Fire Shaka Smart

[Katfid54 8575]

Just now, Nueces River Rat said:

I guess what is depressing is win or lose in what is left of this season,  we have another season of mediocrity to look forward to next year since all the $9.95 types are saying we are stuck with Smart for another season.  So much like football during the later years of the Mack era.... 

Literally no one is saying we are stuck with Shaka for another season.  Everything I've heard is that Del Conte is wheeling/dealing right now, trying to find Shaka a soft landing, so we can go hire someone else.  If those efforts are unsuccessful, it's going to get interesting, but that's a lot different than saying we are "stuck" with Shaka for another season.

If BWG is right that Beard wants the Texas job, you have to think Texas will push hard to make that happen.  It's basically Tom Herman 2.0 (with the caveat that the buyouts here are similar-sized to what they were for Strong and basketball obviously commands much less interest/revenue).  Further, if Tech makes a tourney run, you've got to think that plays in Texas' favor in two ways:  First, it gives CDC more time to find Shaka a landing spot.  Second, it further energizes BMD to open their wallets and ensure we get Beard.

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

 

17 minutes ago, Bitterwhiteguy said:

Imagine how many more teams would be willing to take on his salary if he took this team to the Elite Eight. There's incentive for both sides of the Shaka debate to want this team to make a run.

shit if we win the national title maybe a bidding war will break out!

[Machinator 32097]

I can't believe I'm saying this, but I'm glad there's a game today just so that we get respite from discussing these wacky scenarios that almost certainly aren't going to happen.

[MoJames 8230]

5 hours ago, pigmeat markham said:

Well I guess to represent the UT campus, if I could figure out how to do it, I could post a pic of transient piss and vehicle exhaust fumes.

I'd take that over cow shit.

[MAUFRAIS 6539]

Tho obviously not a landman,  the founder of Yeti has recently arrived upon the scene as well.

Bow down to our new lease flipping cooler and cup manufacturing overlords.

[Huckleberry 32144]

If only there were a way to figure out whether living in Austin or Lubbock is more appealing to the general population.

Obviously I rigged that as well as I could in Lubbock's favor by not just using raw population totals or increases. Now can we stop talking about this settled issue and get back to figuring out ways that Smart is gone?

Edited March 14, 2019 by Huckleberry

[Brian Fantana 6589]

1 hour ago, Bitterwhiteguy said:

Drew is still at Baylor because coaches across the country hate him with the fire of a thousand suns. I have yet to run across another D-I coach who is as universally disliked as Drew and it's the reason most ADs don't really consider him for gigs. Bill Self and Barnes would love to lock him in a trunk and drive the car into a lake, just to name two.

Marshall - while an asshole - is still at Wichita State because the Koch Brothers (yes, those Koch brothers) fund him like he's coaching Kansas. All he has to do is play footsie with another school like Alabama and the Kochs kick in some more cash.

 

Also, Beard is interested in the Texas job. Whether he takes it if/when it comes available is up in the air - others have astutely noted the financial barriers, to name one issue - but he's quietly made it known he's up for the interview. This surprised me when I learned of it because of his deep roots in Lubbock, but it seems to be true from what I've gathered.

This guy is PLUGGED IN

[Brian Fantana 6589]

3 hours ago, Js1 said:

6 whole 4 star recruits? Well slap my ass and call me a bitch, UT could never dream big like that! 

6 is a big number compared to 0 in the decade before. 

[ztejas 42744]

1 hour ago, Bitterwhiteguy said:

Imagine how many more teams would be willing to take on his salary if he took this team to the Elite Eight. There's incentive for both sides of the Shaka debate to want this team to make a run.

Okay, but at what point do you want him to stay? If Shaka actually takes this team to the elite eight that should buy him another year imo. UT hasn't been to the EE in a decade. 

I think even a SS appearance makes it interesting. 

[Bitterwhiteguy 153]

9 minutes ago, ztejas said:

Okay, but at what point do you want him to stay? If Shaka actually takes this team to the elite eight that should buy him another year imo. UT hasn't been to the EE in a decade. 

I think even a SS appearance makes it interesting. 

What I think is happening is separate from what I'd want to happen, but what I'm hearing is that all a run does this year is change the market rate for Shaka elsewhere. Maybe if they make a FF then the math changes to the point CDC would keep him around, but that's a bridge I don't imagine we'll have to cross.

Bear in mind I started hearing rumblings before the TCU game was even over, so I think this has been gearing up for longer than we knew.

[rickyspub 801]

It would horribly disappointing if finding Shaka a soft landing were indeed Step 1. It would be the biggest misstep of CDC's tenure. If he can get one of his Top 5 signed then Shaka needs to be fired and the program needs to be allowed to move on. If Shaka can be found a soft landing elsewhere that reduces our financial exposure, then great, but to make it the first move is borderline malpractice. 

[Machinator 32097]

Just now, rickyspub said:

It would horribly disappointing if finding Shaka a soft landing were indeed Step 1. It would be the biggest misstep of CDC's tenure. If he can get one of his Top 5 signed then Shaka needs to be fired and the program needs to be allowed to move on. If Shaka can be found a soft landing elsewhere that reduces our financial exposure, then great, but to make it the first move is borderline malpractice. 

I mean, if CDC can't find the money he can't find the money.

Obviously his job is to fundraise but he's not a Messiah, and the fact remains that we're asking for more money to fire a basketball coach than we did to fire Charlie Strong.

[VolenteHawk 495]

1 hour ago, Huckleberry said:

If only there were a way to figure out whether living in Austin or Lubbock is more appealing to the general population.

Obviously I rigged that as well as I could in Lubbock's favor by not just using raw population totals or increases. Now can we stop talking about this settled issue and get back to figuring out ways that Smart is gone?

[Loose Stool 112]

Saw this in SportsDay

 

Shaka returns next season

[Machinator 32097]

2 minutes ago, Loose Stool said:

Saw this in SportsDay

 

Shaka returns next season

That's all speculation.

[Katfid54 8575]

1 minute ago, Machinator said:

we're asking for more money to fire a basketball coach than we did to fire Charlie Strong.

Is this really true?

Shaka's buyout, as I understand it, is $12.9 million.

Charlie's was $9mm.  Gilbert's was $1.7mm.  Mattox was $1.1mm.  BJM was $800k.  Haley and Traylor were both approximately $500k.  And I can't even find Bedford's or Clay Jennings' numbers.

That's a $13.6mm buyout package right there, though.

[Machinator 32097]

2 minutes ago, Katfid54 said:

Is this really true?

Shaka's buyout, as I understand it, is $12.9 million.

Charlie's was $9mm.  Gilbert's was $1.7mm.  Mattox was $1.1mm.  BJM was $800k.  Haley and Traylor were both approximately $500k.  And I can't even find Bedford's or Clay Jennings' numbers.

That's a $13.6mm buyout package right there, though.

If you want to make it apples to apples, then you need to factor in Horn's, Berry's, and Lucas' buyouts as well (probably not very big). But even if the totals are roughly equal, the point remains, does it not? Football >>> basketball.

I still have cautious optimism that CDC makes it work somehow.

[rickyspub 801]

11 minutes ago, Machinator said:

I mean, if CDC can't find the money he can't find the money.

Obviously his job is to fundraise but he's not a Messiah, and the fact remains that we're asking for more money to fire a basketball coach than we did to fire Charlie Strong.

In that case, there isn't a landing soft enough to fire Shaka regardless. Everything I see is talking about him finding something that pays around $1M/year. Really, if CDC can't find an extra $1M/year, then he is more of a Mashugana than a Messiah.

[ztejas 42744]

8 minutes ago, Machinator said:

If you want to make it apples to apples, then you need to factor in Horn's, Berry's, and Lucas' buyouts as well (probably not very big). But even if the totals are roughly equal, the point remains, does it not? Football >>> basketball.

I still have cautious optimism that CDC makes it work somehow.

I think a major difference is that UT didn't give Charlie an awful guaranteed extension that would have kept him another 3 years. 

Charlie had 2 years left, correct? So he had already coached 60% of his contract. 

Shaka has already coached for more seasons than Charlie did, and has more seasons left than Charlie did when UT fired him. 

Meaning, yes football >>> basketball but the situations aren't totally analogous. It would be almost twice as many seasons of mediocre basketball as mediocre football at this point. 

Edited March 14, 2019 by ztejas

[Katfid54 8575]

34 minutes ago, Machinator said:

If you want to make it apples to apples, then you need to factor in Horn's, Berry's, and Lucas' buyouts as well (probably not very big). But even if the totals are roughly equal, the point remains, does it not? Football >>> basketball. 

I still have cautious optimism that CDC makes it work somehow. 

That's fair.  I assume their deals don't increase the overall pie much, as well.

But, yes, obviously football $$$ are >>> basketball $$$. 

 

But you're going to have to spend the money either way.  You're either spending it this year, or you're spending it next year (or over the remaining life of the salary).  So the only marginal additional cost is the delta between what you would pay for someone else's buyout this year vs. in the future, and the additional year of paying that coach.

Shaka's deal is a sunk cost.  The only question is when you're spending the money.  When you look at it that way, which any good AD would do, the marginal cost is all that should be considered, and those numbers are much more tolerable.

[jimmyjazz 45055]

1 hour ago, ztejas said:

Okay, but at what point do you want him to stay? If Shaka actually takes this team to the elite eight that should buy him another year imo. UT hasn't been to the EE in a decade. 

It wouldn't look good to fire an Elite Eight coach, but that doesn't mean it wouldn't be justifiable.  If someone hasn't seen enough of Shaka's complete inability to gameplan and motivate on a consistent basis by now, then they're not looking hard enough.

 

[ztejas 42744]

1 minute ago, jimmyjazz said:

It wouldn't look good to fire an Elite Eight coach, but that doesn't mean it wouldn't be justifiable.  If someone hasn't seen enough of Shaka's complete inability to gameplan and motivate on a consistent basis by now, then they're not looking hard enough.

 

I feel like if he makes the EE (again, we're just playing hypotheticals, this team ain't making the EE) UT might as well keep him on for a year to continue searching and save some money. 

[UcancallmeSurly 451]

4 hours ago, Bitterwhiteguy said:

Drew is still at Baylor because coaches across the country hate him with the fire of a thousand suns. I have yet to run across another D-I coach who is as universally disliked as Drew and it's the reason most ADs don't really consider him for gigs. Bill Self and Barnes would love to lock him in a trunk and drive the car into a lake, just to name two.

Marshall - while an asshole - is still at Wichita State because the Koch Brothers (yes, those Koch brothers) fund him like he's coaching Kansas. All he has to do is play footsie with another school like Alabama and the Kochs kick in some more cash.

 

Also, Beard is interested in the Texas job. Whether he takes it if/when it comes available is up in the air - others have astutely noted the financial barriers, to name one issue - but he's quietly made it known he's up for the interview. This surprised me when I learned of it because of his deep roots in Lubbock, but it seems to be true from what I've gathered.

if you can throw in a few "I banged your Mother like that" replies or pics of say Kate or a current athlete eating at Waffle House, I'll nominate you for POY.  That's some quality info up in there.

[justhookit 4159]

2 hours ago, Bitterwhiteguy said:

Bear in mind I started hearing rumblings before the TCU game was even over, so I think this has been gearing up for longer than we knew.

Well some of us were hearing it at the beginning of conference play, so you need hearing aids.

[The Golden Hat 299]

4 hours ago, Katfid54 said:

Literally no one is saying we are stuck with Shaka for another season.

I think you meant literally everyone. 

[Caddox 952]

Holy shit this thread is a train wreck. When did people forget you shouldn’t argue with anyone defending Lubbock fucking Texas. 

[Burt Macklin 18960]

2 hours ago, Machinator said:

If you want to make it apples to apples, then you need to factor in Horn's, Berry's, and Lucas' buyouts as well (probably not very big). But even if the totals are roughly equal, the point remains, does it not? Football >>> basketball.

I still have cautious optimism that CDC makes it work somehow.

One big difference is Chuck’s deal was o my 2 years instead of 4, so the hit to the AD’s budget (or even the boosters) per year is much different. 

2 hours ago, rickyspub said:

It would horribly disappointing if finding Shaka a soft landing were indeed Step 1. It would be the biggest misstep of CDC's tenure. If he can get one of his Top 5 signed then Shaka needs to be fired and the program needs to be allowed to move on. If Shaka can be found a soft landing elsewhere that reduces our financial exposure, then great, but to make it the first move is borderline malpractice. 

I don’t really buy that CDC will keep Shaka if he can’t find a new school. This is all too public right now (and it will only get discussed more publically after the tournament) for CDC to bring Shaka back. I think we’re past the point of no return and CDC is just saying he’ll bring Shaka back to try to keep some leverage in placing him at a new school. I really can’t imagine bringing Shaka back after all the rumors that have and will be circulating about moving on from him. 

[Burt Macklin 18960]

1 hour ago, ztejas said:

I feel like if he makes the EE (again, we're just playing hypotheticals, this team ain't making the EE) UT might as well keep him on for a year to continue searching and save some money. 

Keeping him doesn’t necessarily save money if a school like Wake (who is motivated to pay Shaka some money now  so they can get rid of their coach) isn’t around to offload him or if CDC decides Hoiberg is the guy this year whereas next year’s Coach would likely have a buyout.

 

[ztejas 42744]

7 minutes ago, Burt Macklin said:

Keeping him doesn’t necessarily save money if a school like Wake (who is motivated to pay Shaka some money now  so they can get rid of their coach) isn’t around to offload him or if CDC decides Hoiberg is the guy this year whereas next year’s Coach would likely have a buyout.

 

Well if Hoiberg is the guy I'm assuming Shaka is getting canned regardless. 

[Burt Macklin 18960]

1 minute ago, ztejas said:

Well if Hoiberg is the guy I'm assuming Shaka is getting canned regardless. 

[Katfid54 8575]

25 minutes ago, Burt Macklin said:

I don’t really buy that CDC will keep Shaka if he can’t find a new school. This is all too public right now (and it will only get discussed more publically after the tournament) for CDC to bring Shaka back. I think we’re past the point of no return and CDC is just saying he’ll bring Shaka back to try to keep some leverage in placing him at a new school. I really can’t imagine bringing Shaka back after all the rumors that have and will be circulating about moving on from him. 

I think this is exactly what's going on.

[Tired Horn 733]

33 minutes ago, Caddox said:

Holy shit this thread is a train wreck. When did people forget you shouldn’t argue with anyone defending Lubbock fucking Texas. 

I'll say this for Lubbock--they really have made it just about all that it can be. I wouldn't want to live there, but you have to respect that.

[rickyspub 801]

32 minutes ago, Burt Macklin said:

I don’t really buy that CDC will keep Shaka if he can’t find a new school. This is all too public right now (and it will only get discussed more publically after the tournament) for CDC to bring Shaka back. I think we’re past the point of no return and CDC is just saying he’ll bring Shaka back to try to keep some leverage in placing him at a new school. I really can’t imagine bringing Shaka back after all the rumors that have and will be circulating about moving on from him. 

I think/hope you are right. The optics are odd and at this point are worse than if he got the dreaded vote of confidence from CDC. I just don't see how Shaka can be kept on, short of a miracle run to the second weekend of the tournament.

[Rockethorn1978 6059]

You also gotta believe that CDC is wanting to have an established winner as we enter the new arena, some times the 3-5 year plan and affect keeping Shaka on long term outweighs the one year buyout. Yea the buyout is high but the new arena and long term is the bigger picture here and if you know Shaka sucks then rip the bandaid off and move on. New coach would be entering the new arena in year 2 I believe and that’s better than introducing a brand new coach the first year the new arena opens.

[Katfid54 8575]

50 minutes ago, Tired Horn said:

I'll say this for Lubbock--they really have made it just about all that it can be. I wouldn't want to live there, but you have to respect that.

Talk about damning with faint praise.

[VirginiaLonghorn 4717]

1 hour ago, Tired Horn said:

I'll say this for Lubbock--they really have made it just about all that it can be. I wouldn't want to live there, but you have to respect that.

Well, you know, there’s gotta be a place for folks who wear boots and hats more than just that one week a year that the rodeo’s in town.  If not, then they’ll be trackin’ critter shit all over the place all of the time. 

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

27 minutes ago, Katfid54 said:

Talk about damning with faint praise.

"Lubbock: Maybe It's Not The Best YOU Can Do, But It's The Best WE Can Do"

[Skipper 5954]

4 hours ago, rickyspub said:

 Really, if CDC can't find an extra $1M/year, then he is more of a Mashugana than a Messiah.

This is fucking stupid.  How much are you ponying up?

Edited March 14, 2019 by Skipper

[pigmeat markham 135]

6 hours ago, VolenteHawk said:

The insecurity demonstrated here is fairly entertaining.    Why posters would be so threatened by a simple to each his own concept is perplexing.  My city is better than yours, nonny nonny boo boo.

[Huckleberry 32144]

Nobody is threatened you doofus. Hell, I don't even live in Austin. There is objective data that proves that Austin is a more desirable place to live than Lubbock.

You're right that one side is being humorously defensive, it's just not the one you think.

[pigmeat markham 135]

10 hours ago, Js1 said:

6 whole 4 star recruits? Well slap my ass and call me a bitch, UT could never dream big like that! 

You're trying a little too hard here.  Meant nothing by it other than things seem to be going fairly well at Tech for Beard.  I'm not a big basketball recruiting guy, but noticed Rivals anyway, had them listed as the best class in the conference.  I'm hardly suggesting it's a world's record effort.

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

6 minutes ago, pigmeat markham said:

You're trying a little too hard here.  

So if you Tech people say something we disagree with, we're defensive and insecure and trying to hard when we post in disagreement...? We should prove we don't care by not posting on this Texas message board?

Edited March 14, 2019 by SwanderedTalent

[suddenly shaggy 929]

17 minutes ago, pigmeat markham said:

The insecurity demonstrated here is fairly entertaining.    Why posters would be so threatened by a simple to each his own concept is perplexing.  My city is better than yours, nonny nonny boo boo.

Lulz. Y'all are the ones trying to tell us Lubbock isn't that bad. This is a really stupid argument, even for TCEH. 

Austin doesn't reek of cow shit. There isn't even a reason to get into the hundreds of other reasons Austin is better. 

[pigmeat markham 135]

7 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

Nobody is threatened you doofus. Hell, I don't even live in Austin. There is objective data that proves that Austin is a more desirable place to live than Lubbock.

You're right that one side is being humorously defensive, it's just not the one you think.

Are you actually familiar at all with the word threatened?  Who gives a shit what the objective data shows in regard to a subjective matter like city preferences.  Fact of the matter is some people prefer Alaska to Paris.  So what?

As an aside, the "objective data" indicated Hillary would win the presidency too.  That was some spot on info.

 

[Goo Punch 4275]

26 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

Nobody is threatened you doofus. Hell, I don't even live in Austin. There is objective data that proves that Austin is a more desirable place to live than Lubbock.

You're right that one side is being humorously defensive, it's just not the one you think.

i was going to reply to his post with the famous walter sobchak photo, but you would be shocked by how the quality was on every image i could find. any chance you can find me one that isn't all grainy and old looking?

[ClubWhatever 12066]

Anybody remember the poster “Tim” from Barking Carnival, back when that site was good? I do. 

[Goo Punch 4275]

facts:

Texas fans- entitled

OU fans- retarded trash

K State fans- morons (BOOOOOOOOO)

BU fans- Weird Baptists 

TTU fans- sensitive 

[pigmeat markham 135]

6 minutes ago, suddenly shaggy said:

Lulz. Y'all are the ones trying to tell us Lubbock isn't that bad. This is a really stupid argument, even for TCEH. 

Austin doesn't reek of cow shit. There isn't even a reason to get into the hundreds of other reasons Austin is better. 

Pay attention please, you haven't seen me post the first thing about Lubbock being better or not being "that bad".  Merely, to each his own as there are those who prefer it, which is true.

No, Austin doesn't reek of cow shit, only transient piss, exhaust fumes and traffic as I mentioned earlier.  Not an Austin slam in the least, every city has its negatives.  It's really pretty simple.

 

 

[Katfid54 8575]

1 minute ago, pigmeat markham said:

Pay attention please, you haven't seen me post the first thing about Lubbock being better or not being "that bad".  Merely, to each his own as there are those who prefer it, which is true.

No, Austin doesn't reek of cow shit, only transient piss, exhaust fumes and traffic as I mentioned earlier.  Not an Austin slam in the least, every city has its negatives.  It's really pretty simple.

 

  

Saying Austin "reeks of . . . exhaust fumes and traffic" is tautological, bro.

Edited March 14, 2019 by Katfid54

[suddenly shaggy 929]

Just now, pigmeat markham said:

Pay attention please, you haven't seen me post the first thing about Lubbock being better or not being "that bad".  Merely, to each his own as there are those who prefer it, which is true.

No, Austin doesn't reek of cow shit, only transient piss, exhaust fumes and traffic as I mentioned earlier.  Not an Austin slam in the least, every city has its negatives.  It's really pretty simple.

Fuck off with that bullshit false equivalency. A few parts of Austin, specifically areas around 6th Street smell like transient piss. Right by I35 and Mopac, Austin may smell like exhaust fumes. 

ALL of Lubbock smells like cow shit.