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so, Jeffrey Epstein

Gil Bang

By Gil Bang
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TexArcher
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I love how some guy said Bill Clinton likes 'em young, which could mean any woman under 50, so he's clearly a pedo, but like 16 women accused Trump of rape, and he's facing almost a hundred felony cha

Red Five
Red Five

Ariana Grande, IMO.

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WhatTheBuck

WhatTheBuck 28,788

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37 minutes ago, ChiTownDoc said:

I love all these conspiracy theories.  A lot of people wanted Epstein dead - but I don't see how any of them wanted Epstein more dead than Epstein himself.  He had money and you don't take that with you.  I'm sure it's not the sexiest 'conspiracy' out there but the most likely is that he paid off some low level prison guards to get just enough breathing room to off himself.  But that's WAY too boring for most.  

How did he pay them?

The most innocent explanation involves him being a known suicide risk and someone giving the order to take him off suicide watch. After that he wouldn't need to bribe a guard. Even if he killed himself, someone knew he had tried once before and obviously didn't care if he tried again. That sure suggests the fix was in even if the suicide wasn't staged. If it wasn't malicious then at best it was gross incompetence and an investigation should reveal who gave the order to take him off suicide watch. Then we should hear them explain their actions. 

Do you think that will happen?

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31,499

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38 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

It doesn't. Neither do the vast majority of Americans. Which is troubling when you consider the fact that there are innocent people behind bars.

And some not-so-innocent people serving sentences all out of proportion to their wrongdoing.

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suddenly shaggy

suddenly shaggy 929

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8 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

How did he pay them?

The most innocent explanation involves him being a known suicide risk and someone giving the order to take him off suicide watch. After that he wouldn't need to bribe a guard. Even if he killed himself, someone knew he had tried once before and obviously didn't care if he tried again. That sure suggests the fix was in even if the suicide wasn't staged. If it wasn't malicious then at best it was gross incompetence and an investigation should reveal who gave the order to take him off suicide watch. Then we should hear them explain their actions. 

Do you think that will happen?

Narrator: It didn't.

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ChiTownDoc

ChiTownDoc 21,154

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13 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

How did he pay them?

The most innocent explanation involves him being a known suicide risk and someone giving the order to take him off suicide watch. After that he wouldn't need to bribe a guard. Even if he killed himself, someone knew he had tried once before and obviously didn't care if he tried again. That sure suggests the fix was in even if the suicide wasn't staged. If it wasn't malicious then at best it was gross incompetence and an investigation should reveal who gave the order to take him off suicide watch. Then we should hear them explain their actions. 

Do you think that will happen?

Um, do you really think it's difficult to find people to pay off as far as guards?  For a guy with a few hundred million dollars, who flew high profile people to his own pedophile island, for decades without landing in jail?  Yeah, that would be the easiest part of all this BS he pulled off. 

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triplehorn

triplehorn 2,664

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53 minutes ago, ChiTownDoc said:

I love all these conspiracy theories.  A lot of people wanted Epstein dead - but I don't see how any of them wanted Epstein more dead than Epstein himself.  He had money and you don't take that with you.  I'm sure it's not the sexiest 'conspiracy' out there but the most likely is that he paid off some low level prison guards to get just enough breathing room to off himself.  But that's WAY too boring for most.  

This guy was fueled by power and perverse control which got played out for years with his victims.  It was likely unbearable having that control taken away. Suicide was the last thing he could control.  He also probably really put one over on the folks assessing his suicide risk (more control) to lessen the restrictions for a successful attempt.

Every 30 minute checks, even if performed, is plenty of time to hang/strangulate.  I don’t think he necessarily needed anyone to cooperate with him.

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WhatTheBuck

WhatTheBuck 28,788

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2 minutes ago, ChiTownDoc said:

Um, do you really think it's difficult to find people to pay off as far as guards?  For a guy with a few hundred million dollars, who flew high profile people to his own pedophile island, for decades without landing in jail?  Yeah, that would be the easiest part of all this BS he pulled off. 

So, just another conspiracy theory.

He obviously didn't have cash on hand so he must have had someone on the outside working with him. Did they bribe the person who gave the order to take him off suicide watch? That's the key, not the guards. Or was that incompetence and he still bribed the guards? Regardless, if you're right then surely an investigation will uncover the truth of who, when, where, and how. Obviously in your scenario the "what" is bribery and the "why" is suicide. Care to speculate on how to fill in the other blanks?

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ChiTownDoc

ChiTownDoc 21,154

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

So, just another conspiracy theory.

He obviously didn't have cash on hand so he must have had someone on the outside working with him. Did they bribe the person who gave the order to take him off suicide watch? That's the key, not the guards. Or was that incompetence and he still bribed the guards? Regardless, if you're right then surely an investigation will uncover the truth of who, when, where, and how. Obviously in your scenario the "what" is bribery and the "why" is suicide. Care to speculate on how to fill in the other blanks?

You’re a fuckload dumber than I thought if you think bribing guards to take an extra long break is hard.  Legit lol

Edited by ChiTownDoc
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ChiTownDoc

ChiTownDoc 21,154

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21 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

This guy was fueled by power and perverse control which got played out for years with his victims.  It was likely unbearable having that control taken away. Suicide was the last thing he could control.  He also probably really put one over on the folks assessing his suicide risk (more control) to lessen the restrictions for a successful attempt.

Every 30 minute checks, even if performed, is plenty of time to hang/strangulate.  I don’t think he necessarily needed anyone to cooperate with him.

The NY corrections guy CNN had on said the protocol was to have guards check every 15 min and have somebody with him in the cell.  He also said they all knew putting somebody in true solitary would drive them to be a higher suicide risk - not sure he was on true isolation but this 'expert' said it sounded like they had him in iso for a period.  

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WhatTheBuck

WhatTheBuck 28,788

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11 minutes ago, ChiTownDoc said:

You’re a fuckload dumber than I thought if you think bribing guards to take an extra long break is hard.  Legit lol

Who ordered him to be taken off suicide watch and why? You seem to be evading that point. I think it's kind of important. 

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Guest Lobo

Guest Lobo

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Posted

Investigators, "He took out this insurance policy shortly before he left.  We have reason to believe he may be suicidal!" 

"Hey wait a minute, this is an auto insurance policy!"

Investigators, "That's why we're worried."  

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WhatTheBuck

WhatTheBuck 28,788

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34 minutes ago, RDCanecutter said:

People who are not even close to rich have bribed guards on Death Row in Livingston Texas.

By definition, they already had their day in court, had given their testimonies, and had already been convicted. Feel free to cite some examples and we can see how they compare to a high profile federal case with national and international implications, where the accused hasn't been to trial, or even been in jail that long, where there are a lot of powerful people who would prefer he never got the chance to testify, and who was a known suicide risk and was taken off suicide watch immediately before his "suicide."

Really rich people can often escape serious punishment because they can hire the best legal teams and because they're rich. OJ Simpson got away with murder. Are you sure Epstein didn't think he could still get out of it because he always had before?

Let's see how aggressively this administration investigates this because something stinks. 

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MaybeACoordinator

MaybeACoordinator 8,349

Posted
Posted

I have experienced something like this on the outside. There was a time when my paycheck came from exposing frauds and other sociopaths. One of the worst ones I ever exposed, a truly evil guy like Epstein, was in jail pending trial and I was talking to the cop at HPD handling his case. The cop came to the conference room with all of his confidential files on the monster, spread them out on the table for me, and told me he was gonna "take a break for a while" and insinuated to me that this never happened, but he wanted the truth exposed. So I was allowed to kind of hang this dude on my own.

In that case there was no overlying angle of powerful people being protected. Well, there sort of was, as this guy had victimized some Houston oil royalty in a truly despicable way, but they were truly victims here. They were not in cahoots with this psycho and out raping girls on a private island. 

(I once read a story of an evil California child molester / murderer who just happened to be assigned a cellie who was doing life, was incredibly violent in prison, and had been molested as a child. Things did not end well for his cellmate; the lifer ended up with more prison privileges once the molester had his brains spattered inside the cell.) 

So, yes, the cops will and do cut corners to see justice, as they see it, done. And that could be what has happened here. 

Or it could be that the prison authorities are carrying out orders from on high to have Epstein whacked. Or a combo of both. Epstein was a vile man. It wouldn't take much encouragement to entice a prison guard to look the other way while he offed himself.

In this case, though, we have to wonder about motive. Was he murdered solely because he was despicable, or in order to protect the Lolita Express bunch?

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NowThis

NowThis 931

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4 hours ago, Chooky said:

I wonder how the two boobs in charge feel about losing the most notorious witness and defendant in American history if it was just because they were watching JuicyButts69 on Instagram and typing "dat azzz."

probably sleeping.  I worked a night shift job while @ UT and my 2 partners snoozed about half the shift.  The alternative was heart attack at a young age. I'm 90% sure both were sleeping. 

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Gatorubet

Gatorubet 30,246

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9 hours ago, Loch Ness Monster said:

We'll probably never know who and who wasn't in the old boys pedo club. Our current AG's dad (Donald Barr) probably knew Epstein was a pedo back in the 70s. Sounds like it was a running joke in their circles.

"I've known Jeff for 15 years. Terrific guy. He's a lot of fun to be with. It is even said that he likes beautiful women as much as I do, and many of them are on the younger side." - Trump

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MaybeACoordinator

MaybeACoordinator 8,349

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19 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

"I've known Jeff for 15 years. Terrific guy. He's a lot of fun to be with. It is even said that he likes beautiful women as much as I do, and many of them are on the younger side." - Trump

It's like these fucksticks are taunting us. Yes, we rape young women. Fuck you for caring. 

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Bojack

Bojack 2,081

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Posted (edited)

Worth it to post that slop twice.  It's misleading to say that he presided over the autopsy.  Baden was hired by Epstein's people to observe the autopsy which, according to New York's chief medical examiner, is a common practice.  The results of the autopsy have still not been released, pending further information.  

Zavala, fuck off with posting Hulk Hogan, Bloodsport Capital,  and The_Real_Fly as sources.  It's funny how the right wingers, including the President, are so quick to parrot conspiracies on this.  

https://www.apnews.com/8db7a65602a741ab9f625c2c58d1f688

Edited by Bojack
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Onboard 2.0

Onboard 2.0 9,083

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Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

i fault people none for coming up with conspiracy theories on this.  this is going to be our kennedy assassination.

Doubtful.  Who shot JR was more impactful on peoples daily lives than that POS.

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triplehorn

triplehorn 2,664

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Posted

 

pretty decent reality/fact based breakdown in this thread:

"About 1/3 of in-facility suicides happen while the patient is on watch."

Being on a perpetual suicide protocol can make a subject worse:

Spoiler

Suicide as last ditch exertion of control:

Spoiler

 

Epstein almost assuredly successfully manipulated those assessing his suicide risk:

Spoiler

 

 

 

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Zavala

Zavala 1,384

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1 hour ago, Bojack said:

Worth it to post that slop twice.  It's misleading to say that he presided over the autopsy.  Baden was hired by Epstein's people to observe the autopsy which, according to New York's chief medical examiner, is a common practice.  The results of the autopsy have still not been released, pending further information.  

Zavala, fuck off with posting Hulk Hogan, Bloodsport Capital,  and The_Real_Fly as sources.  It's funny how the right wingers, including the President, are so quick to parrot conspiracies on this.  

https://www.apnews.com/8db7a65602a741ab9f625c2c58d1f688

yeah should be posting more reliable sources like CNN. We GOTTA STICK to what is common sense on these things, don't get caught up in the intrigue of who his friends were.... 

 

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Pam Cummings

Pam Cummings 9,645

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Zavala said:

1565593982193-pol.jpg

Heh, but seriously...

1565583838829-pol.png


1565584088305-pol.png

 

You should be banned from CR for posting this nonsensical bullshit.

 

Seriously, content like this has no place in a serious discussion. I know it's surly, but come on. This isn't an attempt at an honest discussion. This is full on wingnut nonsense.

Edited by Pam Cummings
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RomaVicta

RomaVicta 29,934

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40 minutes ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

i fault people none for coming up with conspiracy theories on this.  this is going to be our kennedy assassination.

We need to drop the conspiracy theory label for every story that may have alternative explanations. I can't think of a better way to enable real nefarious activities than to dismiss even the thought of them as wacko conspiracy theories.

This death is worth investigating thoroughly.  I don't know where the investigation will lead, but I want the answers to the questions that have so many people speculating.

It's not hard to imagine the emotional abyss that Epstein found himself in. It's not hard to imagine him wanting to commit suicide.

On the other hand, I wonder about the marks on his neck after the first attempt. Were they ever identified as fabric burn? What does the cell look like where he died? What opportunities were realistically available for suicide? Who was nearby?

Nobody would care if he were not connected to so many rich and powerful people, but he was. They likely acted to help him in Florida years ago. Did they try to get him out this time? Failing that, was their motive for murdering him enough to make them act?

I want to know. I don't want Bill Barr heading the investigation.

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Guest Lobo

Guest Lobo

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Posted

That 1/3 of inmates that kill themselves were on suicide watch is supposed to quash all the Epstein interest/outrage?  Mmmkay.  

We have prisoners at black site prisons under 24 hour constant surveillance for suicide because they were found with shit like a Quran or a tax return implying undeclared income, and they'll have to stay there for life probably with nothing sharper than their own teeth.  Meanwhile, a withering away Epstein is given a grain leather belt sized 46" and put in the prison wing pithily dubbed by the inmates as, "Our Wing of the Perpetual Shift Change" with cameras found at the Blair Witch Site.  I'm literally half expecting the warden or Justice officials, this very morning, to realize they've been looking at mock-up video of his room on their monitors while Danny Ocean and his gang laugh all the way to Jeffrey's island to divide up the loot.  

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Onboard 2.0

Onboard 2.0 9,083

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19 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

People are pissed he killed himself.  It’s a final psychological victory for a monstrous manipulator who’d never be free again.

And it’s not like anyone would benefit from him being dead to protect themselves.  He wasn’t going to cooperate.

I don't know why people keep saying that ? The threat of general prison population life would more than likely cause him to talk.  Unless he's some bad ass, and could take on all comers, or could use dollars to buy himself protection somehow.

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