more than it is for improper purposes.  But, the DNA makes it even more believable that her family did pass down such a story, because it's actually true. 

[GSU&UT 1799]

2 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

They're trying to pass off a test based on south of the border DNA to make the claim she's got Native American blood, and the test shows she's got less than many other Americans  (who aren't yelling about their Cherokee nation blood BTW).. Now that just seems kind of like .... how to say this ? ...... bullshit comes to mind.  The test did nothing to help her claim unless she starts sporting a sombrero.

As has been repeatedly pointed out countless times, Harvard is the one who said she was of NA heritage, she has basically claimed something that all Okies claim. She does this now, you all cry whine and bitch, and then it becomes a much smaller issue later on. It would be fucking amazing if every one of you who is saying she is a liar would hold even near the same standard for the bullshit we hear daily in this administration and all the other GOP reps that are backing it.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

Just now, GSU&UT said:

As has been repeatedly pointed out countless times, Harvard is the one who said she was of NA heritage, she has basically claimed something that all Okies claim. She does this now, you all cry whine and bitch, and then it becomes a much smaller issue later on. It would be fucking amazing if every one of you who is saying she is a liar would hold even near the same standard for the bullshit we hear daily in this administration and all the other GOP reps that are backing it.

Oh so Harvard told her she was of NA heritage, not her mom and or grammy ??  Gotcha.....

[Johnny Sack 8397]

1 minute ago, GSU&UT said:

As has been repeatedly pointed out countless times, Harvard is the one who said she was of NA heritage, she has basically claimed something that all Okies claim. She does this now, you all cry whine and bitch, and then it becomes a much smaller issue later on. It would be fucking amazing if every one of you who is saying she is a liar would hold even near the same standard for the bullshit we hear daily in this administration and all the other GOP reps that are backing it.

Wonder how Harvard got the idea she was an Injun?

[F250 29201]

It must be a slow day in the CR if people are talking about the Warren DNA.

[Johnny Sack 8397]

3 minutes ago, Mojo Hand said:

Her DNA test merely serves to bolster her claim to an honest belief in her family story of an NA ancestor, which is already backed up by other family members as well.   That she has that DNA wouldn't validate claims to formal NA status because it is insufficient for those purposes.   But she never claimed formal NA status, so that doesn't matter.  Again, she applied for all of her schooling and jobs as a white woman.  Numerous forms prove it.   Given that, it wouldn't even matter if her DNA were all-white.   There's nothing wrong with seeking cultural connection based on a mistaken, but honest, belief in NA ancestry, as long as you don't overstate that belief to be something more than it is for improper purposes.  But, the DNA makes it even more believable that her family did pass down such a story, because it's actually true. 

You think this DNA test bolsters her claim?

[tantric superman 4668]

3 minutes ago, Mojo Hand said:

Her DNA test merely serves to bolster her claim to an honest belief in her family story of an NA ancestor, which is already backed up by other family members as well.   That she has that DNA wouldn't validate claims to formal NA status because it is insufficient for those purposes.   But she never claimed formal NA status, so that doesn't matter.  Again, she applied for all of her schooling and jobs as a white woman.  Numerous forms prove it.   Given that, it wouldn't even matter if her DNA were all-white.   There's nothing wrong with seeking cultural connection based on a mistaken, but honest, belief in NA ancestry, as long as you don't overstate that belief to be something more than it is for improper purposes.  But, the DNA makes it even more believable that her family did pass down such a story, because it's actually true. 

So I will assume that you answer is yes, if she had gained admission to a school or gotten some kind of set aside, that would be a black mark against her -- something that would be wrong, unfair, and dishonest.

[GSU&UT 1799]

1 minute ago, Johnny Sack said:

Wonder how Harvard got the idea she was an Injun?

So you're saying that she didn't submit that she was a white person on all her school and job applications?