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Phoenix cops threaten to shoot mom after she won't put baby on 100 deg pavement


lemonlime

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3 hours ago, usmc0331horn said:

Aren't cops trained at deescalation? It's a disgrace how many of them are just ultra gung ho super cop when it comes to pulling over our citizens of color. Our entire policing and prison institutions need to be overhauled and remade because this obviously isn't working.

“Nothing de-escalates a situation like shooting the threat dead” - Cop Training Manual

How much you wanna bet the entire thing is excused because “they were just following their training?”

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1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

“Nothing de-escalates a situation like shooting the threat dead” - Cop Training Manual

How much you wanna bet the entire thing is excused because “they were just following their training?”

That is infuriating. Just like that piece of shit Brailsford got off because “he followed the training”

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6 hours ago, Bevo said:

I'm curious how a 4 year old accidentally steals a doll, all the employees know about it yet the parents are totally unaware. You would think the employees would have brought it to the attention of the unaware parents as they were walking out the door.

When we visit relatives out near Alpine, half the time we need something, one of the Dollar chains is the only place to get it.  Every time I have to go in one of those stores, it’s usually an aimless 19 or 20 year-old working the register, who is more concerned about her nails or whoever she’s talking to on the phone than watching what little kids do.   

There might be one or two other employees, usually some kind of manager playing Windows solitaire in their office.  

And it’s a fucking Family Dollar store, so it’s not a real Barbie that costs $10, it’s a knockoff that’s a buck or two.  

This whole thing is so weird that cops would completely turn into fucking snowflakes and feel so threatened by a 4 year-old who grabbed a $2 doll.

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8 hours ago, Slade said:

The operative word is "black". Those goons were on full race soldier mode and wanted to exert control over black bodies and the aggression, threats and physical violence were the evidence of that. They did not view those people as human beings. There is something really fucked up with our law enforcement and it's a systemic problem that has been going on since time immemorial, especially when it comes to black and brown communities. They should be fired, those assholes are going to kill someone if they haven't already. 

If you were directing a movie about slave plantations, and you asked me to help you find two guys who could play the part of overseers for a scene where some slaves were going to be whipped, I would say “say no more, watch this video and contact these cops.”

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i'd like to tie those two cops to chairs, sleep deprive myself/binge drink for a few days, stop taking my meds, really anything to get me in a super hypomanic state of rage, and then take out said rage on both of these cowards faces, knee caps, and genitalia. putting myself through all of that would be worth it 100x over for the sheer satisfaction of making these cowards feel as small and helpless as they made that family.

police like this are the absolute lowest pieces of shit known to humanity. i sincerely have more respect for members of hate groups like the klan than i do for these police, because at least they aren't paid by the public to protect and serve said public, and they don't all claim to be national heroes who deserve and demand respect from the very people they terrorize. fuck american police and everything they stand for. 

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5 hours ago, usmc0331horn said:

Aren't cops trained at deescalation? It's a disgrace how many of them are just ultra gung ho super cop when it comes to pulling over our citizens of color. Our entire policing and prison institutions need to be overhauled and remade because this obviously isn't working.

Here's my hot take on things. A lot of these young cops are fresh out of the military and served in Iraq & Afghanistan. When they "revert to their training" it's not stateside police training, it's occupying force training. The militarization of law enforcement doesn't help. They need to dial that shit back down from 11.

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3 hours ago, Bevo said:

Fuck off and quit chomping at the bit for something to go after. I am not responding to the police actions. I am responding to the initial events. Specifically, I was responding to the comment " Makes me wonder what sort of things the employees at the Dollar store said to them on the phone when they called the police to snitch on them". We don't know what happened at the dollar store. This could have been anything from the store employees calling the police rather than telling the parents to put the item back on the shelf or it could have been a family that has routinely been stealing and has previously been approached by the employees and the police. Before you respond though, realize that we are talking about two separate events. You were talking about the police actions at the apartment complex. I was talking about the events at the Dollar store.

What I read on the twitters is that I it wasn’t even dollar store employees that called the cops it was a “concerned citizen” and the cops responded and followed the car to another location. Dollar store employees probably didn’t notice or care if that is indeed how it went down. 

 

 

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The sergeant in the news report who acts like the police are the victims here needs to go.

It may truly be a "few bad apples." But they police apologizers always forget the rest of the expression--that ruined the barrel.  The whole barrel is rotten.

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Cops seem to be formally or informally trained that every citizen they encounter has a gun that is soon to be pointed at them.  

As much as the cops, from all appearances, are 100% wrong in this case, if you want to get away alive from a police encounter, do what they say. It’s unfortunate and sad, but it’s America today.   I’m fortunate that I live and work in areas where there seem to be few police and they refrain from this type of behavior. 

Do police really track down people for shoplifting?  I’ve always assumed that if I saw someone steal my car from my driveway, I wouldn’t be able to get to the police to act fast. 

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2 hours ago, RPM said:

Here's my hot take on things. A lot of these young cops are fresh out of the military and served in Iraq & Afghanistan. When they "revert to their training" it's not stateside police training, it's occupying force training. The militarization of law enforcement doesn't help. They need to dial that shit back down from 11.

I have plenty of friends that I served with, who went on to serve in Afghanistan and/or Iraq, and they wouldn't pull this shit in either of those places against parents with little kids.  It's a good way to A) create more people willing to look the other way while IEDs, etc. were planted, or B) create more people willing to plant IEDs, etc.

A couple have even mentioned how being friendly to the locals saved their lives - things like some kid they gave something to (candy, food, etc.), coming back a few weeks later and that kid would tell them he saw a group of men doing something along some road, and they would find an IED there, etc.

Even if these cops were ex-military, and acted like that, they are psychologically unfit to be cops, or to even own firearms.

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19 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Do police really track down people for shoplifting?  I’ve always assumed that if I saw someone steal my car from my driveway, I wouldn’t be able to get to the police to act fast. 

I worked at a Computer City and a CompUSA (after the buyout) for a few years back in the late 90s here in Austin, and I can tell you that the cops were not that interested in people who were shoplifting $500 items, or even $2,500 laptops.  They sure as fuck didn't roll up, guns drawn, looking to kill somebody.

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1 hour ago, lemonlime said:

The sergeant in the news report who acts like the police are the victims here needs to go.

It may truly be a "few bad apples." But they police apologizers always forget the rest of the expression--that ruined the barrel.  The whole barrel is rotten.

Didn’t the link from OP say they didn’t have body cams yet?

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1 hour ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Cops seem to be formally or informally trained that every citizen they encounter has a gun that is soon to be pointed at them.  

 

Just about. Change “has” to “could have”  and that is what most by the book police are trained to think. And that’s real and fair. Staying alert,  anybody can be a threat.  However that does not excuse these officers’ behavior. This is different. This is not by the book.

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20 minutes ago, Neonmoon said:

If a police officer answers a call and their body cams are turned off, it should be a fine and 30 day suspension without pay. The next time should be loss of license. 

fify

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1 hour ago, atomheartbevo said:

I have plenty of friends that I served with, who went on to serve in Afghanistan and/or Iraq, and they wouldn't pull this shit in either of those places against parents with little kids.  It's a good way to A) create more people willing to look the other way while IEDs, etc. were planted, or B) create more people willing to plant IEDs, etc.

A couple have even mentioned how being friendly to the locals saved their lives - things like some kid they gave something to (candy, food, etc.), coming back a few weeks later and that kid would tell them he saw a group of men doing something along some road, and they would find an IED there, etc.

Even if these cops were ex-military, and acted like that, they are psychologically unfit to be cops, or to even own firearms.

The rules of engagement for our service members is a much higher threshold than for our police.   Couple that with the service members being 18 and upholding that standard, which at times being on the receiving end of actual traumatic and life threatening events.   Police should be able to take abuse like Beefeaters and not react.

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52 minutes ago, GotThatFire said:

Just about. Change “has” to “could have”  and that is what most by the book police are trained to think. And that’s real and fair. Staying alert,  anybody can be a threat.  However that does not excuse these officers’ behavior. This is different. This is not by the book.

I understand being prepared that anyone can be a threat but they are pulling weapons based on the potential of a threat.  The cops are the ones escalating situations like this.  

One criticism that I do have of the people that find themselves in the showdowns with over zealous cops: Do what the cops say when they have a gun on you.  The cops are wrong but you can’t reason with a hyped up cop that could easily make another mistake by pulling the trigger.  Being right and dying isn’t good. 

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3 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

I understand being prepared that anyone can be a threat but they are pulling weapons based on the potential of a threat.  The cops are the ones escalating situations like this.  

One criticism that I do have of the people that find themselves in the showdowns with over zealous cops: Do what the cops say when they have a gun on you.  The cops are wrong but you can’t reason with a hyped up cop that could easily make another mistake by pulling the trigger.  Being right and dying isn’t good. 

 Cops are never supposed to pull their firearm unless they confirm a threat. Hand always at the ready though is what they’re supposed to do, lest they get caught slipping. 

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11 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

I understand being prepared that anyone can be a threat but they are pulling weapons based on the potential of a threat.  The cops are the ones escalating situations like this.  

One criticism that I do have of the people that find themselves in the showdowns with over zealous cops: Do what the cops say when they have a gun on you.  The cops are wrong but you can’t reason with a hyped up cop that could easily make another mistake by pulling the trigger.  Being right and dying isn’t good. 

Problem is they’re screaming at you and giving conflicting commands half the time.

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21 minutes ago, Judge Roybeanbag said:

Problem is they’re screaming at you and giving conflicting commands half the time.

This.  The only way to be sure to survive an encounter with a cop is to...not have an encounter with a cop.

Seriously, they’ll shoot you if you don’t comply with their commands to move, get out of the car, etc...and they’ll shoot you if you move.  If a cop decides that you are a threat, you’re going to die, no matter what you do.  And they will get away with it.

They’re the single most dangerous criminal gang in America.

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2 hours ago, atomheartbevo said:

I have plenty of friends that I served with, who went on to serve in Afghanistan and/or Iraq, and they wouldn't pull this shit in either of those places against parents with little kids.  It's a good way to A) create more people willing to look the other way while IEDs, etc. were planted, or B) create more people willing to plant IEDs, etc.

A couple have even mentioned how being friendly to the locals saved their lives - things like some kid they gave something to (candy, food, etc.), coming back a few weeks later and that kid would tell them he saw a group of men doing something along some road, and they would find an IED there, etc.

Even if these cops were ex-military, and acted like that, they are psychologically unfit to be cops, or to even own firearms.

totally agree. i've known so many marines who were self righteous dickheads with god complexes and stunted cerebral growth, and i've known some real shithead police as well, and yet, the two guys i've known who did both happen to be two of the coolest customers i've ever known. one is retired now, but the other is currently Michigan State Police (and a Texas ex 🤘🏼) and just the coolest, most laid back, secure family man. he isn't threatened by anything, and is just as calm and measured as anyone i've ever met. i wish we had a million cops just like him, but unfortunately he is the glaring exception to the rule these days. 

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4 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Do police really track down people for shoplifting?  I’ve always assumed that if I saw someone steal my car from my driveway, I wouldn’t be able to get to the police to act fast. 

No. And it's not shoplifting until the item leaves the store. Typically, when a shoplifter gets busted, it's store security that catches them outside the store and then calls the cops. If you're the victim of a crime and expect the cops to do much to find the perpetrator(s) on their own, expect to be disappointed. 

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3 hours ago, Nivek said:

The rules of engagement for our service members is a much higher threshold than for our police.   Couple that with the service members being 18 and upholding that standard, which at times being on the receiving end of actual traumatic and life threatening events.   Police should be able to take abuse like Beefeaters and not react.

Soldiers and firemen are trained to put the lives of the citizens they're entrusted to protect before their own. Cops are trained to think of the citizens as their enemy. If anyone should die, better the citizen than the cop regardless of guilt or innocence. 

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And like clockwork.  Blame the victim.  Dad had, gasp, a suspended license.  And someone who wasn't even in the car at the time the "officer" decided to threaten to kill a pregnant mother holding her 1 year old baby, had an arrest warrant. 

 

 

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20 minutes ago, lemonlime said:

And like clockwork.  Blame the victim.  Dad had, gasp, a suspended license.  And someone who wasn't even in the car at the time the "officer" decided to threaten to kill a pregnant mother holding her 1 year old baby, had an arrest warrant. 

 

 

That page isn’t exactly overflowing with support in the comments. Think anybody at PPD has noticed or cares?

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1 hour ago, XYZ said:

I wonder how many more times this happens every day, except that nobody captures it on video so you never hear about it.

And how long it's been going on. Social media/technology has really shined a light on this. It will probably get worse in the short-term before it gets better in the long-term, but at some point the fact that their actions can and will be recorded and broadcast will sink in for cops.

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2 hours ago, Pato del Muerto said:

That page isn’t exactly overflowing with support in the comments. Think anybody at PPD has noticed or cares?

I doubt it.  They know they're going to get away with it.    These are the same people who were led by Joe Arpaio for years.  And, hell, he was pardoned.  They have no reason to believe they'll ever be held accountable for anythng.

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20 hours ago, lemonlime said:

The sergeant in the news report who acts like the police are the victims here needs to go.

It may truly be a "few bad apples." But they police apologizers always forget the rest of the expression--that ruined the barrel.  The whole barrel is rotten.

What is so funny about the "just a few bad apples line" is that the saying is literally means those bad apples spoil the bunch, ruining everything, which is exactly what has happened in America.

 

I'm well past the point where i think that the cops in this country should be completely disarmed. They prove time and again that they are thugs who can't be trusted. These motherfuckers were pointing guns at a TODDLER. And they consider themselves heroes.

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20 hours ago, lemonlime said:

The sergeant in the news report who acts like the police are the victims here needs to go.

It may truly be a "few bad apples." But they police apologizers always forget the rest of the expression--that ruined the barrel.  The whole barrel is rotten.

The baby was going for my gun. I had no choice.

I think we've become complacent even about the absurdly humiliating way people are apprehended. Get on the ground! Knee on the neck. Pull the arms back with force. Jerk arrestee violently up.

Under the guise of "protecting themselves" cops have institutionalized unnecessary force.

I was watching a documentary about the bank job in Erie where the guy had a bomb locked around his neck. Once the police have handcuffed and realize it's a bomb they, understandably, clear out and get behind their cars. 

The guy is cuffed and sitting on the ground. Every cop circling him has their pistol pointed at him as they try to figure out what to do. Why? He cannot possible rise to his feet let alone do anything with his hands.

Maybe the cop should have a hand on his holstered pistol in this case. Maybe. He can't see her hands. But screaming his going to shoot her in the head if she doesn't obey a command that could harm her child is sick.

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What is so funny about the "just a few bad apples line" is that the saying is literally means those bad apples spoil the bunch, ruining everything, which is exactly what has happened in America.
 
I'm well past the point where i think that the cops in this country should be completely disarmed. They prove time and again that they are thugs who can't be trusted. These motherfuckers were pointing guns at a TODDLER. And they consider themselves heroes.

The problem is, we need police, and we need them to be armed. I have no idea how we got from “to protect and serve” to this. The solution is a wholesale change in how police respond and to hold bad cops accountable. It’s a pipe dream in today’s political climate, so I guess we just have to keep complaining in case there is ever a sliver of a chance at real reform.
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4 minutes ago, 'stache said:


The problem is, we need police, and we need them to be armed. I have no idea how we got from “to protect and serve” to this. The solution is a wholesale change in how police respond and to hold bad cops accountable. It’s a pipe dream in today’s political climate, so I guess we just have to keep complaining in case there is ever a sliver of a chance at real reform.

Why do we need them to be armed?  Many (most?) other countries don't arm their police, at least not the police who are in the community as opposed to, say, a swat team.  

But I think it's an overall culture problem, due to far more than arming them.  They've literally gotten away with murder for decades.  Combined with hero worship, a so called blue line they don't cross, increased militarization of the police, roid rage, being taken at their word even when they're lying, and the government/police unions protecting them when they fuck up so that there's no accountability.  It's a toxic combination.  I'm not sure ultimately how to fix this, but a start would be to prosecute the ones who commit crimes (and not the fake prosecution they sometimes undergo today), fire the ones who can't act professionally, and any cop who's caught lying in either a police report or at trial is instantly fired.  

 

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18 minutes ago, 'stache said:


The problem is, we need police, and we need them to be armed. I have no idea how we got from “to protect and serve” to this. The solution is a wholesale change in how police respond and to hold bad cops accountable. It’s a pipe dream in today’s political climate, so I guess we just have to keep complaining in case there is ever a sliver of a chance at real reform.

How often do cops stop a crime in progress, other than traffic violations?  Even when they are nearby and aware, they usually hang back until they have superior numbers and firepower, because they don’t want to be in harm’s way. Most of what they do is after the fact, like investigating, cataloging, and arresting. They don’t need guns for those things. Even serving warrants, they could easily do it in a manner that doesn’t require force but they prefer to bust down doors and file in guns drawn rather than walk up at work or grocery store or gas station. 

They have no problem putting the public in danger with no knock raids, car chases, and discharging weapons though. 

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3 hours ago, gmr548 said:

And how long it's been going on. Social media/technology has really shined a light on this. It will probably get worse in the short-term before it gets better in the long-term, but at some point the fact that their actions can and will be recorded and broadcast will sink in for cops.

Not until cops start paying a financial price instead of the taxpayers, and not until they find themselves unemployable as cops in other departments and/or go to jail.

Not many jobs in this country where you can wreck peoples’ lives, have a union and the government protect you, and the taxpayers cover the lawsuit costs and still give you a healthy pension.  That’s got to stop.   

Somebody that I knew from high school had 18 or 19 years in the Navy, and fucked up royally. Nobody was proclaiming him to be a hero that needed defending, and that he should be given a chance.  No unions were making veiled threats at any leaders to back him or they’d make things difficult.  Nobody was working to make sure he’d somehow get a pension, even though he didn’t have 20 in.  There was no chance he could go and join another branch of service.  He’s working at a convenience store these days.   

This wasn’t one cop being an asshole wanting to shoot somebody. This was multiple cops.  This is institutional.  I wonder how their superior would have acted if he didn’t know people were filming.  

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1 hour ago, 'stache said:


The problem is, we need police, and we need them to be armed. I have no idea how we got from “to protect and serve” to this. The solution is a wholesale change in how police respond and to hold bad cops accountable. It’s a pipe dream in today’s political climate, so I guess we just have to keep complaining in case there is ever a sliver of a chance at real reform.

Probably start seeing this a lot more:

 

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I'm appalled at how the police approached this scene but what really disturbs me was the inability for the police to remain calm and to even process information about what was really happening and not just one but all of them.  How do they collectively not have the sense to see that this is going way out of control and correct and de-escalate.   

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