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Fire Shaka Smart

smokebomb

By smokebomb
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Catdaddyhorn

Catdaddyhorn 3444

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47 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Well, no.  You're wrong.  Not wrong that the Erwin Center sucks, but wrong that it's the main reason fans aren't engaged.  Fans aren't engaged because they don't really care all that much about basketball.  Rick Barnes improved the quality of play quite a bit after Tom Penders was canned and attendance went DOWN.  All at the Erwin Center.  There's all you need to know.

Furthermore, UT advanced to the Elite 8 four times (yes it should have been more) under Penders and Barnes.  We don't need Bill Self to get there.  We need a coach who can recruit like Barnes & Smart have done, and who has reasonable X & O capability (which Barnes had -- sorta -- and which Smart has yet to demonstrate).

We need a coach who can recruit like Barnes and Shaka, but who also employs an aesthetically pleasing style of play. If Shaka had the exact same record he's had here, but played more of the Havoc style he used at VCU he wouldn't have near the number of naysayers despite the mediocre results. When it comes to basketball we as Longhorns are cavemen. You yourself noted that Barnes improved the quality of play over Penders, but Penders had better attendance numbers. That was all due to the up and down style Penders utilized. Nevermind the fact that Penders rarely ran an offensive set outside of his 3 man weave, we pressed, dunked a lot, and shot 3s. Caveman say good basketball! 

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Red Five
Red Five

That is tough to accomplish in four years, but I wouldn't put it past Shaka.

immamac
immamac
Camelback80
Camelback80

Shaka should definitely get at least one more year. Many of his recruits will finally be upperclassmen by then, and he'll have his best shot of any year he's been here. Fans need to realize 2 maj

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immortal13

immortal13 4059

Posted
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12 minutes ago, Catdaddyhorn said:

We need a coach who can recruit like Barnes and Shaka, but who also employs an aesthetically pleasing style of play. If Shaka had the exact same record he's had here, but played more of the Havoc style he used at VCU he wouldn't have near the number of naysayers despite the mediocre results. When it comes to basketball we as Longhorns are cavemen. You yourself noted that Barnes improved the quality of play over Penders, but Penders had better attendance numbers. That was all due to the up and down style Penders utilized. Nevermind the fact that Penders rarely ran an offensive set outside of his 3 man weave, we pressed, dunked a lot, and shot 3s. Caveman say good basketball! 

Lol wut?

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realgreggym

realgreggym 832

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Catdaddy, I understand your point but lets use a football example. Would you rather root for a team like Tech that can be really exciting but is .500 or the Purple Wizard whose teams are more fundamentally sound and conservative but has a better record?  Maybe its a personal preference.

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Catdaddyhorn

Catdaddyhorn 3444

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My post was strictly in reference to the discussion that ztejas and jimmyjazz were having. Based solely from the standpoint of what it takes to get consistent attendance on the 40. Obviously elite level winning supersedes everything, but outside of anything short of multiple NCAA championships in a row our fanbase doesn't really rock like that, regardless of the sport. Even during Mack's run we would routinely have games were a good % of the crowd didn't return after halftime.   

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GotThatFire

GotThatFire 166

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1 hour ago, Tony Soprano said:

People rail on our fan support and that is sometimes understandable. However, just think back to Shaka's first year. Off the top of my head we had sellouts against KU, OU, NC, Baylor, and maybe one other team. That's not bad for a crappy arena like the Erwin Center and an average team. But fans did see some hope. I can't remember if that was the year that KU destroyed us near the end of the season on national tv with Romo and Witten in attendance.  Since then we have pretty much sucked. I had season tickets, but I'm not dealing with that horrible Austin traffic to go watch a crappy, half ass coached team.  You build a nice, actual basketball arena, with a well coached good team, and getting tickets is not going to be easy. Shaka, and our struggles in other sports have sucked the life out of many.

Even if we change the arena and sell out constantly, the fans themselves will still be the same.  They know they have no place acting the way Kansas Duke Kentucky etc fans act. 

Texas has to win one first. Otherwise we’ll just be fake, like aggy fans.

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45546

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7 hours ago, Catdaddyhorn said:

My post was strictly in reference to the discussion that ztejas and jimmyjazz were having. Based solely from the standpoint of what it takes to get consistent attendance on the 40.

Yeah, I understood what you were saying, and you are correct -- the discussion was about fan engagement, not about what it would take to maximize success on the court.

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45546

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Back to coaching options (should the opportunity present itself):  I can't believe Billy Donovan is only in his early 50's.  Is there reason to believe he'd return to the college game?  He has a whole lot of what Texas would look for in a coach, including the way he presents himself.

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Catdaddyhorn

Catdaddyhorn 3444

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Does anyone know if Kenpom bases their ratings only on in-season data, or do they use priors like with early season S&P+?  Funny that Texas is rated 27th by Kenpom following their first three games.  
There are several teams ahead in kempom's ratings who have also looked like complete shit.
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Slacks

Slacks 6791

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Posted
 Texas has never won a national championship. That’s the problem. Win the national championship, basketball fandom in Austin will evolve as well 
Don't have to win it all.... fans were crazy for BMW... get to the tourney and survive consistently... and not just in the year or two with a Wooten who is leaving early.
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Catdaddyhorn

Catdaddyhorn 3444

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2 hours ago, Snacks said:
18 hours ago, GotThatFire said:
 Texas has never won a national championship. That’s the problem. Win the national championship, basketball fandom in Austin will evolve as well 

Don't have to win it all.... fans were crazy for BMW... get to the tourney and survive consistently... and not just in the year or two with a Wooten who is leaving early.

Those were simpler times. Attention spans are much shorter now and there are more things competing for that attention. The 06 & 08 teams were far better than the BMW teams and the fan interest paled in comparison to them. 

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ClubWhatever

ClubWhatever 12087

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13 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

Back to coaching options (should the opportunity present itself):  I can't believe Billy Donovan is only in his early 50's.  Is there reason to believe he'd return to the college game?  He has a whole lot of what Texas would look for in a coach, including the way he presents himself.

Replacing your friend and former assistant after he's fired seems like it's not done in college basketball.  If we wants to come back to college, Donovan can get a really good job and not have to do that.

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texasstrong12

texasstrong12 4668

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Donovan isn't going to be an option at Texas. Kevin Durant is the face of Texas basketball. Look at the comments Shaka made today about Durant's impact on recruiting and the overall program. 

Texas isn't going to hire the coach that Durant said is a terrible coach and had a falling out with. 

Edited by texasstrong12
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Goo Punch

Goo Punch 4275

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Posted (edited)

lol, okay. i can guarantee you that CDC could give zero shits about KD having a falling out with Donovan. CDC will go after whoever he thinks will get the job done, regardless of how KD feels about him. Donovan's track record at Florida > KD's opinión of him.

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texasstrong12

texasstrong12 4668

Posted
Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, Goo Punch said:

lol, okay. i can guarantee you that CDC could give zero shits about KD having a falling out with Donovan. CDC will go after whoever he thinks will get the job done, regardless of how KD feels about him. Donovan's track record at Florida > KD's opinión of him.

yeah, your'e right. KD is the face of Texas basketball and if you don't think he has some impact on the next hire I'm not sure what to tell you. 

Durant donated $3 million to Texas, has an apparel deal with Texas, and is probably the biggest recruiting tool for Texas right now (as Shaka said today). If you think Texas is going to hire the coach that Durant hates you're living in delusional land. 

Edited by texasstrong12
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Goo Punch

Goo Punch 4275

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you are clueless as usual. jesus. as if billy donovan would be available and interested and CDC would say, "Thanks but no thanks, I don't wanna piss off KD." And i'm delusional. Jesus Christ you're special.

oh and hiring Donovan would hurt our recruiting? i don't even know what to say.

oh and we even get one of your classic tangential links that you always post, thinking it makes some point for you. i go back and forth about putting you on ignore, but you're the rocko of the basketball board, so i can't. way too entertaining to ignore someone so self assured and yet completely self deluded.

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texasstrong12

texasstrong12 4668

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, Goo Punch said:

you are clueless as usual. jesus. as if billy donovan would be available and interested and CDC would say, "Thanks but no thanks, but i don't wanna piss off KD." And i'm delusional. Jesus Christ you're special.

yeah, you're dialed in Derka. Tell me how Danny Newsome is better than Jarrett Allen again.

I'm sure you will send me a 5 page direct message now to tell me to stop picking on you. Because that's the type baby you are. 

Edited by texasstrong12
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texasstrong12

texasstrong12 4668

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FYI I'm pretty sure Durant was one of first people that CDC targeted for a donation once he was named the AD. 

https://www.bizjournals.com/austin/news/2018/01/04/nba-starkevin-durant-donates-millions-of-dollars.html

"We are so lucky to have Kevin Durant as not only one of our all-time greats and a supporter of our program, but also as an awesome ambassador for The University of Texas," Chris Del Conte, the new director of athletics at UT, said in a statement. "I've had great respect and admiration for him from afar for years, but now seeing firsthand the impact he has on this campus and within our athletics department, it's truly amazing. He is a special person who clearly has a great passion and love for the Longhorns, and we appreciate him so much."

 

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texasstrong12

texasstrong12 4668

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1 hour ago, txhorns said:

Anyone saying that Durant's opinion on the matter what be taken into consideration is being ignorant.  Now that doesn't mean Durant has veto powers on any potential hire, Donovan included.  

It's not like CDC is going to ask Kevin Durant, "Hey who do you think I should hire?" 

It's just terrible optics with Donovan. 

We're about to name multiple basketball facilities after Kevin Durant, we have an apparel deal centered around Durant, and our AD was begging for money from Durant just 10 months ago. Texas basketball is Kevin Durant. 

The idea we are going to hire the one coach that Kevin Durant hates is nonsensical. It's not happening. 

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Goo Punch

Goo Punch 4275

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8 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

I don't think it's an absurd proposition to assume that CDC would consider KD's opinion on a new hire, should it come to pass.  Happens all the time with program greats and major donors.

"take his opinion into account" does not equal "CDC would never hire Billy Donovan because KD supposedly said he didn't like him one time." How fucking low does your opinion of CDC have to be to believe something so ridiculous? Makes about as much sense as linking a twitter post where CDC points out that we wear KDs line of clothing as "proof" that he would never hire Billy Donovan, as if the two are in any way correlated

Billy Donovan calls up CDC: "Hey I'm leaving OKC and am interested in working for you."

CDC: "Sorry bro, KD says no. Guess we'll have to stick with Shaka."

 

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45546

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13 hours ago, Goo Punch said:

"take his opinion into account" does not equal "CDC would never hire Billy Donovan because KD supposedly said he didn't like him one time." How fucking low does your opinion of CDC have to be to believe something so ridiculous?

I don't know if you're attributing the 2nd viewpoint to me or others, but I wouldn't expect CDC to draw a hard line, either.  I just think he would consider KD's experience and definitely discuss it with him.  (This is only based on my assessment of CDC from a distance, which is in distinct contrast to a similar assessment of, say, Steve Patterson, who couldn't be bothered to do any due diligence or speak with anybody who mattered to the program.)

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Catdaddyhorn

Catdaddyhorn 3444

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Beyond that, KD strikes me as someone who changes his mind frequently on matters like this.  I doubt the utterings of a 1am twitter rant accurately reflect KDs thoughts on Donovan as a college coach.  Not to mention the fact that I think Florida won one of their championships during Durant's freshman year so I wouldn't put it past him to be able to distinguish between Donovan's abilities on the 2 levels.  Come on guys, if Donovan is available he's an automatic take a 1000 times out of a 1000 and this is coming from one of Shaka's biggest sunshine pumpers on this board.  

Edited by Catdaddyhorn
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ztejas

ztejas 43262

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On 11/13/2018 at 7:38 AM, jimmyjazz said:

Back to coaching options (should the opportunity present itself):  I can't believe Billy Donovan is only in his early 50's.  Is there reason to believe he'd return to the college game?  He has a whole lot of what Texas would look for in a coach, including the way he presents himself.

I doubt it. He's making $4 million a year and OKC is looking pretty fucking salty 15 games in. He would go to a different NBA team me thinks before coming to a mess of a situation at Texas.

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Machinator

Machinator 32097

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1 minute ago, ztejas said:

I doubt it. He's making $4 million a year and OKC is looking pretty fucking salty 15 games in. He would go to a different NBA team me thinks before coming to a mess of a situation at Texas.

I don't think it's a mess of a situation here.

I also don't think we're making a coaching change this offseason, though.

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ztejas

ztejas 43262

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1 minute ago, Machinator said:

I don't think it's a mess of a situation here.

I also don't think we're making a coaching change this offseason, though.

By mess I mean he would have to come in and turn things around quickly - which Shaka has failed to do - putting you another 3-4 years back from a SS bid. If they miss this year it will be 11 years since the last SS appearance for Texas - before that the longest gap was from '72 to '90 and the only long-ish stretch without one since then was from '90 to '97.

Honestly it will be interesting to see how much life college basketball has and if the landscape change (when it changes - because it needs to or the NBA will bury it) hurts or benefits UT. 

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satyanash

satyanash 14281

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Posted
On 11/9/2018 at 9:32 PM, satyanash said:

Can we be real? I think we all knew as soon as last season ended that this year was going to be a lost year. Sacrificed so we could say we gave Shaka the requisite four years.

At least that's what I remember feeling.

cough cough

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